co-op forum thought and question

Dave would have to answer any "what-if" programming questions or requests. And unforutnately, I think he's up to his neck in auction programming at the moment; this issue may need to remain on hold for the time being.

In the meantime, I'd say the best course of action is for co-op organizers to take a firm hand in managing their co-op threads. In addition to specifying the desired behavior at the beginning of their thread(s), they can use dmail blasts to communicate with all the participants; that can be a good way to get the message out to avoid chit-chat on the order thread.

I'm doing my first co-op right now, but have participated as a buyer in other co-ops. In one of the co-ops chat became such a problem people were missing important messages from the co-op organizer. I tried to encourage people to follow me to the Parking Lot to chat, but I was unsuccessful (remember I was not the organizer)! ☺

I'm on a co-op where the host disappeared for a week. Once we tracked her down she gave some very valid reasons for her absence but someone made a very good suggestion I'd like to pass on here. That is that each host have a contact person the co-op knows about. That person should have a phone # where they can reach this person so that if the host isn't reachable by computer the co-op can still know what is going on. It's very easy to vanish from the internet and bad things do happen to nice people.

MollyD

If people are going to post pictures of how their plants grew out, it would be nice if the first post of that thread have the information of what was ordered and a link to the vendors website.

Then if I see one that I really want, or if I killed one . . . later I could go directly to the vendor and re-order it.
It would be really nice to have a "clean thread" at the end where people have posted pictures.

I manage to get around on the forum and many times do miss new co-ops.

I appreciate a person who rules with an iron hand.

Thanks for listening to me.

Well, I don't think any co-op is hurting for participants, so "them's the breaks" if you miss one or more.

Make enough rules, and no one will host.

Did I say it was?
gracious...folks are so quick to defend. OR at least sound defensive in writing.
unwatching now.

I think this thread has wandered a lot from the original request and included a lot of other suggestions on how co-op organization and visibility could be improved. If you took all the suggestions together, they would indeed amount to so many rules that nobody could manage to host, LOL.

Here's something I don't think anybody has considered, that wouldn't involve making any changes or additions at all to the current forum:

What if every thread that was *not* an open order or interest thread for a co-op was marked "closed" by the thread starter?

That includes all co-op chat threads, shipping and payment threads, follow-up discussion threads, etc. Often the only threads that get marked "closed" in a co-op are the order threads.

This way, clicking on "see only open/unsolved threads" would produce a list of all co-ops that were actively forming or actively accepting orders. And you wouldn't see anything else. That would be just the same as having a separate forum for those threads.

I think that may have been the original intent in being able to "close" co-op threads.

?

just a simple lil forum for co-op orders only!!!! :)

Why not use Critter's suggestion while waiting on Dave to make the decision? For me it would help in the interim.

Dori, wouldn't using the open/closed distinction work just as well as creating dual forums?

This thread has been open for a month, and I'm quite sure Dave is still "up to his neck in auction programming," so we may not see any action by admin on creating a separate forum, especially a forum-within-a-forum or something that's tabbed between forums etc. as some have suggested. (I know your original suggestion was simpler.)

I realize everybody would need to get on board with closing all threads except order and interest threads for co-ops that are open or forming. But if that could be done, it would give us an easy way to see what's new & available.

nope critter it sure wouldnt!

Why wouldn't it work? It shouldn't be any harder to get hosts to comply with using the "closed" button than to get them to post order threads in a separate forum... What am I missing?

Jill, it wouldn't work because folks use the co op forum for interest, questions, shipping, anything. I just noticed a new thread created to remind folks there was a co op going on!!! The co op already has an order thread, an interest thread and a chit chat thread. So, 4 topics/threads started in the co op forum for one co op that is still open. Then, when it's closed there could potentially be an invoice thread, a shipping thread, and another chat thread or two because the first one got too long.... I'm in the co op I'm talking about, and I dearly love the host and consider her a dear friend, so while I'm singling out that co op in particular, they are NOT the only co op who does this... though I do this this is the first time I've ever seen a thread started to remind people of a co op. (host did NOT start it)

With one forum just for orders, and a separate forum for everything else, when a co op is happening, it won't get buried on the second page or lower because of all the chit chat going on with other co ops, potential co ops, completed co ops, or whatever else.

