I have come to believe mites are spontaneously created from the Brugmansia plant.
Do they ever go away or do you have to treat the plants every day?
mites mites mites and more mites
Yes. and I believe, Yes. sorry. I spray my brugs down, if we don't get a nice shower to wash them off. And try to get up under the leaves, too. Dang, now you have em' what are you using to get rid of em?
LOL tednugent! I'm not laughing at you...but I had to laugh when I saw the title of this thread!
I wish you luck! I've been fighting them for weeks now and I'm thinking it's a neverending battle!!!!
LOL Ted! Sometimes I think so too! I never had mites in my yard till I had brugs. And since we had that terrible heat spell, I have them all over now. They exploded. I read that they love the new green growth that all our overfertilizing causes, so in a way we call them to us.
The trouble with them, is you have to treat them immediately when you see them because they travel fast. I have read they even hitch a ride on your clothes and go plant to plant. Also because they hang out on the bottoms of leaves, it is so hard to hit them all. You leave a few and they come back.
Another thing, is most of us are using miticides that are now only partially effective because mites mutate so fast and get used to them. The good miticides are the new ones to the market that the mites hav enot built up a resistance to but all are so expensive because of their short life of being effective. So I think you only get a partial kill. And that leaves the rest even more resistant. Also some miticides kill mites in only 1 or 2 of their stages of life, so again, you do not hit a knock out punch. The few stay quiet until environmental favorable conditions exist and then come roaring back.
Mites make brug growing almost unacceptable to me. I hate feeling my yard is a toxic dump. When I have small outbreaks, Neem Oil works great for me, and it doesn't make me feel poisoned. But when you have a lot on huge brugs it is hard to cover them in Neem to get all sides of the leaves. And then I really feel like dumping the whole lot.
That makes me feel better I thought it was just me.I use bayer,and ortho, also neem ,insecticidal soap,and a couple of other organic products (oils of some kind I cant remember right this minute) plus I have been washing them with a water hose sprayer almost every day Except the days I spray mitacides I would give up except brugs are one of the few plant I can plant the deer wont eat and they are starving right now.
I forgot to mention I dust them with diatomaceous earth frequently usually after I spray them with water hoping it will make the dust stick so I can wash it off the next day or two.
I am usually a organic gardener but these mites are slowly winning maybe I could use Avid and spray a lot less does anyone have any experience with it they could share?
I know lots of people love Avid but my experience is that it does not work well here. The California mites are becoming too resistant to it, it has been out on the market too long. But the price sure looks more reasonable so you may want to go with Avid.
I am going to try Forbid which is the newest one I think (could be wrong). It works totally different than other miticides. Also it is low on mammal toxicity which makes me feel good. You also do not have to hit the underside of the leaves to kill the mites there and it has a long residual effect. The trick with all of these is not to use 1 kind over and over again but to rotate them to reduce the chance of increased mite resistance. Mites haven't had a chance to be resistant to Forbid so I decided to go with it. I am just waiting for my new vaporizer sprayer I bought from Rosemania to get here. I now mean business. LOL Do not mess with me.
But to tell you the truth, I died at the price. I just shut my eyes and hit buy. I am just sick of them so I am willing to pay whatever at this point.
Floramite is supposed to be good but it too is expensive and does not kill broad mites, so when (not if) you get those on your brugs, you will have to buy another miticide in addition to it.
Rosemania has good write ups on most that I know of:
http://rosemania.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/page9.html
Good luck. I HATE mites.
Oh my gosh I had thought avid was expensive now it seems pretty cheap let me know how the forbid works. maybe it can be bottled into 1 gallon doses and sold thet way to recoup a part of the investment just an idea.
If you want to try another option to supplement your attack. Try 1 part liquid soap,1 part mineral oil, 8 parts water, delivered through a spray bottle. It works for me but mites aren't a huge trouble for me, like in the south. Joelle
Kell, did you know they are sold out of those sprayers at the Rosarium? They said until October I think it was. They don't say how big a sprayer it is. I saw one somewhere and thought it was pretty expensive for the size it was. Can't remember now where I saw it, how much it was, or how big it was.
If that is what you are waiting for why don't you try to get one someplace else? Sure wish I could remember where it was. Battery operated would be nice I think.
Hi Jeanette, I got the Hudson Fogger. It is supposed to put out a fog that will go 20 ft and get in between tight leaves. It is electric. I have mites on my trees. If it doesn't work well, I will cry!
