Sounds like a winner. What was the squash/tomato rule? Good, bad, or ugly?
Companion Planting Wanabees
I don't remember -- we can look it up. I am wanting to raise the subject of companion planting in containers as that is what I will be doing, but have not prepared my questions yet, want to do some research first. I think it can support its own thread perhaps......
Meanwhile, do any of you experienced C.P. growers want to discuss this question on the Vegetable Gardening forum? Someone is looking for a particular type of cover crop to grow under corn:
http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/953908/
Thanks winterrobin. I've grown gallicas before but not for a while - had to leave a few behind in the UK when I moved here :-(( so I'm happy to take delivery of a new one. I'm going to try the nigella and see what happens.
Grownut I have it on good authority that tomatoes dislike corn, dill, fennel, pole beans and potatoes. But who knows, perhaps there's more.......Squash seems OK.
Sugarshokt I have used window boxes (not on the window ledge though) for things like shallots, baby beets, carrots, lettuce, cauliflower and much more besides...It beats having to contend with my bog of a garden any day!. I think your 3 sisters dirt boxes will be a great sucess.
Sounds like the rule may be "if it goes well in tomato sauce..."
Seriously considering just dividing out my trouble makers. Pole beans trellised off the patio to keep the chickens out. Potatoes is some sort of garbage can etc contraption. Tomatoes in one plot with its friends, corn off with the cucurbits and wild things (melons!!) Now where to set my brassicas, carrots, and daikon....
Ooooh --- Mooli aka daikon grownut! I have some seed. Unfortunatley I don't know where I'm going to grow it. Seems it goes well with beans, cabbage, carrot, chervil, cukes, onions, squash ....not hyssop (which I've never had any luck with anyway).
{{{beans. cukes. onions. cabbage. daikon. squash. carrot. basilandpeppers. tomatos.}}} Mentally arranging my rows here. This reminds me of Christmas dinner with ALL the relations. If A can sit with everyone but G and H, B can sit with all but F, C can Only sit with AB&E...surely there's a magical arrangement in here somewhere...
I always have mine by the napa and they fight over the flea beetles...
LOL!
Excellent...I will commit one of the containers to the 3 Sisters method. Thanks!
btw, I planted some Rue beside a rose climber in my front garden as I read it will help to help keep aphids away. I think it worked although I did get quite a bit of those itty-bitty green worms this past summer...has anyone else used Rue for anything?
Raspberries - it's also a good herb in salads - not too much though as it's a little bitter. Especially good in or with cream cheeses.
Food! my second favorite subject.
Sugar, are those itty bitty green worms roseslugs, by any chance (larva of sawfly)? If you or anyone knows of a companion that will deter those, oh please please let me know.
winterrobin,
Just found this excerpt from: http://www.suite101.com/article.cfm/rose_gardening/6936
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Companion planting - the blooms of Passion Vine (Passiflora sp.) are especially attractive to butterflies and moths. Adults choose to lay their eggs in this vigorous grower rather than my prized roses. The vine quickly recovers from any damage and the roses, planted a scant 2 ft. away, are left unharmed. Cornflower and Purple Coneflower are also reputed to be a "preferred attractors."
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Although I don't have a problem with rose slugs It would be interesting to see if it works.
Awesome information. I have tons of coneflower growing. I may have to move some of it to other areas of the gardens.
I did hear tell but I'm afraid to mention it - cannabis is apparently a good sawfly deterent. Not that I'm advocating growing any LOL.
Not that I even know what that is. Ahem.
Err yeah right LOL
wthex, thanks for the link. I saw info on caterpillers, but none on sawflies. Their larvae (roseslugs) look like caterpillers, but they are different creatures, and what will deter cats won't work on sawfly babies. They are very hard to eliminate. I think my only hope is beneficial nematodes. There is a narrow window of opportunity to spread these into the soil - temperatures and rainfall have to be just right - so I've been putting it off. I'll be sorry this spring when they start chewing the leaves again.
I have never tried nematodes. The trouble is I think I'm mainly distrustful of companies that make a living out of selling stuff that probably has to be shiped miles to reach you and has only a tentitive relationship with "Organic " practice. This does not take into account the damage caused to the environment by long distance transportation. I would much rather find a solution to a problem nearer to home - or at least a solution which I could manufacture for myself. No offence intended winterrobin.
:-)) Rosie
No offence taken! The forums are give-and-take; anyone easiy offended needs to grow a thicker skin. Anyway, beneficial nematodes are a totally organic treatment. The little buggers are shipped dormant, then re-awakened in warm water and applied to the soil, where they start to eat the bad guys. They are a check and balance, naturally occurring in abundance in some soils - unfortunately not mine.
I ordered Nigella seeds - Miss Jekyll mix.
I used beneficial nematodes one year on the row where I was planting carrots and I had the best luck with them that I'd ever had. No yukky channels cutting through the outer surface of the carrots! I got them from Gardens Alive, which I see is associated with all sorts of more questionable garden product companies, but they've always worked well for me.
I get my nematodes from Nature's Control. I've been happy with the results, & I'm not aware of Nature's Control having any associations with less-than-reputable companies.
greenhouse_gal and pirate, do you know if beneficial nematodes are a one-shot deal, or do you have to order and apply each season? My other favorite control is Milky Spore, which ONLY affects Japanese Beetles. No other insect in the soil is hurt. You apply this once and the control lasts for a minimum of 10 years. It lasted nearly 20 years for me! If you grow roses or raspberries or any other favorite meal of JBs, this is a must.
roseimp, I see your point about trucking stuff around. Unfortunately, almost everything we need, including our food, is trucked in from somewhere. That's another reason, apart from fresh taste and absence of pesticides, herbicides, and chemical fertilizers, I want to grow my own.
