These are the same chicks that were sick a few weeks ago, now their 6 weeks old and are dropping like flies.
had 4 so far dead. one this morning, 2 this afternoon, and about 6 more sick.
nothing I can do for them I guess. their mixed in with my other ones I got locally, I can't tell that their showing signs, none of them got sick the first time, they are a week yonger than the mcmurray chickens.
I have been given a full refund from mcmurray, and it doesn't look like I even want to try to save these sick chicks.
Should just kill the whole lot of them and be done with it. Dang it, nothing makes me madder! I've worked my xxx off trying to keep these chicks healthy.
If I haven't left them bad feedback on the watch dog, THEY WILL get it now.
As I said before, this is my first attempt at buying over the net and it was a deal gone bad from the get go. NEVER AGAIN!
I've done well locally, and might as well stick to buying locally.
I had a tremendous egg drop in my adults, they are laying up a storm now, l0 to l2 eggs a day out of l3 hens.
and I can't tell by looking at the local bought chickens that are in the same pen as the sick ones, that any of the local bought ones are sick.
Just a heads up all you folks that had sick chicks from mcmurray, that it's goin g around twice here.
They were confirmed AE virus in my chicks 3 weeks ago. and someone mentioned that it goes through them twice before it's done with .
mine are getting hit worse this time than the first time.
I 'm going to town now to buy some more vitamin for the water and some turkey starter to up their protein for a few days, to see if that helps, but the sick ones aren't eating or drinking at all this time.
and i'm not workin my butt off trying to keep them alive.
Mcmurray chicks are sick again
You definitely have a right to more than angry. I hope you don't have to cull your entire flock! I hope your newer ones don't get sick and are good productive hens!
Kathy Ann -
My experience is let them die. That sounds really harsh, but we had been dealing with this since February, and even those some seem to get better, they have been eventually dying about 4 weeks later after the first round of improvements. I keep my chickens very clean, with fresh air, food, and water every day. They are in very comfortable living standards. Their nervous systems are just wrecked. It isn't something you did. It was the virus. I tried and tried to save these darn things, and in the end, I think I just prolonged their suffering. It isn't fair to them. I have had only a handful actually recover and stay recovered so far.
I had my husband cull about a dozen or so last weekend and I have about 10 more to go that can hobble around, but aren't going to make quality birds. I am so mad a McMurray that they will never get another dime from me. McMurray is rediculously priced, talks about being for the little guy, and in the end, they are like everyone else, it's all about the $$$.
Of the ones that didn't get sick from McMurray, I am going to breeder cull most of them. The red stars are excellent, but owned by my brother, the australorps are very good and I will be able to keep all 7 of those. The Blue Andalusians (12) are very healthy, but some are crooked toed, the 7 RIRs will be culled hard, as will the 7 White Rocks. The Cuckoo Marans will also be culled hard (there are only a few left alive after the AV anyway.) I have a few Blue Cochins and one Partridge Cochin that are OK. I am not sure how typey they are yet. I have one Buff Rock female, maybe 2, that are OK, and a couple Buff Rock Roos. This is out of 167 chicks. In the end, I have 11 healthy RS, 7 Australorps, maybe 4 RIRs, maybe 5 White rocks and about 10 other various breeds that look like they will be viable. That's 37 chicks out of 167. PATHETIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I would also like to say it's not all hatcheries. I have twenty some healthy Partridge Cochins from Braus and I just picked up 20 RIRs, 10 Partridge Rocks and 3 White Rock roos from them yesterday that all seem really healthy too. I ended up with 20 RIR pullets in the hopes of actually getting a roo or two in the bunch. They were sold out of Roos. I also got 10 SR Cornish Crosses to try ($.94/each) and they are HUGE. I can't wait to see if they grow well. And you know, shipping eggs in is also a good option for some of us. I have those beautiful, huge blue and copper blue Marans from Bev Davis. Her fertility was exceptional. I also got some more Marans shipped in. Beautiful eggs, not a great fertility, but that's how it goes. We will see if any hatch. On shipped eggs, it is amazing how much faster/better the chicks grow. My Marans are huge compared to the hatchery Marans. Of course, the hatchery ones had AE, so that probably affected them quite a bit.
Anyway, just wanted to let you know...I feel your pain. Remember, this wasn't your doing. It was the hatchery. Unfortunately, we can't always fix their errors...
I am looking for some biddies, may be too late to find any local, but I will not buy from sellers unless I see their farms.
