E85 flexfuel

We are on our 2nd tank of it and will hopefully not have to go back to gasoline. We drive a 2000 Dodge Grand Caravan with a 3.3 engine. We have had it for a year but just made the switch last week. We always got about 20.7 mpg with gasoline and now are getting 19.2 with the E85. I did have to go to our Dodge dealer to get the special oil which is only $1 a quart more than the regular oils. We will gladly support American farmers in this way. I really don't know that they will benefit financially very much except that the demand for corn will go up. We can raise lots of corn in the central midwest. That is why we are called the corn belt. A bumper sticker is available and we will get one and proudly proclaim our loyalty to our nations farmers. You can go to www.e85fuel.com for information on which vehicles will use the fuel and where it is available. I have to drive to another town where we seldom shop but do go to the doctor there to get it. It is suppose to be coming to Sedalia soon.

I'm no expert but doesn't the valuable resourse it takes to grow the corn just as expensive to our resources (water)?

I was sure disappointed to hear that burning E85 you actually get less mileage, so the price difference doesn't really balance out per gallon but you are burning something a little cleaner.

This message was edited Jun 3, 2006 7:01 PM

What valuable resource are we using to grow the corn? Most tractors are diesel and many are converted to biofuel which is made with grain oils. The same oils that restraunts thow away after they have been used in a deep frier for a week or so. Our son makes biodiesel for about $1.29 a gallon for his vehicle. If you are speaking of land, what do you want to do with it? Let it set idle, put buildings on it, or what? We need to break this dependence on imported petroleum. Ethanol fuel is one way to do it and help our country become more self sufficient. The little bit of mpg drop we have experienced is well offset by the lower price. At least we feel it is.

I meant the amount of water it takes to produce corn. It seems like one evil for another....a step in the right direction to think of new methods that's for sure....but still doesn't seem to be a solution. I've heard it only runs about 30 cents cheaper a gallon than gas...but then the less mileage....Also takes fossil fuel to refine it I believe and still has 15% unleaded fuel (hence the 85 part) in it. I think solutions are needed. I think it would also be awesome if companies could actually drill and refine the oil we have here in the states to release the pressure and concern of depending on foreign oil, at least until a "solution" is found.

I did watch a show about a guy who gets the veg oil from a chinese restaurant and runs his small car on this...to convert his tank he spent a grand and he has to clean the oil well with some machine from home. Interesting how the possibilites are finally coming around.

Edited to say: I am fortunate to live in an area where the gas is running $2.55-$2.60 consistently. 5 hours north of me in Dallas gas runs about $2.89-3.

This message was edited Jun 4, 2006 5:07 AM

Here is news about the Ogallala Aquifer:

http://www.uswaternews.com/archives/arcsupply/3scisay2.html

The above site mentions that:



I'm not saying give up, I'm not saying E85 is terrible. I'm just suggesting it requires more research before we can just start demanding this as a product for mass use. I personally just don't know very much about it or the oil industry and there hasn't been much information available about our options as a country.

And the big oil companies intend to keep us uneducated about other viable options to imported oils. CA is testing several types of experimental vehicles which is great. But until they get to be available to the mass public in all areas of the country I am going to support American farmers not Middle East sheiks and oil barons of any nation including our own as much as possible..

Did anyone see the report a couple of weeks ago, I think it was NBC, about how Brazil has become independent of foreign oil. They grow ALL their own fuel.
The best selling cars/trucks are GM and Ford (American) that use Flex Fuel. Some dealers will phase out gasoline powered cars at the end of the year.
Bio-fuel can be produced from almost any starchy vegetation, orange peels and sugar cane after the juice has been squeezed out, etc.
Hopefully, our elected officials will take a closer look at Brazil and turn a deaf ear to the oil lobby. (I know, I'm dreaming.)
Andy P

For those that don't have a vehicle that was designed to use E85...don't use it - unless you're looking for trouble ;)

E85 compatible vehicle list:
http://www.e85fuel.com/e85101/flexfuelvehicles.php

Briggs & Stratton (small engine manufacturer) will void your warranty if you use anything over E10 in their engines because...

* Use of gasoline containing higher than the EPA approved limits, for volume percentage of ethanol more than 10%, or MTBE more than 15%, may cause engine damage and will void engine warranty.
http://www.briggsandstratton.com/display/router.asp?docid=64061

Some info on Popular Mechnics web site:
• E85 is corrosive and will damage almost every wetted part of the fuel system that it touches. Dual-fuel vehicles have stainless steel fuel tanks and upgraded seals, fuel injectors and other parts.
• E85 provides less energy per gallon than gasoline. Dual-fuel vehicles have a sensor in the system to change the quantity of fuel injected and to modify the ignition timing to compensate. They also use an injector capable of higher injection volume. A conventional vehicle running on E85 will run poorly, with reduced performance and mileage--and may suffer engine damage from running too lean.
http://www.popularmechanics.com/specials/diy_central/1783077.html?page=2&c=y

Years ago there was a report that GM was working on cars for Brazil to run pure ethanol but GM said it wouldn't work in the USA because we couldn't grow enough sustainable crops due to our climate. Now they are pushing flex fuel (why the big switch?). It's only been 33 years (OPEC embargo '73) since Gerald Ford was pushing for oil alternatives - what has happened in all those years? Shale oil was suppose to be the wave of the future. Hydrogen cars were considered an option as well (Iceland has hydrogen pumps at their gas stations so consumers have choices).

I'm all for anything to make us independent of foreign oil. E85 is a step in the right direction but will it catch on? I remember when we use to have E10 or E15 years ago but that died after a couple of years. What happened to that?

hczone6, thank you for that information. My DH was talking about the possibility of us using the E85 in our 11 year old lawnmower. I told him there was no way we could do that but he wants to know why. I'll pull this up tomorrow and let him read it. I have heard some of this info recently but the person wasn't absolutely sure of the information.

No problem. I'd love to use an alternative to traditional oil/gas products and I hope they find a good solution VERY soon. It should be an alternative that's cheap and plentiful...and of course, cleaner. If it's ethanol, fine...but they need to get to work making sure we can all use it and that it's readily available and reasonably priced.

Tir_Na_Nog we don't have to water our corn in the corn belt there is very little iragation in the midwest ant there now looking at sugar cane it will make Ethanol and also fire the still after it has been dried

I saw the news report a couple weeks ago about Brazil using multiple farm products for E85, including the sugar cane. VERY interesting! I am hopeful!!!! Glad to know you don't have to irrigate much in the midwest.