Really Newbie Here

I am really a newbie here. This year will be my first year really growing these beauties. I have gotten some seeds from Beth (thank you so very much!), Karen (remember me? Hand painted seed packets.) and bought a mix from Emma Grace. So I think that I have a really wonderful start.
Can you give me some much needed advice on how to grow them? Fert.? Full sun? Soil? Are seeds true to parent?
I am sure that I will have more questions as things move along.
Thanks so very much!
Melanie

Hi meag - those were new days for trading for me - my memory still glows with those brush strokes of yours that looked like sea shells comprising flowers on your seed packets. Are you still painting? Hope all has been going well for you.

First, let me say that all your questions are addressed in the quintessential, online, free, digitalized book on morning glories by Dr. Yoneda: http://protist.i.hosei.ac.jp/Asagao/Yoneda_DB/E/menu.html . Click on Introduction, and follow the links from "The Japanese Morning Glory...Kodansha Panorama Illustrated Book".

And then, here are a few links to some germane discussions and posts from this forum relating to the topics you brought up -

DIAGRAMS OF MG FLOWERS (It helps to understand discussion about morning glories, if you know the terms for the basic parts of the flower.)

http://www.cs.umb.edu/~whaber/Monte/Plant/Conv/conv-part.html

http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/fp.php?pid=4110886 (click on the thread for this post and scroll down for more of Atenkley's diagrammed images)

GERMINATION

Germination of commonly grown morning glories - http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/p.php?pid=3303432

For an extremely comprehensive view of germination beyond but including MGs and many related topics, read both the thread containing the following post, as well as the link to which this post points
- http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/p.php?pid=4299048 -

CULTURE

There have been many discussions on this topic, from folks that say that all they have to do is step out their back door and fling seeds around to other folks for whom things are more complicated. In general, morning glories appreciate full sun, but 3/4 is fine, and the farther south you go, the more some - like Ipomoea nil - appreciate partial shade in the afternoon. If you really want to grow morning glories and do not have a whole lot of sun, then cultivars of Ipomoea purpurea are the way to go. For a great question/answer thread on this and many other MG topics, see Beckygardener's link below.

FERTILIZATION (In general, average garden soil is fine for commonly grown MGs. But the links within the following link go into this in more detail.)

http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/684152/

POLLINATION

Are seeds true to the parent?

Seeds are true to a parent only if you grow one cultivar of a species at a time, or isolate flowers when more than one cultivar of a species is grown by bagging flowers or growing indoors.

Before I go into more detail, let's define the words cultivar and species. The person to whom I was responding in the following post was asking about 'Blue Ensign' which happens to be a cultivar of iris and lungwort, but turned out to be 'Ensign Blue', which is a type of morning glory - http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/p.php?pid=4291463

Now that we understand what a cultivar and species is and why it matters, following is another comprehensive post by Ron_Convolvulaceae with great pictures and explanations of identifying factors for commonly grown morning glory species including Ipomoea nil, Ipomoea purpurea, Ipomoea hederacea, and others - http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/p.php?pid=3504567

With around 50 genera and 1,000 species of morning glories, you could grow up to 50 X 1,000 MG vines and never have to bag a flower. But - there are many cultivars out there, especially of Ipomoea nil and Ipomoea purpurea. Suppose you want to grow more than one cultivar of I. nil or more than one cultivar of I. purpurea, and save seed that will stay "true" to the parent? Or suppose you want to try to making some of your own crosses? The following post contains some links to posts by various gardeners on this forum on this subject: http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/p.php?pid=3858430

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A great general question/answer thread of Beckygardener - http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/769055/

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Meag, hope this helps, and to the rest of the forum, I hope you like the way the above information was presented. Our sticky might eventually wind up with sections that:

#1 contain only internal DG links for the ultimate convenience of DG administration. This is where topics would be alphabetized, with brief explanatory introductions to the more complex links that follow, and those links would just be those posts most comprehensively relevant to the subject. Anyone wanting to read the whole thread of any of those posts could just click on the link with the post.

#2 contain external links like Dr. Yoneda's book - no one can tell how long any external link will be around

#3 FAQs (frequently asked questions - a good place to include rambling threads)

A lot of work remains in developing these concepts, and I hope y'all will continue to be patient with us. I just wrote this to help Meag out for now, but I need to take some time away from DG for my family for a while. I'll be around, but to a lesser degree. May you all have a safe, happy and healthy holiday -

Karen

Melanie,
If you got seeds from me, I hand pollinated them so they should come true.