Also it supposedly uses les insecticide which is so good since Forbid is like gold.
http://rosemania.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/page2.html
Sorry, Rosemania is what I meant.
When are you going to use it? Please let us know how it works. Also the Forbid.
Jeanette
I have been using the systemic. Do you think the Floramite will be too much for them with that in their system?
Kell - GOOD Plan, the rest of us will anxiously await your results.!!!
Broad mites down here only to have a spider mites infestation take it's place. Now you know that just doesn't make good sense!!
I'm stripping leaves and spraying down one more time. I looked at the foggers and figured Bob would 'do in' all the critters around here if I got one of those. (Dogs, cats, parrot, cockateils, parakeets, rescued dogs, strays that came to stay.)
Please have whomever is going to use the fogger to suit up like this or better before they use it. Bob didn't have a straw hat so I asked him to wear one of mine and that's one of my scarfs we used to protect his neck and head. Boy did he get hot in that outfit although he sprayed early morning when it was only 85F. (I can't use chemicals because I've already had the lower part of the left lung removed due to a cancerous tumor.)
I need to make a decision to either burn the brugs to get rid of the mites before they go to my other plants or try a fogger if this next spraying doesn't work. Brugs seem to be their food of choice at the moment.
Judy
Great picture Judy!!
What did you fog with Judy??? Jeanette
Volck Oil from Lowe's works best for my mites. I've had very few mite problems since moving them out of the basement this spring. Sprayed a couple of them with it a few weeks ago - they be gone! Hope this helps. It also took care of one of my brugs with catapillars. I hate catapillar more than mites.
Crystal
I split the cost o f floramite with a friend...... along with stirup..which theyselll with it.. it's phermones..sexual attractant to go in the posion....so if you miss an area.. the mites there leave to go to the posion area..looking for what's going on with that sex thing there..
ALso the floramite is to be alternated with other kilers to keep the mites down... nicely floramite.. isan ovacide also... it kills the eggs... most of the posions...when you kill the mites you have... 20 minutes later ..the eggs are hatching new hoards of mites.. which aren't killed by the treatment.. going to alternate the floramite with forbid... then the plastic explosives..
Gordon
And not a creature was stirring all over the leaves! I finally did my first spraying with Forbid and today my leaves are clean. Still look a bit war weary, but clean of mites. Actually, they are not too bad at the moment as I removed the yellowed leaves and incinerated. JP was hit the hardest and is standing in her pot looking like a skeleton. She may not be brought in this winter - a true mite magnet.
Tussee
Crystal, thanks for the tip on the Volck oil. I read about it and it says it also controls mealy bugs.....and I've had a heck of a time with them and mites. I tried it tonight....wish me luck!
Oh Tussee, I have so many brugs that look like skeletons! Yikes!
Mine are starting to look that way. Not quite there yet. I hit them with Floramite today but did not get the stirrup M Gordon. Hope I am not sorry. But, darn it, when you pay that much for something you shouldn't have to buy something else to make it work.
I have Volek, but have not used it. I was using Neem but it didn't do it.
Jeanette
Jeanette.....
Well.. I looked on it like getting a package to work... if you're buying a race car... you'll be thankful you also got the racing tires.. I do use the coco-wet with the SNG along with their Bills perfect ferts.. they have some idea as to how to get their products workable ....the stir up M... is helpful if you missed some of them in spraying... if you're real careful to get them all... you should be just fine.. I always follow up the floramite in a ffew days or a week... with another cocktail where I mix whatever I have togeter.. and give them something they have never seen before.. a systemic anda few other killers I have about.. I believe they have taken refuge in the overlapping leaves of the mornng glories now..
It's also good to do a visual ID of which mites you have..
Gordon
Gordon, these are strange mites. I am hoping not broad mites because the Floramite says it will not work on them. I do not see webs, I can hardly see the mites. I guess I am assuming they are mites. If not the Floramite probably won't work.
Isn't Polmolive soap the same as the coco-wet? Do you use Messenger? I do not know if it is true, but have been told that SNG a day or 2 after Messenger is really good.
Have you used the systemic Di-Syston? That is what is in the Bayers 2 in 1 Rose food that I counted on for years. So, I found a place to get the Hi-Yield Di-Syston and have used it, but for some weird reason, I don't seem to get the same success as with the Bayer. I didn't want to use the rose fertilizer on the brugs.
I am wondering if the Floramite and the Di-Syston will be too much in the system of the plants???
