Member feedback ratings

I really think it's a good idea.Any rating system will have it's flaws.I am sure, like everything else about DG, Dave will keep a close eye on it. I am all for giving it a try and see how it goes. I really don't see allot of negative post being made. Like somebody said above things happen. If the person is up front with you and lets you know, something is going on then no problem.I just don't want to see this turn into a negative comment because somebody's trade is a few days late or something like that.I think we all know when a trade is really bad or if other things might be going on with the person. I think we need to really think about it before leaving a negative post. Will there be anything about the rating system on the sign-in page? If so that might discourage people some, if they are just coming here to rip people off.

After thinking about it, I do agree that it should be similiar to the GWD in that we can go in and adjust our positive to a negative or negative to a positive.

With daylilies and Iris, we may not know if we got the correct trade for an entire year, which was the biggest problem, recently, I think . If it had simply been a matter of not sending what you are supposed to send, it would have been a different matter and probably easier to have cleaned up and spread the word.

I can agree to Send Terry 20 named Daylilies, and stop anywhere and dig up a bunch of kwansos, and she won't know for a year, perhaps longer what she's got. Same thing with iris. I too, would like to know if someone chronically leaves bad feedback.... if someone has 10 positive things, and only one negative, I'd like to know what that negative said about others. That could be as much an indicator to me as to whether I will trade with that person as someone who has 20 positives beside their name....if they continually leave bad feedback, I'd probably skip doing a trade with them--because the MAJORITY of the folks here are good and decent people, and they do send good trades.... however, some folks can find fault with anything, and I'd rather not trade with someone who isn't going to like what I send anyway. :-)


I am hoping that this is a benefit for subscribers only too?

Even more reason to pay the small price for admission. :-)

Dave, Thank you AGAIN!

My feeling is a bit passive but I think kharma plays heavily into trading. Im a bit nervous about having something wrong said about me some day ....but Ill just continue to be a good DG neighbor and trust all the nice folks around me as well. Alot like life I guess.
Heh heh I was just imagining the TRIALS with Jurys we could have!!! We could have prosecution, defense! Exhibits! Oh the DRAMA!!!!!!
Ive traded a few years now and have had really nice experiences. Most people just want to impress the heck out of eachother.! But I did have a package go awol this summer. Melissa Ohio was very very gracious about it and its in the back of my mind to fix her up a suprise some sunny day, but what if it hadnt been her? What if itd been someone who was feeling angry impatient and ready to burn me at the stake. ? Okay,,,,,,,,,,,,, this is a community and its a very necassary part of working together
G2

Keep in mind there IS a check-and-balance, namely

1) your own track record; and
2) your ability to respond

Let's say Trader_A has done a lot of trades. They've got all positive ratings, but one negative rating where a package to Trader_B went AWOL (or they had a personal crisis - or even flat-out dropped the ball.)

When they realized their mistake they tried to make it up, but Trader_B had already posted a negative rating. So they respond to the feedback with a statement "This package went missing; when Trader_B emailed me, I immediately sent out a replacement box with my apologies."

And let's say Dave allows us to change our rating, but Trader_B fails (or refuses) to update their rating.

Now let's say I'm thinking of trading with Trader_A and Trader_B. Quite honestly, when I read the feedback and response, and realize that Trader_B is being either stubborn or remiss, I'm more likely to take a risk on Trader_A than Trader_B ;o)

This is going to be very interesting because a lot of us know each other which is different from rating an unknown person. I will watch closely!

I have never - EVER - not sent a trade in return, or one that I wouldn't want to get myself, and I have never been a fan of trading feedback on this site. So I disagree that the only people who will really hate this will be only bad traders. From past discussions on it, I don't think I'm the only good trader who feels this way.

However, I have to admit that my feelings get hurt and I usually feel pretty miffed when I don't get my trade in return. And I agree that it's unfair that anyone can take advantage of good traders because there would be no repercussions. So as much as I hate to admit it, not having something in place isn't fair to everyone either.

