Help! I have fireant's in my flower bed!

Well with all this warm weather we have been having, I haven't been able to resist my trips aound the yard to check out the beds. Of course I have to pull back the mulch to look for any new growth. Well as I reached down and pulles the stuff back....my hand was covered up in fire ants! I know from last year that these little buggers will kill whatever they are nesting next to! and I can't bear to loose my Clematis! Does anyone know how to get rid of these things WITHOUT killing my plants????
PLease help!!
In the past I have tried all types of ant killer, but didn't use them around my plants.
So what should I do??

Me to Mooybee.

Orthene. It won't kill them, but if you use it according to directions, they will be relocated in less than a day.

I sure was hoping that someone would tell me. Thanks Aimee!!
I think that is pretty much what all those store bought things do....make them relocate. I think that the fire ants are the WORST! They are the hardest thing I have ever tried to kill! But maybe if I keep putting stuff out on their mounds, maybe the will relocate plum out of my yard LOL!

LOL Jim, ain't them thangs awful?!!

Mollybee, apparently another fire ant killer is urine and/or grits (I learned that in the Jokes & Chat forum, BTW :)

Trish puts a couple packets of Sweet and Low (in the pink paper packets) in the line of the ants, and they carry it down to the queen. Apparantly, it is "pawzun" and kills them nicely.

Dave

That's what I use the artificial sweeteners,works'''

Thanks alot ya'll! I think I am going to get some Sweet&Low first thing tomorrow! And as for the urine...well I do have 3 boys LOL
Thanks again!!

Don't think the urine works, I tried it. Sorry, but I have been forced to resort ot bad chemicals here. I did like the result from piling Feline Pine litter on the mound.

I've always sprinkled store-bought ground red pepper (cayenne) liberally on and around their mounds and my plants. Makes 'em go away very well. I've also shredded some habaneros ~ works the same. A nice side effect is that cats and dogs won't dig in your beds, either.

Thanks everyone! I knew I could get the answers I really needed! ya'll are the best!!!

Are there such things as pet anteaters?

LOL now that really would take care of them ants now wouldn't it?!! Too bad they aren't considered a pet. With all the ant hills I have, I would have to have 2 anteaters! and then they would be soo fat from eatting all my ants that they wouldn't be able to move. hee hee

I read in a local newspaper that pouring boiling water on the mound will also get them to moving to kill them...either way is fine with me. I want them dead cause the moving just keeps them moving into the neighbors yard till they use something, then they move right back...

Yea I think that the boiling water would set them to running but, these little buggers are right in the flower bed and I am afraid that it would scald the roots of my tender plants. But now for the ones that aren't in the flower beds, now that is a different story...I will use the boiing water to rid them!

Yes,MB,boiling water would kill the rest of your plants that ae close to the ant hill but can use it in other areas of the yard but expect a dead grass spot where you pour the boiling water. Now if you have weeds in the cracks of your sidewalk or driveway,boiling water will take care of the weeds for you. Also if you have a shovel,stir up the ant hill and spray with wasps and hornet spray. Kills them dead on the spot.

cool Thanks CoCo!

CoCo, it only kills the few you see. They have burrows under those mounds, and as soon as the mound is disturbed, the ants above ground swarm out and attack the intruder while the ones below rush to relocate the queens,(Yes, they have up to 100 queens per mound) and eggs into the burrows away from the attack. You may kill a few hundred, but there are literally thousands scattered throughout the underground burrows. The long term answer for control, since you will never totally eradicate them, is to scatter bait which is formulated to keep them from being able to produce viable eggs, or a different bait that will be taken underground and fed to the queen so she will die. Even if all the queens died, there would be new eggs already laid which would hatch and start the cycle all over again. So a birth control type of approach is the most logical, and might be why there is one named Logic. Ideally, everyone would scatter Logic or some similar bait on the same date, and renew it in a few months on the same date. Then in time there should be a huge reduction of newly hatched ants, so they could be kept down to a tolerable number. I use Logic, but only on the five or so acres near the house, because it is expensive for something that will only work if used by everyone. I also use Orthene Fire Ant Bait for a quick fix on walks and in flower beds. Some years, I have been able to relax about turning over a rock and digging into soil, as the population was significantly reduced, but they always build back up.

try the sweet and low, and the grits, It just wouldnt hurt, and I would really like to know if it works. It sounds like it should....
Those fire ants must be scarry, we dont have them in the Pacific Northwest, we have just the small ants.

