Advice for repotting a baby Schefflera

I just bought a little scheff from a local nursery; his name is Simon (I name everything. I think things, animate and inanimate alike, respond to you better if it's personal). I want to repot him but I have a few questions.

1.) It's currently in a 4 in pot. Would it be too much for him to handle if I put him in an 8 in pot right away? I know not to plant him deeper into the ground and would be careful to fill of the bottom with soil and such until he's at the right level.

2.) Do I need to be aware of any special soil needs for this guy? I've never worried about this before but after reading several of the threads here, I'm kinda scared that I've stunted and starved all my house plants using the wrong soil. I've been using the specialty mix made and used by the nursery in town from whom I buy all my plants but maybe I should look into more specific mixes for my specific plants?

3.) If it's not a big deal to put him in the larger pot, would I need to space the individual plants further apart? My particular plant consists of four separate plants and when I was shopping around, I noticed all the potted scheffs seemed to have the individual plants spaced near the edge of the pots and not in the middle. I'm not sure if this is important and if it is, how to go about untangling the plants and spacing them appropriately.

I really appreciate any and all help that can be given. Like I said, I've been reading a lot of the old threads and the information I've garnered is just unbelievable. I can't wait for the snow to be gone so I can start my outdoor planters with a seemingly endless fount of information at my fingertips!

Here's another picture of the actually stalks.

Also, I know it's an indirect light plant and I DO NOT keep him at this southern window but rather in the middle of the room. However, for picture purposes, it was easier to photograph on the table.

1) People who are used to using heavy soils will tell you that you need to be careful about over-potting, and you should move up in pot size gradually. When it comes to trees, and plants with roots similar to tree roots, you really need to be thinking about tending to the roots, as well. Once the roots of a plant become congested, growth will always be inhibited, no matter how large a pot you pot up into, unless/until you correct the root issues by selective pruning (of the roots).

I wrote this about container size relations for another forum several years ago. It explains the relationship between plant material (size), pot size, and soil choice:

"Over-potting" is a term that arises from a lack of basic knowledge about the 3-way relationship between plant material/ soil composition/ container size, which together logically determine appropriate container size(s).
It's often parroted that you should only move up 1 size in containers when "potting-up". The reasoning is that the soil will remain wet too long and cause root rot issues. Of course, that's true if you're growing in a heavy, inappropriate soil, but it can be remedied by changing the soil to one that drains freely.

The size/mass of the material and soil type/composition determine both the upper & lower limits of appropriate container size. Plants grown in slow soils need to be grown in containers with smaller soil volumes so that the plant can use water quickly, allowing air to return to the soil. This (smaller soil volumes) will cause plants to both extend branches and gain o/a mass much more slowly. Rampant growth can be had by growing in very large containers and in very fast soils where frequent watering and fertilizing is required - so it's not that trees necessarily rebel at being potted into very large containers per se, but rather, they rebel at being potted into very large containers with a soil that is too slow.

We know that there is an inverse relationship between soil particle size and the height of the PWT in containers. As particle size increases, the height of the PWT decreases, until at about a particle size of just under 1/8 inch, soils will no longer hold perched water. If there is no perched water, the soil is ALWAYS well aerated, even when the soil is at container capacity (saturated).

If you wish to grow in a large container - please do. Just be certain that your soil supports no, or very little perched water. You have all the tools you need to make an excellent soil. Now all you need is the confidence and the materials. ;o)

The short answer to your question is: Whether or not it is appropriate to plant in the considerably larger container depends entirely on your choice of soil. It is probably inappropriately large if you are using a slow/heavy soil, but perfectly suitable if your soil drains freely and is well-aerated.

2) You don't need a special soil, but using an appropriate soil will make your (plant tending) job a lot more fun and make it easier to grow plants with superior vitality. It also can provide you with a much wider margin for error in your approach to growing in containers - makes things more fool-proof.

3) It doesn't matter if you leave them as they are, or space them more widely.

The plant appreciates full sun. If you only pot up, it's ok to do so now, but I would encourage you to do a full repot, which includes root pruning when you repot your planting. Doing THAT would be more appropriate in mid-late June.

Al

Beautiful little tree! This was my first plant and it seemed to thrive from my neglect! I would water it every couple of weeks and didn't repot for it for years, ever though it could have used it! When I eventually started to repot it, I went too big too fast. Soon the leaves started dropping and it got root rot. Eventually I had only a few stems left and they ended up getting bugs and didn't make it.
This plant does not like to have alot of water. No standing water for sure. The problem with a bigger pot is that there is alot of room for the water to sit, and not really benefit the plant. Also it is VERY important to make sure the pot has proper drainage. Mixing some sand in with the soil would be great for drainage and using dirt rather than potting soil also helped me alot. The dirt seems to hold the plant in place alot better and potting soil is too hard to rehydrate after letting it dry out. This is what has worked for me and my (newer) plant seems to be thriving. It's 4 stems/trunks and about 2 1/2 feet wide and 3 feet tall.

I'm sorry, but I have to say that I think adding sand and 'dirt' (topsoil/garden soil), or trying to grow in them as a container medium is going to cause LOTs of issues related to water retention, lack of aeration, and an accumulation of soluble salts.

I carefully explained the relationship between soil choice, plant mass, and container size so readers could see the difference between growing in a well-aerated soil that holds little or no perched water (can't over-pot in these soils) and growing in soils that support LOTs of perched water, like those comprised of sand and topsoil (pot size can be critical). Growing in soils like the latter guarantee that plants can never grow at their genetic potential, even if every other cultural condition is perfect. Growing in well-aerated and free draining soils guarantees that plants have at least that opportunity.

While sand (even builder's sand) might offer better drainage in already poor soils, it slows drainage in good soils and has a decidedly deleterious effect on aeration in either poor or good soils. Topsoil can be counted on to markedly slow drainage and for an even worse effect on aeration than sand.

