Growing Moonflowers and MG's together...

Has anyone grown Moonflowers and Morning Glories together? I figure it'd be fun to have one opening not too long after the other closed. I'm a little worried about the those scary seed pods from the Moonflower though. I don't want them to crush my Morning Glories.
Also, I saw someone planted Clematis and MG's together on this forum but didn't see any MG flowers in that picture, lots of foliage though. Any ideas how Clematis and MG's do together too?

Thanks,
Cheryle

I tried it last year, and the MG's crowded out my clematis....I probably won't do it again.

Thanks threegardeners...Just curious which MG's you grew with your clematis and what kind of clematis? We have about 5 kinds of clematis that we've planted within the past 6 years. Some grow on old growth, some on new. We had trouble with some of them and didn't get as many flowers as I would've liked. Since we added about 3 clematis this past year, it'll be interesting to see how strong they are and how many blooms we get. A few of the clematis are already up - my husband and I saw them a couple days ago.

Hi Cheryle, welcome to the MG forum. Am so glad you brought up my favorite subject of which MGs to combine with which clematis (and by extension, other plant associations with MGs). I'll share a few from my limited knowledge and experience, and maybe we can spark a wider discussion from more knowledgeable folks.

One of the loveliest duets I ever saw was the clouds of tiny, white, scented flowers of Clematis terniflora punctuated with medium trumpets of a hot pink Ipomoea purpurea. Janett_D photographed this from below in her garden in Sweden in late summer - it's buried somewhere in past threads on this forum. Some of the reasons this combination worked is:

1) Vigor - Both plants are thugs, and because they each meet their match with each other in this combination, one will not overpower the other. (In fact, TOO thuggy for Janett, who said she was going to get rid of the clematis, if my memory is working correctly here. Personally, I would not be without this clematis - I just cut it to the ground in late winter or early spring to control its volume and it makes a great waterfall of ghostly white in the moonlight through a section of our yew hedge in late summer) As for the thuggy I. purpurea, that's what I. purpureas do: many of these can make relatively big vines in late summer and are very welcome where you want long vines and/or in partial shade where many other MGs will not perform.

2) White makes pink look brighter and crisper.

3) The contrasting shapes and sizes of the two flowers augment the contrast between the two colors.

4) timing - not all kinds of clematis and MG are as easy to get to bloom together as these two.

There's another clematis species I've only read about but would love to grow that might work here: Clematis rehderiana. It has little, pale yellow, fragrant bells in summer with vines between 15 - 30'. I bet that one would be stunning with Ipomoea purpurea 'Kniola's Black'. This combination would work not only because of the contrast between "blue" and "yellow", but because the blue appears to the eye to be close to black and the yellow appears to the eye to be white faintly blushed yellow. Partial shade would help keep this MG from trouncing this clematis.

And then, suppose you had a 3-4' tall rail fence along which you grew mixed annuals, perennials, vines and shrubs. And suppose, for a 10' stretch, you grew poppies like: the double-"black" peony poppy or Papaver rhoeas 'Angels Choir' or the low Papaver alpinum spiked with P. atlanticum 'Flore Pleno', etc.? All these poppies would be toast by the time Clematis 'Mrs. Robert Brydon' (supported on the fence but still sprawling) filled out their vacated space with her icy-blue flowers. The shorter vines of Ipomoea yojiro 'Mt. Fuji' would make a great neighbor for Mrs. Brydon (especially for the brightness of their color compared with pallid Mrs. Brydon) without taking over the rest of the fence. The Mt. Fuji morning glory is interesting for being descended from a cross between Ipomoea nil and Ipomoea purpurea - see http://protist.i.hosei.ac.jp/Asagao/Yoneda_DB/E/menu.html - click on Interspecific Hybrids - then click on the 3rd link beginning with African strain of Ipomoea nil... - Mt. Fuji is like the "Ray White" ones)

In my garden, clematis (as well as some roses) don't do much until after 3 or 5 years have passed. Once they are established, the take-off is most gratifying; but until they do, I would not sic a MG on a clematis, nor a clematis on a rose or whatever its intended host may be. Always let the host get established first.