Yea I think I am going to try the sweet&low stuff, but since I don't use the stuff, I can't seem to remember to buy it when I go to the store! Guess I will have to make a special trip just for that huh?!!
You better be lucky you don't have fire ants out where you live, they are sooo bad!!! We have them real bad here, and once they get settled in on your yard...you will have them forever!!! Thing is I don't remember seeing them when I was a child growing up, in fact the only ant's I do remember seeing had little tiny mounds that were only about the size of the palm of your hand. But the ones we have now have mounds that are about knee tall and real big around!! I mean they are hugh!! and if you ever step in a pile of them...they will be all over you before you can get away from them. They are plum evil I tell ya!! lol
I will let you all know if the sweet&low stuff works!

They ARE nasty little &@$&@%#s, aren't they? No offence, Pebble, but around here the fire ants would look at those grits and sweet-n-low and say, "Where's the butter?" ;-)

Fire ants are aliens to the US, came from South America somewhere, I think. They weren't around when we were kids, either, but we did have those big red ants that make those 3' diameter nests that were really just bare spots on the grond around the mouth of their hole. I've heard that the fire ants have either been killing the red ants or competing for food with them and winning, but either way there's not so many red ants anymore. And since there's not so may red ants, there's not so many horny toads. I sure miss them.

Hey Wingnut, wonder if the fire ant is the same thing my granny use to call a "pissant"?? LOL I think it probably was because if one ever got on you it would bite the p*ss out of you! LOL Ya think??

Last year I used Andro - seemed to work very well. Just sprinkle some around the hill, they then carry it to the queen & others and they DIE!!

Thanks Azalea! I'm willing to try anything at this point.

I have no personal experience with fire ants, I hope I didn't come across as being an expert (lol) or professing to be one. I had the little blank ants, my whole yard was infested with them, (probably still is) and I didnt want to use harsh chemicals so I did some research, and found out some interesting facts about ants and ways to get rid of them. I dont believe it was specific about any ants, but could have been just about the little black ants.
Those Fire ants sound scary...and if any of you have watched any of those horror movies about insects turning violent and trying to take over the world etc., you might wonder about some of the truth in them, for example, there was one movie about ants with suzanne summers I think, where they were building a resort, (humans were) and they disturbed the ant nests, and they ants came after them..
then there was one where the ants had developed an immunity to the pesticide the humans were using on them, and in fact, there was a mutation and they became stronger and stronger (not bigger) and more resistant to anything, and there was no way to get rid of them. (it's watching movies like this that scares me...cause there probably is a thread of truth in them)
anyway, that was one of the reasons I didnt want to use a pesticide on them, I didnt want them to built up a resistance to them, and I thought the grits thing was a good one, cause I figured, by the time they take it all down to their nest, have a feast and end up exploding i wouldnt see the little mangeld bodies......

well, so I just want to clarify someting: you all say that these particular ants weren't around when you were growing up, and that they came from south america....wonder how long it took them to get here, and how long before they come to Washington? and is this a movie in the making or what?????/

just dump boiling water on them.....move your plants first.
sounds scary really.
Wasnt Aimee talking about a method where everyone use a sterilization medicine? I say let's do it before they get outta hand and move up north.

