Straw bale gardening: no weeding, no hoeing, no tilling

After intermitant showers and lightning today we've taken a break from gardening to watch the 3rd round of Masters Golf tournament in Augusta, GA just across the river from us.

We're very pleased at how not only the weather has cooperated but how well the garden is coming. Our bales finally cooled down from the 125 degrees to 60-65 degrees after approx. 10-14 days of watering and using only fish emulsion. It took 3 quarts, using a 20 gallon hose end sprayer to apply. The straw has decomposed beautifully. We planted yesterday and we can already imagine the plants litterally jumping out of the bales!! Will send pics in the next couple of days.

Kent, by the way since you sound like a "pepper head" too, try juicing carrotts, pulp and all, putting the mix in a plastic ziplock baggie and put as much tabasco sauce or habanero's as you can stand. If you want more sweetness just add sugar or artificial sweetner. Then place in fridge or freezer to chill to your taste, and eat with a spoon as a snack.

I've just adopted a 'baleful' look on my face.

But nobody took my question seriously. Except I went and looked at a bottle of household ammonia and its Ammonium Hydroxide. Now what? Yet another Ammonium compound.

I wish someone would theorize about what will happen now that I've set my bales out in the weather but haven't started the N process yet. I can't do it till after Easter now so that will end up being at least 2-3 weeks outside before I begin. I can't do anything about it though.

Melinda: great update on your bales; glad to hear the fish emulsion is another alternative over the ammonium nitrate. And thanks for the pepper/carrott recipe. I've got a brand new juicer so I'll try it soon. I love tabasco. There used to be a small bottle in all the C-Rations when I was in the USN. I think Uncle Sam still puts them in the MRE's our vets eat now.

alyrics: remember, nature will prep your bales w/out any assistance; it just takes a little longer. Check the condition down inside a bale every so often and see how they're doing, decomposition wise. If it looks like they're breaking down, then you may just want to go ahead and transplant or plant, whatever you had in mind. But, it shouldn't be a problem adding anything to the bales, if you go that route. I don't think you can "over cook" them.

Anyone else have any thoughts on this?

Kent, I agree, " I don't think you can "over cook" them." Just be sure they've cooled down before you plant or you'll burn the roots of your tender transplants.

I'm in the 11th day of the process with my bales. They've really starting to cook! The straw is starting to break down and even some of the wheat seeds are sprouting. They're still a little warm to set out plants so I'm going to wait a couple of days and set out some brocolli and cabbage.

I just screwed on the 1"x 1" hardwood posts today for staking my tomato plants.....

Lookin' good, Big Red! And it sounds like the blood meal is doing the trick as far as heating/decomposing the straw.

I'm a bit behind ya'll but hope to catch up soon. Looking forward to this technique!~

Shoe.

I'm not convinced my bales are heating properly yet, despite the soaker hose and fertilizer. I plant to rake up the chicken yard (ewww) and put that on top of the bales, then water it in.

Big Red why did you use such tall posts for tomatoes? Having come from a long line of farmers and gardeners its amazing that I don't know the answer to that question but I don't. The pic makes it look like your posts are about 8 ft tall. And here's another questionable Q.. Did you use a post driver to put the fence posts down thru the bales? I don't think I could do that on my own.

Somewhere up there I remember a discourse on staking vs. tomato cages - but can someone tell me quickly if I can use my tomato cages?

Thinking of more headlines Kent
A

Mine are beginning to sprout but seem on the dry side. I haven't watered them a whole lot but we have had plenty of soaking rains. The straw is still tightly packed so I can't really get my hand in there to feel it. What kind of temps should I be looking for if I stick in a probe thermometer?
Guess I better turn on the soaker hose more often.

Shoe, yep, the blood meal is really cooking! I'm having a hard time waiting to set out some 'mater plants, too!

Zeppy, that chicken poo should really get it working!

alryics, they are 8' posts, these are some of the ones I used last year. Of course they were driven into the ground 1' so it only left 7' out of the ground. Most years my tomatoes will grow to the top of an 8' post. I've posted a picture of some of my "in ground" tomato plants, Amish Paste from my first garden here in KY. The metal fence posts are not driven through the bales but rather on each end, not only serves the purpose but I thought it would help hold the bales together also.

I've never staked tomatoes -- only caged them. So this will be new for me. I think I'll only do about 3 or 4 bales of tomatoes, anyway. The soil garden tomatoes will be either trained up twine on an 8 foot trellis or caged in my rusty but strong 5 foot high concrete reinforcing wire cages.

Roseone, I need to water my bales more conscientiously, too. Mental note to add to about three thousand other gardening mental notes...

