Hardy Tropical forum.

Maybe under the Tropicals forum the description should just be worded different.

Couldn't agree more, mistygardener! The times (and zones) are a changing! But it's not just us folks stretching the "Tropical" limits that needs a posting place. Everyone worldwide will be experiencing it to a greater or lesser extent. But we could lead the pack, since it will hit here first... Ol' Dave must be sleeping not to have picked up on this...

As I stated earlier, "Hardy" may be the wrong word, but if we all put our brains into motion I am sure someone could come up with one that is fitting to our cause. The phrase "For Gardeners by Gardeners" keeps coming to mind for some reason here. We have the "Tropicals" forum, which gives a short explanation of what it is, then the "Tropical Gardening" Forum that doesn't give any explanation? So, why not add another to the list to help us less fortunate souls out here in the colder climates?

Garden Web made a separate tropicals forum called Tropicalesque, specifically for people growing tropicals out of their zone (no, I don't go there anymore--like this site much better). Now whenever I see a tropical garden in my neighborhood that word tropicalesque comes to my mind.

Another thought on this is that it would be great for people when they are interested in buying/bidding on the new Auction Site when it is up and running, too. For those of us interested, it would be easier on the Sellers/buyers in the long run. Making less questions to ask and answer. Of course, it would be up to those bidding/buying to check to see if the info is there.

But the sellers aren't supposed to "sell" in the forums.

Who is selling in the forums?

Nobody, yet.

The hardiness questions could be asked in the tropical forum we already have, many of them are zone pushers and would gladly answer any question.

I guess I always saw that the tropical forum was mostly frequented by people who were growing tropicals but didn't live in tropical climates. So what will the tropicals forum be if we make a new forum for talking about tropicals when you don't live in a tropical climate? Topics like "I live in zone 6, what tropical-ish plants will do best for me" would be perfectly fine to ask in the current tropical forum. Or maybe I'm just confused on what everyone wants to talk about.

If you checked out the link I posted above you will see that I didn't get a lot of response from it, which is where a Forum particularly for this would be great. This would eliminate having to go to each and every forum and asking the same questions, just on a different plant. It could all be incorporated into one place.

So.....if I'm reading this right....since I live in NC, I have to stick to my region only? I was born on a tropical island, have a natural penchant for all things tropical, except marijuana...and hence found myself drawn to Tropical Gardening. And it's just a bonus when these "cold climate" regulars have similar lovely spirit of the islanders and those born in the tropics.
So.....that meant too that I have to stop associating myself with MidSouth Gardening. Jeri11 always says that MidSouth is a state of mind and anyone is welcome to the forum. I would say the same apply to ANY forum.
Gardening is why DG exists, not our locations. My opinion here.

Hi there my sweet Jaye! :o)

My only thought on the "sub tropical" forum was there are many different forums that I have to visit to find out about sub tropical plants. I go the Fla. Ga TX AZ and Pacific Northwest forums becuase there are people on those boards that grow plants that can take a little frost but are more at home in the tropics. There is a large part of the country that is 8b-9ab and many plants that are at home in the tropics will grow in these zones. It would be just easier to have one forum I think.

Here I'll give a few examples of what I'm trying to grow this year. From seed BTW. These are really tropical trees and bushes but should be fine in my area.

http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/go/38374/
http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/go/1254/
http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/go/2048/
http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/go/64960/

The tropical guys really don't have much to say about plants like these and my home forum has very few people in the Carolinas that can grow these. Basicly only the South Eastern corner of SC. Usually very close to water. Other states have the same conditions as me but aren't located close to me.

This is mostly redundant. If you think you want to grow tropicals in a colder zone, that is your own problem. Having just returned from Paradise, Maui, I recognized many plants that we usually grow as houseplants. If I want to try them in the beds, that is my problem...and problem it is. No reason to have a forum because it is just not a reality. How can I tell what I can grow for a season, and one season only. We can all try but to be successful time after time but it is not a reality. So sorry to be a wet blanket. Jen was sorry that she is not able to grow a lot of the plants that are only meant for cold weather. Won't even try it. She couldn't grow tulips if she tried. Peonies? I don't think so. Just research what is good for your zone and make the best of it. You can be assured that I am really sorry that I can't grow all the beautiful plants I have seen. Just thrilled that somebody can, even if I can't.