aaarrggghhhhhhhhhhh

Hey, Pebble! It's global warming you need to sweat. These ants are called "Imported Fire Ants" because they did indeed come to the Southern US, maybe Ala? on a load of, I think, lumber, from South America, in the 40s (?). I will look up some stuff right away and come back. Thus far, the imported fire ant hasn't been able to survive in colder climates. In order to get to you, it will have to arrive in a shipment from a warmer climate, or the states above the Mason-Dixon will have to become much warmer. Or the fire ant will have to develop resistance to cold. The Northern states should be very interested in research being done to control them before this happens. If the US had been aggressive back in the 50s, we wouldn't now have this problem, which has destroyed millions of acres of farmland. I read about a farmer in Alabama driving across his field and his entire tractor sinking several feet into the honeycombed burrows they had formed, and that was over 40 years ago. My Louisiana neighborhood association in 1960 had a meeting and floated a bond for research and chemicals, and we were shown a film then of some of the early damage. But USDA appeared to ignore the problem. They weren't in West Texas as recently as 20 years ago, but they are there now in sufficient numbers to cause problems. Amdro doesn't kill enough to make a dent, and yet people keep buying it by the ton. If it worked, they would be gone. Another funny thing about them is that you can't drown them. In floods, they have been seen forming a ball up to two feet in diameter and tumbling along in the water. They have caused fires by gathering in electrical circuitry and breaker boxes and shorting out the wiring. As Wingnut observed, horned toads and tree frogs, as well as some forms of lizard, have been virtually wiped out by these ants. They carry seeds to their burrows for food, and these seeds often work to the surface or are dropped along the trail, spreading unwanted weeds. They can kill plants by burrowing into the stems for sap or moisture. I have stopped growing okra because they move into the pods for the seeds as soon as the pods are an inch long. I am extremely cautious about using chemicals, but fire ants leave me no choice if I am to live here at all. They built a mound under a corner of my Morgan storage building, right up to the floor, then set up housekeeping in the wall as high as three feet. I poured boiling water on the bottom of the mound, collapsing it and hoping to persuade them to move. They moved. Over about four feet, and built a new mound in front of the door. But a major percentage stayed in the walls and rebuilt the original mound within a week. Be afraid. Be very afraid. They are indestructible.

I went to Texas A&M site on fire ants, and it seems they did enter through Mobile, Ala. and they are predicted to arrive in Washington state! I think I cut a URL that you can use to navigate the A&M site here: http://fireant.tamu.edu/management/index.html

Yep, Aimee's exactly right! Everything she said jives with what I've read, heard and observed. It's a scary sight to see one of those "floating balls of fire." Last August they clogged up some electrical connections on my house and shorted out my air conditioner. A hot person is an ANGRY person and I was ready to use ANYTHING, including straight gasoline, to get rid of them. I didn't, though ~ Sis talked me down. *grin*

I'm rather afraid of the same things as you, Pebble, re: resistance, so have been using the red pepper with much success. BUT I surely don't have them anywhere NEAR as bad as some do. If I did have mounds two feet tall all over the place (like fields I've personally seen), I'd be more MUCH more aggressive in my approach to them. Also, I have to keep an eye on the chemicals as my water well is only 20 feet deep and I have two creeks nearby for things to run off into, but sometimes I still have to use chemicals. When I do, I use them according to package directions to try to minimize the chance of them building up a resistance. Aimee, wasn't it A&M that let go some sort of fly that's a natural predator of the fire ants? They lay an egg on the back of the ant and the larva feeds on it after hatching. Last I heard, the fly was doing well, but not as well as expected.

BTW, Pebble, not to worry! You didn't come off sounding "experty" and I hope I didn't either. I just saw where you were from and thought you might not realize how evil these things are. Kinda' like people down here don't realize how big slugs get up there where you are. I've heard they routinely get big enough to fill up a hot dog bun. Is that right? Wow!

Oh, YUCK!!

check this url http://www.antcolony.org/natural_ant_control.htm ... hopefully to shed more light on the subject. hope that help

This is really scary
egads, people, every single houselhold in texas needs to participate at the same time - much like aimee had mentioned in an earlier post. here is the simple version of it:

Fire ant baits consist of pesticides on processed corn grits coated with soybean oil. Worker ants take the bait back to the colony, where it is shared with the queen, which then either dies or becomes infertile.

too much information for me - scared me to no end - like I said earlier, this is a horror movie in the making.
And I didnt see anything about them coming up to washing....so if we ever trade - you guys be sure you dont send me any ants ok???
we have our slugs, but other than being gross and squishie they dont go around harming much (unless you have a field of lettuce)

Now I'm going back and reading MaVie's link
(just so I can get a little more scared)

Aimee that business with your ants bldg in the wall of the shed - oh honey.....I just dont think I could live with it.

do they attack unprovoked?