Well you must be taller than me! I'd have to get the DH or a DL (ladder) to pick off a 7 or 8 ft post
Do you mind me asking what kind of tomatoes you're growing? I can take this over to the tomato forum if you want. I am totally new at successfully raising tomatoes. My dad has rows and rows of them but I have too much shade to ripen them. So this year I'm raising tomatoes at a friends place.

alyrics, I'm six feet tall so if they grow near as well as normal I'll need a step-ladder also. Here's another pic of my Amish Paste tomatoes from my 2003 garden.

Also, here's a link to the varieties I'm growing this year.

http://davesgarden.com/journal/ed/index.php?tabid=2685

roseone, didn't mean to ignore you, I really don't know what temperature they should reach. They do get really warm to the touch if you force your fingers down into the straw.

I don't use a soaker hose , I water mine by hand. They get 2-1/2 gallons of water per bale per day. When we get heavy rains I don't water. Seems to work out good for me.

Thanks Big Red - what a great photo! I am trying out 10 varieties of tomato this year and going to keep track of what works up here.

Thanks. I put the soaker on for a couple of hours this morning, I don't want to run my well dry. Carrying water is out of the question for me. This is supposed to fun and easy. I'm treating it as a fun experiment to find out what happens.

Kent, I would like to add my thanks for starting this thread!

I bought 4 bales of straw at the Miami County Co-op in Paola, Kansas for $3.50 a bale. Very, very tight bales and they used baling wire. Not sure what type of straw, very bright gold and pretty. ( LOL, sounds like I buy cars based on color too, doesn't it?)

I started them with blood meal today....I am so exicited. I live next to a public softball complex, and the grounds crew are always buzzing back and forth on the street by my house on little 4 wheel gators, etc. I think I almost caused some accidents when I started watering in the blood meal, those guys were driving by looking over their shoulders trying to figure out what I was doing!

I had to fight myself to start small...I have already over committed by ordering too many Rose bushes that will be arriving in May, so I have to keep my veggie garden small.

To All: keep those bales watered; my pop tried a couple of bales last year and half way neglected them; his tomato plants were about 1/2 the size of mine

Note to self: Got to get a USA map and put some push pins on everyone's location.

haleysaunt: welcome aboard to the USS Baler

Headline: Osawatomie Police Declare Bale Garden Traffic Hazard - Town Council Passes Ordinance Requiring Screening Around All Bale Gardens

alyrics: you're on deck

Big Red: I've got to read up on those tomato varieties you're doing, especially the "Mule Team" one. I'm a sucker for anything that's got the word "mule" in it. I recently bought some BBQ dipping sauce called "Old Mule" and it's fantastic; a NC product, at www.oldmule.com

This message was edited Apr 10, 2006 8:41 PM

OK BigRed--I KNOW I'm living in the wrong climate now, mine never get that big.....unless maybe spring and fall crops can be added together and count!
Debbie

Well I'm going to get back to my idea for an Ammonium Nitrate co-op. But Kent has to fill out the app with his name and address because I don't think its safe for anyone else to do it. Uncle Tim had one heck of a time with that.

Today's headline:
Pioneer -Indian Altercation Re-enactment Squirted out of Existence by Trigger-Happy Bale Gardener
Quote: "I just don't go for flaming arrows being shot at my tomates" says Bale Gardener whose front yard looks like a straw fort. "This is not the kind of heat I had in mind"

Hi ya'll! I've been reading this thread since the beginning with baited breath and I've been talking about this to DH and he was in awe when I showed him the pics. Yesterday we drove down to Commerce and picked up 20 bales of Coastal Bermuda hay!! Yippeee! The farmer had it advertised in the Market Bulletin as mulch hay, and he told me that he had cut it last fall, and then it rained before he got it bailed, and he tried feeding it to his cows and they didn't like the way it smelled and wouldn't eat it. I got those bales for $2.00 each! (maybe I should have gotten more?)

I have an area of my garden already tilled for my corn, and a stretch of fence where the peas are growing, which will soon be holding up beans, and the rest I am going to plant in bales. I am so excited.

As soon as I get them all laid out I am going to start watering them. Here's my question: I have a 55 gal drum half full of chicken manure tea I made last summer. I am thinking that I can pour the tea on the bales to jump start the composting process. Do you think the tea will have enough ammonium nitrate after sitting in a sealed drum all winter?

It seems like to me that preparing your bales is like preparing a meatloaf. How many different ways are there? 100's I'm sure, depending on taste and preference. But the most important thing for safe human consumption is that the meat be done to at least 165 degrees to kill any harmful bacteria. How can we tell what proper heat it should be unless we have a themometer. We purchased a deep fat frying themometer that shows 50 to 400 degrees. This will work on soil as well as the bales.

We planted 16 tomatoes in all of the same type bales and they were treated the same way. When I put the plants in most of the bales the temp was fine. I tried one and it felt warm and when I checked the temp it was still 115 degrees while the others were 60 degrees. We lost those plants in the hotter bales. I know some of you warned not to plant in hot bales but didn't say how hot was too hot. Well now I know!!

