Pugh Bear's Propagation Thread

Doesn't work. Haven't heard a thing from Admin. jen

Wow I tried to real it all but to no avail.

I think it was a little intimidating to get into this thread too at first but you were all so welcoming that I got into the drift fast.

I suck at propagation but have propagated several things since getting on here and it was more successful for me than in the past so that is good. I also saved a barely thriving Austrailian plant that I don't remember the name of that I got at this outback nursery on the way to Phoenix. It was dieing for a year and before it gave up the ghost, I took a good branch and put root stimulator on a piece of it and tacked it into the ground attached to the dieing parent and the parent died over the Winter but the branch lived so I cut it apart and it carries on.

Have any on you propagated Vitex in any manner? I have some but want to take cuttings. I don't know if this is the best time though as it is our hottest month in Aug. and sometimes Sept. here. I get those balls and try to soak them but they never germinate. I got some seeds sent to me and somebody sent me seeds, not balls. Someone sent me balls too. I have no clue if the seeds are in the balls or the seeds came from the spent flowers. I can't get those Vitex balls to do a darn thing. I love the plants though. I also want to know how easy it is to propagate Buddelia from cuttings and if so when?

When in doubt ask the expert, so I contacted Shoe and ask him his opinion about ES. He is so nice and helpful and I do respect his instructions because thank God he raises my kind of plants too. LOL Here ws his reply. He pretty much answered my concerns and I have decided after all that, not to use it for now. I already have plenty of what ES gives my plants going into them by other sources. I could harm them if I used more. The fact I use the Liquid Iron formula along with the MG with the same things in it is sufficient for my plants.
Here is his reply:

Howdy, Friend!

I was just reading the thread on Gardenia. There is a bit of misinformation there and I hate to contradict others. Maybe at some point I'll point out a few corrections, most of them are minor anyway.

Epsom salts is fine to use on potted gardenia. However, your best bang for the buck and as a kindness to your plants is to use it as a foliar spray only, not adding the powder to the soil. A teaspoon (or up to a tablespoon) mixed in warm water in a hand-held quart spray bottle then sprayed on the leaves will bypass the root system, going directly to the top growth and will allow the plant to use it immediately. This is best done mornings or evenings or on cloudy days when the stomata (leaf pores) are open; they tend to close up during direct sunlight/heat of the day.

Keep in mind that some fertilizers have magnesium in them already so you should read the ingredients. Same is true with sulfur being in most fertilizers. If your fert has both of those ingredients then adding excess magnesium may inhibit uptake of calcium. Also, a fert high in potassium will inhibit uptake of Mg so a proper balance is necessary.

If you use one of the liquid fertilizers (Miracle Gro for example) I'd go for one with an NPK ratio of 3-1-2 for an excellent balance. If no magnesium is listed as an ingredient then feel perfectly fine using Epsom Salt as an amendment (foliarly) from time to time.

It's common to add magnesium to potted plants, either through house plant fertilizer or potting soil amendment. In-ground gardening usually offers enough magnesium in the soil as it is except in certain parts of the country or where there is considerable rainfall and/or leaching incidents.

Back to your 'starter gardenia plants', keep in mind a pH slightly on the acid side (as I'm sure you know) is fine especially if using balanced fertilizers or ones touting "for acid lovers". Note the "slightly acid" part...too acidic and once again the Mg will not be usable by the plant if used as a soil amendment.

Hope this helps. Hope it is not overload!
Holler back anytime you like...

I must do some shipping today so I will be back later. Today Dave is to come back. Hopefully he will.

Evelyn.... this will be fun... I'm going to the nursery today to buy some root hormone...I will try to root a chocolate coleus for you. I know you will love it... they are such beautiful plants.

I enjoyed the conversation about the epsom salts... I've been thinking about using it on my Meyer lemon tree which has some yellowing of the leaves... for some reason... I had the instinct to spray rather than sprinkle into the soil... so that was good information... thanks everyone.