But, unless there's something I'm not thinking about, I don't see how this allows for a difference between someone who runs into snags and someone who sets out to be deliberately dishonest. I just think there are possibilities of more problems as it's set up right now, and something this important should have all the kinks worked out before being implemented.

Edited to include this:

Terry, I think I am missing something. In your example. If Trader B left negative feedback and Trader A made amends and added to the feedback but Trader B doesn't update, does that mean there would be three entries in this case?

Also, I think I should logout and poke around some.


This message was edited Aug 16, 2004 9:08 PM

Larry if you send out plants for postage and they never send the postage you give them bad feedback. It's the same thing as not fullfiling a trade. You are still being ripped off. I am glad to see this happen after what happened to so many people by Bloomluvr2003 aka thehumblebumble

Where would these ratings show up?
Sorry if that's been covered, I just don't have the stamina to read all of the preceding posts. I'm all out of breath.

Ref: http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/403184/

Go to your Member Page ;o)

Well I'll be . . .
Glad I asked. Thanks, Terry.

I'm not sure how I feel about all this, but willing to give it a chance. I'm a little concerned about members, or ex-members setting up a new account and leaving bad feedback just for spite, even though it has no basis what-so-ever, and is just made up.

I'll be looking through my trade lists and trade tracker and see if I can come up with all the people I've traded with or who have so generously helped me and my gardens out. I'll be back.

Been reading through this and sure am willing to give this a try. I had a close call with a daylily trade, mine was to go out this week. I also have been stiffed for postage-keep saying I will not send before getting the postage first-but when you have dug that pile of bulbs!?! and you trust someone who posts here and you (I ) keep on getting excuse after excuse and the bulbs went out this spring???? Just gets to me. I do a wee bit on eBay and like the + - and reply. A nice way for feedback and also to explain a position. Hope that it works here the way it is laid out-protect from the very few who do a lot of ripping out and causing stress here.
Add: I will go through past trades and give feedback to my wonderful folks ASAP :):)

This message was edited Aug 17, 2004 12:31 AM

Long thread. I'm going to start a new one with some answers.

dave

Ok, where to leave the feedback at ? not sure on that one, I too think we should be able to warn folks here of bad traders coming over from other sites, I know one in particular that came over from there. After all thats what they do, they get banned from there for bad trades and come over here.

I too would only leave negative feeback if they didn't respond to my emails and didn't send a package at all, I wouldn't leave negative feedback for a small package of plants where I sent big ones, I wouldn't leave negative feedback if they hadn't sent there,s but have been responding with me about why and said that they would send soon.

kathy_ann

Go to their MemberPage... you'll see a link for feedback.

It is ashame it has to come to this.. I would only give negative feedback when necessary. I really enjoy this site. I have learned allot from fellow members about gardening. It is so fun trading, and making new friends. Dave I appreciate you taking action on this subject., and trying to protect us honest traders

Continued at http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/450816/

there is a spot to for rebutals! this is GOOD! I think dave has done one heck of a job again

Well, I will start doing that from now on but I couldn't possibly go back and leave feed back for all the trades I've sent or received now. I wouldn't know where to begin. But I have never been dissappointed nor left anyone hanging I don't think. If I have please let me know so we can start this off on a good note.
Jan

Sorry that it has come to this policing action. Really glad that the only things I do are give lily seeds to people and constantly beg for La iris seeds from people. Hint hint.

I have found that seeds sent to US of A must be disguised as Homeland Security is routinely destroying them if they are so labeled.
(Found this out last year when sending lilium seeds to the NALS lily seed exchange).

Seeds get into Canada without any prob. luckily.

I've sent seeds to UK, Denmark, Norway with no probs at all. Australia & New Zealand are a diff. story.

Inanda feeling sad about this necessary policy here on OUR Garden.

This can be a great thing. But there are some issues I'm concerned about.

The post office sometimes makes mistakes and some people understand, and other people seem bent on blaming the trader. I have had plants that I've sent packed well and in sturdy priority mail boxes arrive crushed and late. Some people don't except the fact that it was beyond your control. Not everyone uses the post office as an excuse for sending trades late, sometimes it really happens that way. I sometimes offer replacements when able but some people never seem satisfied with the best that you can do.

