Philosophy 102

Good story. ^_^

Back again from the edge of oblivion (hopefully for good this time around!), and I have very much enjoyed catching up on this thread! I am fascinated with the wonderful minds and senses of humor in this group! I won't comment on much as I am so behind, but will say that I loved Pixy's chant (I too will leave out the splits and handspring however!), am still snickering about the visual I have of Steve's cheerleader outfit, and Judi, your last story put a smile in my heart!

It has been a very busy week, and yesterday my daughter Mary and I made and canned applesauce from the apples we picked in her future in-laws' orchard. Mary has done this before but it was my first time canning anything, so she was the kitchen boss and I was the grunt. I never knew how satisfying it is to see all those jars lined up, full of something delicious that you spent hours making. Especially if you picked the fruit! Remember, I've been a corporate city girl for way too long so this is special for me. What a nice day it was.

I don't know about the rest of you, but I enjoy the cold rainy days. I feel a bit lazy, and I use the weather as an excuse to drink lots of hot tea and read by the fire. I have even taken to doing the newspaper crossword puzzles. My garden has been abandoned for the time being, and I've yet to pull up the tomato and green bean plants. For the first time ever, after raising a load of kids and having a demanding job, that it is actually possible to slow with the season and enjoy it. So all of you who have trepidation about retirement, fear not - you will finally be able to live.

Oh, in case you all think I'm a totally lazy bum, I've been doing volunteer work, and the most rewarding is with a program called SMART (start making a reader today). it's a great program!

Judi,

I helped Mom can for the first time last year, and you are right...there is nothing like the feeling of seeing all of your little jars in a row and knowing that you will be able to enjoy the spoils of your garden all winter! That was all it took..I am now officially hooked! Also, good for you on being able to relax and enjoy the onset of fall. I am still worrying about outside stuff, but I think it's because if I actually spend time inside, I will guilt myself into having to clean my poor ignored house!

For the record, I do not consider people who have worked hard their entire lives and now are resting and relaxing and doing whatever they darn well please to be 'lazy bums'. It must be very nice to be able to live life at whatever pace suits you, volunteering if you want to , not volunteering if you don't want to, enjoying the rain and the books. It sounds just lovely to me.

Yes it is just lovely. We have been retired since 1987 and are enjoying every minute of it. But you will be surprised how busy you are.

I have been working hard today and yesterday but my long ferry trip from Juneau to Wrangell was wonderful. I read a book about the gnostic gospells, and napped several times. I watched eagles, sealions, gulls, otters, cormorants, as I sailed by them at a slow 9 to 12 knots of ferry placidity. The ferry was mostly empty but the few of us who sat and talked and just savored the alternating sun, fog, and clouds all day. When we got to Sitka it was all sun and the hike to town and around was exilarating. As the night sat on us early at 4pm, I crawled back into a book about the fur trade and what the early Americas looked like to these early adventurers. I fell asleep on the floor of the ferry waking only to the port of Petersburg we stopped briefly in around 3 am. Back to sleep to wake to my arrival in Wrangell to pull my kayak on wheels while pushing my work supplies a mile to the clinic to set up and get ready for the people to show up. It has been so pleasant. I too want to retire but not now.

What an amazing picture, Sofer.

It was downtown Sitka day before yesterday when I was out in a boat with a Tlingit friend of mine. Fresh snow in the mountains behind Sitka.
This is looking out to sea from Sitka.

Sofer I love your photos - Sitka is an interesting town. It was balmy and sunny when I was there so it was fun to wander around and enjoy the beautiful scenery.

Yes retirement is great. I have been so busy I have no idea how I had time to work. This is a much more peaceful lifestyle! Before I returned to school to become an architect I had been an RN for years, hence my arch career of designing hospitals. I have an inactive California license and I decided I could be more valuable as a volunteer for 'Outside In' if I got an Oregon license so I will start classes in January. I hope this old brain can still retain information - just this morning I took out the recycle trash and instead of dumping it in the recycle bin I dumped onto the compost pile. Then I had to gather it all up, shake off the leaves & dirt, and put it in the proper bin. Geeeezzz.

