Freedom of Speech at Dave's

Thank you, Dave, for allowing freedom of speech here. People in Europe are very angry about Spike's post on GW telling people not to trade with Europe. I tried to post a reply and got a Friendly Reminder, telling me that I wasn't allowed to criticise the administration of GW in a post. Spike hadn't posted as the Webmaster, only a ordinary post, and he didn't say it was GW policy.

Someone else in England tried to post (did post) a reply, but again, I expect it will be gone by now. Strange, but his member Page is empty, too, and you can't e-mail him.

Perhaps this works in the US, but people in Europe don't like petty dictators. Here's the other reply:

'Saw Spikes comments on this subject yesterday and just had to reply.
I agree Spike, Foot and Mouth disease is bad news in parts of Europe and you need to take a responsible attitude, but paranoia aint the answer. I live in a part of the UK that is unaffected by this disease. There are restrictions on using certain footpaths that cross farm land, but I have yet to hear any credible commentator say that seeds of garden origin pose any sort of threat at all, even if you do intend feeding them to your pet lamb rather than plant them as intended. So, take care but dont get taken in by the hype in the media.

I noticed that Spikes posting didnt provide the usual means to reply - curious ?

Trust me, Britain (and Europe) are still open for business ! '

So, thanks again, Dave - this freedom to express our opinions without fear of punishment is a very valuable asset to DG.

Thanks Mary. I am that member from the UK that Spike doesnt like (yes - he did removed my posting), which is why I have switched to DavesGarden.

You couldnt see my members page or my trade list because (according to Spike) my ISP was using a technique that required me to continuosly re-input my password but still never let me in. So, I could never set it up or update it. Another good reason for moving from GW.

Thanks for your support for we Brits and rest of Europe. Anyway, you have my email address now.

El Tel

Welcome, El Tel.

Another good thing about Dave's Garden is that, if you have a problem, you just ask, and someone (even Dave) will give you the answer. You can get into your Member Page here, and you can write a bit about yourself by clicking on Preferences when you're there. And you can change what you've written in a post even after it's posted by clicking on the bit on the left of your post that says Edit this post. You can post more than once on a thread without having to change the subject heading.

If you have a problem with your own computer, ask on the Computer Forum. Dave doesn't tell you it's your fault, he solves it for you.

I can pretty well guarantee that, by this time next week, Dave will have added something new, and if you want another Forum for anything, just ask.

You'll notice the difference!

Keep digging spike, your hole will soon collapse around you and swallow you up, and you will be able to talk to yourself all day long.

FREEDOM OF SPEACH ROCKS @ DAVE'S GARDEN !!! HE IS THE MANNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN !!!!! Rock On !!! Down with the other Facist Dictators !!!!

[ Removed by member request. - Admin ]

Mary Us Yanks dont like it one bit! He is an equal opportunity petty dictator! Sounds like I am not missing anything at GW . Havent been back. And wont.And I said I wouldnt talk about this anymore. Well Mary hope you stay here and enjoy the freedom we all enjoy here. Dave and Trish have been most generous to us all.

I wasn't intending to knock Spike again, but to point out that it is important that people are allowed to correct other posts if they feel they are giving out the wrong information. In this case, what Spike posted was inaccurate, and several people in Europe, who know the situation there much better than Spike does, wanted to post a reply to his post and explain the true situation. Spike not only prevented them from replying directly to his post (which is on two Forums and open for all the world to read), but removed any other posting on the subject putting forward the correct information.

It is a fact that there are over 40 countries in Europe, and Foot & Mouth disease is only severe in one of them (the UK). There are isolated instances in half a dozen other countries, and these can all be traced back to animals exported from the UK before animal movement was restricted.

Spike is telling the world not to trade seeds with all of Europe, and he is trying to frighten people by implying they can be put in prison if they do, and he is wrong.

Publicising false information severely devalues the integrity of GardenWeb.

