Some people are

Here it is Thanksgiving eve and I just got back form grocery shopping. I am disabled and must use the electric carts provided by most stores and also use the disabled parking spaces. It is painful for me to walk but I can only walk about twenty-five feet or so and then must rest. I have multiple problems and the most disabling is post polio syndrome.

First I need a parking space. The large grocery store where I enjoy shopping is "Publix" in our state and the employees are very helpful to all especially the disabled. They have ten disabled spaces but today there were'nt any spaces. Two were occupied by the disabled person sitting in the car waiting for their daughters to finish shopping. I know this for a fact for I saw them come out as I had to keep cruising around for a spot. This is totally illegal for the disabled must leave the car to have the privilege of using the space.($250.00 fine if caught) After parking I hobbled into the store and guess what? No electric carts! Sooo I had to wait another thirty or forty minutes. An hour and a half gone by so far but, hey, that's the way it goes. I'm used to this. Finally, I get a cart and as I'm driving away and in the middle of the store, the cart starts to run out of power. Make it back to the entrance and my luck turns for the best. There is an available cart. Now I can do my grocery shopping.

At the end of my shopping tour I head for the bread isle for a loaf of bread. I like to save that for last so I don't squish it and there in the middle of the isle is a 10 yr.old or so in an electric cart. I asked her was she sick or could not walk? She said"No". I told her she should not play with those carts because they are for people that can not walk and there are people waiting to use them so they can shop. She said she was sorry and was going to bring it back to the front of the store. A little angel but then her mother came on the scene. I told the mother politely, that these carts are for the disabled only and not a toy for children. She became very defensive and exclaimed "What's your problem? You have a cart!" I couldn't believe how an adult could be so ignorant for the disabled. I told her what I went through to get a cart and told her there are disabled people waiting for a cart. She was a very ignorant person for all she kept saying was " What do you care? You have one!" Other people in the aisle were disgusted with her attitude. Finally the child's grandmother came over and had more sense than her daughter and told the little girl to leave the cart. Reluctantly the mother relented but kept saying , now to her mother, "What does he care --- he has one!"
Please give people like me a break? Don't use our parking spaces or our electric carts if you don't really need them.
It is illegal but more so -- it is immoral and I hope you never have to use them. Thanks for letting me sound-off!

A VERY HAPPY THANKSGIVING EVERYONE Tplant (Ted)

Ted, what a bite!

It's too bad some people don't have the sense to raise their children with some awareness and sensitivity. Best we can hope for is that the Mother, somewhwere down the line, will get to experience the obverse first-hand. Too late for the nonce, but maybe in the long run, some of them will get it.

Today was the first day I have worn my O2 shopping. The folks in the new Lowe's bent over backwards to help.

Hopefully, the Mother and her Child are the exception. I have never heard or seen that happen before. The Mother was very rude and teaching her Daughter how not to be respectful of the law and rules.

I've seen it before. Well not the cart but the parking spaces are really abused. You see it alot with kids, some one's parent has a disability so they take their car out and get to use the handicap spot. Who cares about the people who really needs them, right? Ugh, just because it's not being used right now doesn't mean that some won't come along who really does need the spot.

Feel better though that not every one is this way. That mother of that little girl probably has problems of her own. At least the grandmother had sense. I hope she plays a big part in raising that little girl so she doesn't turn out like the mother.

I do admit to using my mother's handicap hangtag occasionally for the last couple of months whe I could not walk into the store on my own from the back 40. Now I have a diagnosis and qualify for my own sticker. I never thought I abused the privelege, as I felt handicapped without a firm diagnosis.

They are pretty tough here on enforcement and I rarely see folks waiting in a vehicle for an ambulatory person unless I go to a big city.

There was a funny episode on Seinfeld where Jerry was having a conversation with a man in a wheelchair after he left the toilet cubicle. The man said something like,"nice cubicle, huh fellow?" Jerry said, yes, nice and roomy. After the guy in the wheelchair led him along a bit more Jerry even admitted he liked the lighting in the handicapped cubicle for reading. Then the guy lowered the boom. The episode pointed out that some use handicapped facilities without even thinking, no real malice, just passive inconsideration.

I agree with you. My FIIL is by all means handicapped now. He loves his trips to stores where he can have the electric chair or cart . So he can go off by himself and have some space. I am building manager for my building, I have cars towed away that parked in the handicap spots. I will try to find who is parked there and ask them to move. It they refuse I have them towed. So much easier to move than to pay a tow bill. Darius I use the handicap thing when I take them to the doctor etc so I can take them to front entrance. I take them in and get them seated then go park , never use the handicap spots since they can't walk that far anyway I have to drive back to pick them up when its time to leave.