One of my 'pollinators' has decided he/she loves my basil!! All the leaves are stripped... I couldn't find the worms... but I suspect a little white butterfly that has been hovering.... my thought is to move some into the garden window in the kitchen for me and leave the rest outside for the pollinators...I'm trying to be magnanimous but it's hard when I love basil so much! :)

I have some really pretty heliotrope blooming in the garden (smells so wonderful) and a dahlia named 'Jenna' (my daughters name which is why I bought it) that is a bright fuschia pink! The dahlia is in the front of the house and I see it when I walk up the driveway on the way home in the evening... it's a cheerful plant! Does anyone have some ideas for nice looking stakes... the homemade kind? I hate to spend money on stakes... the dahlias that I grow are tall and all need staking... my stakes are functional... but not pretty. I thought about staining them... but I don't think that is a good idea as the stain would most likely leach into the soil when I water... and paint seems so artificial... I'm not terribly creative .... any thoughts?

Have a great day everyone....Nancy

Mornin' Dawn,

Dawn, you really lost me with your Vitex an balls. Don't know what either are. I assumed that Vitex was a plant until you started talking about balls. then I thought maybe it was those balls that contain seeds and you throw them out to start like wildflowers or something. But then you talked about vitex cuttings so decided that wasn't right.

Please help me here. Jeanette

JB, I would never contradict Shoe.

Hi Nancy, Would you please post a picture of the Chocolate Coleus? Sounds very intriguing.

One thing, before I forget it, which I do real fast lately, JB, Shoe did say powder when referring to the Epsom Salts. I am not sure if there is one like that and I have just not seen it, because mine have always been white granular and I let them soak in very hot water, just enough to cover it in the bottom of the container, and then after about 5 minutes I run a bit more real hot water in and make sure it is dissolved before adding cooler water to it to use. Otherwise I end up with the ES in the bottom of the container not used in the end.

OK, Nancy, I love Heliotrope. And yes, it does have a very nice aroma. Stakes for Dahlias. What I am thinking it is too late for now, but for next year, if you remember, I always pinch my dahlias when they get about 5 or 6 inches high. To make them get a lot of stems. This way they don't require staking so much. Some not at all. They hold each other up. I pinch each new one that comes up. You will not have as large a flower, but you will have more flowers.

As far as "prfetty" stakes go, don't know. I would say just to go thru the online catalogs in the gardner's supply and others and get some ideas. You don't have to buy theirs, but you can get ideas.

Jeanette

Morning everyone. I am just checking in. I am taking Burk to work and then spending the day hanging out with my Mom. I will check in again later on.
Seas the day!

Linda, have a wonderful day with mom!! Jeanette

I don't know if the seeds are in the little balls. They look like MG seeds. So I always tried to nick them and soak them. No luck. Someone sent seeds so I don't know. Vitex is known as Chaste Tree. Maybe they don't do well in the Pacific North West.

http://theseedsite.co.uk/db22.html
"theseedsite" said this:
"Vitex agnus-castus Verbenaceae
Seeds are dark brown woody balls with a point."

So I guess the "balls" are seeds, not pods.

Maybe they need to be held moist in the fridge for a few weeks to break dormancy. Or winter sown.


http://www.nsl.fs.fed.us/wpsm/Vitex.pdf
by John C. Zasada and C. S. Schopmeyer
said:
"Seeds germinate readily without pretreatment (Dirr and Heuser 1987). However, stored seeds may exhibit dormancy that can be overcome by stratification in moist sand and peat for 90 days at about 5 EC."

They also said that "nursery practice" was to stratify seeds of lilac chastetree.

I found another source that advised a 2-week moist-chill stratification for the Verbena family.


When in doubt, I would try adding a little hydrogen peroxide to the pre-soak water, in case that helps.
Like 1 1/2 tsp per cup, starting with the weak "3%" hydrogen peroxide, not 30%.

P.S. Some seeds lose their dormancy just by being stored too long. So several-year-old seed MIGHT have a lower germination % than stratified seed, but higher than non-stratified seed fresh seed.

