Membership

Bernie, you should have received two renewal notices. If you didn't, can you double-check your profile and make sure your email address is correct? If it is, then all I can guess it that maybe it got swept to your delete file with junk mail? If you feel pretty certain that didn't happen, can you start a new thread and ask Dave to check into it?

Brenda, you and kooger may want to tag onto one of the (unfortunately, many) other threads about the newsletter's sporadic behavior.

Terry this is the most recent newsletter issues thread.....I searched for it last night when I posted unless it's somewhere other than DG forum. I went looking for the thread where Dave said there was a Cron problem.

I also received two newsletters. no prob' to me

still receiving two newsletters as of 6/6

As to why someone doesn't renew? I'll give you some reasons that come to mind for me.

The welcoming someone new is a great idea; I have extended personal "welcome to Daves" to folks on more than one occasion. Were there welcomes to me privately? There was one, from Gardenwife. :-)

Like it or not, there are a few cliques, and if you're not a "part" of that clique, you are basically ignored. No, I will not point fingers, or give examples-- just reasons why someone would not renew.

Just like real life, there are the "popular" people and the not so popular people. The popular people post and have droves of people responding to them, The "not popular" people post and are lucky if one or two answer them. Goes hand in hand with the "clique" thing.

How many times has a newbie posting a question been told, "we've discussed this before, go here and read" then we cite a URL on Dave's to a long ago discussion. I'm probably guilty of doing that too; but, one of my professors once told me, if you have a question, more than likely there are others who have the same question but are afraid to ask. If we direct them to another thread instead of taking the time to personally answer them, is that the right thing to do? I don't know. Would that turn someone off? Probably.

The "drama" that comes along everyonce in a while, has already been mentioned.

Too busy, don't use it, heck, I joined the Weight watchers website a year ago, it has forums too, but I rarely use it.(obviously)

Maybe they joined because they wanted information on one particular thing they saw but couldn't read without subscribing, they did, found out what they wanted to know and haven't been back since. (Initial reason I joined)

They started with the 2 months for 5 bucks and let it expire because for whatever reason, it just didn't fit their needs.

A quick look will show you more trading going on at "the other site" than here. If someone is really into trading, they're going to spend most of their time there, why pay for something you don't use?

Less Co ops? If someone joined for the unique feature of co ops, the drop in number of them this year might be cause for a non renewal.

Thankfully Dave's has the option to only "watch" forums you're interested in, if it weren't for that feature, there would be way too much "fluff" for me to successfully navigate, and would be more aggravation than it's worth to try to find my way around. Something anyone who emails a new person might mention. Yes there is something for everyone, but you can easily "ignore" the things that don't interest you. No offense, what is my "fluff" is another person's treasure. :-)

A personal observation that makes the forums hard to navigate at times. Yes, we all love pictures, but, if everyone starts a single thread for one picture the forum quickly gets bogged down, and it's hard to find other messages among the all picture posts. I LOVE to look at pictures, but let me give a generic example: I have an Olympus C-750. Someone posted something like, Look at the great closeup I get with my camera. Instead of responding to that, I start a new thread, and say something like, here is my closeup with my C-750. If 8-10-15 people do that in a row, the "conversation" threads on the forum are bumped to the second page. What if a newbie happened to post a question amongst the photo posts, and it moved off the front page of the forum before someone could answer it? Just something to think about.
Maybe Dave could give a choice (similar to viewing feedback on ebay or email messages in Yahoo) whether we want to view 10, 20, 50, 100 threads on a single page. I'd like to see the 50 most active threads on the first page of a particular forum instead of the 20 that are there now, but a choice would be awesome.


Probably the BIGGEST reason I could think of that somone would not renew is the fact that with any message board (or email) it is very difficult to convey emotions/feelings using only the keyboard. I have witnessed on more than one occasion someone getting "huffy" because they took what someone meant in a not serious manner, very seriously. Everyone behind these screen names are human, and humans get their feelings hurt, sometimes easily. If someone's feelings are hurt, and they leave, more than likely they'd never admit that to anyone, even if they did get a "personal" email from a "peer".



Again, just some reasons I thought of that would cause someone not to renew.

I'm also glad that this site is about a whole lot more than trading plants. That's one of the things that makes it so special. It's about love and friendship and sharing. I've never seen an on-line clique, but then I don't see a lot of things. Perhaps that is because I'm more focused on what I can offer others rather than worrying about how many people are viewing my threads.

