Help with ID?

Plymouth, IN(Zone 5a)

Hello everyone! I'm new to growing morning glories. When I purchased a new home last spring I was fortunate enough to have some wonderful plants come with the house including two different morning glories growing in several locations.

I "think" I have figured out what they both are but am not absolutely certain, so thought I would ask for some expert opinions. I rescued seeds from these vines growing up out of the burn pile in the back yard. Luckily I was able to convince my dbf not to burn anything there until I was able to save the various plants and seeds that had volunteered themselves in that location.

Thumbnail by countrymouse5A
Plymouth, IN(Zone 5a)

This first one I'm pretty sure is "Star of Yelta".

Thumbnail by countrymouse5A
Plymouth, IN(Zone 5a)

And this one maybe "Blue Star"?

It looks exactly like the picture on a pack of "Blue Star" morning glories I saw in a store last week, but doesn't really look like the photos in PlantFiles. Any thoughts?


Thumbnail by countrymouse5A
szarvas, Hungary

My Blue Star has tan seeds , Star of Yelta black-brown both are Ipomoea Purpurea

Toronto, ON(Zone 5b)

http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/p.php?pid=6110569 it kinda looks like sydney (from byndeweedbeth's journal - I hope you don't mind)...I looked some of the purpureas up on DG with similar corolla and ray colours:

http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/go/100206/
http://davesgarden.com/community/journals/viewentry/161768/
http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/p.php?pid=5910889 (Dany's other post)

But could be something else also


Eliz

Clatskanie, OR(Zone 9b)

You are a good researcher. I have encountered the same thing with these types, and find that there doesn't seem to be a seed company selling Sydney as a pure strain.

Thompson and Morgan sell a "LIGHT BLUE STAR" that looks like yours.

Beware, that to avoid copyright infringement, some people out there will give these strains, new personal on Ebay names, which adds confusion to the consumer end.
Blue Denim, Blue Star, Light Blue Star, Sydney, etc. Are they all the same thing, with the pictures taken at different times of day??? Maybe.

As for the seed color, my opinion is this. I personally believe, the longer a seed pod has to ripen the darker it gets. I believe that if a variety is allowed all the time it wants, in the climate it chooses, the seeds will be more uniform in color. I believe that if I grow a strain, that folks to the south of me grow prolifically, that I will probably have a higher count of light seeds. I think that the light seed coats occur for at least 2 reasons. In Japan they have a practice of removing the outer seed coat, thus softening it an making it grow for the buyer more easily.

The other way I think seeds come in various shades is this. If I plant a seed of a morning glory, and allow it to grow up a stick, and bloom it's heart out, that come frost, seed ripening stops. So I start at the bottom of the vine and work my way up to the top. At first all the pods contain black seeds, but this changes little by little until I get to the top of the vine, where some of the pods, don't even get compared to the others, because they were so new when the freeze came. The last ones at the top turn to mush. They must be included in the count of the ones that didn't turn black before they are thrown away.
I have repeatedly said "I", because many sweet people here on this forum believe the color of the seed coat of seeds of the same plant have some,
as yet unknown meaning, yet to be discovered. Maybe they want to psych out some of the genetics, prior to growing it out? Therefore, I think it is best to use the lightest colored seed coats first because they probably have the shortest shelf life.

Remember this. If you take a picture of the same flower at hourly intervals, by the end of the same day, , the time of day the picture was taken, is very important in identifying that variety by a mugshot of the flower. 5am and 11am pictures could be so different, , in color, that they might be mistaken to be different varieties, even though THEY ARE PICTURES OF THE SAME FLOWER HOURS APART.

Hope some of this helps. Frank

Netcong, NJ(Zone 5b)

There are most definitely species and strains of Ipomoea which have light colored seeds and only light colored seeds no matter how long they ripen,although becoming partially decomposed may cause a darkening of the seedcoat...

There are strains of Ipomoea which usually have dark seeds and the color of these original dark colored seedcoats is more susceptible to seedcoat color changes due to environmental factors that can influence the seedcoat pigmentation.

Lighter seedcoats tend to produce lighter flowers,but certainly not always...mutational changes which affect the color of the seedcoat are often accompanied by changes affecting pigmentational changes in other plant parts,even though the associated genes may be in different locations within the genome...

TTY,...

Ron

Aschaffenburg, Germany

Blue silk, ipomea nil, produces only light or tan seeds...

Assuming the tan seed is a recessive gene, when crossed with let's say Khokan (seed colour black), we would get black seeds in F1 provided the parents were heterozygote.

A selfed F2 would split according to Mendel's laws and there would be both tan and black seeds...



Martin

Netcong, NJ(Zone 5b)

Ipomoea tricolor cultivars come in different seedcolor forms...
http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/p.php?pid=1625123

I have never encountered Heavenly Blue,Pearly Gates or "Wedding Bells"with the same type of light colored seeds that some strains of "Flying Saucer" or "Blue Star" produce...
http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/p.php?pid=3345139

The the dark colored seed forms of I.tricolor do produce a rosey-pink pigmentation on the stems......light colored seed forms of I.tricolor do not produce any pigmentation on the stems...


TTY,...


Ron

Aschaffenburg, Germany

That's highly interesting Ron.

Last year I bought seeds at ebay that had a picture making me believe they were variegated nils.

When I received the seeds I identified them as tricolor though about half the size of the normal Heavenly Blue or Flying Saucer seeds. I know they constantly put wrong pictures at ebay...

I got these tricolors going last year, but never saw the results because we were moving at that time...

I guess I need to try these again, I have seeds left over. It would surprise me if these should have a picotee edge as in the pic (in retrospect they did look like kawaii, which is nil, I know). I have never seen any in the tricolor species a pictoee edge...


Martin

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