Kilikina

I just finished catching up with this thread. There seems to be as many opinions and interpretations of what a "Hardy Tropicals" forum - whatever its eventual name - would be about as there are DGers and zones.

For me it means something that is generally thought of as being tropical (e.g. Musa) but a certain species (e.g. basjoo) or cultivar has been bred to make it either reliably winter hardy in my zone 5b garden or close enough that I could either push it a bit with serious protection or overwinter it in my insulated but unheated garage. To some it means the same but hardy to zone 7, while to others they're thinking zones 8 and 9.

Hardy for me means it needs to survive for at least 3 months under a 4 foot deep snow cover with average daytime high temperatures of -10C and periodic dips lasting about a week of highs in the -20C to -29C range - before calculating windchill.

This represents a pretty divergent set of views and no one forum IMHO will be able to satisfy all of them. When I ask a question about a plant in relation to its hardiness, being told that it sure is hardy by someone in zone 7 will not really benefit me much, and the same would be true for someone in zone 7 getting that response from a gardener in zone 9. I'm not sure what the answer is, and I would still like to see a forum that would benefit those in cooler northern zones, but on reflection I would hate to see a new forum set up that ends up having the same "problems" meeting peoples' expectations as the existing Tropical related forums do.

Just my 2 cents worth - please don't shoot the messenger :-)

Christi,
You live in an area where you CAN grow these things, but maybe not the same as what Jen, or Carol, or any of those that live in the wonderful land can grow. I really feel as though your first sentence was really uncalled for. I am glad you were able to go to Hawaii, and to share it with all of us, but not all of us will ever be able to do so. And you know, if we can grow Tropicals here, more power to us all. And I think if any of you wanted to grow the things that we can, you could always put your things in a refrigerator for the cold treatment that they need.

That's the point. Just easier to have people with similar climates say what worked and what didn't over time. No biggie, I do it all the time. I don't try to recreate Maui in my back yard. That would be just stupid because it won't work but you can find things that would look at home in Maui.

Funny you bring up tulips. They simply will not come back where I live and that question is asked year after year. No big deal, people try it and the next year the tuulips have all rotted. Just doesn't work. That's the point of having forums specific to people who should beable to grow the same things more or less.

Basicly it comes down to this. Your in 8a, you will be no help to me. I'm just trying to make things easy for myself. LOL>

So in other words, don't come into the tropical forums and ask for suggestions on different tropicals that we might be able to grow in a cooler clime that you don't know about because no matter what it won't grow there.

I never thought I would here some one on Daves say that what I might want to grow is a problem and don't bother any of the rest of the groups. We are on our own.

EXACTLY Robin! I am seriously disgusted with remarks being made here, it is just so unreal! It makes me feel unwelcome to DG just because I am not 'suppose' to be growing the things that others are!!!

It's insane to just stick to what you can only have. People collect and enjoy stuffs from other areas. That's the issue here, willing to learn the know hows to keep them alive.
Okay, those of you with a tropical aquarium living in cold countries, logic doesn't tell you what to do, but knowledge does.
My cold climate friends and I, are doing just that...seeking knowledge, so what's wrong with that?
Once upon a time, a trip to the moon is impossible............

Whoah! Everybody take a deep breath and slow down! No one is saying anything at all like "don't try". Ever!!! There are some clear cyber related misunderstandings going on here.
In my earlier post I stated that I didn't understand what you were asking for. When I first joined DG, I quite naturally gravitated to the Tropicals forum. But for the most part what I found there was exactly what I think you are asking for: People growing tropicals in non-tropical places. These parameters did not help those of us who were actually in the tropics, and therefore we asked for a Tropical Gardening Forum. Many of you in this thread visit the TGF quite often, and are never treated any differently than any other tropikid! If I have misunderstood what you are asking for, please clarify it for me.

In the meantime...think pink umbrellas drinks, warm aloha hugs, and stop to smell the pikake.

Yokwe,
Shari

Shari, I'm sorry, but you have clearly read the posts and see that there are many things stated that should not have been. We were all here just trying to get something started that we were interested in, just to get bombarded by those who didn't think it was necessary. I think that we are viewing things differently as some of us have made inquiries about certain things with little, and sometimes, no response. And I am not saying it was you, but I have visited some forums to where I was made to feel 'invisible', and that is not a good feeling! I also know I am not the only one who has been made to feel this way.
Maybe one day I will be a transplant to a tropical area and not have to worry about growing things I am not suppose to.

