Advice on planning a border?

Al, Has that sentence ever been directed your way before??
( "Al - thanks for getting us back on track.") ;)

Is this a private joke or did I sound like a moron?

Sorry Pirl. Do you know Al well? He is very funny and often all over the place. His restoring order, instead of disrupting it (in a good way) just hit my funny bone.
Dave

: )~ Al is funny!

I know Al is funny (and have told him so) and I thank you for explaining the situation.

Al's alot of things..funny is also one of them!!! But I have to agree with Dave - I never thought I would see that statement directed to him. LOL!! sorry Al

Where is Al? We're getting off track again.

You guy are way off track again - but I'm gald you found it funny on the humorless day I had.
Getting back on track - I really like the plants in this post + helenium as my recommendation..
http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/581126/
pirl- I told you these guys were awful ;)

Okay, Al, I'll believe every word you said. Didn't you always wish for someone to say that to you?

Here's a site with a few ideas - there are a few pages to it:

http://lifestyle.msn.com/HomeandGarden/Home_GA_SSfrontyardflowerpower_BHG.aspx?GT1=7908

Thanks for all the tips (and humor)--I'm working on my master list and i'll run it by you all once i get it together. I've decided to go for a cottage garden-y feel, sticking to mostly pinks and white...it should be fun...

Anyone here ever grown Deutzia Godsall Pink? I'm not sure if I'm going to go with an oakleaf hydrangea in that corner (don't worry, debbie, it's still a contender), or the deutzia, or there's a butterfly bush with variegated leaves and pink panicles (Strawberry lemonade, i think)...any votes???
(yes, debbie, we know what your vote is!) :)

I know I am coming into this late but I can't resist the blank canvas! I love deutzia, but i think it may need more light than you have in this spot. I was wondering from the pics if the problems you have had in the past are because the two trees are competing with what you plant in this area. Trees take up so much water and nutrients that it is so hard to get anything to grow near them. My suggestion would be perennials that grow in sparse dry conditions and shade- alchemilla mollis, heuchera, daylily, rudbeckia.
The other thing that tempts me about this blank canvas is the need for structure. A shrub to anchor the garden on the corner of the house, as suggested already, would be a great start and you could add a grouping of shrubs next to the steps (grouping of course, not rows! please no rows here!) and perhaps one in the center between the windows. Maybe I can photoshop something up - what else should I do, certainly not work! ;)

I agree with "please no rows". I'd be thrilled to never again see rows on rows of any plant!

Meg, ok I'll try not to be prejudiced :) I agree with dirtyinnh, I don't think you'll have enough sun on that corner for either the Deutzia or Butterfly bush. That particular Deutzia would tend to look "straggly" without enough sun. Don't get me wrong, I love Deutzia, well at least some of them :) We have several, one 'Magicien' whose flowers are gorgeous, but I have to fight with it every couple of years and whack it back - it's just too vigorous, sending up branches that reach almost 10' tall! That might not be so bad if the rest of the shrub would follow suit, but the base of the plant never fills out properly and you're looking at these huge "arms" that are reaching for the sky! I'm not familiar with 'Strawberry Lemonade', although we have had the variegated Buddleia 'Harlequin' for a long time. We have never had good luck with it :( The green and white variegation is lovely and the contrast of the dark purple flowers is fantastic, but it is not as vigorous as most Buddleias and most years I have to chop away at least half of the shrub that has died back or reverted to just green foliage. Now, if you absolutely have to have a variegated Buddleia, I'd vote for 'Santana'. We've had this one for two years now and the gold and green variegation is beautiful and so far it appears to be a good grower as far as variegated Buddleias go.

You already know what my answer is - If I had just taken a picture of my friend's Oakleaf last summer I'm sure you wouldn't even be considering anything else for that corner. The panicles on her Hydrangea were some of the largest I've ever seen - at least 10" long! But I'll forgive you if you decide on something else :)

Here's a pic of Santana's foliage from last summer.
Debbie

Debbie - both the depth of the color of the panicle and the variegated leaves make such a wonderful combination and a terrific contrast.

Hydrangea 'Tardiva' is another beauty and it, too, can be cut back, quite severely. It did get a tad larger than we expected but it was worth moving the plants surrounding it.

Pirl - you're talking about my shrub now, a true must have.
http://davesgarden.com/pf/showimage/93710/


Meg - I can draw you up something I just wasn't sure you decided on

Al

Mine, too, Al!