The plants in the 60 degree bales are all doing fine. So, I'm thinking one of the secrets to get ready for planting in your bales, like for starting your grill for barbecue is "know your HEAT"!!

Put Yourself on a MAP!

Strawbaleman had the great idea:
"Note to self: Got to get a USA map and put some push pins on everyone's location."

I know a great mapping place, where some clever wag has been playing with the google maps ARI -- So - we've got a map, tell your friends, come and plug your electronic push-pin in: free of course, and no one sends you silly advertising.
If this craze sets in for the long haul, we could pull the map over here, even.

c'mon over and see:
http://www.frappr.com/strawbalegardeners

Sulfate of Ammonia - as a rotting agent
I'd picked up a bag of this from the good local Orchard Supply Hardware a few years back, that I use in silk painting as a flow agent; it is Nitrogen 19-0-0, so I assumed it'd be good to use to prep these strawbales. I'm ever curious about these things, so I Googled up a few articles on the use of Sulfate of Ammonia / sulfonurea / Ammonium sulfate (some of the names you might see for the same thing), which is what's now available by the bagloads in garden supply places instead of Ammonium Nitrate (since one simply can't make things that go boom from the sulfate of ammonia).

There's a good article from the Missouri Agricultural Experiment Station on their experiments with using various nitrogen sources other than Ammonium Nitrate:

http://aes.missouri.edu/fsrc/news/fsrc2.stm

"About half of Missouri's 12 million acres of tall fescue receive nitrogen (N) fertilizer either in the spring or late summer to increase yields. Because ammonium nitrate is being phased out and urea has NH3 volatilization problems, growers need comparative information on new N products for pastures.

Our objectives were: 1) to compare ammonium sulfate, ammonium nitrate, urea, ESN coated urea, Nurea, and Nurea with NITAMIN, and mixtures of ammonium sulfate with urea and ESN as N sources for tall fescue in spring and late-summer applications. "

They had splendid results with the Ammonium Sulfate. I'm a-gonna use it with my bales.

Ok, I tried adding Louisville to the Map. Can't do it.
I clicked on Join now still no luck. So if someone can add Louisville, Ky. go right ahead

Iam, try clicking on the "add myself" block on the right hand side of the map. It pulls up a window where you enter your name and address.

pam

Well, seems like my bales may be ready eiher in late fall or next spring. I checked the temp in two different rows of bales. The first bale was 57' and the other bale was 66'. The air temp yesterday was 68' and it was 33' in the morning. I will keep using the soaker hose and be patient. In the meanwhile, the bales are a handy ready made bench around the garden.

Hmstyl, your bales are probably half decomposed already if they got a good soaking way back in the fall.

We need to start a new thread on this before this one starts getting really long to load.

I agree.

OK, with everyone's approval, I started a new thread.

Have a blessed day!

KR

new thread is here
http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/590925/

This is great. Since I joined acouple of days ago, I have gotten more ideas than i can keep up with. WOW. I'm adding this to the todo list for next year. I have heavy clay soil and I hope this method, over several years, will help recondition the clay. I currently have added a raised bed at 1' height for veggies. It is working great, but is very expansive even when I'm doing all the labor.

Sure are alot of posts for this thread. More than I can read in one sitting. Thank you Straw for the Thread. Thanks to all for their advises and suggestions. Please keep them coming so I can get more ideas.

BTW, How about carrots, lettuce, beets, ect. You know, the veggies that I call rooters. Would the bales Work them????????


thanks to all for the uplifting ideas.

nivac,

Welcome to Dave's, you'll be sure to meet lots of new friends here!

Click on the link just above your post and you'll see that this posting has expanded to Part II. I'm trying this method for the first time this year, lookin' good so far!

This method sounds awesome! Before this week is over I will have bought my bales and will be giving them the 10 day treatment! I'm so hyped I think I'll go to the feed store right now! Bye!

I wonder if you could use this method to winter sow?

Connie

Connie,

I don't have any experience with "winter sow", but it sounds like a good experiment to try.

Here's the link to Part 5, which is where we've left off. You'll see the links to Parts 1 - 4, also.

Most of us are through bale gardening for the year. Waiting for Spring.

http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/631772/

Kent

Thought I'd bump this thread up for all of us that are now starting new beds for spring veggies later.
carol

That's a good idea Carol, but Kent, what about starting a new part when this gets going for us dial-ups. It takes forever. Have a happy and prosperous new year everybody!!

Jeanette

We're at Part 6.

Join our bale garden discussion by clicking on this link: http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/680745/

I am very excited about growing my garden in these bales, and sorry but I didn't read every post, you've probably said this before but I didn't see it. I know pine straw is no good but what about other types of hay...esp. bermuda or fescue (my dad has a farm and both are readily available). And does using other types of grass/hay dictate the fertilizers you need to add?