Jeanette
Jeanette - I've used Neem also. I like the Volck better. With the Neem you have to mix in a little (just a squirt) dishwashing soap, but not the kind that has a degreaser in it (like Dawn). I like the cheap lemon kind for mixing it. It makes the Neem mix better with the water. Hope this helps
Crystal
Well, I'll try it Crystal. I tried my Floramite, but maybe didn't give it enough time. I just keep taking all the leaves off and finally chopped up and destroyed Tiara today. I just couldn't take them any more. I didn't put any soap in with the Neem. Maybe I should have.
Then to top it off we had a windstorm yesterday that knocked my biggest and best budded Grimaldi off the deck railing and broke the center right out of it. I guess I just was not meant to have brugs. After this fall I will decide.
I will try the Volek. Thanks Crystal.
I should try Volck too. I have never added a sticker to my Neem, but I use the stuff already prefabricated. I bought the pure Neem and it was a real disaster, it separates out. The Neem by I think Safer, goes on OK for me.
Jeanette, I have heard Palmolive is great to use on the plants. I use it on my aphids with great success. I wish mites were so easy.
Oh NOOO!! All budded and your CG took a nose dive. Not fair at all!
Too bad about your Tiara too. I never could grow that one, it always was a failure to thrive for me. I am hoping Charleston, which is Tiara's sister, is easier. So what does your mite damage look like, Jeanette? Broadmites attack the new leaves and cup them. They get very brittle. I let the spray soak down the stems too. Here is a pic.
Kell, you forgot the pic. I know what spider mites are. These start from the bottom leaves and go up. They must travel up the stem? Have you heard of that? They first of all concentrate around the base of the leaf starting about 3 or 4 inches. Look kind of like a crust on the back side, but like little pin spots where they are sucking the chlorophyl out of the leaf on the top side. Then before long they are spread over the entire leaf with the tiny pin size spots on the top side. When they have covered the leaf it is almost silvery looking..
I will see if I can get a picture tomorrow, altho, I filled a big bag with leaves this morning so I might not be able to.
Kell, about the Neem oil. When it separates like that in the neem container, put it in the microwave on high for about 15 seconds. Then when you run the water in, use real hot water. Just a little bit. Then switch to lukewarm. If it separates then, I shake it real hard.
I have the mites or whatever they are on the plants on one deck but not on the other. I think the problem is, overcrowding in the hot weather. Because, if one gets something, it has spread before you see it. Especially something like this. I always watch for the spider mites. Today I did find a web on one leaf on the Tiara so that is why I got rid of it. That was besides the other.
Also, I have been finding earwigs right down in the center of the new growth . I think they eat holes in the leaves when they are new, and then when the leaves grow, obvously the holes get bigger too.
You know Kell, I used to spray my plants with peroxide. I wonder if that would help? BTW, have you used your fogger and Forbid?
Jeanette
I am going to use it tomorrow when my DH is home to help me with the fogger. I still need to buy a respirator. I went to buy it yesterday and just now realized I left the store with a cartful of plants but never went to even look for the respirator. Welcome to my life.
I never have studied spider mites, Jeanette, so your observations may be universally true. I can just see the damage they do a mile away on my brugs. And what the bottom side of the leaf looks like when infested. They seem to work fast too. I think the wind takes them all over.
Broad mites are much worse to me. They so deform what they attack. Here is that absent pic. LOL
Boy, do I know those!! So far I have not had those this summer. I'm sure I might before the summer is over. Then I had something that was attacking the new growth but it wasn't spider mites. It deformed the new leaves. So, I used neem there and that worked. I could not see anything on them and it was only one plant.
But, I think when we are treating affected plants we are bound to get some that are just out there taking a look at where is the juiciest place to start? I don't know, now I am getting weird. LOL
Depending on your water and air temperature , you can add from a teaspoon to 1/2 a cup of rubbing alcohol [ in the winter I use 1/2 a cup and right now I am at a tablespoon ] I was using the alcohol with Volck which is heavy- thicker oil .
Now I have switched to the Neem and like I said a tablespoon of rubbing alcohol . Oh sorry -
I SPRAY EARLY EVENING ONLY ---
2 tablespoons of neem , 1 tablespoon of rubbing alcohol and a gallon of water .
I use a pump up sprayer and shake up until it looks all bubblely inside . My sprayer only holds about 1/3 of a gallon . I use it all - I don't save any - I don't know if alcohol breaks down Volck [ I was told it does ] or Neem , but I don't want stuff sitting in sprayer and then have to clean later .