All of those folks who open the chat threads don't want them marked closed because the chat is ongoing. So, that won't help in bringing the active co ops to the top of the forum as long as they're in the same forum with all the chit chat.

Now, if a separate forum was created, and hosts marked the thread closed when ordering was completed, that would be most helpful, but with the co ops in the same forum as everything else, even having the option to "close" something is almost useless.

This is just my experience with the co-ops that I have run...only a few. I have never understood why there needs to be a separate thread for payments and shipping. Is it just as easy to save the first few posts for the host's use for these things? All you have to do is go in and edit them as needed.....and then everyone knows where all the info is for that co-op. I have started chat threads and found them helpful at keeping the actual co-op thread small, but other than that I don't understand the need for so many threads for one co-op. JMO

Me either Mendy, I've done mine the same way, but the trend seems to be a separate thread for everything, so Dori asked for the actual orders to be somewhere else. It's crazy wading around over there trying to see what is taking orders and what's not. ;)

I agree completely!

Me 3. That has definitely made it busier than it used to be. When you are used to all that being in one, it is hard to wade around and find them.

Melissa, I'm not just talking about marking threads "closed" for co-ops that are closed... I'm also talking about marking as "closed" all threads but one for a given co-op that's open or under development -- either the order thread for an open co-op or the "anybody interested?" thread for one that hasn't been started yet. All other threads started by a co-op host would be marked "closed" so that they wouldn't show up on the list of "show only open/unsolved threads."

I realize that would require hosts to mark all those other threads closed... but I don't see how that's any more difficult than asking hosts to post their threads in two separate forums.

There are already ongoing chat threads marked "closed" because some hosts "close" all the threads related to their co-op when the co-op is closed to additional orders... but not everybody does that, either, and that's part of the reason for the clutter that remains when you try to view only open co-ops.

I was still contemplating if there wasn't a way that the thread line couldn't be identified with just the word OPEN and CLOSED in bold color. I wouldn't think that would be difficult to implement. Leave everything else the same but draw attention to the active ones in this manner.

I understand and relate to the debates over the chat threads and shipping and receiving threads but I recognize that the co-op forum is set up for co-ops. The different topics on the forum can be as varied as those on say the daylily forum. Some threads are strictly about daylilies, some wish friends happy birthday or address holiday events and what gifts were received. Some of the threads are just chat, some asking for help, one discussed the Daylily magazine. The generalization is "Daylily" but the threads are not restricted.

Unless there was a ''business only" requirement the Co-op forum should be allowed to have whatever threads anyone wants to submit pertaining to co-ops.

Again, I understand the frustration of wading through to find what's open as well as the need to respect and honor host's requests for keeping the chat out of the ordering thread. My two cents would be best spent to see if the option of just changing the color of those two words would be possible.

....just the thoughts and opinions of someone who's just finishing work and should've be asleep hours ago, thowing in my two cents worth!! LOL!

~Dawn

The coop forum has far more threads about the same coop going on than ever before and in my opinion has gotten very cumbersome to wade through.

I like it when the coop organizer has just two threads per coop. Strickly the order thread with no chat where the organizer has allowed additional space just below the, coop information thread for other needed future business (paid, shipment,etc), and another thread for chat and questions. This way I don't have to wade through any other threads for fear of missing important needed information about the coop in which I'm participating.


I use to be able to go the coop forums and scroll quickly through the new threads to see if new coops were going, but now there are so many new threads that are offshoots of the original it is getting very confusing.

One of the reasons I enjoy DG so much is because of the wonderful coops that allow me to have many more plants than I would be able to if I were to purchase from my local vendors.

I know there has to be a solution that will work well for all involved in these wonderful coops.

Debbie

Dawn, there's a link at the very top of the forum that you can click in order to see only "open" threads. There are still some closed co-ops whose hosts haven't marked followup threads "closed" and some chat threads, etc., but it does cut down the list that you see and make it a little easier to find the active ones.

Critter,
that is true but I'm with Deb. It is nicer to go to the first few posts in the order thread to see if I made the list, then to see if my money was received, then to see if I've been shipped - all in one thread.