We have had discussions about Foot & Mouth and Mad Cow Disease here at Dave's Garden, and because everyone has been able to express their opinion, it is more likely that we have arrived at the truth of the matter here. Which makes Dave's Garden a more valuable place altogether.

You are right Mary, we need not continuously dig at Spike - he will learn sound WebMastering one day. However, it is intiguing that he is targeting Europe over the F&M issue. As I have discovered from the learned debate now rampant in the UK, we are not alone in harbouring the disease; the only difference is that we dont have a vaccination policy for Foot & Mouth; culling is our main chance of retaining a "disease free" status. But a number of countries do vaccinate their animals (which means the virus is present but supresssed in those animals) and they still export the meat for human consumption. I understand parts of Africa, Asia, the Middle East and South America use vaccination; I dont see much paranoia concerning trading with those areas.
Argentina was mentioned by one of these experts; makes you wonder where they are exporting their prime beefsteaks to !

El Tel

This post will be gone soon, but it just shows what a little ignorant posting can do:

http://www.uk.gardenweb.com/forums/load/ukgard/msg0408292929615.html?2

and this:

http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/load/exseed/msg041424555374.html

This message was edited Sunday, Apr 22nd 4:38 PM

I see exactly what you mean, Mary. How sad! I would be happy to trade with anyone in Europe anytime. :)

Oops! Forgive my manners, eltel, and welcome to Dave's Garden! :)

Terri

Thanks for the welcome Terri, I look forward to finding a lot of new gardening friends right here.

At the risk of "behaving like a Spike", maybe we have done the GW thing to death. I am still angry about the ignorant way the subject was treated but I will make this my final contribution to the subject. I got the several supportive e-mails today and my reply was:

To: Bruno, Jackie, Mary,

Thanks for your supportive comments - like Jackie I get a red mist in front of the eyes when ill considered and potentially harmful statements are made by those who should be better informed. I don't intend holding a vendetta against the guy - life's too short, I only hope he rapidly learns the damage he is doing to what was otherwise a very tolerant, understanding and friendly association of gardening enthusiasts.

You were right, Spike did his usual pull on the offending material (you and me both Jackie), but hopefully it got through to some members. He's also disabled my member ID at GardenWeb but as I couldn't use it properly (No MYPAGE or LISTS could be set up), I am not losing on the deal. I'll get around to setting up my trade list on DavesGarden when I have de-cyphered the instructions !

Regards

El Tel

El Tel-

A Big welcome to Dave's Garden!!

I noticed that you mentioned some potential problems setting up your trade list. At the top of that page, you will see a wonderful tutorial by SMSPear1. I think that it will help.

If you ever have any questions about it, feel free to post!
We're always here to help. (Email is fine too).

Again,
Welcome!!

Trish
(Dave's wife)

Thanks Trish,

No problem; its just finding the time to read the tutorial.

My current HAVE seed list (from GW days) is in alphabetical order in a WORD document which I was hoping I could cut and paste into my page here. There are about 50 of them, so I was looking for the quick (lazy) solution ! Don't seem to work like that, so I shall follow the instructions. Don't worry, I'll get there eventually !!

El Tel

Welcome ElTel - you weren't born in Dagenham were you? Can I have your autograph ?

Oh yeah, by the way, love the sun tan !

Welcome again, it's nice here, you'll like it.

Jo

No, Jo (or is it Spike ???) - to both !! Nor did I play for Spurs (though I do support them) and I dont now commute to and from Middlesborough. The tan went long ago.

Sorry Dave, bit of an "in" joke about UK Soccor. I promise not to do it again !

El Tel (but not Venerbals)

I think we do need a place to talk about vmirror (Not to just rave about Spike.) and list the problems and discuss them. Why? If you go "Googling" Thathomesite and GardenWeb often show up first. Then if you try to get an answer there, and they do have many answerers, you run into technical problems that are quite mysterious e.g. apparently some ISPs are banned, apparently some e-mail addresses are banned, and some words like JavaScript are banned. I have not even gotten to the nuances of political correctness.

I suggest do not rant and rave but rather exchange specific information.