Corey

Corey, do you use the Food Grade Peroxide? 30%? Reason I wondered, is because you advised Dawn to "start with" .03%. I would not advise anyone to have the 30% around unless you know what you are doing and have a use for it.

It is very strong. A lot of people use it for washing/sterilizing. A DG friend years ago used to use it to clean the area where her dog had it's babies. She raised and sold them.

I don't have any of the "strong stuff" - just the 3% Hydrogen peroxide. I think it is more widely available at drug stores.

>> Like 1 1/2 tsp per cup, starting with the weak "3%" hydrogen peroxide,

I didn't mean anyone should change to something stronger after "starting with" 3%. I agree that 30% peroxide calls for some caution, maybe even gloves and goggles!

I meant that, when making something for soaking seeds, it's convenient to take 1.5 tsp out of a bottle of 3%, and dilute that up to one cup.

The "starting concentration" would be what you find in drugstores (3%), and diluting that 32:1 would give you a "final concentration" of around 0.1%.

And equivalent would be to add 3/16 tsp (= around one millilitre, or 20 drops, or maybe one small eyedropperfull) to one ounce of water.

The same source that suggested suggested double strength (0.2%) for spraying on sick or fungusy plants.
(1/4 cup of 3% H2O2 added to one quart of water).

http://www.using-hydrogen-peroxide.com/gardening-with-hydrogen-peroxide.html

Corey

Well, I had a great day. just give a little old lady from a small mining town a power washer hooked up to water and watch her have fun. I had the window washers coming this PM so I washed down any area that was not touched by the rain, if and when we have it. My main focus was on the front courtyard. Took me about 1 1/2 hours.

I dead headed some coleus. I plant the pieces into my holding area. It takes them about 3 weeks to root.

I found one seed pod on my new lantana. "Rose". I purchased three in Spokane and hand carried therm back in ther plane.

Dawn, behind my wrought iron fence are 4 chase trees in the green belt. Last year we had many coming up under the trees at the end of the greenbelt by the golf course. I will go down there sometime the next couple of days and see if there are any babies. The trees behind me are loaded with seeds or they were. The birds have been in them for weeks. They are a little small than a pepper seed before you grind it. .

I got another ripe seedhead off of Moy Grande hardy hibiscus and another ripe seed head off the pink and white rain lily. Peppermint, another patented hardy hibiscus has three seeds heads.

They made a hugh marijana grow house bust today. Two houses. You could not believe all the beautiful propagation equipment they had. Police went in front door, bad guys went out back door.

I received 3 rooted Plumerias today as a gift. So I am going to watch the evening news and then I need to get them planted into pots. I will see you all tomorrow. 105 today. Sharon

Also received, from same young man, a bag of Mardi Gras seeds. it is a varigated green and white leaved bush with pink flowers and fragrsnt. Zone 6 to 9. Sent about 5 pods and about 200 seeds. Anyone want seeds? I am going to plant some in pots and some in the holding bed.

Ok Sharon, I'll take some seeds. I know I can't grow them outside but if I can, I will try in the house. Wonder if they will go year round? Send me a couple and I will try.

Evelyn, I still haven't forgotten your caster bean seeds. I really will get them out. Jeanette

Only we could look at a pot bust and envy the propagation equipment.

"Look at all that! Oh, WOW!
Really Good #$%&, too!"

Corey

Well, Jnette, i now think it is Plumeria seeds. I have asked the person who sent them. But I will send you some anyway. It will be a fun project for all of us. Now I am on the hunt for the other plant I found.

I just came in from gardening for about an hour. Beautiful time to garden. I have been up since 6am so i am probably going to crash while I am typing.

I made a list of what i need to do tomorrow because 3 things i was going to plant from seed today did not get planted. OCD was in full bloom today. BUT. one thing on my in the head list was to clean seed pods out of KOI pond. Pleasant surprise was the gardeners did it yesterday.

Whoops, just wrote a long diatribe but it wasn't on topic so ttyl, Jen

I think off topic is OK until we open our fireside chat area. Dave will retuirn. But as long as we are not killing each other or telling each other to eat dirt, I think we are OK. Just put OT at the top of the post.

