I removed the Current Events forum

There's a first time for everything...

And the first in this case is, I removed the Current Events forum from the site - it doesn't exist anymore.

Apparantly, a small group of people here didn't read the introduction to the forum: Post your messages in such a manner as to contribute to a fruitful, thoughtful, and interesting discussion.

I regret if the removal of the forum inconveniences anyone.

Dave

Oh! I wondered why that no longer came up. I was just about to report a bug.

It's still showing up on my list of forums and I can't figure out how to take it off. Any advice?

Dave, you might consider that if you start a forum and you entitle it "Current Events" that it might entail what is going on currently in the news. You never prefaced it as "current gardening events." A fruitful, thoughtful conversation might discuss ethics as to the future of the country, your garden, your kids, and subsequent generations. War is very likely in the cards. That's going to affect you, believe it or not. It will also affect this site. What could be more fruitful than to discuss the nature of patriotism and the state of the world? If the water's too hot, I agree, keep your site sterile from any such conversations, but you posted it first and others made all kinds of inflamatory posts which lead to my reaction.

Boy, I'm not sure if I'm disappointed or glad I missed what led to this.

Disapointed here. I didn't post a lot there but did find the various opinions to be thought provoking and insightful into the people here.

Basically conservative slams were acceptable on this site until a few of us objected and countered with some liberal perspectives, Gardenwife. Very obvious double-standards resulted in the elimination of any further potential offenses. Now all we need is a political prayer thread! ;>)

Pala, I'm sorry you feel that way, and I know the political prayer thread comment was aimed at me. I know I relied on my friends here at DG to help me through this, but I don't feel that I deserved that comment. Please accept my appologies if I offended you.

Really, Joan, this wasn't 'aimed' at anyone. I do pray for all of us though and am frightened about the lack of concern about this very serious issue. You can read my prayer and see if you don't agree. :>)

Pala, you certainly have the right to your thoughts, and you aren't alone in what you believe. Matter of factly, half the people in the United States lean in your direction of thinking.

But these kinds of debates are best meant for over the dinner table and around the bar-b-que, not in an online forum like this.

The water is too hot, and I'm (once again) sterilizing DG of all political discussion.

dave

Mr. Dave Sir, how can I remove the Current Events Forum from my preferences since it's not listed anymore.

Thank you...

JoanJ and Sledder: I took care of that, sorry for the inconvenience. It should have been removed automatically, but it is now.

(I've never removed a forum before, so there was bound to be at least one problem)

dave

Not a problem at all!! Not for me anyway.

Thank you..

I suppose it's just as well. If there's no way to stir up trouble here (intentionally or unintentionally) we'll all get along better anyway. I won't be all that sad to see it go. It's better we stick to more garden related stuff. I may have been the cause of some fuss in that forum as well...so that keeps me out of trouble on here with certain members...lol I think Dave has been much more fair than some forums I've seen. I've been surprised at some of the stuff he's let stay posted.

Well I just posted on the prayer forum to Pala's thread and I see that it too has been removed. I don't understand!! Political debate is one thing, prayers for a peaceful world is something entirely different in my humble opinion.

Messages of a political nature are not allowed, louisa. I thought carefully before removing the thread in the prayer forum, but eventually decided that I need to be consistent across the board.

I rather like the existence of the prayer forum... I'd hate to see it go, too.

Dave

I too would hate to see it go but can't imagine that it could ever pose any problem. Let's hope it never becomes an issue.

One of my jobs is to indeed imagine that -anything can become a problem- because it's true that anything can become a problem, no matter how innocent it seems.

And experience has taught me that the longer I sit on a potentially bad situation, the harder it gets to fix it. Since enacting my new "gentle yet firm" policy over a year ago, the site really has been running very smoothly!

dave

I agree Zany - I thought the forum was quite informative, especially if you don't always get a chance to get news updates.
Don't know what happened and don't want to know, but I will miss checking that forum.