Al

So how does the "average person" determine whether the soil is heavy and inappropriate, or if it is slow soil, or the size/mass of the material and soil type/composition, and all that other great stuff you said? Alot of that was over my head! :) You obviously know quite a bit about soil.
I've have been growing plants indoors for about seven years and considered myself to be pretty good at my hobby. :) Of course there is ALWAYS room for improvement!
My Dad had a livingroom COVERED with plants and he ONLY used garden soil unless the plant was given to him with potting soil. But it would end up with garden soil eventually. My Dad's plants were second to none and mine are not that bad either! Both of our plants are nice and healthy. My experience with the potting soil you buy in stores has not always been good, BUT I've never had problems with using garden soil with or without sand. Actually I've only used sand in with the Shefflera. It seems to me that garden soil would be closer to natural than potting soil. I don't understand why or how it is bad? And without having to go back to school to learn about soil, what options does a person have?

Sorry if I gave bad advice, but my plants all seem to be doing well and are healthy so I am going to ASSUME that it works! But you know what they say about assuming.... :)

Don't take this like a lecture or as anything other than a friendly conversation. I'll try to answer your questions and explain.

So how does the "average person" determine whether the soil is heavy and inappropriate, or if it is slow soil, or the size/mass of the material and soil type/composition ...." That's a good question, because not a lot of people realize that you can do much better than bagged peat-based soils. The short answer is: If you cannot water so the soil is fully saturated and at least 10-15% of the water you apply comes out the drain without risking root rot, your soil is probably inappropriately slow and heavy. The reason I say that is because if you can't water so you flush the soil w/o risking root rot, you guarantee that soluble salts from your fertilizer AND tapwater remain in your soil. As the level of salts increases, it becomes increasingly difficult for the plant to take up water and the nutrients dissolved in water, so the plant can actually die of thirst or starve in a sea of plenty.

That said, if you're happy with the way your plants are growing ..... I'm not trying to get you to change anything. I've been helping people grow better plants for a really long time. I do lectures, demos, workshops, and spend quite a bit of time on the forums. Through experience, I can say that a very high % of the problems people come here with are rooted (is that a pun?) ;o) in their choice of soil. Often, diseases and insect infestations occur when a plants defenses are weakened from the stress of growing in poor soils. Root rot, or depressed root function/metabolism are directly related to poor soils, as are high salts levels. Several nutritional deficiencies are also related to inhibited root function in poor soils. So when I hear someone suggest a soil I know will hold lots of perched water (a layer of soggy soil at the bottom of the container that drainage layers cannot correct) and little air, I sort of have to disagree.

Water behaves differently in containers than it does in the garden, and we need to make allowances for that difference (explained here: http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/1073399/ ), so what works in the garden is often best left there because it doesn't work well in containers.

We can actually quantify the parameters of what makes a good potting soil. Good soils should have at least a certain amount of total porosity (60%) and when the soil is completely saturated so it can hold no more water, it should still have at least 30% air space. Garden soils might have 40% total porosity and less than 15% air porosity in containers, so we can be absolutely sure that plants cannot grow at close to their genetic potential in these heavy soils.

When you grow in heavy soils that hold lots of water, the roots subjected to anaerobic (airless) conditions quickly begin to die - within an hour or two for the finest roots, which are the most important. The plant cannot regrow these lost roots until air returns to the soil. Then, the plant must use energy it would have allocated to flowers, fruit, foliage, branch extension, roots other than what it's replacing, or it would have stored the energy. This cyclic energy outlay that occurs every time you water is very taxing and expensive for the plant, and you can easily see how it hampers growth.

If you're interested, you can read more about it by following the link above. If you have more questions, I'll be happy to answer here or on the thread I linked to. There are also 2 'sticky' threads at the top of the container forum that should illustrate how many others have found considerable value in what I just shared and what you'll find there.

Take care. I hope this was close enough to being on topic, Courtarfaust. It looks like you got more than you bargained for. ;o)

Al

Hmm Al I think you have ALOT of info up in that noggin of yours! :) I could talk to you all day! But we probably wouldn't get too far unless you were to speak in Layman's terms!
So one of the soils you use is

"My Basic Soils
5 parts pine bark fines
1 part sphagnum peat (not reed or sedge peat please)
1-2 parts perlite
garden lime (or gypsum in some cases)
controlled release fertilizer (if preferred)
micro-nutrient powder, other continued source of micro-nutrients, or fertilizer with all nutrients - including minors"

I want to make some and test it out. I have some slow release plant food (19-6-12) would this work?. What is "micro-nutrient powder, other continued source of micro-nutrients, or fertilizer with all nutrients - including minors" and is that different than the plant food I have? Please without getting too technical! You obviously know what you are talking about so I have to give it a try!

Al,

I don't mind in the least! I love the information and can't wait to use it.

In reference to your post directed at me, I think I will go ahead and wait until June and do a full repot as I think my other plants could use it too. Between now and then, I think I'll gather up the necessary materials to make some of the soils you describe in the link.

Again thanks for the information!

-Courtney

Pam - The 19-6-12 is a very good choice as CRFs go. Take note of whether it includes the rest of the essential elements - some do and some don't, and making sure they are all available is important to normal growth. If your fertilizer doesn't contain the minors, I'll ask you to forgo using it in favor of a soluble fertilizer that does - that ok? It's a good way to keep things simple. The most difficult thing to find is the pine bark in a suitable size. Once you've located that, the rest is easy. I'm glad we end up being pals instead of being at odds w/each other. ;o)

I think you made a good decision, Courtney. ;o) I'll be around if you need help. If I miss your post(a), you can dmail me, too.

Take care, guys!

Al