I just noticed something that could potentially explain some of the problem here--I think there is some confusion between what the Tropicals forum is for vs the Tropical Gardening forum. A few people have raised issues like wanting to know what tropicals will do well in zone 6/5/etc, and questions about hardy bananas like Musa basjoo. I was just over in the Tropical Gardening forum (not the Tropicals forum) and I saw recent threads there with both these questions. I'm sure people got some answers there, but since the Tropical Gardening forum was started specifically at the request of people who live in tropical climates, it might not be the best place to get advice on growing tropicals in non-tropical climates. The Tropicals forum is probably more appropriate for that since it is for people trying to grow tropicals regardless of where they live. I know some people who live in non-tropical climates hang out in the Tropical Gardening forum and there's certainly nothing wrong with that, but perhaps they might find more answers to their questions if they posted in the Tropicals forum instead. So maybe we don't need a new forum, just better clarification of the intention of the Tropicals and Trop. Gardening forums.

Whoa guys, lets not spoil good friendships. I recognise many names here that I have enjoyed "meeting" on Tropical Gardening. I don't believe that anyone has ever been made to feel unwelcome, please don't let's go in this direction. I understand your wish to have a forum that might suit your area better as I also understand that perhaps we are not too much help with cold weather problems, but unwelcome - NEVER!
Jen

I guess it depends on who's shoes you are walking in on how a person is made to feel.

What difference does it make to those who are in a 'tropical' type area if another forum is created for sub tropicals or tropicals for a cold region. It is of no interest to you, you can grow these plants. If the rest want to experiement and push the zones why should anyone have to go to 20 different forums to get answers. I never thought bananas could gow up here, but there are hardy banana trees.

I don't mind keeping it on the tropical forum and discussing everything with everyone but like I said earlier change the wording of the description. Newbies have no idea that that forum is including the colder zones and the tropical gardening was created for your particular areas, the tropics.

Maybe another forum isn't the answer, maybe a description of what is tropical and what the tropical zones are, just to help people in the right direction. But with all the crazy weather patterns these days who's to say zone 11 isn't going to get a real cold snap and zone 6 will have a balmy winter.

It could happen.

Well it looks like Pandora's box here. First I would like to say many of these plants are found in cold climates usually in places like China or in high elevations they have adapted to the cold. Other hardy tropicals I find are native to areas were they have drought certain times of the years and have developed ways of storing energy in rhizomes or tubers. Though they are not meant to take cold this storing of energy has made it possible for some species to survive colder zones as well. The idea here is not to just talk tropical plants many of us grow tropical plants the point here is to talk about plants that survive and survive in harsh cold climates weather it be yucca rostratas hardy palms or aroids. Some plants are not tropical at all like petasites or skunk cabbage but when seen they are considered tropical looking. Their are also nurseries like Plant delights who's main topic of sales are hardy tropical looking plants that can take the cold.
Conversations like these can be held on the tropical forum. I am just not sure everyone there specially people in tropical zones are interested in the subject while northerns like myself would find it very useful. Personally I think the subject is large enough and focused enough on this certain nich that it could create the conversation and activity fill it's own forum. If not then I think it would at least be needed in the near future as this whole form of gardening seems to be taking off.

To me, if you're going to make a new forum, it would be along the lines of something that bwilliams just suggested, about how to get a tropical look garden, not necessarily how to grow tropicals in less than tropical climates since that's already covered by the Tropicals forum. But a forum on how to create a tropical look in colder climates could be interesting and provide a home for discussions that aren't already a perfect fit for another forum.

Separately, I also think it would be good to straighten out the confusion about the Tropicals forum vs the Tropical Gardening forum. The way I understand it, Tropicals = growing tropical plants regardless of what climate you're in (and many of the people who hang out there regularly are in non-tropical zones). And Tropical Gardening = the joys & challenges of gardening in a tropical climate. There's nothing wrong with hanging out in the TG forum if you live in a cold climate, but when it comes to getting answers to questions that relate to growing tropicals in your colder climate, Tropicals is going to be a better place to post. I noticed that some of the people who've been advocating for the hardy tropical forum spend a lot of time in the Tropical Gardening forum, but rarely (or maybe never) post in the Tropicals forum so I wonder if everyone even realizes that there are two different forums, and if they are aware of both then apparently it's not clear what the purposes of the two forums are.

