Speakiing of mulch . . .

As some of you know, I have two 50YO Fruitless Mulberry trees in my front yard. For years I've allowed them to gather in the beds next to the house and over the surface of the beds in which I have azaleas planted. They've not suffered from that topping. Mind you, I've never turned them into the soil in the beds, BTW. Not sure how that might impact the soil chemistry, hmmmm.

But my question is this . . . I have 120 feet of rose bush beds with a brick or concrete block fence on one side and a concrete border on the other. I have not amended the soil since I planted them. I have them set up so that I can irrigate them via a little canal like farmers used to do. I have a major problem, BTW, with my lawn invading these beds; lawn = bermuda. Can I take the leaves which fall this year and throw them on top of the rose beds? I know it sounds like a lot of leaves, and it is. But they will break down into nearly nothing, given the length/width of these beds. I'm just thinking that it might be a good use of these "green" resources and save me from having to throw them away. I can simply cart them from the front yard to the back yard (she says as if that's no big deal!).

I'm also thinking that perhaps I could lay them out on top of some weed barrier cloth, which would help reduce the bermuda filling the beds up. Then, come summer, add bark?

Thinking aloud . . . . Thoughts? Ideas? Suggestions?

Linda

Pic = pretty flower from one of these beds

I've added leaves (whenever I could get them) to all of my flowerbeds and my vegetable garden for years. They break down and enrich the soil which feeds the plants. I wouldn't throw them away--add every one of them to your flowerbeds! Your plants will love you for it.

I usually shred leaves first--otherwise they can mat down over the bed and prevent water from getting through as well. If you shred them then that won't be a problem. As far as the weed cloth, personally I'm not a fan of using it over beds--it's fine under paths and things but I think it hurts the health of the soil underneath it so I don't like it where I'm going to plant. To keep the Bermuda out, I'd try putting in some edging and then anything that gets past that and into the bed you can spray with a product like Green Light Grass Out which kills grass (including Bermuda) but doesn't hurt your plants. The one caveat with it is it works slowly--you'll spray it and then it takes about a week to start looking like it's doing anything.

Oh! Thanks for that! I didn't think anything less than an A-bomb would get rid of Bermuda. I went googling around and found that there have been folks developing selective herbicides for it that will work in zoysia grass too!

Bermuda snuck under 6" edging very quickly in my DS's yard. I'd guess you would have to go with as deep of edging as you can find.

I'm having good luck getting rid of Bermuda with the Green Light. There are other brands like Ortho Grass B Gone that have the same active ingredient so if you can't find Green Light in your area I bet you can find the Ortho. The only trick to it is patience, just about the time you give up on it and think it's not working, you'll start to notice the grass starting to get a little yellow around the edges, and then from there it gradually dies. Of course if you have a lawn full of it next to the bed it's going to be a constant battle, but you can keep it from taking over.

I've had good success with Grass B Gone, but as ecrane says you have to be patient. I've also sometimes had to respray after about a month to finish off the invading grass.

WHAT?! What about Roundup, which is what I've had my "lawn-gardeners" use? I thought Roundup was a non-selective, kill the world type of herbicide. But the 9" barrier I have between the bermuda lawn (I know, I know, but it's been in Fresno due to the summer sun/heat for years) and the rose bed has not kept it from looking for water on the other side! UNBELIEVABLE stuff!

The Green Light & Ortho grass killers only kill grass not other plants so if you accidentally overspray onto other things in your garden it won't hurt them. If you don't have any other plants around then by all means use Roundup if you want, but in my case the grass is in the middle of beds crawling around my plants, so if I used Roundup on it then I'd kill some of my desirable plants too.

These roses are in the center of the bed, ecrane3, and the grass, when cut down, is clearly visible as to its movement toward the bushes. It seems that they may be spraying at the outer edges toward the roses and only as close to the bush branches as needed in order to kill the creeping grass. They are likely killing off the grass at its beginnings, as it were, with the newest growth at the tips being caught up in the "parent's" further out. Moreover, my roses don't have leaves, typically, near the ground.

Nevertheless, there's an inherent risk in using an agent such as this, no doubt. But it keeps returning and returning, and returning. I don't have it zapped on a regularly scheduled basis, which may contribute to its repeated return. Should there be a schedule which keeps after it until it just gets too weary of trying to come up and around? The grass at the outside edge of the concrete border, which is 9'Xumm,6' or so. You know, that typical concrete border. A truly vigorous and invasive plant.

BTW, I actually have a shredder I've not used in years. I can drag that puppy out and just throw the leaves into it as I move it along the length of the bed, sending those leaves right into the bed. I never thought of that. What a GOOD idea!

Linda

Unfortunately as long as you have a lawn full of it you're going to be fighting it constantly. I'm expecting that I'll win my battle eventually because mine is leftover from a lawn that doesn't exist anymore so as long as I keep after it, it'll go away eventually. But as long as you've got a lawn you've got an endless supply of it so it's always going to be trying to escape into your beds.

Ack, some kids just don't like to get haircuts and keep trying to escape the chair, don't they? ah well . . .

thx, all, I'll shred those leaves up this fall

I actually live in Fl and have alot of crabgrass, and what I have found most effective for roses is this: (keep in mind they are my favorite flowers and I have a big collection)

1. Put down a two to three inch layer of compost, I use store bought mushroom compost
sometimes.
2. Layer on an inch or two of grass clippings to help minimize nitrogen robbing of next
two steps.
3. Get some old cardboard boxes, they are easy to cut to shape and in this multilayer
mulch work just as well as weed fabric but decomposes as well.
4. Run your piled up leaves over with a bagging rotary motor and pile them on thick over
the cardboard.
5. Here in my soft climate organic matter gets eaten up very quickly so I also go over
that with a layer of cypress wood chips scavenged from the county dump.


Just make sure you wet all the layers as you put them on their so they dont wick your soil
moisture away


Hope that helps :)
Amber