Conifer ID

Oops-

Hi Maackia - no, there isn't any reliable distinction; basically, the maps of native distribution work on known historical locations, and evidence that trees cannot (or are unlikely to have) have arisen from human introductions. With some species, this can impossible to determine, or only determinable by archaeological research. Trying to map e.g. Pinus pinea (which has been cultivated for over 6000 years in the Mediterranean) or Cryptomeria japonica (similarly cultivated in Japan and China for several millennia before botanists wanted to map it) is a complete nightmare.

Hi Quilib - the fs.fed.us link I don't get what they're saying at all! All their P. resinosa entries are "0.000" though, maybe that means 'absent'? (as it must do for e.g. the similar entries for P. elliottii, a deep south species).

State champs can easily be planted specimens; there's plenty of WI-non-native species on their champs list (couple of Ginkgos, and you-name-it all else!). The wisc.edu one is only mentioning it as an overstorey above an orchid site; again, that could very easily refer to planted trees.

Resin

Well, then your cones from me shall come from Menominee and Dickinson Counties of Upper Peninsula Michigan.

Thought I might point out to you that our buddy Ken (kandlmidd) lives in Presque Isle Wisconsin which is Vilas County and according to the maps I have been looking at, that's a resinosa hotspot! I'm sure he'd share!

For my area, Swink and Wilhelm are about as good as it gets. I have their first, second, and third editions of "Plants of the Chicago Region" and no mention is made of P. resinosa existing anywhere in 1969, '74, or '79 so I'd be inclined to believe the P. resinosa I ran across is not "wild". There are herbarium reports stating resinosa existed in Lk Forest Illinois at one time however those trees are long extirpated.

My Kane county native plants book says this--"It, too, is a rare native along the lower Fox River, the only site in Illinois, and has naturalized here south of Leroy Oaks Preserve."

Well, there's that word naturalized.

Interesting that the only evergreens listed as native to my county are Thuja occidentalis and Juniperus virginiana, while the deciduous tree varieties are huge in number. What evolutionary pressures would cause such a situation???

My guess is warm temps and lower precip. I am surprised you (Kevin) have native arborvitae in Kane Co. Wild T. occidentalis is common in the upper half of Minnesota, but very rare in the lower third. But then, you do get more rainfall than us.

Should everything fall through, Resin, I have land in northern Minnesota along the Canadian border. Definitely wild resinosa is common, along with P. strobus, P. banksiana, J. communis, L. laricina and P. mariana. Probably won't be up there until June, but whatever you'd like is possible.

Rick

Another quote from the book--"Thuja occidentalis-rare-found at Trout Park and Chicago Junior School in the wild but it and various Eurasian species are extensively used in ornamental landscaping. It is a splendid, clean evergreen in natural settings, to 30', with flat sprays of rich green needles, but it has become stereotyped in hedges and foundation plantings where it is often over-used and abused."

Well let's now go to the extremes, this spring I'm hoping to visit the naturally occuring Pinus resinosa stand located at Upper Tract in Pendleton County, West Virginia. As far as I can determine this is the most southernly native Red Pine location in U.S. I'm hoping to maybe collect a few small seedlings as well as cones!!!!!!

conifer50