The buddleia has to go, doesn't it?

Really need to check this forum more often.......

I used to buy in multiples. Then, well then after a series of events, and now little money, I only buy one of each, maybe 3 or more if it's a shrub and it's small enough = less money. I'm doing exactly what sally said and doing it the cheap way. Waiting for plants to fill out so I can dig and divide and spread em around. joe, some day my plants will spread and since you're so close, you're more than welcome to any excess I have.

You could make a t-shirt............I'd buy one :o)

Gosh, this forum is depressing... I try to be good about avoiding invasives, but now I see that I've still got plenty. It makes me frustrated that the garden centers don't post more disclaimers to help buyers make more informed decisions. I know, I know, I know, Buyer Beware. Ugh.

I agree wrightie, the garden centers don't help and really add to the problem. There has been many times I've been attracted to plants and and have questioned employees and have purchased plants I've had to throw out when I've looked them up. Part of the problem for me is that many of the great garden writers are British and following their concepts lead to problems here.
I just had to post the photo of my uprooted butterfly bush. Replacement will be Joe-pye-weed cultivar "Little Joe". I will miss the silvery leaves this winter though, if we do finally have winter.

I asked about the Butterfly Bush on another invasive thread. I have had one for about 15 years. Just one. The last few years I have been ill and not deadheaded and there is still just one Butterfly Bush in my whole area. However, I have watched as the Butterfly WEED has marched down the roadside totally unaided by mankind. But then the Joe-pye-weed comes into bloom and that is all you can see anywhere! It takes over! I hear that Queen's Anne Lace is so invasive but the original settlers in this area often used it. I don't have a single one and there aren't any for a couple of miles around me although they do show up along the roadsides farther away from my house.

I live in the foothills of the Blue Ridge and keep hearing about "native" plants and trees. There are practically NO virgin forests along the Appalachian Mts. They were practically clear cut as settlers moved in and built homes. Not many of those settlers took the time to write down the species of trees and plants they were killing or what they had brought with them. We really have little proof of what is "native" and what is not.

I have been studying this for about 20 years. I got interested when I moved to the area and became fascinated with its history. I am sure each area of our country has it own special twists and turns in its history that effects our current environment.

Supposed the Sweetgum tree in "native" to where I am. It is also annoying, sheds large, burr-like seeds and is very, very invasive. It's roots stay close to the surface and constantly send up suckers and is very extensive. But it is NATIVE. It is a very, very hard wood and few people will take them out.

I think we are talking about two different problems. Invasive and/or native? Native does not necessarily mean good!

It's really hard to comprehend that such a beautiful plant can pose such a threat. Perhaps your plant hasn't set seed however others have and they've done so in South Carolina. Butterfly Bush has in fact naturalized in SC so somebody's plants are escaping cultivation and it's not just one or two doing it but groves-
http://plants.usda.gov/java/profile?symbol=BUDA2
So has Daucus carota-
http://plants.usda.gov/java/profile?symbol=DACA6

I disagree that we have little proof of what was native and what wasn't in that region and there are several research stations that share just this information. I've visited Clemson as well as other centers myself. They're out there and they're open to the public yet how many people know they are there?

Many acres of land convert to weeds annually. With all we have learned about invasive species, it's a shame. We can do what we can to address the mistakes of the past but we need to move forward. Screening plants for invasiveness is going to be a tremendous help. This type of legislation is coming.

Perhaps someday in the not too distant future, we may be able to enjoy some virgin forests along the Appalachian Mts.

This for wrightie-
When one jumps on, others will follow.

Link to The Nature Conservancy-
http://www.nature.org/wherewework/northamerica/states/michigan/news/news2223.html

MollieB55- You sound sort of angry or maybe a bit scared. Are you worried that butterfly bushes might become illegal to own? Or that you will have to deadhead your bush by law? I don't think that's going to happen. Sorry that you have been ill. You must miss working in your garden, I know I would.

You are wrong about butterfly weed (I assume you mean Asclepias syriaca or Asclepias incarnata) being "totally unaided by mankind". It marches down the roadside exactly because humans have created the ideal conditions for it. First, when the road was made, we scraped away all the other plants. Because rainwater washes off roadways and collects in troughs and ditches by the side, plants that tolerate standing water thrive there. Asclepias spreads there first by seed. But then it multiplies by rhizomes. It can not be eradicated by roadside mowing. Cut one down and it will pop up in two more places.