I want to pick more apples and can some more! julie, I know what you mean about ignoring the inside of your house. I have gotten very lazy about that, and I don't see that changing any time soon!

Today I went to Fred Meyers to pick up two items. Freddy's is not my usual market but they carry the dog food that Koka loves. The other item I needed was a jar of capers. I grabbed the dog food and after a search in this store that is the size of Texas I finally found the condiments aisle, and my capers. That aisle is really long, and packed full. I was amazed at how many condiments are available, and then I wondered just how much they contribute to good health. I picked up some random bottles to read the labels and there is nothing, except one brand of mustard, in that aisle that humans should be eating. I love love love catsup but it's not so packed with nutrition. Then I realized that for years I have been reading labels to see if stuff contains anything 'bad' instead of reading to see what good nutrition the item can provide. Now I'm thinking about all the little daily decisions and choices we make everyday, and if we do so thinking about avoiding what's 'bad' instead of what will bring health and happiness. I am going to try to think about my decisions and choices differently for a few days.

I don't read labels thoroughly anymore. Mainly, I "scan" them: if there are more than a few ingredients, I probably don't want to eat it. I think it's great that we have so many food choices, but the result of that is food that contains preservatives.
I love to cook - but these days I've been eating much simpler due to the food available from my garden.
Cold weather = dwindling harvest = disappointment. BUT, I am grateful that i did not have to hunt for my dinner tonight!

I admit I am label reader. I prefer to buy things that don't necessitate label reading, like broccoli, oranges, or nuts from the bulk isle, but my busy life means I get processed foods more than I would like to have a quick meal.

Portland, it's an excellent point. Making choices based on positive things rather than negative things. It puts more positive energy out there for all to enjoy and attracts more positive things into one's life.

Pix, in just one day I found it is more difficult than it seems. I think it will take practice!

All the good stuff takes more effort . . .

Definitely. It takes a lot of practice. And on some days it's almost downright impossible.

Uhhh, I suppose the COstco hotdog and soda pop that we ate for dinner yesterday was not on the "good" list. And the Halloween Candy for dessert? And the bowl of Life cereal for bedtime snack?

I did have acupuncture today. What is the general opinion of that type of treatment? Does it really work?

I love acupuncture. It works, but it's not going to be as fast as taking medicine. And it depends on what you are getting it for and how good your practitioner is. When my son's face starts breaking out, we go to the acupuncturist and it starts clearing up right away. Of course, they usually give him some nasty tasting herbal brew to take as well, to support the liver, but whatever. It works nicely for his skin I can tell you, and he is very good about brewing and drinking his herbal tonic, even though it tastes really foul. I had a spur on my shoulder a couple of years ago and it hurt me to lift my arm straight up. The pain was very acute and sharp. The acupuncturist fixed it in 3 sessions. He also used another device that I think used sound waves. It made the muscles in that part of my arm very relaxed. The same guy treated my daughter's thyroid problem and it improved radically very fast. He was such a talented acupuncturist. I wish he was still around.

There is quite a lot of research regarding the efficacy of acupuncture as a treatment modality for many different ailments. Here is a link for you to explore:
http://tcm.health-info.org/WHO-treatment-list.htm#_psych

I don't know about the hot dog and candy and the life cereal. If it made you happy, it's probably all good! I was thinking along more general lines in terms of decision making rather than just food issues.

Thanks for the info. I want to know more about it, I find it fascinating.

Acupuncture has been around for thousands of years. It's recognized by most major insurance companies (at least) for pain relief and that says a lot.

My dog, Nick had it after his spinal cord injury. He would welcome the vet/acupuncturist at the front door and then run to his dog bed to lie down and wait for the treatment. The first time he was a little nervous. By the last treatments, he would fall asleep immediately. My friends have had similar reactions from their pets.