How introspective, Dave. I do agree with you about the fact that it may be
a nice respite to have a completely non-political site...If it were
possible. It will be interesting in the future to see what you deem as
"political" or "prayer" expression worthy of censoring(?) This is a huge
statement you made in action and although it is your site, and you own its
content and our actions while we are on it, I suppose it's your perogative.
But it's not the American way. I appreciate your removing the entire forum
instead of just my thread, as you did in the Prayer Forum. That was really
inappropriate though. I am only wishing the best for the planet and we are
faced now, with going to war. It will most certainly be a grave misfortune
which will indeed affect us all.


I came upon Davesgarden.com, initially thinking that it was a delightfully
open forum filled with people who were interested in nature and the
preservation of it. I enjoyed talking tomatoes, posting photos, database
pictures, etc., was especially impressed by Brook and Melody's posts and was
raving about it to my family. Then I saw someone just insensitively trash
Harry Belafonte, yet you said nothing at this thread. There were also
spirited Martha Stewart critiques, and then there was the War thread, to
which several of us responded. It was only when it was represented at all
by liberal statements which caused a sore reaction from conservatives that
it had to be censored, because there were some people who couldn't stand
another opinion...However, no thanks for removing my prayer post! Now this
is blatant censorship of a tangible expression, and a very human expression
sharing a valid feeling and I consider it a violation as there were no
personal statements made in it. Not that it will make a lot of difference,
but I now also pray that you will come to your senses and see that we must
live in a compassionate world with each other, even when we disagree, and
that we live in one world with other nations and an ecosystem which will not
tolerate a third world war. To rationalize otherwise seems anti-Christian,
anti-Buddhist, what have you, and I think you will be shocked at what could
be revealed in the mainstream news in the near future. You're probably not
old enough to remember the repercussions of Viet Nam or Watergate, but
what's in store for us all now could be much, much worse. Disagree all you
want. Might as well just figuratively dump "Seven" on the whole site to make
sure there aren't any hidden agendas lurking about. But you know, there
always will be something someone may be offended by, whether they react to
it or not. Relax.

(Edit note: I will refrain from posting to this particular prayer forum and will walk on eggs not to bring up anything controversial if I stay. Apologies for having offended anyone. I'm probably too candid about my thoughts on this website.)

In Peace,

Barbara Collins
Olympia, WA

This message was edited Wednesday, Nov 6th 2:59 PM

I am very new to this site. One of the things that has made it a happy accident for me to stumble upon it is the obviously warm relationship the participants have with each other. When I found the Mail Call Forum, that has even included the sending of three cans of rootbeer to a teenager in Scandanavia so he could be introduced to rootbeer floats, I called my wife to the screen saying, "You gotta see this."

As I explore Dave's Garden, the magnitude of the founder's accomplishment has begun to amaze me. The scale of work that has gone into shaping and maintaining this slice of cyberspace is Heurculean. He has managed to create on the internet what the inventors of the internet actually dreamt of..., the closing of distance..., both the dissolving and respecting of difference..., a sense of community made possible and enhanced by elegant technology.

As users / members / parts of this community, I am thinking that we all owe Dave our support, and that this support can in part take the form of trying to use his creation in the manner in which he originally intended. While I may or may not disagree with his choice to remove the Current Events Forum, what I am obligated and pleased to do is to support the fruition of his vision.

Religion (I have one), and war (I have been to one), are topics that arouse the deepest passions in men and women. These passions have a place. Dave has decided that his garden is not necessarilly the place for some of these passions.

Pala, I've read a few of your posts in various forums and truly hope you'll stay.

Dave, what more can I say than, "Thank you."

Adam.

PS: I hope no one has been offended at a newcomer expressing his point of view.