That's nice Pirl - I hope mine gets that big someday. I bought mine for $5 in a gallon pot 3 years ago.
I am always trying to get people to buy paniculata's in cooler areas instead of fighting with macrophyll's, but they want the color instead.
I've got Limelight too, and I'd like to add another this year, maybe Quickfire.

I planted a quickfire last summer- early july. it was $4.95 sale at the nursery - by fall it was twice the size and the blooms were gorgeous!! Actually i planted 6 of them - but that goes over to the "am I crazy?" thread which seems to be popping up as a theme in many of these threads. Maybe its a bit of spring fever?!!

Well, dirtyinnh, it could be either spring fever or cabin fever. I just want to be outside but the wind from the northwest keep on gusting along!

Al: have no fear! Someday yours will be as big as mine.

I love the hydrangea family and rescued a 'Pee Gee' from behind the 'Tardiva' last year. Is it really possible to train the 'Pee Gee' to tree form?

pirl - I see a lot of PeeGees in a tree form, 6-7' max around here. I have a PeeWee that is a related variety that isn't nearly as good.

Thanks, Al. I've had 'Pee Gee' before and it was always purchased in the tree form, not the bush form. I bought this one from one of those low price nurseries by mail, and it seems to be determined to grow in the bush form. If I remember correctly it seems to have had it's central leader removed so I'm not sure if it can be trained to grow in the desired tree form.

In fact, I bought the 'Tardiva' while shopping for a 'Pee Gee'!

pirl - last year I saw the tree form of Pink Diamond around like crazy, maybe an improved variety of PeeGee. I see both forms of PeeGee around quite a bit. Not sure it removing all but a central leader will force it to be a tree form, that's what I am trying to do with my PeeWee, but it is so slow growing I think I'll give up.

They have been pushing Endless Summer so hard because it blooms on new wood, but it still dies back and will never get very tall here. I'm thinking of getting rid of all my macrophyll's.

Be still my heart! Before you do anything rash with those macrophylla's please let us know the names. Pixydish and I will be having tremors in the meantime.

I'm not disposing of them don't worry. I just need to find new homes for them. I have 2 Nikko's and a Blue Wave. I was just out today taking boughs off of stuff - including their 10" black stubs.

I have an Oakleaf and Smooth that are good enough to keep.

I also have 2 burning bushes to get rid of also. I suppose I could post them in the UMW forum, but nobody near me ever speaks up.

Earlier you said that you're trying to get people to grow Paniculatas. What is the problem in the UMW with the macrophylla's?

They die back a lot and the buds are killed so they don't flower or get much growth in a year. Of the 3 I listed they are 3 years old and 12" high - getting a couple flowers each in a year. I think it is just the low temperatures that do it. I live pretty close to zone 4(average cold temp. about -17) I try to protect them with boughs from windburn but that doesn't help. I have other marginal shrubs like buddelia and smokebush that are short lived, but do great when they are alive(that sounds funny).

It does sound funny but I do understand your point. I think I'd grow Paniculatas just as you do, in your location.

I guess the theory was to get some colored flowers in the shade, which for shrubs is hard around here. My only other colored shade shrub is a Kerria. The rest are perennials - not that tall either.

Do Spirea Japonica work in the UMW? Perhaps the shrub form of Potentilla?

Yes, not really for shade though. I saw a tree(single trunk) form of potentilla last fall - who is that for?
I do have some cranberry bush viburnum as filler also.

So now you know I'm a failure at suggestions for UMW flowering, shade loving shrubs.

I plead insanity since I'm so thrilled by the arrival, on the first day of spring, of my only grandson, Charles Robert Pasca!

CONGRATS PIRL!!!! : )

Thank you Grenthumbs!

congratulations Pirl!

you're not a failure - sometimes there aren't answers

Charlie is a yummy looking baby! Look at all that hair!

He is one hairy little baby. He even has sideburns!

I'm so happy for you! Babies are great, and when they are that little they are great for snuggling!

You won't find me disagreeing with you at all. I held him and rocked him and snuggled and kissed him for two hours. I'm so overjoyed to have him in my life.

I love how new babies smell. I made my mom laugh when she came in to see my kids before we came home from the hospital, I said "Mom! smell my son, he smells like a new baby!" She said "thats good, I was affraid he might smell like a new car!"

How cute! I loved your words but your mother's response was even better!

There was something about Charlie's hair, when I snuggled into that mass of hair, that was so warm and appealing!