It's generally supposed to free up your qi (chi), the energy you channel through your body from the earth, which is all-healing. You can "run" energy on your own with practice, through yourself and through others. Cats love it when you practice on them.

I went to a seminar by Rosalyn Bruyere, the energy healer, years ago at the first Body Mind Spirit Healing Symposium in Bellevue. Standing near her was like getting ultrasounded. The lights flickered multiple times at the Meydenbauer Center when she was attending. And it was a new building then . . .

Katie59, How cool was that!!!

My insurance pays for 12 visits, I think.

Pix I'm also thinking about more general decisions, and not particularly food issues. It's proving to be a bit tricky and requires some degree of concentration.

Judi - I agree that it's about ALL decisions. I thin it's always better for us to approach them from a position of power and initiating action (I want to . . .), rather than a position of weakness and stopping action (I don't want to . . .).

I love the saying, "Be a part of the change you want to see in the world."

Lynn, I say "go for it". Coverage for 12 visits is common. The intention is to prevent you from going more than once a month. The insurance company fancies that it's "protecting" your benefit and not allowing an acupuncturist to use up all your visits at once because they don't think 12 visits in a week, for example, is the best way to use the treatment. In some cases, they're right. There definitely are good providers and bad providers.

WhenI was at the insurance company we saw cases of doctors doing "adjustments" on newborns and using up all a member's benefits in one big visit, which didn't do the member any good.

Is once a week too often?

I definitely don't know. It's such a young profession (in our system) that there are a lot of people out there who use it differently, fewer standards; it's hard to tell the true professionals from the charlatans.

I would think that it depends on what you're using it for - nerve regeneration, pain relief, insomnia, quitting smoking, etc. You might just get a second opinion about frequency of treatment.

I like the idea of using an MD/acupuncturist. Other people like the idea of using someone from China. You just need to make sure that your insurance will cover that particular individual.

It's pretty easy to tell the charlatans from the actual medical providers, in my opinion. The medical providers go to accredited schools and are certified by the associated licensing body. I think the best way to tell if the provider is right for you is to listen to your gut feelings about the place and don't talk yourself out of any negative feelings you might have. If you don't feel good about it, go somewhere else. Just like any kind of provider, medical or otherwise. This is one of those instances where I choose to believe that most of the providers out there are simply doing their jobs and doing the best they can do for their patients, and that they have good intentions. When I focus on those providers, I am more likely to find them. Certainly there are charlatans and bad providers in every profession, but they do not deserve my attention. Focusing on the bad providers out there will certainly manifest them and bring them to you, just like looking under rocks enables one to find slugs. Seek and you shall find.
Frankly, I prefer an acupuncturist who comes from a tradition of using this medicine, but that's just my personal preference. The guy I used to go to (before he started traveling around the world, lucky him) was very young (and also very, very small) , but he was well qualified and he was raised by a grandmother who practiced Chinese Medicine in indonesia. It was in his blood to be doing what he was doing. He was so natural about it, so confident, and so correct all of the time. His youth was misleading. Also, I noticed that when he placed the needles, I didn't feel a thing, even though some of them went fairly deep. I contrast that with my most recent provider who was raised in the United states in the western medical tradition. She is very nice and perfectly qualified, has an extensive knowlege of herbal remedies, etc, and she is effective, but she is not as skilled as he was and I frequently was a little uncomfortable after the needles were placed. I really liked her personally, but he was a much better clinician in terms of skill. On the other hand, I could understand what she was saying whereas his accent was very heavy and between his accent and my terrible hearing, it could be a little comic at times.

One thing to know about in advance when you go to any kind of 'alternative' medical provider: if you need nutritional support or if you need to have herbal remedies, your insurance will not pay for them. since one cannot patent traditional chinese herbal remedies, the FDA does not bother with them. This can run into extra money. Personally, I never mind paying it, but if you don't expect it, you might be surprised.