I was in Walmarts a week ago and saw a lady that works at a health clinic in one of the carts. I had been to the health clinic many times and saw her getting around with no problem. I was there that same day and saw her walking around with no problem. It does make me mad and I'm not disabled even though Bobbie is but she seldom uses her sticker unless we go to the doctor.

If I ever caught my child riding in a handicapped cart, I'd skin 'em alive, and if I didn't see them do it, I'd hope that someone else would do it for me.

My kids are getting older now, but when they were younger, we'd pass by the handicapped parking spaces and they'd say "I wish we could park there." My consistent answer was "be thankful we don't need that space." As they grew older, the message sunk in. They never grouse about empty handicapped spaces going to waste anymore (at least not within earshot of mom ;o)

I also had to educate them that handicapped doesn't mean poor. They made some skeptical comments about newer or expensive vehicles with handicapped tags, so I had to point out that debilitating diseases don't discriminate - they happen to people with and without the means to afford a nicer vehicle. I think watching their Papaw's declining health and death (COPD among other ailments) drove home that sick people don't always LOOK sick. If more compassion comes of that painful, bittersweet life lesson for children to learn, then I'm thankful.

DH and I recently ran into an old high school classmate of his. He was joking and bragging about borrowing his aunt's car, replete with handicapped tag and using it to snag good parking spaces. I'm sure the look on my face told everything I was thinking, because his smile quickly faded. I still shake my head whenever I think of that conversation...

I have fibromyalgia and have been so bad at times I didn't dare shop during the day because I might wind up with spasym frozen muscles in the middle of the aisle. At night the clerks knew my problem and would check on me once in a while to make sure I wasn't stuck somewhere. We finally found medications that allow me enough relief most of the time to do most everything I need to do even if it is not all I want to do. Someone asked me the other day why I didn't use the electric carts and to tell the truth I don't think it ever occured to me to use them. We've moved now and the big stores don't look after me the way they did in the small town and sometimes I am in tears by the time I get back to the car but as long as I can, I will continue to use the regular carts. Good wishes to those who do have to use them but I'm hoping I never have to join you. When I see someone getting their chair out of the car or van I ask if they would like some help or if they would rather do it themselves. Most of the time they pass up the help. Jessamine

Tplant you definitely had/have a right to "sound off". I hope it never happens again.

Judy

At our closest Super Wal-Mart, 25 miles away, it is almost impossible to get a Handicapped parking space.. We have a sticker to use for when Mama is with me.. The store probably has around 20-25 handicapped places..And yet 9 out of 10 yimes I just have to drop her at the door and go park elsewhere...Sometimes I ride around waiting..Usually the one's using the parking spaces are no more handicapped than I am.. It is a sad situation around here.. After shopping, I go out and get the car and pick her up at the front door again...Waiting for a cart is also a hassle..This store needs many more...I see the use of carts abused also..They are some real insensitive folks out there, along with a lot of really good ones..Where I come from, if I were ever caught being disrespectful to someone older or disabled, I wouldn't be able to ever do it again...In this part of the country, we got Whuppings, and I mean good..lol...I could go off on this all day, especially since my mama has become disabled and needs lots of help..All folks should have to spend a day in their shoes..I feel that if we all live long enough, we will get there also...

Larkie

Think I'd have been tempted to tell that little girl the cart was for people with physical handicaps, not mental ones like her mother had. I wouldn't hold out much hope for the grandmother's influence, doesn't look like she did a great job with the daughter!

My mom uses these carts and chooses her stores according to who has carts and parking spaces and who doesn't. Our local Albertsons is so nice they will assign a courtesy clerk to shop with her so she doesn't have to lift things or reach high shelves. I quickly let them know, that not only did that courtesy gained them Mom as a customer, it got them me too, who easily spends $700 a month at the grocery store.

A couple of things I have learned from experience with her. People are rude to someone just trying to drive those awkward carts. They don't turn well, they are jerky, they are cranky about shifting from forward to reverse. Please have patience when the person is blocking the aisle, they aren't meaning to. I frequently hand things down to people using the cart, offered to unload for them at the checkstand, and do my best to stay out of their way. And I have gone to management when I have seen kids on the carts and insisted they do something. I've learned that being obnoxious is a lot of fun sometimes.

