Starting my Fall garden-did I plant Suger Snap Peas to soon?

My suger snap peas are already coming up, they are about 2 inches tall. If I planted too early should I plant some type of plant to the south of it that would shade from the sun? Or should
I just let things be? I thought I was supposed to use my first frost date of Nov 15 (here in North Texas) and back up to 'however many days it takes to harvest'...anyway I came out around 2 weeks ago for this pack. But I'm getting the feeling that I might have calculated wrong by the looks I'm getting from experienced gardeners. Last year I planted too late and I got about a dozen pea pods then they froze!

As long as they are going good , I would take my chances. Usually the big problem in planting too early is getting them to emerge in hot soil.

Sounds very early to me. I might plant in November or December.

I do that also for April harvest. Lady beetle is apparently trying for a prefreeze fall harvest. Can't do it here, but that part of Texas has a longer season.

In Houston, there are no freezes, just frosts, and snow/sugar peas laugh at 28 degrees. We plant sugar snaps/snow peas in December and January.

This message was edited Sep 5, 2008 4:47 PM

Of course, but IF you want fresh peas for October and November, which is what I think she is trying to do. English peas, Snap peas, Snowpeas over winter nicely here, but they are susceptible to light freezes when blooming. Lots of more northerly folks do plant a fall crop. Just too blame hot here to get them started early enough.

I put in green bush and wax bean seeds today. My tomatoes are over 2' and just starting to bloom. I actually like my fall garden better than my spring one as bugs and weeds seem less prolific. We will put in all of the cole crops and peas in early Oct. Usually don't have a freeze until Christmas. As long as the tropics leave us alone we should have a bountiful fall.

Hope you will too.

I had something like a gallon of green beans ready for Thanksgiving last year. They were fantastic. :)

Lucky!! I wish I had the growing season like you do in the south.

My Suger Snap peas are doing great! They started blooming 2 weeks ago and I'm eating them as fast as I can!!

I'm in Zone 7. Is there anything I can plant now, such as carrots, kale, chard...or spinach. High is 60 and low is around 40. Are seeds a possibility or should I stick to transplants?

You can still probably plant quick maturing brassicas like radishes, turnips, mustard, kale and get a late fall winter crop, Spinach and carrots you may be able to overwinter for a spring crop.

Ladybeetle, congratulations on your fall crop of snow peas. It usually pays in the long run to experiment and discover for yourself , what will grow and when in a given locality.

This message was edited Oct 27, 2008 10:43 AM

Feldon,
What kinda green beans do you grow? I'm looking to grow the ones you get in the cans at the store, only much BETTER, cause they're homegrown. Which varieties would I need to plant and when in the Houston area should I sow the seeds? I just bought Dr. Bob Randall's book (FINALLY!!!), and I'm going to sow some Sugar Snap peas this weekend. I still have some Kentucky Wonder seeds. Can/Should I sow them now, or wait until closer to Spring? Thanks.

Linda

Feldon30?

Sorry about that.

Kentucky Wonder is great if you like green beans, which I do. I've been buying them from H-E-B whenever I can.

But I am totally hooked on Dragon Tongue beans. Dragon Tongues are much larger, longer, more tender, and taste almost buttery when lightly steamed. Hurricane Ike really messed up my schedule and I didn't sow seeds until very late (and really not enough seeds). I'm not going to have a big harvest this fall.

However I am going to plant a TON of snow pea seeds. I like snow peas better than sugar snaps by the way. Oregon Sugar Pod II. I can use them in anything. When I stir fry, I pan-sear the meat or chicken, transfer it to a plate, add the snow peas and a 1/4 cup of water, then cover with another frying pan. So I am temporarily turning the skillet into a steamer. Then I remove the frying pan, add my sauce, return the meat or chicken, and continue for a few more minutes. It's very quick.

The interesting thing about snow peas is that in my experience they grow rather slowly and then they take off like a rocket in March and produce through May.

This message was edited Nov 12, 2008 7:44 PM

I know what you mean about wondering when to plant. First year veggie garden here. Planted too late for Spring (June 1) and we had ALREADY had 100 degree days in May!. I do not think we are going to have winter here this year. We had a weekend of 69 degree days Oct 18, so I planted some short rows of cabbage, sugar peas, radishes, broccoli and beets. Sure enough, we've had 80 and 90 degree days off and since then. All except broccoli are coming up, so I try to cool them with water. Nights are down to 40's, so that helps. I have 2 volunteer tomato plants starting next to the tall, poorly producing, drying tomato plant. I did not figure on the changing axis of the sun, so the garden area that started out for flowers then had winter squash, cantaloupe, peppers and tomato plants started by seed is getting a lot more shade than expected. Tomatoes have produced a few small fruit. Gophers are still busy and ate one pepper and one tomato plant (even with chicken wire underneath and up sides to 2 ft high). Guess I will get out early tomorrow before it gets to 89 and plant more seed and then look forward to the next Saturday when it will be a CHILLY 78!