Portland, i forgot to reply to your post about how tricky it is stay positive. Yes, it is tricky sometimes. I doubt if anyone every gets it right 100% of the time, and lord knows I don't get it right much of the time. Some days are better than others. But I always try. I've come up with a way of thinking about it that might help you. I consider that every thought I put out there, everything I allow my mind to focus on, is like a fishing line with a hook on the end of it that I cast out into the world. I'm certainly going to hook something with each line. If the thought is based on fear, then fear is my bait. I'm going to catch something that is fear based in return. I believe that's called 'karma' or, 'what goes around comes around'. If I focus on positive thoughts then those become my bait and i am likely to catch more positive things in return. I believe we have 100% free will in what we attend to, what we pay attention to in the world. It isn't that negative, or fear-based things do not exist, it's just that I do not choose to give them my energy. LIfe is too short to be focused on the bad stuff. If something happens, I will deal with it. But I know bad things are much less likely to happen when I don't go looking for them all the time. Does that make sense?

Pixy, that was excellent! I don't usually post but I have to thank you for that. What a great way of saying it! And I do believe it is true, we do get what we are looking for very often. Because we are looking. So if we are so busy looking for the negative in fear, well we may miss the positive right in front of us. I saw a program a long time ago about thought patterns. I am sure there was a lot to it but what I got was that your brain is electrical and thought impulses are electric. When you transmit a thought it makes a path. So that path becomes easy and familiar. If you think negative things, regrets and resentment, then that path become the most used and that is where your mind tends to focus. So you have to redirect the thought patterns. I have worked for years and making new paths and have done pretty well but I continue to have to 'redirect' some thoughts, especially sad ones. We really are in control if we make the effort and it is an effort.

I am interested in accupunture. I got a session years ago and remember how relaxed I was after. I cannot remember why I got it or if it worked. I may go again to see if it can help with migraine headaches. I like the kinds of things like this, it really cannot hurt you. Lots of medications will help but the side effects are so awful you end up creating a worse problem. If this does not work, you have done no harm.

Yes, that's what I think as well. There's nothing lost by trying it, and frequently if we allow our minds to be open to the possibility that it can help, it really does help. I think migraines are a very good reason to seek acupuncture treatment. Sometimes I wonder if migraines might be caused by a disruption in the natural flow of subtle energy, electricity as you say. nothing to lose by trying it.
I think it is very hard to retrain a brain that tends to think negatively. Many kinds of supplements and medications can help while the training process is in place. I do think that until the belief systems that hold negative thinking in place are changed, it's an uphill battle. There is always a belief system underlying fear-based or just simply negative thinking. Sometimes working with brain chemistry gives us better access to those belief systems and an easier time changing them.

Interesting thoughts - but I find myself wondering if fear is always a negative, or is it a reflection of uncertainty?

I often find that I am most fearful when faced with a new idea, situation, challenge, direction: right now I am about to do my first solo 20 mile walk and I am absolutely fearful of not being able to navigate from the map. But the idea of not trying this would be disappointing. Sometimes fear is an enlivening thing - it heightens the situation, it reminds us to be careful with new ideas or actions, it makes our thinking creative and defines the existing limitation and helps us to push further.

In the same way I actually quite like the statement "I don't want to....", I think it is a tool to establish boundaries and perimeters: the outward limits of the current thought or action - 'I will go so far and no further'. Once we have that established we are incredibly free to work within or outside the boundaries we set. It becomes a position to build on, a creative platform.

Perhaps negation is positive.

Fear is not a bad emotion - it has saved our lives for millions of years.

It's what we do with the fear that counts. Are we more prepared or more aware? Do we take action to change the circumstances to be more in our favor? If so, then that's a good thing.

It's when fear results in inaction that we need to step back and ask whether we should be challenging ourselves a little more.

I would not say that it is easy to tell the good providers from the charlatans. Especially if you don't work in that industry. If they are still practicing then they've found ways to hide. And most of us aren't very good at saying, "Stop. I don't like that." or "Hmmmm. That sounds strange to me." It's important to rely on the right certifications - you just need to know what they are and how to find them. Again, not so easy for the lay person who doesn't work in the industry.