Ecrane, I think that is what it has been about from the very beginning, but I guess we just couldn't get it put into the right words. 'sigh'
And I agree there needs to be clarification on the TG versus the Tropicals Forum. I can't say I have ever started a thread in any other than the TG cause I didn't know any better. But I am sure I have posted in both on a thread someone else has started. I was looking at the Tropicals one earlier and there isn't near the movement as in the TG forum.

Sorry Robin, I didn't mean to say that I was in way speaking out against another forum. I quite understand that it is wonderful to be able to "talk" to people in the same circumstance as yourself. In fact, this is why TG was started by Shari because of our unique areas and problems. I can't make any comment on the Tropicals forum as I don't go there, and have no idea what they discuss, or why it is not a good forum for you. I was just hurt that anyone felt unwelcome on TG, and felt I had to speak out , at least for myself...
Aloha

And for me Jenny...I think we have all tried to make everyone feel welcome in TG. But ecrane3 is 100% correct. There is confusion about the two different "Tropical" forums. That is what I was - obviously badly - trying to say. From what I was reading it sounded like you were asking for something that already exists - the Tropicals Forum. If that forum does not answer your needs, then by all means ask for another forum...it isn't up to us to make the call as to whether or not you get it. But please, never feel that you are not welcome in TG...sometimes those really long threads get beyond me, but you guys do a great job of communicating in them.

Yokwe all,
Shari

Most of you have never made me feel unwelcome, in fact it has been just the opposite. I don't even want to think about any unfriendliness either.

I see there are new descriptions on the forums. This will help tremendously, it is what I said back at the beginning. We just didn't know that the there was a difference. I certainly could never figure out why there was two different ones.

I love posting on both the forums. I am learning from both and I hope have made some new friends in both.

Well, as usual, I am confused. The TG Forum got a new name, why is this?

Oh, and the Tropicals forum has changed too, I see.

i didn't know that there were 2 different tropical forums already in place. i don't use either one because i don't grow enough tropicals for questions to come up most of the time.

the main reason i said i would be interested in a forum like this is that i guess i was hoping to create something like plant delights nursery has. whenever i see that plant delights can grow a plant then i KNOW that as far as winter hardiness goes it will grow here too. there might be other considerations, such as soil acidity/alkalinity to consider but at least i can check winter hardiness. i love the plant files on daves but unfortunately i have found the plant hardiness section to be wrong many, many times.

There are three if you count the tropical fruit forum

http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/f/tropicalfruit/all/

I have read this thread 3 times and still can't understand it!!!! It seems that there are 5 or 6 things being discussed here.

DG even with 234,000 forums(I hope it never comes to that) is never going to satisfy the needs of every single person...d'ya think? Seems to me that searching many forums to find some obscure point is what needs to be done. Tropicals/Tropical Gardening/Tropical Fruits/ Vegetable Gardening - they could ALL answer most wierd questions on growing something "tropical" out of 'zone requirements'...most people who live anywhere could usually do it. I don't like the new name Tropical Zone Gardening because many who grow tropicals successfully do not live in Tropical Zones. There are folks in the frozen tundra of the midstates who have some amazing 'tropicals'.

Tropicals - IMHO - is about the plants themselves and can slide anywhere it wants to grow. Tropical Gardening is about gardening/growing these Tropicals either in Tahiti or Iowa....

Let's all take a deep breath - (((((((((((((((((aloha eachother))))))))))))))))))) and go out there and GROW!!!

Carol

I guess we never thought about the potential for confusion between the two forums. Today I tweaked both of them

Tropicals is now Tropical Plants: http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/f/tropicals/all/
Tropical Gardening is now Tropical Zone Gardening: http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/f/tropics/all/

The Tropical Plants forum has a different introduction; the Tropical Zone Gardening forum has an introduction (there wasn't one previously.)

I would recommend using the Tropical Plants forum for "what-can-I-grow-in-my-zone" questions.

The Tropical Zone Gardening forum is one of the international (regional) forums. As such, it's really meant for those who garden in the tropical climates around the world. (It's a great place to visit - especially in the winter months - but those living in the tropics probably can't help you much with temperate climate questions ;o)