Now you know why all my clients and employees called me Mother Winter

Jeanette I guess my description of Balls on the Vitex was not that far fetched after all.
I do soak them with 3% peroxide but nothing comes of it, all seeds are fresh from my present seasons plants but I did not statify them. Will try that or just layer them in the ground attached to the plant. It goes dormant in the winter here, so hope it will have time to grow roots.

Thanks for the info guys.

Sharon our Lowes has the sickest looking inventory this year. Everything will be going on the clearance shelf for sure. They had three of them and lots more needs to go there. I guess that humid thing we had last month did some damage here to all the nursery stock I'm told.

Dave how are you hanging in there. Prayers for your quick and successful recovery.

Maybe Terry hasn't had time to get around to this one yet is why you can make up your own rules for now.

Oh, and Corey, you can joke about all the stuff in those p b, but no kidding, they spend a lot of money on that stuff. The kind of stuff we would love to have but don't spend the money for it.

Reminds me, I have that stack of trays to send Dave. Been looking for a box for them and Bob just told me about one he has down stairs. Yeah, they came from a p b. Never been used and am sending Dave about 70 or 80.

Jnette, I am not making up rules, just going with the flow. No one bothered us before the battle.

So I feel if we stay within reason, they will monitor us but basically leave us alone.

I got on here to do some banking and check on something for the Board. I am planting seeds today for several Mother Winter, "I Want", projects.

I have a new seed pod on the yellow rain lily. I will see when it ripens how many seeds.

Dawn, I went to several nurseries looking for a particular plant and could not believe the dire shape of the plants. Maybe that is why I have not purchased any new plants.

See you all later. Dave, where are you? I read abut the terrible thunder wind rain strom you guys had.

Oh Man, I would love some of the propagation equipment from a pot bust. LOl You all are right, they have the best stuff. I always look for the cheapest way possible and then dream about the good stuff. LOL
Had a great day with Mom, We went through all of the home stores and now I want to redecorate everything.
I am planting today. I am totally bringing my potting mix and pots inside because our heat index right now is about 108. The problem is that I am not getting anything done outside. My plants look as tho they are the abandoned orphans of the island. Burk just told me that I can rearrange part of the dining room and use it for plants. WOW! maybe he isn't quite ready to build my pantry, but I will sure take over that space for a little while.
Well, I gotta get busy. Will check on you all later.

Does anyone know how to root the clerodendrum Bleeding hear vine? I have one I would love to have more of.
Thanks, Linda

Linda sounds like you had a wonderful day with your mother. How nice. Redecorating is for fall and winter projects. LOL, you have plants to tend to now girl. Good grief, 108!! But you are on the water so should not get the humidity that the rest get, is that right? It would be bad enough to get the heat, but to get both would be a killer.

Boy, I just don't know about bleeding hearts. My guess would be to divide the plant like most perennials. Bet Dave will come on here and tell us. As a matter of fact, didn't he do just that a day or 2 ago? I am going to go look. ttyl,

Nope, I was wrong. He talked about laxatives, I mean Epsom Salts, and phlox. Not Bleeding Hearts. Jen

JB said on Facebook she was having a down day.

Wonder why?

I feel like I have some bug. I'll spare you the wierd details but have been feeling yucky for two days. Did not sleep for crap. I need to water at least my bargain plants from lowes. Yes, I guess us and humidity and heat are not good on our plants grown for our dry climate. I heard it is coming again this weekend, at least a chance for it. I guess it was true that most of the nurseries have been hit with dieing plants.

My Brug is large but not blooming, my old one that I have in the ground, stays tiny but has two blooms. I have yet to see them bloom, but they are there.

JB posted on Facebook that she had her hair and nails done, mowed the grass and she now feels better.

Dawn, us desert rats are not use to humidity.

I got some gardening done but it now looks like Saturday is going to be the day I get seeds planted I am getting my hair done tomorrow.