Yes, Aotearoa (and welcome to you!) There are many wonderful things about this site, though different values may be present. However, the one we all have in common is gardening!! I was doing just fine until I read the Current Events Forum which angered me. (And Dave, I hope you don't remove the Prayer Forum as you state on your hyperlink that matters of a religious or political nature aren't allowed. We need prayer even if the current events forum must be cancelled. Just a suggestion.) :>)

Pala
I am sorry you are so upset. I did not read the thread so I could be out of line here and if I am please forgive me. But perhaps Dave did not step in when everyone posting was agreeing with one another, not because of the slant on the subject matter, but because it was friendly. Then when others entered the conversation with another point of view, it was no longer a friendly conversation. What good would it do if we all got into it over such an emotional topic as politics? Dave steps in whenever emotions get too hot. I do not think he was making an editorial comment on your views but on the ensuing melee. He does not want an environment here where everyone is angry and not talking to one another. And discussing politics between people who do not agree is the fastest way to make everyone hostile, hurt and miserable. Not the best emotions for a gardening community that is based on a common love and enjoyment in sharing that love!

Kell, you are correct in your supposition. Indeed, I have historically allowed all kinds of stuff that go against what I personally believe in, as long as they didn't become a bitter dispute. When a conversation heats up is, historically, when I usually step in and do something.

Clearly, I disagree with at least 50% of the people in the United States (probably more than that, even) but I try to run this site in a fair manner. I think that 2 years and 20,000 members later, I've done something right. :-)

It's good to have all of you here. DG is about gardening and friendships, and we're richer for your presence.

Dave

I'm confident that if the discussions in the current events forum were more focused on rational debate of the issues and those who make the issues (people in public life such as politicians and activists) rather than ending up with postings of everyone's personal beliefs and opinions, the forum would have stayed. Many times I typed up something only to erase it and think to myself, nah...I better not post that...it'll just make things worse. You don't always have to intend to offend someone personally for it to happen. Once people's opinions on politics are posted it just becomes more of a shouting match...even if you aren't shouting. Trust me, we aren't going to solve the world's problems in the current events forum. Posts like news articles about current events (non-devisive) and so on was what I think that forum was more geared toward...not people's personal beliefs and opinions. We all have opinions, many of them quite different. There's certainly nothing wrong with having an opinion, but when the forum helps to begin a division in the DG community, it's fine with me if it goes away. We don't need and "us" and "them" type of cummunity here...or at least that's how I feel about it. I know I'm guilty of posting my personal beliefs...even when I knew better. It's hard not to though. It becomes a situation in which you feel the need to provide a rebuttle to someone else's post. It just gets worse and worse.

Kell I see your point about politics and personal slants and also some of what you said, hczone, but obviously you can't read the hopeful prayer for world peace I also posted along with another person's post in that thread that was censored, as it doesn't exist on the site anymore. What gives? Why is a prayer with only good wishes for world peace unacceptable at this gardening website?

Pala ~~~

Some questions don't have satisfying answers. Life's imperfect (mine too).

Adam.

Pala, again I did not see your prayer so I may be way off base. However, perhaps it was not your prayer itself, but your prayer read in the context of your political posts, that made it appear to be political in nature.

I am a political/news junkie and in my heart I just know I am so right in all my opinions. I have had knock down drag out fights with my DH who happens to have all the totally wrong opinions! During the Clinton years I almost divorced him, and him me! Anyway, it has taught me that people can disagree but that doesn't mean one person is bad or even wrong. Perhaps it is best not even to go there and instead dwell on your commonality (esp if you want to stay married!LOL). Right now war is a very hot issue, either way you view it. In this divisive political climate over the possible war, a peace prayer could be viewed as political and get people going again. Dave was probably just trying to refocus us all back on our common interests.

But you know what Pala, I bet God heard your prayer which I just know was heartfelt, whether it has been deleted or not and will know what to do to help us all thru these hard times.

Tell me...How is not wanting World War III political? Am I being petty here?

Religion and politics-- two topics sure to raise the blood pressure and start an argument. I used to wander over to the Current Events forum myself once in awhile, but I shan't miss it.