This site is improving every day. More and more people are joining and being welcomed. That didn't used to be the case, but with each passing day, we learn and grow and become a little better at being the kind of people that reflect the genuine mission of this site.

Understanding why some folks would want to leave is important, thus this thread. I hope we'll continue to learn and make the kinds of positive changes necessary to make this site the best it can be.

Melissa,
IMHO I think there may be some truth to your clique statement. However, I think it has more to do with the fact that some people have been a member of Dave's since the beginning or at least a couple of years and have become fast friends.

Yes, I have noticed that a newbie has a hard time getting an answer sometimes, in fact, quite often. When I first joined I had the same problem. I was a little miffed but decided that was the wrong approach. I searched enough other threads to see that it happened quite often and if someone didn't get the answer they wanted, all they had to do was *bump* the thread back to the top with a new question or a statement such as "Hey guys, I really need an answer on this. Anyone?" Then usually someone would answer. I'm sure that some people would not come to that conclusion and just leave.

I think you're idea of being able to view 10, 20, 50, 100 threads on a single page is a great idea.

You're last statement about people being human and it's easy for feelings to get hurt is SO true. I have had to modify my posts on several occasions before I hit the send button. With as many members as Dave has, it's going to be hard to keep tempers down ALL the time. It's a fact of life that we are human.

Smiln32,
You were the first one to welcome me to Dave's and I felt very welcome here. Thank you! Sending people a welcome note is probably the most beneficial thing for keeping people and making them feel welcome. As for why people would leave.......I don't know. I just can't imagine why anyone would leave. I LOVE it here. Common sense tells me that the longer I'm here and the more I post, the more friends I'll make and I need all the friends I can get. I'm a stay at home mom and I don't get out much. :-)

Definitely some truth to your observations, Melissa. And understandable, of course. Some members have been friends for 3 yrs. already! I'm fairly new and have noticed and been emailed about other newbies not getting their questions answered. The post will get lost in between friends talking back and forth and if I notice, I try to respond to the newbie's question or comment, just so they know they aren't being ignored. No one likes to be ignored and ignored people will soon stop posting. :)

I no longer know half of the fora here, I try to make time but it's not always possible. I do understand about some of the new members though, it happens to members who don't post much too (regardless of time signed up). Hey, you know for some of us, even an oldie like me, it's still about the plants *G* the friendships (which I cherish dearly) are a wonderful bonus.

I'd not bother with a final questionnaire it would be a wasted effort on me, those who'd need to know would be emailed privately.

Melissa, you've brought up some excellent points. Some are things we can work on (as humans), some are things that technology can be tweaked to make better. And some are things that come with growth that can't necessarily be removed. (And if someone wanted an answer, paid $5 to get it, and have no need of our forums, I'm glad we were able to help them, and maybe they'll remember the site and pass along the word to others who could benefit from a long-term membership.)

I do try (not always great at it, but...) to look for posts with zero responses. If it's from a user I haven't heard of, I especially try to take the time to read and give SOME response - even if it's "welcome! and here's a link to a similar thread" ;o) If I don't know the answer, but I think I know who might, I try to take the time to post a message saying "don't give up - I'm going for help!" and then email whoever I think can help them, with a link to the thread and ask them to respond if they can.

There's no formula that will guarantee 100% success on keeping people, but if more people will send out a welcome note to the newbies (especially if you see something you have in common, such as where they're from), and if we all make a bit more of an effort to look around for the posts from the less-talkative and/or newer members, and see to it that they get a helpful response, I think it'll go a long ways toward making everyone feel the same warmth and camaraderie that draws so many of us together here.

This is a very good discussion and has expressed alot of different viewpoints. I have been a member for some time now and really enjoy DG and it's members. I don't post all that much, I'm more of a reader -lurker- whatever you want to call me. I read the forums ( alot of them) every day. I learned so very much about gardening , I can't express my appreciation enough.

I almost didn't renew . I had many reasons (I thought) that were justified. I am not much of a computer person and I don't understand journals. Have never found the place for a want list or wish list that I see people talk about. I can't partipipate in many trades , I am bontanical-name challenged, and most people want to know more about what they would receive than just a common name. I use the plant data base alot and if not a member , I could still do that. I don't do much with seeds.So I don't trade them.
I wished often, when I first joined ,that I had a close friend or buddy to help me navigate and learn about DG. I now know that my questions would have been readily answered by the knowlegeble members here, but at the time of joining , I felt shy and very reluctant to show my ignorance of plants or computer skills. I think Carla's personal welcome is the best thing I 've heard . If someone had e-mailed or sent a personal welcome, I would have asked that person all my questions until I felt comfortable asking publicly in the forums. Just MHO only. Lou

Just for the record...I'm not the only one who sends out welcome messages. I know gardenwife and tcfromky have both sent out welcome messages, too. Other's, I'm sure, do from time to time, also.