And here my Howie could certainly use a handicap tag and such carts, but he won't. He broke his back in 1994 in a fall at work, then reinjured it and had surgery in 1996. He doesn't "look" handicapped unless you notice him walking crookedly on an especially painful day, but he hurts all the time and can't walk far without having a shopping cart to lean on. Even with one, he still can't walk for very long without hurting badly. I keep telling him it doesn't matter what other people think if he uses a cart - he knows, and our family knows, the reason he's using one - and it would let him enjoy activities which for him are too taxing.

This message was edited Nov 27, 2004 8:04 PM

I agree that these carts should be strictly for those who do need to use them, and my late adopted-mom had to use one because she was in too much pain to walk, and not strong enough, but I'm curious, TPlant, about something you said at the end of your "sounding-off", as you put it, and maybe I misunderstood what you said, but you said it's illegal to park in spaces designated for handicaps, which it is and you will get a ticketed for doing so, but did you also mean that it's illegal for someone to use a cart who doesn't actually need one? That lady sounds like she was on drugs because of how irrational she was. I can only feel pity for someone like that because of how miserable they must be, and they try to make others feel as miserable to make themselves feel strong and important, when in reality, they are very weak, frightened little children in adult bodies. Anyway, I hope this sort of experience never happens to you again because it certainly does not make for a good and happy day.

Maybe she just had a really bad day and was being irrational.

CaptMicha - that was my thought, too. She probably just let her kid use the cart to shut her up and was ticked someone called her on it.

We'll never know WHY the lady was so rude, and it really doesn't matter. We're not responsible for how others' handle themselves, but we are responsible for how we handle others, and I think TPlant handled the situation wonderfully, for that particular situation, and I completely understand his point of view because when you cannot walk because of pain, and I've been there, or other circumstances, and you go to use a cart and one is not available because someone's kid is using it for a toy, I'd be annoyed, too, and it would be nice if the managers could find a "legal" way to watch who was using them and who really needed them, and maybe there is but I'm sure they have to be careful how they would handle a situation like that because they could find themselves in legal actions against them and/or the store, and that's not a good thing. TPlant, maybe you could talk with management and bring it to their attention, and just see what they say, and see if they realize people are misusing them. Anyway, hope you don't have to go through that again, and good luck.

Gardenwife --- Your Hubby sounds like me after my first heart attack. The attack changed me completely and weakened my already stressed muscles due to PPS but I too would not use an electric cart. I also could not walk more than 25' and always in pain until one day I relinquished and you know what? I really enjoyed shopping pain free. Tell him to try it. If he doesn't like it --- he can always go back to pain! I was stubborn also.

Grayse2 -- What I meant was that it is illegal to park in a disabled spot if the disabled person stays in the car while the able bodied person gets out of the car and goes shopping. The disabled person must leave the car also or use standard parking space. No unfortuneately, it is not illegal for anyone to use the cart.

Capt Micha --- No the lady was not on drugs. I know the tell tale signs of an addict and she was sober and naturally irrational.

TPlant, it wasn't Capt Micha who thought she might be on drugs, it was me, and it was just a thought.
Doesn't really matter why she behaved so badly, she just did, I just hope that maybe the next time they go to the store, she won't allow her child to play with one of the carts. Speaking-up about such things can, and do, make a difference. TPlant, I was wondering if post Polio Syndrome is the same as just Polio? A kid I grew up with had Polio, and he had to wear these braces on his legs, and for a while they connected together at his ankles......he had a few surgeries, but apparently they caught it in time because he was fine, after a while, and is still okay today. About parking in a handicap parking space....now this is here, but if you park in a handicap spot, and you are not handicap in some fashion, you do get a very stiff ticket, but if you park in the spot that's next to it, where one side is the blue line and the other side will be a yellow line, and your tire is on the blue line, they'll give you a ticket for that. It happened to one of my husbands' bosses. I think he contested it, and the judge said he didn't have to pay the ticket, which I think is right, but at some stores, esp. right now with Christmas shopping going-on and all that, I'm sure they'll be cracking-down on non-handicap parkers parking in a handicap spot even moreso. My adopted-Dad has this tag that he hangs around his rearview mirror for handicap parking, and maybe his license plate has the handicap sign on it, I really do not know, never really payed attention to it. He has the handicap tag because he was in Vietnam, and has two blood disorders from being exposed to Agent Orange, and he has more artificial parts in him than I have in my entire house.....LOL.....and because of the blood disorders, his legs are giving-out on him, he walks with a cane, but cannot walk far at all, and he only has part of one lung, so I'm sure he uses the carts, too, when he's not being too stubborn, that is. Anyway....hope your Christmas holidays are happy ones, and you don't have to wait so long for a cart next time you go shopping.