By the way, Aimee, did you say they come up on lumber becuase you know I am in the lumber busines??? LOL - I dont bring lumber into the US - I send it out ....

Pebble... u got me ROTFLOL =). u are too to funny...HA HA HA!

ant from what i understand are known not to cross lines. this may sound funny to u, but u can experiment like i once did, where u see the ants, draw a line using Comet cleanser on a straight line. u'll be surprise they do not cross that line at all. there is one pesticide i know that works Diazinon, a product by Ortho company. summer of last year, my son's house was infested with ants during one of my visit. i had him buy 2 bags of Diazinon, spread it around the perimeter of the house. the same practice i do around here. talking about fire ants... i live in the desert and u see them by the millions around the area. so far they have not invaded my garden ... as yet ;)!

try not to use red wood compost or any wood compost at all cause lumber by product do invite those nasty critters around. i have also planted some wormwood [artemisia absinthium]. i've read once this plant deters ants. i do have lot of them and am willing to share some cuttings for postage. they are easy to grow, but one has to be careful where they plant it though.

do not worry about trading with me, i do not ship plants with soil on them =)... hehehehehehe... ma vie

MaVie, maybe your ants won't cross a line, but I assure you, these fire ants will not only cross it, they will erase it! I surrounded my house with a 3" wide line of cayenne to deter other pests, and the fire ants built mounds over it. I have encircled their mounds with various insecticides to see if anything would cause them to avoid it, and nothing daunts them. I have been watching them here for almost 13 years, on almost 30 acres of pastureland, and very little even slows them down. If the grass is tall, they build in it, but if it's mowed, they simply build all over. They don't show a preference for any particular area, building on an asphalt driveway as well as in a heap of coffee grounds. I do note this: I bought Lillian 10 cubic yards of river bottom dirt for a hill to play on, and ants apparently have not built in it. Then there is the pine litter from the cat's pan, they vacated when I covered a mound with it. But if I dig down below it, I might find them still under it, haven't gone that far.

Pebble, I am not certain what the shipment was that is thought to have brought them to Mobile, I have read various things, but if they were found on lumber, it could be that they were seen there and had formerly been on something else in the ship. It must be terribly difficult to inspect every inch of everything in a ship's load, so I think the actual carrier isn't so important as the point of origin. We get impatient with restrictions, but this is one of the reasons they are needed. With every shipment of goods from one area to another, we run the risk of contaminating every port where the ship stops. How can we have our lifestyle without such risk? Even within our own country, there are restrictions, and yet, garden pests spread. I received a box of iris several years ago, from a Master Gardener in a Northern state, who assured me they had been properly treated to kill the larva of a moth known to be in that state. I became ill and didn't get the rhizomes planted, and when I opened the box later, the rhizomes were full of maggots. Had I planted them, I would possibly have given them a start in this area that would prove disastrous. I didn't realize until then that agricultural materials aren't legally shipped from that area, which is on the other side of the Mississippi River from me. A search for restrictions made me feel like you do now, quite afraid of plant trades from other states. I have oak wilt on my property, and I will not even consider sending this soil to anyone. But I know others send me what could be contaminated soil regularly. A 10% bleach solution is said to kill anything harmful, so I use it, but am never quite confident something won't slip through. A fourth teaspoon of soil could contain the eggs for thousands of harmful critters. I don't have the answers, and I'm not sure anyone does.