Our products including poultry are sometimes from other nations like China that can be dangerous .
Since the dog food scair, we now make up a 10 day batch of rich,corn, chicken and whatever non fattening scraps, freeze it in serving sizes for our dog.
I saw ducklingss at a local store, that looked very sick .If we keep bringing in imports in such huge quanities, no telling what will happen.
Today millions are suppose to be in our streets protesting from other nations, some of them bring in deseases too ,not to speak of cost to care for them.
We really need to be careful now because this nation ain't what it use to be by a long shot .
I left my number at 2 places local that grow chics, hope they have some left.
WEll, I may have spoke too soon on a second round of AE
when I came home from town, I had 6 more dead out there and 3 more very sick. there is blood in the stool. they aren't wobbly like they were last time,
I'm thinking cocsidiosis? i'm gonna go look it up to see what the symptoms are.
i'm just not sure if it s' a second round of AE going on here, I didn't ahve that many sick chicks when I left for town today
looks like i'm goin g back to town to try to clear this up
blood in the stool is coci
I found this on the net
i'll be back later I have to try tosave them,
The most easily recognized clinical sign of severe cecal coccidiosis is the presence of bloody droppings. Dehydration may accompany cecal coccidiosis. Coccidiosis caused by E. tenella first becomes noticeable at about three days after infection. Chickens droop, stop feeding, huddle together and by the fourth day blood begins to appear in the droppings. The greatest amount of blood appears by day five or six and by the eighth or ninth day the bird is either dead or on the way to recovery. Mortality is highest between the fourth and sixth days. Death may occur unexpectedly, owing to excessive blood loss. Birds that recover may develop a chronic illness as a result of a persistent cecal core. However, the core usually detaches itself by eight to ten days and is shed in the droppings
Kathy -
This is usually pretty easy to treat. Follow through for the whole time (7 days I think?) and get their bedding cleaned. Dirty bedding is how it is spread. They will die fast if it isn't taken care of, but they also rebound quickly if you take care of it. You use the sulfa power in the water.
What is the sulfa powder?
CRAp I can't find it anywhere in searcy, i've called
gosh i'm gonna loose them all before i get them cured
people, haven't heard of sulfa powder here, they said teramycin, I really need some help, the local vet didn't even know what to buy.
I can't go to town to get it till I know wht to get and what it is.
sorry. I'm so mad and so upset over this. mad cause I called 3 places and nobody even knows what coci is.
Ok, found a feedstore that had this stuff that gets rid of coci.
I had them on medicated chick starter but took them off. Why did I do that, cause I had ducks /geese too, didn't want to buy both.
so now what? put them all on medicated feed? geese too?
i'll be back in an hour
pray there aren't any mroe dead ones
Is this what sulfa is http://www.americanlivestock.com/pc-1183-166-sulmet-solution-125.aspx I making up a first aid kit for all my pets, everytime I need something I need to drive 30 miles to get it. If it isn't or you have a better kind can you please post it.
Thanks
Lora
WONDERFUL Idea Lora, please post what 's in your kit ok, I think i'm going to do the same thing.
Ok, the sulmet solution is something I've bought before. I've never heard of sulfa.
now I just got back from town and bought something that is scarey says not to use it in animals for human consumption, so does this mean I can never eat any of these chickens?
I bought
cocci rid active ingredient is amprolium
If its like any other med for farm animals you cannot eat them for a certain period of time. Of course you should check with the manufacturer just to be sure. Amprolium is what is in medicated chick feed I believe
Ok, I won't freak out then. thanks so much for all thehelp.
I've lost allmy nerves for the day. Ihope the rest of them get better, kind of weird how only themcmurray chicks got cocci and noone else got it. I suppose they would have gotten sick sooner or later if I hadn't treated them. guess the mcmurray chicks were already poorly from the AE ruining their immune systems
Hi kathy_ann. I'm sorry you are going through so much!
I do think the McMurray chickens are susceptible because of their previous illness. It is what all the sites on AE warn--chicks may recover, but they won't thrive. The egg drop with your layers is probably AE working its way through the flock--luckily it won't hurt them long term--just don't use any of their eggs for hatching and keep them away from the chicks!
I have been debating whether to use medicated starter because they say if you keep chicks on it for too long they won't gradually build up the natural immunity they need to go out in the cold cruel world. Of course if their immunity has been compromised by AE as soon as they go off the medicated starter (which they probably need in their weakened condition) they are going to very vulnerable to coccidiosus. I hope you can recover a nice heathy flock you can just enjoy.