Grayse2 Yes, PPS is polio. Those of us who had polio in our early years are cursed to have the similiar symptoms again except this time it destroys the strong muscles that got us thru the years and now it returns to strike us again in our golden years. There is a website that explains it all. It is horrible. I too wore a brace and had surgery to eliminate the brace. I was hospitalized for one year, two weeks and three days. I'm sorry for your friend for PPS usually strikes in your late fiftys or sixtys and none of us seem to be the exception. Doctors don't know much about it except to give us pain meds and neurontin for nerve damage.


Unfortuneately this time of year brings out the worst in some of us. With all the commercialized stress of shopping and parking and getting to sales. It's run, run, run! If we could only go back to the real meaning of Christmas.

TPlant, you are right that this time of year does tend to bring out the ugliness of people because of the stress of the holidays, and it can get so frustrating trying to shop when you are tired and just want to be home. I try not do much shopping right now because I am not a shopper anyways, and it only makes me crazy to have to try and drive in all the traffic, and put-up with all the people. We give money to the neices and nephews, and I only a few gifts to buy besides that, so I usually wait until the last minute to do that. I take one day and get it all done so I don't have to do it every day until Christmas.
I hope my friend doesn't have a relaps of the Polio, that would just be awful because he and his wife had a son a few yrs. back, and he is a Down-Syndrome baby, so if he did have a relaps, it would be so awful. Do you have the link to that site you mentioned so I could read about this disease? I'd like to know more it. Thanks, TPlant, I enjoy chatting with you, you are a very informative person.

Sure thing Grayse2. Try www.postpolioinfo.com This site will give you several answers to PPS.

Thanks, TPlant. I'm eager to learn about it.

Both of my parents are elderly so I have to take them to their many doctor's appts. Dad drives, but only near home. He has had both knee replacements. It is very upsetting to see people using the parking spots and carts that do not need them. He worked very hard to get off the walker and cane quickly and didn't want the handicap tag but at 83 I think he should keep it.
I hope you have a Happy Holiday,
Teresa

I know this is not the case here but Jim mentioned above that he saw a lady use one that was able to walk just fine. Just a reminder there are lots of people who have good days where they can walk and do things and then bad days where they need a cart or a parking spot. So don't be to quick to judge based on someones ability to do something when they are having a good day.

I have lost 80 lbs this year and it still has not helped my back. I am now thinking of getting my own cart if this continues as I lose weight. I have always blamed my pain on my weight but now that I am losing the weight and things have not changed I am rethinking my options.

Hi Howie...you are right, and I can relate to what you are talking about. I have genetic problems with my back, and some days are good, but some days it's hard to walk into a store, up stairs, or whatever. I ended-up in the emergency walk-in clinic because of my back, and there was NO WAY I could have walked around a store without the help of something to help support me, or whatever, and one of those carts would have been a lifesaver. Sometimes pain doesn't completely debilitate us, and even though I do what I need to do, doesn't mean I am not in pain, you just learn to deal with it the best way you can, and get through a day the best way you can, and sometimes that means having someone drive you where you need to go, and dropping you off at the front door, then waiting for them to come inside so you can use them for support so you can walk around a bit to get your shopping done.
Congrats on losing 80 pounds, that's fantastic!!! I don't know how much more you want to lose, and you may know this already, but your muscles have been carrying this excess weight for a while, correct? Because of the strain on them, many of them are probably still pretty weak, and they do get weak, so they'll just need to be built-up and strengthened. Don't get discouraged. If you can lose 80 pounds, you can lose the rest, and I know even though you feel like it hasn't helped your muscles, just think how much it's helped your joints, organs, and self-esteem? I don't know if you are incorporating an exercise program in your weight-loss, but I highly recommend it because of the benefits it will bring to your entire person. Get yourself 5 lb. hand weights, or whatever, and start using these while you are watching TV, or whatever will allow you to use them when you are doing something else. I use them while I am dancing. Dancing is one of the best exercises a person can do, and adding the hand weights gets fast results, at least for me, anyways. Even if you march in place, using your hand weights to help build-up your arms, this will go a long ways, and your back muscles will come around, just give them time, and if you have to use a cart until them, then use one, but make it a goal to not stay in it long so it doesn't become a "crutch". Hope I haven't over-stepped my bounds here, didn't mean to if I did, I just like to help if I can, and I like to hear about people helping themselves live a healthier and better life. Stick with it, and don't get discouraged. We all know that when we start on something like this, there WILL be days that are harder than the day before, but the day after will be easier, and we'll do what we need to get through each and every day. Keep doing whatever it is that you are doing, and you'll succeed...no problem!!!!