I am in one right now where I have to jump around to keep up with what is going on and I have to scroll back through a thread to find a link to the spreadsheet; if the link were in a post toward the top it would make it easier. It has made it harder for me to comply with the wishes of the organizer. I have gone back and re-read entire threads and found things I missed-too time consuming.

Especially at this time of year when I should be outside cleaning up the garden.

I think that making 2 separate forums would be easy to get hosts to comply with because if the thread wasn't an ordering thread, it would hopefully be deleted. There could also be a disclaimer, kind of like with plant files or GW, "are you sure you want to post this"
"Is this a co op order thread?" before they hit submit. I'm sure that wouldn't require any more programming on Dave's part, and might thwart unsuspecting hosts from posting in the wrong spot.

You said we strayed very far away from the original question, and we have. The simplest solution, and what Dori asked for originally would be two separate forums--no bells or whistles, no color coding, no forum within a form, no tabs, just two different places.

Well any simplifying change would be appreciated.

This is really eating at me...seems there has to be an answer!
I send my apologies to Dori for 'straying' from the original question ... 50 lashes with a wet noodle and guilty as charged.

I acknowledge the host should be allowed to set whatever guidelines make it the most convenient on them ... reserving the top few posts in the thread for that pertainent information is one of the best ways I've seen.

What if the co-op forum was changed to business-only like to classified ads with all the chat, discussion, shipping threads hyper-linked to the product/specific forums? (cross-posting allowed only for co-ops) For example when I contemplated purchasing clematis I went to the Clematis community forum and gained a lot of new information just scrolling through. I had never gone there before but now I have it as one of my 'watching' forums. I know I'll be purchasing some soon and (hopefully) joining and meeting another great group of gardeners. I think something along this line would really enhance and expand my DG experiences ...

I hope an workable solution is found soon so that dissention over the co-ops threads doesn't appear to Dave as troublesome and affect the future possibilities. Again, my two cents for what they're worth... ^_^

~Dawn

I am new to co-op ordering this year. I notice a lot of the coop threads getting really cluttered. I think there should be two separate threads:

Co-Op: Ordering/Payments/Shipping
Co-Op: Chatter/Discussion

I have often wished that there could be an order/payment/shipping thread that was locked to everyone but the host/hostess. But, that would mean we would have to d-mail our order to the hostess and she would have to enter all the info in the thread which would mean even more work.

The chatting thread should be kept separate since these threads get so long.

I really appreciate the efforts of the host/hostess of the co-op's ... a lot of work involved and I'm sure sometimes a lot of headaches too!

Melissa, putting in an extra step to ask "are you sure?" or "is this a co-op order thread?" is an extra programming bit, although not (probably) a big one... still, it might not be something that Dave can turn his attention to right away.

Asking admin to monitor an orders-only forum and delete or move any off topic threads seems like a lot to ask of admin... but maybe it would only be needed initially.

I agree that the format most hosts seemed to use a while back, with one thread for all business details and a separate thread (more if needed) for chat made for a less cluttered forum. But sometimes threads just get too long and new threads are needed.

Jill, that programming is already in place, I can't remember whether it is in plant files or in the GWD. Which is why I suggested it.

I don't want to have to ask admin to monitor, that is a lot to ask, but, in the first couple of weeks they might have to go in and delete a few threads until folks got used to them. Then again, maybe not?

OK, that probably makes it a smaller tweak to put it in place for a new co-op orders forum.

I know this thread wasn't initially about finding a way to make our existing single forum work better, but I keep coming back to thinking about the whole open/closed threads thing.

I think one thing making that confusing is that when you mark a thread "closed" in other forums, that generally means to stop posting to a thread. In the co-op forum ideally all threads for co-ops that aren't accepting any more participants (including chat threads, shipping threads, etc) would be marked "closed" so that only active open co-ops could be viewed by clicking that link at the top of the forum. But that puts a big "CLOSED" sign on all the other threads, even when people can and should be actively posting to them.

I wonder if there's a way to tweak the existing option just a little so that a host can mark threads closed without the big "CLOSED" appearing on the thread title.

Would that help at all?

As for compliance, maybe thread starters could be gently asked to mark threads "closed" if that co-op is no longer open to new participants.