Karen (with a K, LOL), thanks for all of the information. Fingers are crossed. Hopefully I will grow some of the beauties that you have here on the MG forum. Yes, I still paint. It is still one of my joys. I hand paint my x-mas cards this year. Karen you have a wonderful time with the family. I get to go and meet my sons ship in just a little bit. He is coming home from Iraq.
Beth, I was just curious about the seeds being true to the parent. I am really excited about the ones that I have gotten from you.
Thanks all.

Meag, that was an awful lot of info to dump on you - if you don't ask some newbie questions, I'm going to feel awfully guilty. I still have a good bit of Dr. Yoneda's book to read (not to mention re-read) yet, myself.

Have added an envie for you to a pile I'm already working on - might we persuade you to post a painting of (some?) of the MGs we send you next summer or whenever you can? (hint hint to rest of forum here). I'll be posting more pics of my MGs and the garden context in which they grew when things get less chaotic here. Right now, I'm not concerned about copyright, and anyone is welcome to them. You could be practising right now on pics already posted - I'll bet many, if asked, will be delighted.

Wonderful news about your son being home for Christmas.

Welcome Melanie (that has always been a favorite name of mine)
You will love the MG forum and all the generous and helpful people here. I think this is a busy time for a lot of us so the forum is a bit slow right now... If you dmail me your address I will send you some extra seeds I have after the Holidays.

Karen Blue is the Queen of links!!

Nice to here another will be coming home!!! ☺

Karen you know that I will do my very best!! I do so enjoy painting, growing brugs, and now plan to grow MG's. I have started reading the links that you have provided. So much information!! I will more than likely ask questions along the way.
Luv, I have been around Dave's for awhile. Yes, you are all great people and friends!! I would love to have a couple of your seed if it is not to much trouble. Thanks so very much!
This weekend will be a exciting time for me! My son is home!! I will have all five children, their spouses, and grandchildren here! Whewww!! It is going to be so crowded!! LOL!!
Thanks so much!
Melanie

As a newbie here too I also appreciate the links! Nice to see another Brug convert here lol!
Caren (with a C, LOL!)

This is fun!! Both of you here!! How did your mirabilis loigiflora (sp?) do? This is what started it all. Mine didn't do to good. Just imagine me trying to ask questions and both of you asking me which Karen, Karen with a K, or Caren with a C. LOL!!
Karen, if the people here don't mind, I don't want to infringe on any copyright laws. I will lift a few pictures from the forum and see what I can do about some little paintings. Better yet, I will find the pictures and d-mail the owner and ask permission.

Another newbie question: How long are MG seeds viable?

Welcome aboard, Caren with a "C", for all the larking about we did with musical identities - it's coming back to me - we actually found what we were looking for: the uncommon, night-fragrant, desert 4 o'clock - Mirabilis longiflora, didn't we? Melanie, I have 5 seeds left and can put some in your envie if you'd like to try again. They are cold-hardy perennials that come back from their roots after winter here.

Back to MG seed viability - MG seeds are known to be viable for 5 - 10 years, but that can vary quite a bit (up to 50 years) depending on how well they are harvested, dried and stored. (A great thread that developed from ByndeweedBeth's bringing a pack of 1949 seeds to this forum is here - http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/677301/ )

HARVESTING

When harvesting MG seed, they should be brown and crispy - http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/p.php?pid=3560541 . Some have success harvesting "'nearly ready' mature seeds" ( http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/p.php?pid=4090680 ), but that might not be best for long-term viability where the seed coat is concerned ( http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/p.php?pid=3305246 ). Also, waiting for seeds to arrive at just the right "brown & crispy" stage can result in the pods shattering before you get to them, so some like to bag them with some porous material not conducive to fungus ( http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/p.php?pid=4017486 , & following posts 4017492, 4017498).

For many of us, seed pods of many Japanese morning glories, such as cultivars of Ipomoea nil, do not ripen before frost. So, to harvest seed, it is often advisable to grow these vines in pots that can be moved indoors when frost comes.

Alternatively, starting a couple of weeks before your typical autumn frost date, cut stems with pods and bring them indoors to ripen in jars of water with a dash of hydrogen peroxide (H202) to prevent formation of slime. The water should be changed daily, but the H202 gives you a little bit of latitude there. The stems will continue to photosynthesize which contributes to the continuing maturing of seed pods, so I keep mine going under grow lights, and, also, I take off leaves before bringing the stems in because insects come in with them.

(Note: Ron prefers to leave all the leaves on the stems of his vines when he brings them in to ripen in water. About the bugs, he says he gently moves his fingers along the leaves and stems to squish the aphids and company. Always listen to him before you listen to me :)

In my case, however, by the time frost is imminent, 99.999% of the leaves have gone to rust and couldn't photosynthesize anyway. To me, since the beauty of the flowers offsets the slovenly demise of the leaves, this is a small drawback.)

