A reasonable, fair and balanced approach to discussion 2

We came from here
http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/1101620/
Please follow the guidelines that Pixydish has set forth. This isn't to be controlling, but to try to keep things...calm and level-headed.
Thanks everyone!

The guidelines really aren't controlling anyways...Pixy has simply asked...

One thing I would like to point out is that there is no sense in asking question that we know we are not going to get answers to at this point. There are certain things that are not going to be discussed...either by Dave or by IB. There is no point in asking about those things. I think it would be even worse to speculate on those things at this point...worse than that would be to argue and disagree over those things.

Also, it would not be fair to ask Miguel (or IB) questions that we know we are not going to get answers to...and then later say, "See, I told you they wouldn't respond to us!!" That's not fair. Let's keep this fair.

Just my opinion

That's kind of a hard thing to take if you are going to see all your work go up in the air in four and a half hours........

Yeah, it is. That is a big part of what makes this difficult. There's a lot that just can't be talked about...and that's no one's fault. That's just part of the legal process.

I think (my opinion again) that whenever we lose something we want to blame someone..."Someone has to pay for this!!!" I think that, along with the questions that cannot be answered at this point, make everything a lot more frustrating. There's no easy answer.

What to do with that anger? I dunno. I go dig holes in the garden. Seriously, that's what I do. In the middle of digging the holes somehow my head gets un-clouded and things just start to make sense. Sometimes that does take about a week or two tho....

I wonder if there is some legal way they can extend the deadline of the cease and desist order? Maybe then people could find a way to save their work and lessen some of this bitterness.

I don't know, that would be very nice. I hope that happens. Whatever happens in the end, I really hope that all the cubits owners find someplace, someway of rebuilding.

This message was edited May 28, 2010 6:01 PM

I know what you are saying Vickie. Someone posted in the "venting thread" not to cut off their nose to spite their face...and that's about how I feel right now. What makes DG feel like home? It's the people. It's not the great info. Sorry, but it's not whether or not Dave or IB are running it. It's the friends you find here...

Whether or not those people stay because of this whole situation is up to them. No one is making them leave...they are making their own choices. No one is making them stay.

It is sad that people will destroy what they claim to love most to prove a point.

I'm not planning to quit DG. I'm paid til August. I'll decide then.

I said I was gone for awhile. When I came back and looked around, I felt out of place. People had their friends and I wasn't one of them. Lots of new people who didn't know me. The old crew was friendly though. I got a nice warm welcome from a few.

I was sort of in the same boat as you Nap. I had been gone from DG for nearly a year. I had checked in now and then, but not nearly the multiple daily check ins like I had previously done. When I came back things seemed a bit alien to me. Old friends were gone...with no forwarding addy. New folks in their places. What was up with that? Everyone at the former DG had known me (and you too!), but now they were gone...this just felt weird. I felt like I was being welcomed...when I should be the one welcoming them. I was getting 'how to' lessons from folks who had been here for a month, LOL! Crack me up. The whole time I'm thinkin, "Honey, I was one of the pioneers of Brug Bucket Bubblers!"

Then the site started doin weird stuff. What the heck is giong on with this place??? That's when I started digging and found all this mess and things just got crazier from there.

LOL! I was the one who started the Photo Editing thread, and now it's like 5000 posts later, and they don't know who I am. It's like they say, you can't go home again. Home doesn't wait around for you. It moves on.

Whew....I am really surprised at how this all exploded. I see no reason to leave DG. I have never really fit into any of the little cliques always just a bit off ot the side.

Guess not too many folks who don't want to yell, huh?

I appreciate the effort you guys.

Well this all seems pretty sad. I'm not really sure what is going on here, but I am a member of Cubits and can't honestly see what the conflict could possibly be about. They are two totally different things. DG has always been such a special place, you could no sooner pick it up and move it than you could dig up a hundred year old tree and transplant it to another garden.

I will watch and wait. If Cubits is shut down by of the owners of this site, I will continue to use your wonderful database, but will no longer be a paying member when my subscription runs out. I am hoping this is all a tempest in a teapot, but I just stumbled upon this forum and don't really know what's going on.

I'm not quitting DG. If I were renting an apartment and were unhappy about the way the management was dealing with some situation across town, but I liked my neighbors and loved my neighborhood... I wouldn't break my lease and move out. If I could have some positive impact on solving the situation, I'd try, but I don't see "voting with my feet" as a solution here.

Very good comparison Critter, thanks for sharing that!

You have a very good point there. Some people are happy here and some have valid reasons to be upset and unhappy enough with the leaky roofs and stuck windows to want to leave but that doesn`t mean they don`t like their neighbors nor does it mean they didn`t enjoy things for a time in the past.