Kathy_ann -
Same stuff. Sulmed is perfect! I think the MM chicks are just weak. I seriously don't think they are capable of recovery, even if they seem recovered. I am glad we got rid of most of ours. One less worry for us, and less torture for them.
I admire your determination to save these chicks. And I feel like it is an effort that if not in vain. Even if you just save one or two at least you'll have them. I dunno, I'm speaking form the point of view of a person who keeps just a couple chickens as pets (not to eat were vegetarians) and for the eggs. So maybe I'm just overly sentimental to mine. Yeah you could just go and buy healthier chicks for a lot less than you've spent to recover these, but sometimes the best pets are the ones you save. We have a dog that had distemper when we adopted him from the pound(for those of you who know its a virus that has an 80% death rate and effects their nervous system). Most vets wont even treat it they will just put the animals down, but we wouldn't have it. Well it took months and months, all of our time and wasn't cheap but now hes the best dog we've ever had. He only has a slight twitch of his jaw as a lingering neurological effect but no one ever notices until we point it out. The pound, the vets, everyone said he would never recover.
Sometimes you just have to try anyway and you do get miracles.
But like I said its a different point of view, if you are not raising them as pets but as animals for food them maybe its not worth the effort to get a slightly sub-par animal health wise.
I hope this doesn't sound like I'm trying to convince you not to do what you need to do. It just sounded like you were trying hard to save them so I wanted to give you a little light at the end of the tunnel.
How are they today? Fingers crossed!
I always try to save any animal I have--but I also have them primarily as pets. My main determination is what is their quality of life.....If they are enjoying being alive, or have the prospect of enjoying life, then I go for it. If if it is just a long misery, I try to find the kindest way to end it. It is a horrible decision to make.
Unfortunately a lot of people with chicks from that particular MMH season are having to make that decision over and over again--it is a hearbreaking situation.
Oh Meg, trust me, I am a softy too. Your reading a post from someone who has spent thousands of dollars trying to save horses, dogs, etc. I even spent $200 on a barn cat's emerency C Section, which my husband about had a stroke over. I have spent hundreds of dollars trying to save these chicks. It has gone on since February 20th of this year. Yes, that's right, like 10 weeks. I don't blame anyone for trying to save the chicks, I just think it may be cruel to them in the end. It's a battle a person can't win when there is nervous system damage that isn't repairable. If you have seen these chicks, you'd understand. They don't have normal mobility and quality of life is very poor.
Cocci is a different thing. Perfectly treatable with full recovery. AE, not so much.
"I even spent $200 on a barn cat's emerency C Section, which my husband about had a stroke over."
LOL! sounds like a scene at my house. You spent HOW MUCH on WHAT ANIMAL!?!?!
I found one more dead this morning, haven't been bck out there, but headed there next. they all seemd to be ok now. or on the up hill.
I still have say maybe l0 to l5 left from mcmurray. lost 8 3 weeks ago to AE lost 11 to cocci had 39 of them,
so we'll see, I hope that some of the roosters were in the sick bunch LOL
bad thing here, is we have crows that will pick them up twhen their their size now, and carry them off, hawks and other flying birds, so they have to be watched if their outside, and most times we just keep them in their house, it's closed up. so no fresh air. which is bad, I can haull them all out and put them in the chicken tractor, but by the time I pick them all up and transport them, I can't move from all the bending over. sometimes I let the door stay openand let them out to mow the grass down, they don't all come out, just a few of them,
most days I throw fresh pulled grass up inthe house for them to eat, and they chow down on it.
I hope I have no more dead ones, going out there now to check.
kathy
Hi Kathy-ann, last year when my chicks were too young to free range I built a sort of screen door for the front of my chicken house. The house is really a wooden shed with two door in the front so I used 2x4's as a frame and stapled chicken wire to it and used eye hook things (4 of them) to hold it in place. It worked great and I still use it, I put a big handle on the 2x4 that runs in the middle of it to slide it back and forth for extra security at night and insulated for the winter to cut down on any drafts.
Maybe something like that could get some fresh air??
That's exactly what i'm working on getting my DH to do for me. I think it will work good for letting in the air .
Great They will get lots of fresh air and be protected. I even hung a box fan on mine sucking the air out this summer for those hot nights.
Ilost 3 more this morning, one from mcmurray and 2 of the local bought chickens.
and one more local bought chicken is deathly sick.