Thanks for such wide ranging options for planting during the cooler seasons. I'm in Zone 7 so I need to adjust everything you have said by a month or two. We have lows into the 20's right now and yet we have lots of days when it gets up to the 60's. So, cold frames are probably the best option for any planting right now. Or, of course starting seeds indoors but I really don't like to do that. So, I have to learn patience. By the way, I'm getting ready to put up a post on Winter Gardens in Zone 7 in case you are interested. www.kirbyplant.blogspot.com

Here is a cute joke I thought I would share regarding when to plant:
An oldie but goodie...

A prisoner in jail received a letter from his wife: "I have
decided to plant some vegetables in the back garden. When is
the best time to plant them?"

The prisoner, knowing that the prison guards read all mail,
replied in a letter: "Dear wife, whatever you do, do not
touch the back garden. That is where I hid all the money."

A week or so later, he received another letter from his
wife: "You won't believe what happened. Some men came with
shovels to the house and dug up all the back garden."

The prisoner wrote another letter: "Dear wife, now is the
best time to plant the vegetables."

Cute!

OK, the peas I planted 10/18 are up and flowering. They are just getting to be taller than the 3-ft high chicken wire 'trellis' I gave them. How long does it take to get peas after flowers? Do they need bees - haven't seen any since cold weather, but saw hummers today. There were/are not aLOT of flowers, but we are having moderate weather now with days in 70-80's and nights in high 40's. Cabbage is started to form round heads, spinach is at a standstill. The winter beets were much more yummy than the one grown in the heat of summer. We have flirted with freezing (down to mid 20's a few nights) over Christmas and New Years. The seasonality of it was fun.

Are peppers (anaheim) supposed to be perennials? The first freezes did not affect them, but now they are looking more dry. If I cut that part off, will they come back? They will be getting more sun again as days get longer.

Quiltygirl,
Talk to me about your winter beets, as I have Chioggia and Bull's Blood beets coming up that are about 4" tall now. They were planted back in November (around Thanksgiving weekend I believe). Our temps are averaging in the 50-60s daytime and this week we've awakened to temps in the mid 30's. No real freezes here, and no sustained temps below 35 (maybe that 1-2 hours before the a.m. sunrise). I truly want to harvest a lot of beet greens (as well as the roots!). Please share your growing/reaping experience. Thanks!

Linda

I'm into winter sowing right now. The forum here has helped me a lot and I put up a little info on my blog www.kirbyplant.blogspot.com I'm so jealous of all you folks in TX and CA we're at least a month behind you here in NC where it's going to be 8 degrees tonight. At least the light is moving in the right direction altho the temps will be low for another 6 weeks.

Gymgirl - As I said I planted 10/18 and just plain box store Detroit Red Beets seed pkg. This is my first year with a veggie garden and my third time in that year planting beets. I really have a hard time with spacing and thinning, so most things I have planted - especially the beets are too crowded to grow full size. I did a little better with round 3 of the beets. The beets I grew in summer did not have as sweet a flavor. Didn't know if it was the heat or variety. Same variety in winter tastes much better. The greens are still good in the winter even though they have been full size for quite a long time now. I have just left them in the ground and pick them when needed and think they are staying fresher than fridge. Never knew about beet greens till I grew the first batch and they were awesome! Can't convince the rest of the household though to even try!! (You should see their faces when they see me eat the 'weeds' our Mexican friends said were edible -- taste like spinach and they SELL it @ hispanic stores)

We had some gloriously cool days of 50-60's around Christmas with nights as low as 20's, but as you said, not sustained. Veggies doing OK except peppers, but they were not intended to be winter crop. We are now having 70-80's with dry wind (can hear porch boards make same noise when you step on them in AM as very thin ice when it is really dry here - summer or winter). Being in Houston you probably can't relate to single digit humidity! We get all excited about rain (only have a couple month window for that), get a good soaking, then darn if that wind doesn't come up. Not all zone 9's are created equal! Wish more stuff referred to the 'Heat Hardiness Zones'. Then we could have wind zones and critter zones and.....

It is no wonder to me that wonderful tomatoes can be grown in S. California. The humidity and sustained high *evening* temperatures put a premature end to tomato production here in Houston.

My biggest mistake last year was downright laziness. We had extended drought and I just did not water my plants enough. I am looking at running some PVC pipe to each of my beds so I can switch water on and off with less effort. I'm hoping that will make me get on the ball more. I would have had great tomatoes through July if I'd been more diligent.