Also, some people don't pay attention to the fact that your offer for plants may have been ex: a rooted african violet leaf (as stated in your post): and they were expecting a grown plant.

Some people also don't seem to listen when you say that plants for postage get second priority to trades when some one is sending you something in return. It should be stated but as I've said, some people just seem to care what your post said.

The two things I have the most problem with is boxes being left out in the elements, and the plants usually don't survive. Some people understand, others don't or wont.

&

Then there's transplant shock issues, I've had plants look great but arrived in really bad shock. I trade new plants all the time so I never know what ships well or not.

Thanks for listening if you got chance to read all this, I know, it was alot.

-CaptMicha

Having done customer service for a major plant company, I can concur with many of your reservations, CaptMicha. Hopefully, people will be more forgiving with folks they see and talk with in the forums than they are with companies, though.

I think people can understand when someone is sincere and "things happen" - like with a crushed box or a lost shipment. I am sure if this happens once among several good transactions then a person's good character will show. The "weeding out" of unreliable/inconsiderate/unethical people will benefit the the broader community.

It seems to me the greater complaints would be the sad fact that some traders don't trade, just receive. In the case of plants, the investment is much higher than with seeds. It seems poor packaging or shipping techniques can be dealt with on an individual basis. If such issues are not resolved, then it is time to post something negative. Some of my best trades started out shaky and got much better after we cleared the air.

i think it is not fair. i have negitives on my member page due to postal problems and have emails to show how much i have complained and now i have negitives due to things getting lost or stolen in the mail. yes i have asked for things to be resent if possible and some things more then once in my case as it kept happening. my old post office since i am now in a new town has a stack of complaints from me on this. but should i be punished due to problems i have no control over?

down side of this is now i have been turned down for trades twice due to this. the post office is not in my control and things do happen. i ask everyone to put tracking on my stuff due to this fact. it makes postal services honest.

things happen and in small little town and especially overseas shipments things get lost taken or stolen.

is everyone whos stuff gets confiscated due to customs gonna get negitive feedback when they have no control over this??

i think now people who get negitive feedback wont want to trade because people wont trade with them and they may be the best people to trade with but things happen they have no control over. its not right. and now i am having to deal with people saying no to me because of postal problems i had no control over.

i emailed people when i had postal problems and have always been up front with people. now my feedback tells a different story.

i am in a new town and a new place but right now no one is giving me the chance to prove myself due to bad feedback. kind hurts when i know i am a good person.




This message was edited Aug 28, 2004 6:32 PM

I think this is a good idea & I am also very happy to see a chance for people to post a rebuttal. This should weed out the honest traders from those that take advantage. I am sure there will be some negatives that really were just a legit mixup, and those can be responded to in a rebuttal. I know that if I see several positives and 1 negative with a believable rebuttal, it is not going to keep me from trading with that person. But when you start getting several negatives & a pattern starts showing, then the excuses & blame shifting are going to show up for what they are. I think it is going to take great courage to post a negative for someone & I hope that if people do not have that courage, then they will refrain from posting anything at all. It would be sad for people to post a positive rather then have someone mad at them. That would defeat the whole purpose.

Perhaps Imazdi, you should offer to send your end of the trade first. Surely folks would be willing to trade if you indicated that you would send them either their trade or postage prior to them having to send their end to you. Over time, I am sure that these new trades will result in your receiving positive comments that will overshadow the negatives that you now have.

What I really hate to see happen right off the bat is the people that do recive bad feed back, and give an excuse, and another excuse on and on, and you go along with them, as soon as you do leave the feed back they go and post bad feed back on you.........LOL.....live and learn........sure glad I have traded with lots of folks and know a bunch of you........
:o)
Dee

Thank goodness ebay feedback doesn't have a forum where folks can go on and on about their feed back and back and back.

Perhaps this thread should be closed?

Wow! You are brave, Daisy.

How's that, Ulrich?