Thanks grayse2. No I have not been exercising much yet. I know I need to do that and give it time to help. I don't use a cart yet. I was just saying if my back stays the same I may get one in the future so I can do the things I want to. I still have about 100 lbs to lose and I hope that will make a big difference in my back. We are going to join the YMCA soon. We just need to get off our butts and do it.

I know it isn't funny but I had to laugh anyway. I too go through the no parking and no carts almost every Sat. It is certainly a real aggravation to just get to spend money that you don't want to spend.

Honibee, if it's a chronic thing at the store you go to, go to their website and send an e-mail to corporate. Tell them you are disabled and that there are many non-handicapped people using the handicapped spaces, and there are never carts readily available. Stress to them the importance of providing these services to their customers, and it is up to their management to make sure disabled customers are taken care of.

If that doesn't help, Clark Howard on the radio even suggests threatening an informational picket some Saturday afternoon at a business if they persist in ignoring a problem. Hopefully they'll listen to your e-mail and you'll not have to cross that bridge, though.

gardenwife, I did most all that you suggest. In our area we have two Home Depots. One in my town, Pembroke Pines and a newer one in my neighboring town of Davie, Fl. The older store has one rickety, dilapadated cart that moans and creaks as bad as I do. I have e-mailed them twice. The first time they were polite and promised that they would get two new ones. One year later I again e-mailed them and reminded them of their promise. They sent me a e-mail telling me to contact their customer service rep. I didn't bother. If they didn't fulfill their promise after one year I decided it would be a waste of time. We get a lot of lip service but no results.

Threaten a picket. Or have an attorney specializing draft a nice letter reminding them of the ADA.

Howie....yeah, getting into an exercise program and sticking with it can be hard, and this I know from experience, and I go back and forth with it, depending upon how busy I get....not that this is good....but it'll all come in time. I met a man a couple weeks ago who lost 135 pounds, so I know this will be a cinch for you to do. We'll just hope your back gets better and stronger, and it won't stay like that. Positvie thoughts and strong motivation go a long ways, and sounds like you've got those down, so nothing to worry about, right!!! Have a good one!

Grayse

Tplant, good for you! And you go right on pointing out people's incivility - somewhere along the line you'll definitely make someone stop and think, and that's a good thing!

This topic reminds me of the amusement I got a few years ago watching people cruise the parking lot at a local health club. These people (many of them much younger than me) always wanted the parking spot with the shortest walk to the building - just so they could go inside and run on treadmills, pedal stationary bikes, etc. to get a good physical workout! LOL

Yes! Isn't that the biggest of ironies? Especially in nice weather, what's the big deal about "athletes" having to walk a few more yards? LOL

Healthy people competing for the closest parking space to their health spa so they can go in for a work-out? Just think about that!!!!

I also want to remind y'all that sometimes the healthy-looking person walking from a handicapped spot may simply have a lung disease and is unable to walk very far. Usually it's worse coming back out of the store, where walking has exhausted them if there's no cart available.

It always appalls me when I see cars in the handicapped spots that don't have the licenses or the tag on their rear view mirror - they aren't supposed to be there.

I have a problem with grocery shopping. Not enough to warrant asking for one of those spots, but I need help to the car, because I"m not supposed to lift. But when I see people taking spaces or equipment when they don't need them, it really irks me.

That "mom" you mentioned in the first post may end up being handicapped herself someday. You never know what cards are going to be dealt to you in the continuing poker game of life.

I never could have imagined that I would end up with spinal problems. I'd always been athletic, active.... that woman better hope Kharma doesn't come her way.

Try to stay positive and realize that some people are just grumps or mean, and remember that that makes you a better person than them, without ever having to tell them so.

tplant, i am also slightly disabled(i say slightly because i'm stubborn,hehehe). when i find non-disabled cars parked in disabled parking spaces i just park directly behind them. then when they come out to scream at me i let them watch me call the non-emergency police number to turn them in. i've done this twice so far.

The Kroger stores in our area will give you a key, to keep, for their [handicapped] motorized carts if you are disabled and need to use those carts. My [late] husband always appreciated that.

Howie [or anyone else], I still have Mike's electric wheelchair, if you're interested. It's almost new, and I could give you a very good price.