My poor garden is ready for August heat to go away.

It said on the news that Oklahoma had another bad storm late yesterday. I hope Dave is OK.

I will return tomorrow. Be safe and be happy. I need my camera. You cannot believe my holding garden. Full again. Sharon

OFF AND ON TOPIC, I THINK

Good morning everyone, thank you for going off topic and discussing my mental health yesterday. Much of this confusion on this list has contributed to some of the way I feel I am sure. My private emails are increasing because those of us who did not stay on topic during the day are using other methods to communicate. I feel so bad about those who are sitting there waiting for Dave to get better, or for this thread to get back to being a "Propagation Discussion Group of Topics of No Interest to Anyone." I am sure the administration would take a while to figure that one out but it may work. Just a thought.

I have not been posting because usually in the past I posted in the morning to say good morning to all, then I waited for someone to get up and the day went from there. If I had a question, no matter if it was a shrub or a gardenia, I ask it and the discussion took place and that was it. If it was a weather discussion which was my favorite topic, it did help me decide where and when I could ship plants to. But, since we are to start a new thread for every plant, there is no way to know, after the specific topic is started where the people are that you want to address your question to. Most of the people I discuss propagation with are here on this thread. So, I just do not bother. I have been going to All Things Plants to talk and discuss different questions and topics. They have their problems I guess because although the boss man DG Dave has tried to improve the mistakes he made here, there will always be someone who is not happy.

Don't you find it interesting that the number of view is 843 and the replies is 188. Who in the world is watching this thread and not joining in the discussion? I suppose that is Jen and my fault for not being here very much.............as it was OUR bantering that kept them away. I don't think so. The problem on this thread was not the discussions/and playing we had over the years. It was the discontent that was brought in by Katie with Ruby and unfortunate as that was, it was not really solved, because the problem people were not the only ones who were so called punished. I wish those hundreds of people who are not speaking up would JOIN IN AND tell us what they want to know. There is absolutely Nothing here to draw interest anymore. And for those of you who said you hesitated to join in but did anyway, aren't you glad you did.????...........see what you would have missed. We are not a group of stupid, foul, loudmouth jerks, as it was made sound like we are, we are a group of intelligent professionals who enjoyed each others company, shared information and thought we were doing good for those who needed our expertise. Yes, we get rowdy and naughty at times, but THIS IS THE REAL WORLD AND you find me someone who doesn't and you will see one miserable person. Or one person who professes to be perfect and is just a hypocrite.

I want the group back and I do not care where we are. I have not heard from Dave and I am sure he has a good reason.

As I said before, Good Morning my dear Friends. I hope you have a wonderful happy day. I know I will now that I have said what I had to say. See you later.

Oh my goodness! I haven't thought about who stole the eraser in forever. Thanks JB. :)

Um, I agree that this thread now does not make any sense to me. As a newbie coming into it was like standing on the end of the high-dive board, pinching my nose before I jumped and hoping for the best (if anyone who looked in on it was too scared to post they could have/should have posted in the propagation FORUM and not on Pughbear's thread).

It has always been said on Dave's page/initial post that the only stupid question is the one not asked.

So there must be a LOT of stupid questions out there. :D

That is my hypothesis in response to your post, JB.

Beyond that, I have nothing to add about propagation except I am still trying my hand at it and will let someone know (maybe Terry?) if I have a problem.

A.

Good morning everyone.... I was asked to post a photo of the chocolate coleus and I let the time get away from me so Evelyn... here you go... sorry for the delay. It's really such a unique plant... I really like it! This is a nice close-up. Nancy

Nancy, that is a gorgeous coleus. Afternoon all! I managed to transplant all my little seedlings yesterday and a full flat of daylily seeds. Today it is rainy and thundering so I am just hanging out in the house spending tons of time on the computer.

Jnette, we have both heat and humidity because there is so much water. I lived in the desert as a kid and even all these years later I think I would love to live in a dryer climate, especially if I had my beach close by.