That stuff I got from the feedstore isn't working fast enough I guess. I'mgoing to get some sulmet this morning in hopes to help cure them faster.
I'm also calling mcmurray monday morning and telling them. If for nothing else, peace of mind. Their sickly low immune chickens are what's causing this mess. If I had known I would have separated the two batches 3 weeks ago when they got over the AE, maybe my local bought batch wouldn't have got the cocci.
This seems strange. Usually Sulmed clears up any problems within, like a day, seriously, if it is Cocci. Is that what you are giving them? If so, I would be concerned that it isn't Cocci. We have had no bloody stools in our McMurray chicks, but we do still have them die off for no apparent reason because their nervous systems aren't right. We haven't lost any since last week though.
I am giving them sulmet in their water.
and their still dropping like flies. had 2 mor this morning, and I put 2 others out that I thought were dead, but came to live when I putthem out there so their not quite dead yet.
been on sulmet since friday night, well friday morn I gave them medication for cocci in their feed same stuff that's in medicated feed, got it in powder form, saturday I bought the sulmet and have been giving it to them since sat morning.
my second flock that I intrigated with my mcmurray chickens are dying too.
I don't have too many left LOL.
I called mcmurray, of course , they denied it being the fauolt of their weak chickens. and I shouldn't have called them, cause it just made me more upset. They didn't offer any assistance or help. had this attitude, why the xxxx are you calling us .
Unless the chickens that are dying aren't eating and drinking which may be the reason i'm still loosing them, I tried to feed a couple medicated water the other day and they died the next monring.
this has been going on for say since wed. I didn't know untill friday that there was bloody poop though.
Everybody i've talked to says it 's cocci. I haven't had the poop tested. .
i'm not going to try to save any more by giving them water , if they aren't goin g to drink it then they'll just die.
I'm just about done with the whole lot of them.
maybe next year DH will let me start over. I don't know. hemay say it's not worth the effort and expense. I have enough chickens to give us eggs.
Kathy - so sorry this has been so hard. I know it has been a bad experience for sure....
I had thought about adding a couple of chicks for my lone chicken to have some company- and I would like to have a rooster in the bunch because I love to hear them....but after reading this, I am almost scared to purchase any!!
Genna
Don't be scared to purchase any Genna, There are tons of places that I would purchase from again and i'd definitely buythem local again also. Granted it has been a horrible ordeal for me. and I won't buy from mcmurray again. But I would buy from ideal poultry and a few other places.
but if your just gonna get a couple it would be less expensive on you to try to get them local or through the newspaper. Also, mixed breed chickens, seem to thrive alot more than purebread chickens do. they seem to be healthier and more able to combat illness.
I didn't mean fo this thread to scare folks off from buying chickens. Not what I intended.
I would look into something other than Cocci if I were you. If you are following the dose instructions and the med is fresh, they should have cleared up a LONG time ago. Usually the meds kick in within hours. It works almost instantly.
There are lots of great places to get chicks. I am very pleased with Braus Hatchery and breeders that I have found. So far I have really gotten quality chicks!
Thanks.... I will check Ideal and Braus.... never ordered chicks off line... Would prefer to just find someone local with chicks for sale....but haven't had any luck yet. I don't want "show" chickens - just yard chicks..........LOL
Genna
LOL! Yard chickens....those little punks.
I agree... would like to have some fancy chicks to show but don't want to deal with having all those individual cages - so I just want some to add to my large chicken house that only has ONE occupant.... :-) She thinks she is living in a mansion because she has the whole place to herself!! LOL Of course, she has been alone for so long, she might not like the idea of sharing...............
genna
i was looking at petfinder this morning and was really surprised with how many nice chickens they had for adoption nationwide. even one roo, won at a show, and the boy didn't want him once his project was over ;-(
also check your local classified ads, and look for flyers at feed stores.
tf
Hadn't thought about that..... would be nice to give one a home that someone didn't want anymore..... (as long as they were HEALTHY!)
Thanks
Genna
Yep, you wouldn't want one coming from my house LOL oh woes me poor me. I"ve been struck by the sick bug.
tf I looked on petfinder yesterday and for my area all I could find were medium to large barnyard animals. What catergory did you look under to find the chickens?
MollyD
Hi MollyD--look under "birds" not "farm animals". There are tons listed around here, even chicks. Lots of roosters in the big cities (I'm thinking fighting rejects). Good luck!