I agree with Equilibrium as to having evidence of what was native and what wasn't. There was plenty of interest in new species of plants. Although the first explorers to the new world were looking for trade routes to the far east, they took back plants and seeds as well as other potential trade goods. Where do you think Europeans got corn, tomatoes, tobacco, potatoes, sweet potatoes from? All of these plants originally came from the new world. Many originated in South America but were traded by Indian tribes until they became ubiquitous through out the new world. And although early settlers were very busy just surviving, they didn't have computers, ipods, TVs and the like to spend their time on. Some were self educated. They read what ever books they could find. They studied their surroundings including plants. Here is a link to a short piece about Humphry Marshall, an American botanist.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humphry_Marshall

greenkat, I am not scared about the butterfly bush. I do know that I can read everything available but it will not hold as much water as what I have lived with for 31 years. The botantist you refered to was born a hundred years anfer the first Amercan settlement. And Europe did not get potatoes from us, we got them Euorpe.
I have a vine that I see people asking for all the time and calling native. It probably it. It is second only to kudzq for being invasive however. It will choke the life out of huge trees.I had a lovly poplar stand and didn't realiz the top of it was riddlled with musgutine vine. Lighting hit that vine one night and travled long it and I lost 7 beautuiful trees. I constantly check my works for it. Now I hav neighbors building arbors for them. The birds will eat those grapes and leave me with the vines to keep under control. It easily escapes into the wild but noe cares.

Since this has come up, I have ased around and no within 50 miles of me has any trouble with the butterfly bush. NO on deadheads.I do just so I can get more blooms. I am ready the diaries of several families that settled along the Blue Ridge and try to complie a list of plant that they knew that were here when then arrived. as well as plamts and animals that they brought with them.

South Carolina got rich on rice and indigo before the Civil War. Both crops brought over by the African slaves who then had to teach there owners how to plant and care for them

I guess my main cripe is that I don't care how NATIVE it is, if it invasive, I don't want it! I don't know where the Butterfly Bush came but it is staying i get myy garden up and growing. I am looking into joining the closest Native Plant society.

Interesting comments, "no within 50 miles of me has any trouble with the butterfly bush".

Equilibrium, Hi there! Remind me not to write at 5 in the morning ever again! Everyone, please, forgive that wretched spelling. And I did not mean to come off sounding so snippy at all! Believe me, I know i made and still make lots of gardening errors! But when I moved into this area it is so different from my place of birth - SC vs Ohio, and I loved it so, that I began researching its beginnings and history. Then I taught SC history for 8 years. Plus, I have lived in 4 states and SC is the first place that I ever had to battle invasive plants. (Probably just go lucky there)

My first few gardens here died because I was trying to make it an Ohio garden. Then I got intested in the lists of Natives. Muscadine was the first thing I learned to hate - especialy after losing the poplars and having a huge tree fall on my house during a storm. It had been choked out by the Muscadine vine! I had onel live in the house a few months.

Believe me, I spend more time getting rid of invasive plants that anything else. I sure don't want to contriubute to the problem! And after reading how the settlers stripped the land bear, I do want to bring as many natives as I can - if they don't take over my entire yard!

I know what you mean about the native grape, the Muscadine. We have it here in MD. It is tenacious once established and very hard to uproot. We also have Virginia Creeper, another native that has invasive tendencies.

I

This message was edited Feb 12, 2007 7:07 AM

My husband refers to it as typing while impaired. Mostly happens to me when I am overtired or when I have a cat in my lap that I am trying to type around or when I wake up in the middle of the night bored out of my gourd because I fell asleep too early.

I never make gardening mistakes... no not me... never ever ever- ha!

Vitis has a look alike that is exotic that many mistake for the native however, even the native can get a little weedy when the flora and fauna that historically occurred with it that kept it in balance are absent from the equation. The Poplars you referred to may or may not be native.

You're so close to the NC border that you might want to check out this native plant society too-
http://www.ncwildflower.org/

Mollie:

Did you send your muscadine up north for vacation? Here's one cohabiting with Platanus occidentalis in Ghent, KY.

That is its trunk on the left.

NO WAY - that is huge.

Way.