Hi to everyone, hope you all have a good day.
If for any reason we move somewhere, let me know where you go.

Linda

Just dropped by because once again thinking along the lines of propogating some things for next year and selling at a couple of Farmer's Markets in the area. I too am interested in the Hibiscus and see that Linda is the lady to see regarding them. Sharon, I have been meaning to write and tell you that I was given a really lovely surprise one morning after requesting some pink Hibiscus seeds from you. I had forgotten that in the spring we had ordered and planted two Hibiscus until the morning that I looked out the back door and to my great surprise there is a beautiful red one as well as a beautiful pink one. Now if I can have some luck propogating both, I will be a very happy camper. John took pictures this morning, but I haven't downloaded them yet, but will post as soon as I get them on here.

I am happy that this group has been able to once again thrive and that no one seems to be worse for the wear. I have known several of you from other forums over the years and regard you as sensible and caring folks. Dawn, received you seed package yesterday but haven't opened it yet, but thank you so much for them.

With a very few exceptions everyone I have ever met online from Dave's or in person at our local plant swaps and other areas as I have traveled from home and met Dave's Gardeners that way have been the very most giving and caring people all together for a common reason, a love of gardening. Probably at least half of my gardens are from members of Dave. There are many out there in Dave's land who have also been gifted with seeds and plants from me.

I too feel a special fondness to Dave's Garden website for the difference it made in my life some years back when going through a hard time and which with the help of members here, I recovered and am living a much happier life than might have been possible if I didnt have so many who cared and who by their actions and gifts in the mail, showed they cared.

I can only hope that I will be of assistance to new people in the future and make them feel as welcome as I have always been when participating in the chats.

Dave, good thoughts coming your way for a speedy recovery. To all others, I hope you have a wonderful weekend.

Ruby

Ruby I am glad you got the seeds. Hope they are not crushed to death, I wrote hand stamp on them. Like you said you won't be planting for a while now.

JB I can tell you took this really personally. We are still here and frustrating as things are when they change, we will figure out how to do it for the sake of each other's friendships. Which we got here on Dave's nice Propagation thread. I think venting is necessary sometimes, but don't check out on us. We still want to hear your pearls of wisdom. lol

I am bored and browsing the boards, and I must say that of all the OFF TOPIC posts I have ever seen, this has got to be the OFF TOPIC-EST!!!

http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/1209200/

Sheesh!

JB and Jen - you got nothing on urbanveggies. :P

A.

That's a good one Amanda. Urban veggies!!!

hellnzn11 I propagate my buddleia in January. It was actually the first thing I ever rooted and started my obsession! I usually take a whole stem/branch and cut it into 4in pieces. I make a diagonal cut directly below a node. I dip the node end in rooting hormone and stick it in a mix of peat and perlite. I water, bag them and keep them under lights until I see growth. I remove the baggies after growth appears and keep them under the lights until it warms up enough to take them outside.

Jb I am glad I joined in. There is always someone here to answer my questions, at what seems like any hour LOL. I also have learned a couple of things in the short while since ya'll welcomed me.... speaking of which I have to find that darn bag of epsom salts my ferns look kinda yellowish.

Hey all.

I am locked out of my hotmail account for the moment in case you were trying to get me. :D


A.

Well we had a wonderful cloudy day. I thought it was going to rain but no such luck. I went outside about noon to look around and came back in about 3 hours later.

I cleaned out the area that have to LA irises. I also cleaned thr area that has bearded iris.

I was walking past my tomato/pepper raised bed and heard a noise. I looked around there was this dasrling little cotton tail. I guess I know who has been eating my peppers. Now I need to investigate how to keep cute little bunnies out of my vegestables.

My female schnauzer fell in the pool again. Both times at night and after 10pm. The landscape lights go off at 10pm. Just a miracle we found her in time. I now have the doggy door area blocked off so she can get in the side yard but not the back.

I have my first cucumber. Last year I got one, so maybe this year I will get two and break a Sharon's home grown cumcumber record.

Everyone is hiding today so I am going to go hide also. Sharon