Robin, I only used the nematodes once and I'm not sure they carried over. My carrots didn't do that well last summer but I didn't notice any channels in them - they just weren't that healthy or prolific.
Leslie
I think the nematodes have to be reapplied.
http://naturescontrol.com/predatornematodes.html
I've been wondering whether marigolds repel beneficial nematodes. I don't want to cancel out my pest-control efforts if I plant marigolds. Does anybody know?
This message was edited Feb 21, 2009 6:40 PM
Winterrobin I try to buy whatever I need locally and shop locally for veg if I can't grow it myself even though it's cheaper to buy stuff over the border about 20 miles away. I've learned my lesson about purchasing foodstuffs from supermarkets that import cheap supplies from abroad - last year I found a strange larva in a jar of pickles. They had been bottled for this particular supermarket chain in South America of all places. I can just hear my poor old granny saying "And why couldn't you make your own pickled onions the way I used to? " LOL.
Several years ago I got infected by such an unusual strain of stomach bug my doctor asked if I had visited a third world country. I got a long term bowel condition due to an "exported" chicken. As if those countries haven't enough mouths to feed.
The only thing I regularly have imported from other countries is seed cos I figure they only take up as much space as a letter. I'm even experimenting using herbs and other plants as liquid feeds for my own plants - it's cheaper than buying in organic fertiliser - which isn't made here in Ireland.
I will have to try to find a pic of those little green worms on my roses...
We have used the nemetodes when we were over run with those crane flies (the bugs that look like mosquitos on steroids)..it worked great! I'm thinking of using them again this spring.
pirate, one of my favorite companion planting sites is run by the National Sustainable Agriculture Information Service (THAT'S a mouthful!) http://www.attra.ncat.org/management/comments.php If you scroll down to "Ask...." you may get an expert to answer your question. Their site states African marigolds release an agent that is a nematode repellent, but it doesn't specify if both good and beneficial are
affected. If I paid good money to get beneficials into my soil, I'd be careful about the marigolds.
roseimp, I'm so sorry to hear how ill you became because of tainted food. We have waves of illnesses throughout the country caused by one thing or another....pet food poisoned by melamine, spinach, peanut butter products contaminated by salmonella and e-coli. It's scarey. What can you buy with confidence anymore?
I never thought about it before, but now that you mention it, it surprises me that Ireland isn't making fish emulsion fertilizer by the gallons. You're surrounded by oceans.
The thing about companion planting is you can't really hedge your bets. It's a bit of a leap of faith to use plants alone to curb garden nasties and improve growing conditions. Undoubtedly a certain amount of crop loss can be expected but no system is fool proof and even more conventional pesticides leave a lot to be desired.
Marigolds were the first companion plant I used over 25 years ago and I've used no other form of pest control in my greenhouse ever since. They are not particular about what sort of insect they repel ( I think one of the toxic chemicals in their make up is a substance related to sulpher) so using them with nematodes just won't work.
Yes, winterrobin, you would think we would be reasonbably self-sufficient here in Ireland wouldn't you? I'm afriad we're a bit behind the times. One of these days in the not too distant future, if you can't get something locally, you will probably have to do without.
Leslie,
I just stumbled across confirmation of your suspicions regarding tomatoes and raspberries hindering each other. Territorial Seed Company's info page on raspberries includes the following:
"SITE PREPARATION ? Prepare your planting site in early spring. The soil pH should be between 5.8 and 6.5. Choose a site with high organic content or add compost before planting. If possible avoid areas that previously grew tomatoes, potatoes, or eggplants. Work the soil to a depth of about 8 inches."
http://www.territorialseed.com/Raspberries
This message was edited Feb 22, 2009 1:20 PM
O drat, that must be what was niggling at me in the back of my mind! So now what do I do? The tomatoes have been and gone but the raspberries are still there. I guess I just don't do it again and hope for the best.
Leslie
Any thoughts on planting spinach over my potato bed?
Jerry
Leslie, can you move them? The roots are kinda shallow, right?
I've got a 39' row of 'em, PuddlePirate! They're right next to the asparagus bed, and I'm not sure where else I'd put them anyway. I'll see how they do this summer without solanaceous neighbors; if they don't seem happy I'll have to bite the bullet and do something else with them.
Leslie
Compost, mulch, and hypnotize them into forgetting all about the tomatoes...
Grownut, I love your solutions...er... ideas?
Leslie
If we knew what tomatoes do to the soil, we could try to undo it. Tons of compost might mitigate the problem in the meantime.
texusrockgarden, spinach is a somewhat cool weather crop here and will probably do best if it's planted after your spuds not with them. It is supposed to be a good companion to celery, cauliflower, eggplant, pea and strawberry but I don't think it has any enemies. I usually plant lettuce beneath my potatoes, that way they get a bit of shade during the heat of the day - if we get any sun that is !!! Squash might be a better alternative for you. I saw a neat trick for confining the squashes wandering habit by using poles or canes around them to keep them in bounds, weaving in new growth as it emerged.
Perhaps you could plant some rue to seperate the rows greenhouse_gal or if you have enough room, roses.
:-)) Rosie
Some digging around online suggests that the tomatoes vs. raspberries problem could be verticillium left over in the soil from the previous year's crops. I wonder if an application of mycorrhizae would crowd out the verticillium and help the raspberries bounce back?
http://davesgarden.com/guides/articles/view/935/
Maybe I could see if Gardens Alive has something I could try. Yes, I thought it was a virus or other microbial issue, rather than simple dislike. The raspberries didn't look very thrifty last year and the leaves were spotty.
Always something, right?
Thanks, Puddle!
Leslie
Let us know if it works.