She is a Naturpathic Doctor at a Chiropractor's office. I am seeing the massage therapist there, also. I was surprised at the cost of the supplements they sell, but if they work, then I would rather pay the cost for them, rather than use prescription drugs with so many nasty side effects.

I understand where you're coming from. See what her credentials are (is she an MD or not, how is she accredited for acupuncture, etc.). Hw long has she been doing acupuncture, where did she train, what is her philosophy of treatment, what is she treating and what is the expected outcome. Some of the nicest people don't really have a plan for treatment and don't communicate well the expected outcome, so you use up your benefits with no benefit.

Often, the insurance company will require a written treatment plan and that an MD make a diagnosis for treatment by the acupuncturist or chiropractor. There are lots of good service providers out there. But I can't tell you how many negative stories I heard at the insurance company about undertrained and underskilled alternative health care providers treating for things they had no business treating. It's especially a dog-eat-dog world out there when you're dealing with these new services.

Don't forget that supplements can also have unwanted side effects so make sure that you get a blood test taken first and know what you're supplementing for.

I don't think fear is a bad thing if we understand where the fear comes from. Staying back from a cliff is a good fear. Its when you have a fear that does not allow you to accomplish what you want to in your life, thats when it is a bad thing. I had a real fear of public speaking, I was a manager. I had to get over it and it was very, very hard. I will never really enjoy it as it is not a part of my personality, but I can do it without a lot of fear and discomfort. I do feel badly for people who have great fears of living their home, for instance. It so much cripples life.

Please keep us updated on your accupunture. I am so interested. My migraines came after a horse fell and rolled on me and broke my neck, cervical fusion with a plate and screws and I really am better, but do get migraines. Perhaps my electricty is not coping with the metal well??? I have a shot I take that works well but would much rather just not have them.

Could you share the supplements you take and what you take them for and if you feel they work?
I take Sam-E for joints, I have a bad knee
I take fish oil, again the knee
I think they both work and really help.

I was taking glucosamine
But am stopping, don't think its helping
I am taking vitamin B, originally for carpal tunnel and I THINK it helps.

I am interested in what works for people.

Many people use acupuncture for migraines. Results are mixed, but there are some successes. I think you should try it . . .

My best friend in Portland is a faithful acupuncture patient, for anxiety, I think. She is after me to try it for insomnia, which has been the bane of my existence since at least age 4. Lately I'm really at my wits' end with not being able to sleep, but boy -- talk about fear! NEEDLES.

But I would try ANYTHING to sleep. It's been a particularly bad week -- I'm on the verge of weeping, which is not like me at all.

I feared the needles also, but it wasn't bad at all. I kept envsioning myself as looking like a human voodoo doll. Only a couple felt a pinch, but then subsided.

Summer, give it a try. The insomnia will drive you crazy. I have horrible headaches, sleep apnea, and insomnia. Part of it, I just discovered, is due to a severe deviated septum, which I have had so long (broken nose) that I have developed a big bone spur there. So, I can't breathe through one nostril, the other side over compensates, gets plugged up, can't use the C Pap when it is plugged up, thus low oxygen level, this causes me to wake up with sever headache, lack of sleep. This is one vicious circle that I hope to break, surgery is scheduled for Nov 17. The acupuncture should help, and hopefully, it will at least help control the pain. The ENT Dr gave me a prescription for Vicodin, but I do not want to take them unless I absolutely have to. Sorry for the long post!

SK, I know a fear of needles is a fear of needles, BUT

A good acupuncturist won't cause pain. The needles (if you can call them that) are very thin in diameter in comparison to injection needles, which need to be bigger because they carry fluid. Insertion of the acupuncture needles is supposed to be in between the fibers of skin, rather than breaking through them.

Tell yourself that it's a totally different concept . . .

Lynn, you will feel so much better after the surgery, I'm sure!!!

I highly recommend meditation for improved breathing and breath control . . .