Photos of my newly built lasagna garden

Those who have been following my threads know that I have been very preoccupied lately with the making of a new, large lasagna bed. Mine is about 10 feet wide and 225 feet long. Here are some photos showing the progress I have made, along with the assistance of a good-hearted neighbor with a tractor and bucket on the front. As you can see, I could not help myself and had to transplant a few things to the new bed.

The bed winds around several trees in the backyard, including 3 very large oaks. If you look hard, you should be able to see the new rebar arbor standing near the center. Quite a change from the prior photo!

What a great job you've done! And such a setting with your mature trees!

great job-looks like you will have a lovely place to sit and enjoy your day! :)

Wonderful planning and exacuting of the plan. Such a restful place to sit and read, visit, etc.

Thanks Dea and notmartha. Here is a photo from a different angle.

It looks lovely. Can't wait to pics of it next summer. =)

I have to ask, are you sure it's not going to kill the oaks? I know years ago the Garden Club built flower beds around the ancient oaks in the park, and they nearly all died (the trees, I mean). Turns out you can't cover their roots ...

I have several 30+ yr. old oaks in my yard that I would love to build beds around. I'm too afraid to kill them, tho. If you know something I don't, please share!

Cheri'

Aack! I sure hope Cheri that this will not pose a problem for the oaks. Actually, my Dad was present while the neighbor was moving the top soil for me and he told me that he did not think the bed was deep enough to bother the trees. He had pointed out to me that if you bury a trees shallow roots too much then you may kill the tree. I had not known this when I planned the layout of my new bed but relied on his telling me that he did not think my bed was too deep. Plus I had seen other people who have built large boxed-in flower beds under established trees with no apparent adverse effect.

My oaks are at least 50 years old. I surely would not wish to do them any harm. Does anyone know whether my bed will be a problem for the trees? Should I *gulp* move the soil?

beard, what are the ingredients of your different layers? How deep are they? They are beautys!

I don't know precisely what the deal is, I know not all trees have this issue, but it's not just oaks. I've been told that you can safely raise the soil level by 2 inches per year, which seems like a tremendous waste of time to me. It would take 6 years to build a bed I could work with!

Surely someone out there knows. I'm going to look around for a place to post the question. Is there a tree forum on DG? Maybe the Landscaping people will know ...

Cheri'

I posted the question on the Trees & Shrubs forum.

http://davesgarden.com/t/403183/

It doesn't look good. =(

I hate to see your trees suffer ....

Cheri'

Cheri' you are not alone! I also hate to have anything happen to my trees. Since your first post, I have been doing some internet digging and have looked at various sites on the subject. As I understand it, the soil, if too deep, acts like a blanket and smothers a tree. One site though said that preservation of half of a tree's roots will ensure its survival. I read that a tree's roots are generally as long as the tree is tall. Since the trees I have are at least 40 feet tall, I know that I am not smothering 50% of their roots.

On the other hand, some sites stess the importance of the roots that flare out at the base of the tree.

I am thinking I need to rake some of the soil away from the base of the trees. I hope that will be okay. Better safe than sorry! Thanks for the warning.

Oh and I forgot to add that I read that the white oak is "moderately" adaptable to environmental changes. The Northern Red Oak was listed as being low in adaptability.


I also read that the soil not be landscaped under the tree so as to cause water to pool there. I don't think mine will do that. Also, my first layer under the top soil is shredded bark which I assume would provide more air in to the roots. In any event, I think I will be raking back some of the soil.

What they are saying in trees & shrubs is that even 1 inch is risky. *sigh*

I think what they mean when they say 'half the roots' is one side or the other. Because I've heard that too, and my trees have stood having the roots on one side covered (by the neighbors) However, the ancient oaks that were killed in the park had tiny beds built around them, prolly less than 3-4 feet from the trunks all the way around. Obviously the roots of these centuries old oaks stretched way past that. I doubt the soil was 8 inches deep.