I wish the ending date for ordering would be put in the titles, so I can quickly tell if it is too late to join in. Maybe LOD 1/1/08. (LOD - Last order date)

The co-op forum is a place where it would be especially nice to be able to edit thread subjects, Cathy! Sometimes titles just aren't as descriptive or concise as might be useful... and you just can't go back and change them when you realize that.

I like your suggestion, but I'm happy if that information is easy to find in the first post, too.

If you look at all the forums, you'll notice that Dave has always tried to keep all the forums' functionality as similar as possible. Keeping them consistent makes them a lot easier to maintain. For that reason, I don't think adding a forum-within-a-forum, or different colors for different types of threads is feasible.

What we *can* do is stipulate in the introduction that only co-op organizers can start threads. It will take a heavy hand initially to get everybody accustomed to this rule, and any off-topic threads started by others will have to be deleted (we can't just move them elsewhere, because all co-op information should be kept in the co-op thread.)

With that rule in place, the organizer can then dictate their own rules for the threads: chat or no chat; separate thread for chat, or keep everything in one place. I think that would cut down on the confusion, and allow the forum to remain more on-topic.

As a side note: we are happy to edit a thread's title as a courtesy - let us know if you need something changed or added after you launch a thread.

terry thats all really helpful but cant you PLEAS make a order only forum??? hats all i wanted
something simple called CO-OP order forum
the organizer can post orders only there and you can help us delete chit chat there if need be. No color coding no extra this and that just a orders only forum!!! pretty please!.
You remember back to the start of co-ops when this site had maybe 1000 members and ALL the forums were easy to follow and we could even keep track of each other!!!

This site has grown to gigantic(good deal) and just a SIMPLE fix to that one forum
would really HELP us all.
A bunch more members-more co-ops-pretty please!!!
Please im not alone with this quest-if not now I will be back! :)

please?

Maybe an ORDERS ONLY forum with the ability for the hostess and hostess only to delete chit chat postings from that thread and she could send us to another thread for all the talking?

its really a simple fix!!!

If the current forum is made clear that only co-op organizers are to start new threads, that will let it become (pretty much) a streamlined "orders-only" forum. Organizers can decide if they want a "chat" thread (or not.) The organizer can specify in their thread if they want people to limit themselves to one post per thread, or if it's wide open for back-and-forth conversations.

(Letting a thread starter edit out other member's posts could lead to some pretty ugly unintended results - I don't think that is something we want to do.)

I don't think setting up a second forum would achieve what you're wanting (it's really hard to dictate behavior by technology. And - more importantly - we don't have a way to "link" forums together, or embed one forum within another forum. So another forum would just hang out there - maybe used, maybe not.

Yeah, I know you are right regarding letting thread starters edit other people's posts. I should have thought more on that one, LOL. I've seen people's feelings get hurt many times just from misinterpreting the typewritten word. Yeah, that could cause some serious conflict and could get real ugly! Y'all better be glad I'm not a decision maker, hee hee ... this place would be pure chaos! ^_^ I really didn't think that one through, did I? LOL.

Along with stipulating that only co-op organizers can start threads, do you think it would be useful to suggest at the top that organizers "close" all threads for co-ops that are no longer open to new participants?

A while back, it seemed like people were making more use of the closed/open thread designations, which made the option to view only open threads a lot more useful. Now, when I click "view only open threads" I get about half threads relating to unfinished business in co-ops where ordering was finished some time ago.

Dori, I'm not trying to argue with your suggestion for another forum for orders only... but if there's not a good way to make that happen, then I'm wondering if there's a way to use the "close thread" option to help the situation.

Unfortunately most of the chat threads are started by co op organizers, so I really don't think adding that wording will alleviate the congestion in the current co op forum. Leave the current forum as it is, but move co op ORDER threads to the proposed Co op order only Forum, and stipulate that only a host/hostess can open an order thread.

As it is now, if someone is gauging interest for a co op, they post in the co op forum, then when they have enough interest, they open the order thread AND the chat thread( I,II,III as the case may be) then they open a payments thread, then they possibly open a second order thread because the first one was too long, then they open a shipping thread--in the mean time, someone opened a small co op, with one single thread, and it gets pushed down down down because of all the traffic on a single co op's multiple threads.

Yes, it would be nice if folks took time to read the rules, it would be nice if they wouldn't post questions in the order thread... but they don't, and they do.