I don't know how mites move and haven't used tangle-foot on Brugs but I do put it on my apple tree to stop wholly aphids and ants . [ hasn't stopped them ]
I have noticed that the raccoons , skunks and cats stay away the night I spray . The alcohol Volck spray make my grapes [ thompson seedless ] ugly where the soap Volck mix didn't . I haven't sprayed the grapes with Neem /Alcohol yet .
So Tony, what does this get? Are you talking like aphids, mites, or what? You said it doesn't stop wooly aphids and ants? I don't have a problem with raccoons, skunks or cats. Heck, even I would stay away from that mess. LOL
Just in case you all have seen this thread.... this is my 2 cents or more like a quarter since it is so long.
http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/643963/
Judy
I have been using Floramite on my Brugs & MGs & whatever those pesky mites are attacking. It does work but it takes about 5 days, then they are gone! Then I don't have to spray again for 25 days or so. I really spray good, I tip the tall ones down (most of mine are in pots) so I can spray both sides of the leaves & the bases of the leaves & any new shoots. I spray every one in the same area. I have a couple that are 10-12ft tall, obviously I don't tip them over, but I spray the heck out of them & they seem to be doing fine. I don't think I have ever had Broad Mites here, knock on wood! Just spidermites.
White Flies are a pain too, & I have noticed the Earwigs in the new shoots too, thay are hard to kill. But they have not been as bad this year as they were last year. The mites seem about the same as last year too. I try to get to them right away, cause you know what happens if you put it off a few days!!! I have Volack oil too but have never used it on Brugs. I may just suprise those mites next time & use that! I used the Bayer 2 in 1 last year but it didn't seem to slow the mites down. I haven't used any this year on the Brugs, only on my Roses. This Brug addiction is not a cheap one! Bj
I just read the product guide for Floramite ... it doesn't kill broad mites which I supposedly have and or had, but it surely knocks out many other mites. Knock on wood, but these mites haven't found the roses or Hibiscus yet!!!
Judy
Judy I am so sorry about your plants. I know how totally frustrating these things are. Did the Ag agent say if the mites would continue to live in the soil where the brugs were planted? In that area? I suppose they would travel to other plants? Or would they live that long? How far can they go?
Did he address that issue at all?
You had a real good post on these terrible critters. Good luck with the rest of your garden.
Jeanette
Jnette
We didn't discuss the items you mentioned with the Ag Agent, however he suggested we spray the ground around the brugs, which I didn't want to do because I can't find anything saying it won't kill the worms on the other hand I can't find anything that says it will. However Bob and I decided to take his advice and spray under the brug canapy, I like multiple trunks, bushy type brugs.
We have an extraordinary high number of worms in the soil because we have nutured/fed them for years and never used any pesticides other than the odd hand full of sevin dust when there was no other choice. All my potted plants sitting in the yard have worms in them, they've crawled in via the drain holes. I think the alfalfa pellets attract them and their casings are good for the plants.
Judy
That is good that you have the worms. I don't have many because there is so much sand here and my house is built on granite. There is a lot of granite on my property.
I have a pretty good compost pile going and every time we go fishing and buy worms I put the extras in the compost pile when we come home. So, possibly I can build it up. Also, before I mulched my garden I put a lot of alfalfa pellets and steer manure down.
I also found worms in a muck bucket of potting soil I had used for a brug. You ar right, they do go in the drain holes.
I"m BACK! With mites too!!! Lucky me.
The spider mites are on some hoyas...and I have been round and round robinhoods' barn with advice and advice and advice. In a nutshell...this is what I got from the Extension Services' Plant Pathologist:
The 'new' product I bought called TetraSan which is a Miticide/Ovicide is minimally effective. (78$ sounded better than 240$ for the Ovation - ovicide). It inhibits molting which, I guess, kills the mites. However, Carmine Spider Mites don't molt...SO...HELLO?...this product is deemed 20% effective. Why didn't they charge me 20% of the price?
I went for the Ovation to use with the Avid...and will spray in 7 day cycles. 2 should do it. I did like the Garden Safe Neem oil concentrate I bought at HD..it took those suckers out FAST...and will continue to use it on spot problems. Haven't noticed problems on the Brugs...but then, I don't want to know about them!!!! I admire from afar...!!! I love my brugs but I am having trouble dealing with so many 'special needs' and our fertilizer bill is outof site!!!
Carol, The Mite Murderer of Puna!