Yes, wonderful tomatoes "CAN" be grown, I've been told. But certainly not by me my first year. First, I planted too late, June 1, and we had already had several days over 100. Yes, the evening temperatures most places do go down, except the really low desert, which makes beautiful evenings. When I lived on the coast I would come home from work and put my sweats on and a winter scarf on my neck to sit on my deck and watch the ocean @6PM because of the breeze - in July! Once the breeze died, it was just right. But, now I am on the other side of the coastal range and although the eves are nice, and the humidity, or better-the lack of it, is nice, the days can be just hot. Sorry to whine, but the coast spoiled me. I've even broken a thermometer by putting it in the sun and the mercury had no where to go after 116! It is not everyday, but seemed like more than usual last year.

Anyway, I've learned that all the cracked tops of my tomatoes - and I do mean all - were caused by uneven heating & watering. In July I planted seeds again, in the ground for tomatoes and others and had to again water sometimes 3 times a day or everything would be limp. But you are right, I did not have to worry about getting the leaves wet at night from sprinkling,. This year I would love to be able to try this 'tape' drip product: http://www.dripworksusa.com/ttape1.php and have timers so as not to be a SLAVE to watering. I could hardly go to the beach for the day (hour drive each way) much less go away for a few days.

Speaking of needing to be less lazy, I guess I should have tomatoes and others already started. Thought I would use those clear clamshell containers cookies come in from the bakery as when they are shut they make a terrarium. But now that you say humidity is not good, maybe just leave them open (somewhere?) and plant both sides.
Lynda

When you start seeds, a good amount of humidity is a good thing. Seedlings do not mind humidity at all as long as it's not downright damp.

The issue is when the tomato plants are blossoming, the pollen inside the flowers can clump if it is too humid especially at night when pollination occurs. Also high sustained evening temps and very high daytime temps can cause the pollen to denature.

Also as you know fruit quality can go down in the hottest months. Stewed tomatoes off the vine!

So that is why I recommend starting as early as possible and just going the extra mile of protecting your plants if there is a cold snap. A little bit of diligence with WUnderground.com and blankets can mean the difference between a small crop and a giant one.

Thank you, feldon.

Ladybeetle, If you're still watching this thread this is a link that may help you.

Frost Dates - Last Frost Dates In USA -

Scroll down till you see the State of Texas:

http://usagardener.com/breaking_ground/frost_dates_usa.php

~* Robin

Waving Hello to you, Feldon! ^_^

As I commented in another thread, those USAGardener frost dates are quite different than other frost date lists I have ever seen. They are about 1-2 weeks later for most of the dates I'm used to seeing. I wonder if those are considered 0% frost (all chance of frost has passed) or 10% frost (only 10% chance of frost, which is what most frost date lists are based on).

If you wait until March 31 or April 10 as they suggest for Austin or San Antonio, you will get VERY FEW or NO tomatoes.

P.S. I do not think snow peas are bothered by mid-20's temperatures.

I spent a bunch of time trying to figure this out last year. The problem I saw is that sometimes the "Last" frost date was confused with the "Average Last" frost date. The true "Last" date is later than the Average Last. The average last date falls in the middle of the possible last frost dates...so there is still a substantial probability for frost if you plant on the average, but should be little or no chance of frost using the later "Last" frost date. As feldon says, though, if you wait until the last minute in Texas, you'll be pressing your luck with the summer heat on the other end.

David

When I look at that chart, the closest to me that I find is either Pasadena or Palm Springs and both show April as last frost dates. That would be a big surprise for Pasadena and probably a record breaker for Palm SPrings as it is in the desert!

dreaves,

I think that is exactly the issue I was talking about.

A "Last" Frost Date would be what is considered to be the 0% chance. But we cannot wait until then to plant tomatoes in S.E. Texas or except in exceptionally mild get few to no tomatoes. And frankly, if you wait until April to buy tomato plants in the local nurseries you will find that the best plants have long been sold.

The Average Frost Date is what I believe is the 10% chance. There is still a 10% chance that there will be a frost after that date. In fact the last 3 years -- 2006, 2007, and 2008, there HAVE been very late frosts, well into April.

If you want to grow tomatoes in S.E. Texas, you must be willing to protect your plants with blankets, row cover, plastic, or something, and be able to apply it during the day or the day before so that heat gets trapped inside. I found out the hard way one fall that putting the row cover out a few moments before sunset doesn't really help much.

Growing tomatoes in Texas is NOT EASY, but the reward will be remembered long after the extra effort that had to be put forth grabbing extra blankets or sheets and clipping them to your tomato cages.

BUMP!

Ok, I'm reviving this thread to ask what my Houston area growers have either sown seeds for in the LAST 3 weeks, or plan to sow seeds for in the NEXT two-three weeks.

Thanks!

Linda