Cubits just went offline

I'm in tears.... grown-ups are supposed to play nice.....

I'm in Mourning and have lit my candle.
Vickie

Yep... I was on cubits and it went off at 6:55 CST. I think that is 4:55 in CA.

We can still hope and pray that it doesn't last long.

Like I said in the other thread. Time to start contacting the advertisers and tell them we will no longer purchase from them if they contiue to advertise on DG.

I've posted over here our response: http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/1102085/

Please feel free to continue to discuss things here is you wish but I'll likely focus any answers (if you're interested) in the other thread.

thanks

I just read Miguel's thread. I guess it's over. I'm so sorry for the people who lost cubits over this. That is very sad to lose all that work. I hope they were able to save the work that was important to them. Personally, I'm especially going to miss Mamajack's coop cubit. That one rocked. I spent way too much money when she had the Easy to Grow Bulbs cubit.

I was struck by how specific the allegations were. Unless they were sure, IB would be taking a huge legal risk in posting those things. I am actually very surprised that they allowed the release of that kind of detailed information, so I can only guess that they are certain of their facts. This is not going to go down easy with people.

I think you are mis-underestimating a big Corporation that has lots of money and lawyers on their side. They get away with all kinds of things when they hold all that power. This happens all the time. Just because they were willing to spell it all out in public, doesn't necessarily mean didily. Their thoughts.. Just let the average Joe try to sue them.

Well I hope that Dave has good attorneys. If he believes that he is on solid legal ground, I hope he takes it further. I hate to see small business people squashed by the 'big guys' (having been there and done that myself - being squashed that is), but if he wrote 'back door' code and then used it to his own advantage, that's not okay. I don't know what to think about the database accusation. I know there are plenty of people who added their own stuff to the cubits database, trying to build it up. But 170,000 is a really big number for a database that has only been around for a little while.
I was asked to join that site through a dmail here on DG. I remember being surprised at that because I thought it was against the rules to solicit membership for another garden related site through DG, but I thought maybe the rules had changed when Dave sold it. (I was hoping so, anyway) I know there was more stuff there than gardening, but there is here, too.

You're right about one thing, though. Money and power always seem to go hand in hand.

Kinda reminds me of what is going on here in good old Niceville (I didnt make it up, I really do live in Niceville). For many many years, it has been full of mom and pop type stores and everybody knows everybody. Well, they are building a big Walmart here. Two guesses what is going to happen to many of the wonderful shops that have been around for so long. Once again, big business is going to squash the little guys. Bummer.

Yep! Guess we're just witnessing it coming to the internet now. Won't be long, there won't be any competition left. No choices anywhere, not even on the internet.

When you think about it this puny little DOT.COM company, Internet Brands is JUST a dot.com company... no real substance as far as a public company goes. They don't MAKE anything, create anything... just live off of advertising and clicks. Big Deal.... developed in the DOT.COM craze. How they got to be public is a mystery.

That's what happened in my husband's hometown in Tennessee. No small stores left. Only one walmart. It's very sad, indeed. Sometimes I think they are going to take over the world. But here's the other side to that one: in my town, Lakewood, we didn't need a Walmart. We had plenty of stores. But we have one. And it's put others out of business. Why? Because our city council allowed it to happen because they wanted the tax dollars it would bring. It was a disgusting example of ... well, I don't know what.. but it was disgusting!
Only thing is that on the internet, people buy and sell their sites. This site was sold, not taken over. First to Name Brands Media, then to IB. I think that's the hardest thing is when people design businesses that are so successful that they cannot keep up with them. It becomes too much work. So they sell to someone who has the resources to take care of the business, and then things change. That's what happened to Heronswood and that's what is happening here. Maybe the only way to change that is for people to jump ship lock, stock and barrel and start over somewhere else. But the problem with that solution is that most people don't want to start over another place.

Kind of like those sucker fish that attach themselves near a sharks mouth and scavenge off whatever morsels that are missed?

More like the parasites that suck the life blood out of a fish.

Hey, y'all gave me a chuckle with your graphics!

Well, they say laughter is the best medicine...

Those are disgusting graphics! LOL

Indeed. I felt pretty disgusted with the big store was built right over some very pretty landscape. Very disgusted, indeed.

Pixy, my invitation to join Cubits came to my private email address. Right then and there I knew Cubits was on shaky ground because that address was on file at DG and should have remained here. I know this will make me a heretic in the minds of some, but it's a fact.

Cubits is up!

Daves rebuttal to the accusations
http://cubits.org/dave/thread/view/24252/