That's great! You'all deserve a big round of applause.&^^%$^&*())**(clap, clap, clap translated).I think it is the best way to retain subscribers. Lou

I have enjoyed and learned so much with my membership, and as long as I am gardening, I'll be here!
I did, unfortunately, spend several hours trying to utilize the Journal to save the fertilization and bug killing receipes I wanted, and store plant info from the Brugmansia forum. I never could figure it out.

I just recently renewed for a year after having the 2 month membership. I renewed because I use the plant database a good deal, and have learned much from following the forums. However, to be completely honest the real answer is something else.

Being summer, and so everlastingly busy I might have let the membership lapse, but I received a personal welcome from Smiln32. I followed the forums along to make sure her husband got home safe, and followed her plant trip adventures with interest. Information I can usually track down, but good people are hard to find. I have been shy about posting. As always it is a bit difficult to work up the courage to step in to an established group, but I am looking forward to taking a more active part.

In particular, I am looking forward to winter when chores slow down, and I can plan and map and identify and dream--this time with help and advice and ideas from all over the country.

Judy

Judy, that is about the best reason I have heard. And please jump in and post anytime. We don't bite....at least not too hard. I promise!

I have to agree that personal welcomes are a great idea. It also opens the door for emailed questions about the site that might not be comfortable posting to a forum. I tried to follow the Welcome forum for awhile, but with all the garden work I have here, I found I was only welcoming a few and felt like I had neglected the rest... so I quit trying... mistake?

As with any organization, growth means we can lose our personal touch. It's not intentional, but with thousands of members, you just sort of find your niche and settle in. I used to post to lots of forums, even when I had nothing more to say than 'Gee, how about that!'. I was pretty ignorant about boards or forums, so I thought I should respond to everything. Nowadays, I stop to consider whether I have anything to offer. I think that's a virtue rather than a flaw.

As for misunderstandings, I'm pleased to see far less quarreling than we had a while back. If there has been more, I've missed it... good. It really is hard to convey the intent of a written correspondence, so when some seasoned member suggests that all caps is 'Shouting', they are trying to be helpful, not judgemental. (Just an example) I've stepped in doo doo several times in the last couple years, and it is one of the reasons I don't post as often. As with Baa, the plants are my main interest, and I don't want to find myself outside the gates of the garden because I mis-spoke or was mis-read.

One of my pet peeves is 'garden snobs'. I quit our local garden club for that very reason. It never occurred to me that I might sound like one on Dave's, so if I have, please believe I'm not a snob. I like to have the botanical names because common names just don't pinpoint a plant. Common names vary from state to state, country to country. I love to trade seeds, but have to wait as much as two or three years before I know what I've grown if the trader has no idea what the botanical name is.

So, I probably won't be sending out personal messages much, and I may not spend too much time on the Welcome forum, but I'll make every effort to look for those unanswered threads (I've had a few of those myself), and I'll always answer any emails that are sent to me. I'm no expert, but I'll share what I know.

Very nicely said, Weez. I try to watch the new subscribers list and send welcome emails to those in my area - usually SD, IA and MN. And also in ON because that's where I'm from. Most have replied and I've had really nice conversations with them and I hope they have felt welcome to join in anywhere on DG.

I have learned so much in this thread. Making people feel welcome seems to be the key from what I've read. I think personal notes to new members is vital and hope more people will do this, at least to folks who live in their region. We all want to feel like we belong and this can be as simple as a few lines and the "Send" button.

I always try to make a point of welcoming new members I see from Ohio and contiguous states. It's great to see locals come on board.

As a mere two-month subscriber and a new gardener, I can attest that finding a personal email from Carla early on absolutely made my day! I mean, she was an UBER and wasn't even close geographically! :) I had read other posts by her, along with those of other long-standing and well-respected folks from here, and had already seen the benefits of the site. Carla, accompanied by all those other delightful folks that responded to my Welcome Mat thread, made me feel comfortable enough to go on to post questions and comments and even start threads.

I like this community! *GRIN*

*HUGS*
Donna