DRYING

And then, it is very important to immediately place them somewhere they can dry out for a few weeks. As I harvest mine, I put them in paper envelopes, and as soon as possible, I depod them into 3" x 3" home-made paper trays where they can air out in thin layers for a few weeks. An approximately 10" x 20" tray can hold about 18 of those little trays, and I use mesh-bottomed trays because, in our tiny house with 2 curious cats, I have only found one place they are leaving alone: the top of the refrigerator where they can be loosely stacked for air flow. I prefer drying seeds on a paper surface, because air vapor more easily condenses onto the surface of ceramic plates and other materials.

But, further south in Florida and Louisiana, humidity is more of a problem with drying out seeds. In the following thread, Beckygardener arrives at a great technique in which she air-drys her MG seed along with moisture-absorbant materials like rice and paper in cups - http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/p.php?pid=4098922 . If my suspicions about the Murphy in Becky's Murphy's Law having whiskers, curiosity and a purr when scratched behind the ears are true, then this thread is all the more so valuable for anyone reading this. In the thread, some say their seeds are always kept in paper envelopes.

STORAGE

Good storage is totally dependent on how well you dried your seeds, especially if you ultimately decide to store them in plastic. One reason to store in plastic is a pest that sooner or later MG growers may encounter: weevils. Atenkley says that storing his seed in a baggie within a baggie helps to keep weevils from roaming into neighboring seeds - http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/p.php?pid=2995184 . And Ron said he uses "the extra-large freezer ziplock bags > they are thicker and thick plastic tupperware containers and haven't found any bug that can chew through either one of those" here - http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/p.php?pid=2997690 . For more indepth coverage of weevils, their life cycle, dirty tricks, etc., the whole thread containing the foregoing posts is great.

I store my seeds at room temperature, and common sense tells me not to let them freeze, but I do not know the exact limits - nor optimum conditions - of storage; so if anyone would like to chime in here, I'd love to hear from you. If you don't mind, I'll edit what I write to centralize information on respective topics that come up - by linking to other comments.

I have just finished my second summer growing species and Japanese morning glories, and I did not figure all this out by myself. Heck, a medical situation keeps our budget close to the bone, so I could not have afforded to bumble around on eBay going through who knows how many $$ before I ever would have come into possession of the kinds of MGs I've been growing. Guess who rescued me before I even knew I was being "rescued" from being morning glory-less?

In the beginning, EmmaGrace bestowed an incredible array of these seeds upon me in trade for one little measely rooted cutting. And, also, when I arrived at this forum, I benefitted from the years of research that Ron_Convolvulaceae had (and continues to) invested into studying the science of morning glories. For me, any subject is in itself a cross roads for the interplay of different disciplines of thought, and I have especially loved adding a glimmer of scientific understanding to my love of flowers thanks to Ron.

Emma and Ron have been quiet lately, and wherever you are now, I hope you're feeling the glow of my - and so many others' - thanks and appreciation.


This message was edited Jan 1, 2008 9:51 PM

bluespiral, great basic info and resources. Thanks for taking the time. We can all benefit from it. I know I can.

Karen blue - ditto what revclaus says - this is a great thread, tons of good info - your time spent on this is greatly appreciated!

Joanne

I agree!! Karen you have taken so much time to help me and I am sure others in this forum. You are such a wonderful person. Thanks!!
The reason that I was asking about the viability, I got some seed in a trade about two years ago. At the time I didn't know what to do with them, They are: Henka "Blue Blizzard", Kurerai, Shirayuki, and a few others. A couple were from you, Yojiro, Rose & Chocolate Silk mix, and Hatsu Arashi (if I read it right). I haven't a clue as to what this look like.
I would love to try the mirabilis longflora, maybe this time it will grow...hopefully!

Well, looks like Becky has taken over the sticky - I know whatever she comes up with will be helpful to many.

This message was edited Mar 19, 2008 7:48 PM

What sticky??

I agree... what sticky??

I know there was some talk about a sticky a while back and I believe facts and links were getting gathered by a few members. I don't know about anybody taking anything over though???

Why not do more than one sticky?

I agree it might be better for one person to create a sticky because there is less confusion and it`s like crocheting in a way. If two people work on the same afghan it will look strange and become irregular because each person has their own individual style much like handwriting.

Who says there needs to be only one sticky? The top contributors know who they are and each could come forward with anything they are willing to contribute. imho

I don`t want to do a sticky because I feel like others here would do do a better job than me. I have enjoyed chiming in and mingling but I`m not one of the experts. I would enjoy reading anything anyone came up with.

Karen

Me too. Bluespiral, I consider you one of the experts. Write your own.