Those nasty little fire ants have killed a many a trees around my house. It seems they build their nest in and around the trees and the next thing ya know, the tree is dead!! We have lost 2 full grown lumbardy popular trees 2 full grown plum trees, and 3 pine trees! (and it just so happens that those 3 pine trees were helping to hold up the boys tree house!) So yea we have had our fair share of them also. It never fails though, if the boys see a freshly made mound of ants, they think they have to mess with it in some kinda way, weather it be stepping in it real quick, or poking it with a stick...they always say "anyone at home?" and before they can say it, the ground is covered in ants! But I guess boys will be boys!
and yes I have tended to many a ant bites on their feet and leggs because of it...but they simply can't resist those mounds. (good thing they are all old enough now to know better than to stand close enough to get bit) now they kick the mound and run! lol O and I have had my fair share of ant bites also, but not because I disturbed the mound eaither, simply standing still long enough in the wrong place. they leave bad sores too! I'd love to get rid of them for good!

They are called fire ants because their bites cause a blister to form. And they are the only ant that bites as well as stings. I am with you, I would love to get rid of them for good, but I think it will never happen because of the need to coordinate the effort in a nationwide campaign.
The chemical companies don't want it, they would prefer to sell us more chemicals, and they probably have bought the researchers to keep off the market anything that would be a real solution. We end up using as many chemicals or more, but never in an effective manner. Just as we had government intervention to wipe out cattle screw worms, we should have it to wipe out fire ants. But we don't eat trees, and the damage to crops and farm land (millions of $$$) seems to be not enough to force attention. We would see a solution if it interfered with someone's steak supply.

Aimee, in one of the links you posted, it did say the ants came here on a load of lumber...
You guys, this sounds sooo scary to me. I vaguely recall watching a documentary about the effects of ant bites (undoubtedly fire ants) on this lady, she almost died. and also on a little girl who did die. I had forgottten about this until just now as I was reading the latest posts.
It appears that they were allergic, and the effect was like a massive coronary. (heart attack?)
I wish you all so much luck, this would be scary.

Aimee, speaking of diseases etc., we have almost every single load of lumber inspected by USDA and get a phytosanitary certificate for loads going overseas. and all lumber coming in to the USA has to be fumigated. we just had a fiasco with a couple of loads of Birch coming into the US from Russia, they had not used enough of the chemical to fumigate, so both loads had to be re-fumigated this weekend at an astronomical price, becuase the USDA inspectors as well as the fumigators had to work this weekend. I am a very strong advocate of protecting our land from outside influence, and also not exporting ours.
Just recently I found out that there is a virus killing the Oak trees in california they call it "sudden oak death" I dont do anything with oak out of california, but apparently the virus also attacks other trees, and the Big leaf maple is a host, and I do export a lot of big leaf maple out of here, but the stock out of oregon and washington is not affected yet.
OHHH the trials and tribulations.....

I hope I havent sent anyone any critters in my trades, i do wash my roots very well, but it could be something not seen by the naked eye, virus, germs. microbes etc.

Keep me posted about the fire ants, the phenomena is staggering.

Aimee and Mollybee, you have my symphaty.

There was an old John wayne movie about Ants wasnt there?
oh yeah, and then there was the cartoon ants...lol

I guess all of us here in Georgia are having this problem. I did the same thing as Mollybee. I poked around in my mulch and found fireants everywhere, but I do not see a mound in the bed. That was kinda weird to me, becuz usually you see a mound, but the mulch had them in it everywhere. The day before my wedding my hubby and I noticed 3 fireant beds right where our wedding tent was going to be. We knew we had to get rid of them and the people were coming that day to put up our wedding tent. We got some Orthene Powder fire ant killer. We put quite a good bit of it on the bed and after about 2 hours we looked and actually saw the DEAD ants on top of the mound. If they did relocate, it was far enough away that they were not guests at my wedding or reception, which was all outside in the same place. It worked for us that day, so off to Wal-Mart I go. I think I'm gonna get the Orthene powder (stinks real bad) and some sweet and low and take care of these ugly mean creatures!!!!

Thanks, Traci

I have put the sweet&low out in the bed, so I will be reporting back the results soon! Wish me luck!!