You'll see, I'm sure.

Edited to add a link to a thread I started some time back that nearly got me tarred and feathered and run out of town on a rail, hee hee.
http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/403184/ten+lines

This message was edited Aug 28, 2004 11:59 PM

Actually Ebay has a wonderful forum for asking questions, venting or just plain visiting. It is along the top of the ebay page under COMMUNITY.

Yes, but ebay has over 30 million users and I know about COMMUNITY because my primary income and business for the last 6 years has been ebay. This is a miniscule site in comparison as is this forum and thread. There is also Safe Harbor reporting for repeat offenders.

I too am glad to see the feedback here on users but the option to give a rebuttal has a place and it should not be in Dave's Garden.

This thread was not started for rebuttals.

Just my opinion, but I think if Dave did not want peoples opinions on this post, then he would NOT have left this thread open.


This message was edited Aug 29, 2004 11:22 AM

Daves idea regarding feedback is a valid and sound one, in this I applaud him. It was a big descision on his part to initiate this system and I am sure he did weigh the options. However, Dave knew there are people here in our garden that do prey upon our goodwill, who are not honest/trustworthy and need to be exposed. Truly he did us a favor. I will not hesitate to do my part in warning others when needed. Yes, I agree that it does take great courage to post a negative on someones feedback and sad to say not everyone who has been ripped off will do it....but at least the tool is there to be utilized when all else fails. I also refuse to publicly bash anyone who initiates a negative feedback to a member. Personally I would like to know beforehand on those who created problems or ripped someone off before they have dibbs at me - IMHO my plants/seeds do carry some sort of value no matter how petty others may deem them.

Some people will always blame others when they sink their own ship....the fact is they never made sure they were sea-worthy before they set sail.




This message was edited Aug 29, 2004 12:47 PM

you dont want negitive feedback dont leave negitive feedback. some people feel if you leave it then you deserve it back. whats fair for the goose is fair for the gander gramy used to say.


but think and make sure you tell the whole of it. before you leave damaging feedback. i have emails concerning one of my negitive feedbacks but the only way someone will know the truth is to email me .

others may feel the same as i do when they get negitive feedback. no one knows the truth except the parties concerned but now people dont want to trade or anything because of negitive feedback. that isnt fair when the dispute or wrong doing outside of your control is between those people and those people alone.

but now sue to feedback people are going to make snap judgements and people lose all the way around. people arent gonna give anyone a fair shake because of negitive feedback. it could just be something between people and all the truth isnt out due to a rebuttal limit of space and then people just see the short side of it and make snap judgements.

someone just isnt going to say okay she/he left bad feedback so now i am going to leave good for them. yeah right. doesnt work that way.

then people find this a way to get back at each other for bad trades, or things said or done to them all in all through forums or trades or whatever.

feedback is a way to hurt people and get revenge. i hardly ever leave feedback on ebay due to this. but ebay hounds you till you do. i hate feedback ratings. things happen things go wrong things go right. its part of life but to ruin someones reputation because of a few bad trades and then no one wants to trades is gonna cause alot of problems in the long run.

get all the facts before making snappy judgements over feedback!!!!

the whole truth of it isnt there and only mainly the whole truth is known by the ones who left it and replied to the feedback. get the facts before you decide not to trade with some one.

in my case of thetwo of the three negitives left for me. i ended up having to use my hubbys po box in the state across from us ( live on the border) to get the seeds in question because my post office was bad. and now they merged two more post offices with it so the problems are gonna really soar.

glad i moved away from that one and can say have recieved all mail at new po box.

Whatever happened to Love, Hope, Faith and Charity? All I can say is, God knows.

"eyes"

The facts are all there in the rebuttals, no need to further explain. At least we know now by your own admission that the feedback system is working.....

Not everything is an excuse or a lie. I think this thread was a great idea for people to post their comments. The more we learn, the more we understand. I know that after reading this, I'll consider (even more) the other person's side and what may have happened.

P.S. I haven't really seen much feedback yet on anyone, how many people are leaving it?