I'd uncover the roots, if it were me. Sorry to rain on your parade!

My long term plan for my oaks is to let the level of the soil rise naturally, via the decaying leaves that accumulate there (and the ones I encourage to accumulate there). I just run the mower over them to speed up decomposition. I've been doing this for 5 years, and it's still the low spot in my yard. *sigh* Unfortunately, mine are on the property line, next to a privacy fence. Can you say "DEEP SHADE"??? LOL. Nothing will grow there!

Cheri'

beardtongue, I was amongst those watching when you initially posted about doing this enormous bed. I don't remember that you said anything about large oak trees in the path of the bed or I'd have sent up a RED FLAG then.

I strongly recommend you promptly contact your local US Forest Service person for advice but it is my personal opinion you will kill the oaks.

The layout of the bed is fantastic, as is the project, and I'm sure it will have a wonderful effect when it's planted and growing well but you are sure to be upset if it kills the oaks. Over the years I have seen too many oaks die from just such fill over the base and roots.

I started a shade garden bed around my 100+ year old oak, adding about 4"-6" of soil about 5 years ago. A week later I promptly removed it on sound advice. Later, I started adding an inch of soil mixed with bark screenings once a year, and in some small areas I have added 5-6" just for one plant but none over the base of the tree. It seems to be doing okay but I continue to be cautious and don't add any more to it.

The roots extend out to the weep line.......ie:as wide as the tree branches extend outwards in a circle around the tree.
Please do not cause any tree to suffocate .
The everchanging soil does rise naturally but at such a slow rate that the trees growing roots are able to keep up with this by way of growing larger and upwards staying above ground .
IMHO,SB

Beardtongue, I also strongly urge you to remove at least half the soil from around the base of your trees.

I know it must be heart-breaking to hear after all the work you have done, and I didn't understand originally that the trees were going to be incorporated into your beds. I have spent years working with our backyard woodland, and I have learned about hardwood trees -- we have many oaks and hickories and ash and elm trees.

If you can un-bury an area around each tree, maybe 3 feet around each trunk, that should be plenty of breathing room. I know it might sound difficult to find the original depth of each tree, but the bark is really different around the collar, which is where the trunk meets the roots. That is the really important part of each tree to leave alone.

Rather than undoing all your lasagna beds tho, is it possible for you to use something to poke deep holes through the layers? I am thinking of something like a crowbar, perhaps an inch or two in diameter. That should allow enough air to penetrate into the rest of the beds to prevent the tree roots from suffocating. Poke air holes all the way through your new beds, and maybe at least 6" into the original soil. Do this every foot or two. Besides giving more air to your tree, it will also speed up the decomposing process of your new bed, giving you good soil that much quicker!

As your lasagna bed ages, the height will decrease, maybe by as much as half, depending what type of ingredients that you used during construction. So that you will end up with slightly raised bed, which should be OK around your oaks.

The design looks fabulous tho! I love the way you have curved it around a sitting area. It should be a wonderful place to enjoy the outdoors next summer. I love sitting under our trees -- it is so much cooler than sitting under a canopy!

Lupinelover, thank you so much for your advice. I value your input, as I do from the other posters. I have not done anything with the trees so far but plan on working on them this weekend. I have done some reading on-line about the subject and spoken to a neighbor who farms around mature trees located in his fields. The neighbor thinks my beds will have no adverse effect on the trees but I wish to err on the safe side and remove some of the soil.

You are so right that it is disheartening to think of having to disturb the beds I worked so hard to make. But on the other hand, I really wish to do this project right and would wish no harm to my lovely old trees. By the way, after further talk with my parents who purchased this homestead in 1961 (and I purchased from them in 1997), I think the trees are at least 100 years old.

Your idea about using the crow bar to "ventilate" the beds is excellent and workable. Certainly can't hurt!

Again,thank you for your reply.

Here I go again with another dumb newbie question. What is a lasagna garden? I've heard of it before, just don't know what it is.