why we should use latin names for plants

hi all

I just found this

"The beginning of wisdom is calling things by their right names."
(Chinese proverb)

lets start from today.

Mark

Can of worms comes to mind :)

Just to add confusion, if we are to be correct in all our naming then one thing I shall point out is, Latin names is not (as you know) the correct term for the taxonomy of plants, were I to be pedantic we would be referring to Latin names as Botanical Binomial. Latin not being the only language used, the Greek/other languages used are Latinised, and several forms of Latin are applied.

*Big Grin* Just kidding ya.

I agree that (what I prefer to call albeit technically wrong) botanical names are important for our understanding of which plant is being discussed, especially the few of us who live in other parts of the world. I've often been confused or had to run a search on the common name when reading threads.

I do, however, like to know a common name as well as the botanical. As much as they are confusing, they do often give a description of the plant, its use or place in society, which is an interest of mine (I may be alone in that LOL). Common names also allow other gardeners to know what they are growing and learn its botanical name through asking those who are more experienced in using the more correct terms. Maybe we can get used to using both so that we:

a) Don't alienate each other, some people will flatly refuse to use one set of names

b) Don't get confused as to what is being referred to

I think the plant database will help out on this as the people who contribute will have to look up the plant they are adding to learn the correct botanical name. One concern I have about the plant database is the people who add the common names (as I have done) to the botanical from different parts of the world will cause confusion. Dusty miller came up recently on the seed trading forum as one which is a common name here for one thing and something totally different in the US. If you are looking something up under its common name you may be disappointed.

Baa, all I can say is AMEN - to ALL your points. I too find the common names often charming and interesting. Yeseterday I posted a thread when I came across ten different plants all called Firecracker Plant: (http://davesgarden.com/showthread/85313.html). Only two of them even shared the same genus, it was certainly a broad cross-section of the plant kingdom :)

And here's a prime example of why common names can be interesting. I recently came across a book review of the Dictionary of Plant Names by Allen J. Coombes. In the exerpt, the reviewer tells that Lysimachia is named after King Lysimachos of Thrace (c 360-281 BC). He is said to have used the plant to pacify a bull; Lysimachia’s common name is loosestrife. Pacify a bull = lose strife. Neat, huh?

To be honest, when I revived my long-dormant interest in gardening last year, I had forgotten most of what I ever learned about plants, especially their "real" names. I have re-taught myself by reading, asking questions, and growing plants that I find interesting. The best way to REMEMBER all that information is to commit it to paper (or in this case, to a database.)

And yes, Dusty Miller is the common name for about 10 plants, some of which are at least in the same Genus. It is an unfortunate example to use here, though; some of the plants under this common name have had more than their fair share of botanical names as well, and are still weighted down by several synonyms.

So here's to learning a common language, everyone. Check out the database. Search for a plant by whatever name you know it as, and learn more about it. If it's not there, add it so others may learn, too.

OK points taken.

I thought for a moment you were writing a book when I swa your post. LOL

another thing that gets to me is plants in the database that are the right family but the wrong plant to go with the botanical (little snigger) name. e.g. having an entry for Rudbeckia laciniata but showing R maxima. I havent checked on this entry so if it is i aint picking on ya.

Mark

Mark if you find things that are incorrect, please let me know and I'll work with whoever contributed the entry to correct it. It's the bane of every database; I find all sorts of misclassifications and incorrect photos on reputable sites. I'd like for ours to be as correct as possible. When we find errors, we can all learn from them :)

And speaking of the database, I was wondering if you had had a chance yet to move those gorgeous photos of Geranium pratense over to the G. pratense entry originated by Mary. Thanks so much for sharing your photos; I'd sure hate to see them get lost in the shuffle when Dave deletes the duplicates entries :( Please let me know if you have any problem finding or moving them. Thanks!

This message was edited Tuesday, Aug 28th 4:14 PM

go vols, I have changed my entries to read Geranium pratense cultivars and have changed all my photos also.
http://davesgarden.com/plants/go/538.html

Mark

My biggest problem with botanical names, Greek, Latin or Martian is that they are so often changed by someone who decides that they have found a better way of classification - Persicaria comes to mind. I have some wonderful old books, a complete set of the Wildflowers of New York State and finding what I'm looking for between there and my newer books is a study in insanity! And then there are species that have been given "names" as if they were cultivars and that can run to massive confusion in my rather lax labelling. Actually, my BIGGEST problem is that I just love words and go from reference to reference, always finding 10 more possibilities that I can handle! This is of course why I am forced to write poetry - I really need to use all those wonderous words for something!!!

"would not a rose by any other name smell as sweet?

LOL Yes, but WHICH rose?????

As Kathleen said..Which Rose LOL

Of course it doesn't matter what name anything carries, what does matter is that it has a consistant name, which identifies it from surrounding objects similar or disimilar to itself and which is recognisable to a group or groups of people.

Medicinally, we would be in a right pickle if the correct labelling wasn't applied, be it to plants or anything else. LOL I dread to think what concoctions would be made up.

Here is an example when the latin name is the best

Phallus impudicus

I'll let you look it up..


Byron

I can imagine the first word! but ......... it's not even in the RHS Plant Finder book.

Mark

Stinkhorn fungus grows wild round here and is aptly named.

Just to play Devil's advocate, I vote that Butterfly Pea Vine is a much lovelier name than the botanical one. Not to mention, a little bit less embarassing to mention in mixed company. ;0)

If you start calling plants and such by their given names only Mark you will not only lose me in some of these threads but perhaps others that are not so plant knowledgeable as yourself. Just a thought. JACK

aww, go_vols, what's wrong with the butterfly pea's name?? LOL!!! My daughter (grown) thinks it needs to be moved away from the passion flowers!!!!!!!! ROFL!

Prain

all it takes is to learn one of your plants a day and soon you will know all of them.

Mark

tiG, I'm giggling :) I wonder what would happen if you left 'em alone together?????

Mark and Prain - before we get into a debate here (and it's happened before on this subject), please read Baa's post above. There is a middle ground here. Some folks love gardening, but technical names leave them cold, or they just don't have the time/energy to absorbing a lot of new information. Others of us can't get enough, and are constantly seeking to learn more. Neither side can (nor should even attempt to) force the other side to come around to their way of thinking.

When trading plants and seeds, I agree wholeheartedly that it's best to communicate using the botanical name, so we don't end up with a different plant than what was expected.

Any good gardening book will cross-reference common names with botanical names, which is handy when you need to "translate" for trading purposes.

In fact, the book I mentioned above is a pocket sized book, and would be good for anyone who doesn't have a reference book yet. (And no I don't get a percentage of the sales that might be generated from this thread, too bad!)

Your right, and after a heated discussion with my dear wife I have to agree, ( cuff, cuff) it would be nice to know proper names as well ,lazy jack.