If you stick to talking about gardening/pleasant topics on DG, you will never find yourself in hot water. We had this discussion here about a year ago, when the wise sage Go_Vols said: "We can not expect to have anything in common other than a love of gardening." So true.....

Just don't say a word then when another 9/11 style of catastrophe happens. It's a political topic. Don't react. Keep your opinions to yourselves and keep the topic on gardening. Remember that's what this site is about. No religion. No politics. No matter what...

The Current Events forum was borne as a result of 9/11. Should another event like that occur, I'm sure Dave would consider whether a forum for non-gardening topics is warranted.

While I certainly wouldn't consider myself a dispenser of sage advice (lolol, Inda!!!) here's verbatim what I had posted previously. I would contend it holds true here, too:

"...when we talk about things other than gardening, please remember that the only thing we can assume to have in common is gardening, and treat all other subjects tactfully and gently. Just as you would in conversations with garden club members you see once a month. IMO, this isn't the place to hold forth a lengthy discourse on our personal beliefs on most any subject - except maybe which tomato really is the tastiest..."

I consider DG to be filled with several hundred of my "next door neighbor" gardening pals. In the real world, I may lean across my neighbor's fence and have a 20-second conversation about whose turn it is to weed-eat the fence row. And it might turn into a 2-hour discourse on the goings' on in the neighborhood, world politics, religion, or all three. Even though the common thing that brings us both to our backyards is our gardens, we're still very different people, with different perspectives on most topics.

But unlike my real-world neighbor, I can't read y'alls body language or facial expressions to know when I'm getting into dangerous territory with someone. Nor can you read mine to know when I'm biting my cheek to keep from smiling, or when I'm dead serious, with a glint in my eye that means "batten down the hatches - she's fixin' to blow!"

So once again, I would beseech all of us to assume little about one another, except that we *did* all decide to join a little ole gardening site... ;~)

Thanks, Vols. I knew you would come to my rescue. :-D

I still think an "Ignore this User" feature would be worth it's weight in gold, although I understand that it isn't feasible here. Actually, given the amount of subscribers that we have, I'm surprised that there isn't more heated verbal sparring.

As for me, I've learned to push myself away from the computer when "I'm fixin' to blow!" It's only hard the first two or three times that you do it. :-)

As I said...douhle standards.

Pala, you're obviously quite new around here which is great as we love new members but Are you a gardener or a political activist of sorts. I am a Canadian and love this place for the expertise on gardening, the wonderful people but I really don't think this is the place for politics. I think everyone would be much happier if we talked about brugmansias, my passion, or roses or tomatoes. JMHO

I think it would be good to let this drop now. Dave has spoken, and we need to accept his wishes and go on from here. This is his site after all.

I think we just need to quit talking about it altogether and just let it die. DG is what it is and you either love it or ya don't that's your decision. Dave made the decision to do what he thought was best it is his site after all. I didn't see the post I never went to that forum for that reason I come to DG to get away from all that. I am not saying anybody was right or wrong but let's just let it go and get on with gardening hey that's why we are here isn't it?

Nobody likes me, everybody hates me,
Going to the garden, eat worms
Big ones little ones, ushy gooshy gooshy ones
Worms that like to squirm.

Bite their heads off, suck their juice out
Throw their skins away.
You'd be surprised how many little worms
You can eat three times a day

Nobody likes me, everybody hates me,
Guess I'll go eat worms,
Long, thin, slimy ones; Short, fat, juicy ones,
Itsy, bitsy, fuzzy wuzzy worms.

Down goes the first one, down goes the second one,
Oh how they wiggle and squirm.
Up comes the first one, up comes the second one,
Oh how they wiggle and squirm.

Well I never...! Well okay. Am I ever out-voted. You win. I lose, Dave. ;.-( I'm gonna just crawl back into my hole here on the left coast and hush up. Here's a link to get everyone off the computer and out in the garden. It's not dangerous in any way, political, religious or pornographic...just a little error message. End of thread for me. http://www.mamselle.ca/error.html

now that's funny!!!