As for the large-flowered hybrids of clematis, combining them with morning glories is a tough call. Rather than grow them through each other, how about growing a clematis up its own upright and a MG up its own upright, with the two meeting on the crossbar linking the two uprights to see what happens? Or, perhaps meeting from a greater distance apart as on an arbor? What an opportunity to mingle the burgundy velvet of Clematis 'Niobe' with the white silk of Ipomoea nil 'Hama no Yuki' ( http://davesgarden.com/pf/go/103776/index.html ) that would be.

You could get a nice succession of flowers through the growing season that way, with the MGs flowering into frost after the clematis have finished. (However, in general, if you prune clematis of Group III (includes genes of C. lanuginosa and C. Viticella) right after they bloom, there's a good chance they'll rebloom some time between August and October. Shirley1md would be a great source of info on clematis in general)

I hope I've given an idea of how the growth habits of Ipomoea yojiro and I. nil and I. purpurea compare with each other. When you consider that I. yojiro resulted from a cross between I. nil and I. purpurea, it's fascinating to see the traits of the parents mixed in the offspring.

A couple more combinations with MGs, but not necessarily including clematis --

Grasses catch morning light as dramatically as morning glories do but in different ways. The long, narrow, silvery blades of Miscanthus sinensis 'Morning Light' used to glow beneath the backlit silk of Ipomoea tricolor 'Heavenly Blue' in our garden years ago when neighboring trees didn't block the sun. Its neighbor, Clematis lanuginosa, is the only survivor of that combination today.

There was a section of blue flowers at Sissinghurst that had a wall covered with Perle d'Azur (Group III). A grouping of pots in the foreground containing dwarf morning glories like Ipomoea nil 'Sunsmile' or Convolvulus tricolor thickened with curly -parsley or Convolvulus sabatius in shades of blue, violet, purple, etc. would be fun with which to carry on the blue theme later in summer. At the base of the pots, another dwarf MG, Evolvulus nuttallianus (hardy to zone 4a), could be naturalized with its woolly gray-green leaves and bright blue, dime-sized flowers.

Last summer, Ipomoea 'Cameo Elegance' white-splashed leaves were quite a contrast with a black-leaved canna - hopefully this year I'll get a color echo between the red of the canna flowers and the red of the small 'Cameo Elegance' flowers, which had a wider white outer margin than that shown in PlantFiles. All those broad leaves rose from the thin, feathery leaves of lemon southernwood and a low hedge of rue. Clematis 'Polish Spirit' bloomed earlier that summer with rose 'Abraham Darby' nearby.

I'm sure there must be tons of other possible combinations out there. Who was the one that posted a pic of morning glories growing through sunflowers? Seemed like that was the essence of summer.

My eyes are quitting on me, so can't proof. I look forward to others' input.

Interesting topic here. I haven`t grown Clematis so I can`t help you there, but the following link shows MG and Sun flowers growing together. what a unique combination and concept by Gardener2005.

http://davesgarden.com/forums/fp.php?pid=3350924

dee

My wife and I have grown the two together, and the morning glories, I mustsay, exhalt the shortcomings of clematis. I have always loved clematis, but gee. I bought my wif ea 6 year old clematis one year for valentines day, and it cost a pretty penny too then. Today it is on an arbor around the kitchen window. Last summer it got all covered up with morning glories, and I have to say that was the only time it was ever covered with blooms til frost. Clematis are beautiful when they are in bloom, and that is only for about 2 weeks each year. The cheap good old fashioned morning glories on the other hand bloom their hearts out for you all summer until the first frost. I would like to be able to say that about clematis. Right after the clematis finished blooming, the morning glories started to bloom and kept it up til the frost came at the end of Sept. Boo clematis. Frank

Here the clematis is blooming while the morning glories are just getting started so the clematis is done when the morning glories begin. Bluespiral is right about letting your main plants such as roses,clematis,jasmine etc. get established well before adding any annual vine to spice things up for summer. Your number of vines matter as far as how well they grow. Try spacing everything about 6 " apart and with morning glories less is more. You can overplant them and end up with a mess of vines full of bugs difficult to control due to the mass of leaves they have to hide in and fungus disease will be encouraged in overcrowded nils. Start the seedlings and thin them out and don`t worry about anything as long as you have them spaced apart and not over crowded.

I think One moonvine or one tricolor...or one to two purpurea or nil such as SOH is enough to accompany a clematis on just about any trellis or porch railing. The nils such as youjiros and Hatsu Arashi are more petite and polite with their growth habits so you could put more of those. That is just an opinion of course. You can experiment with different numbers and cominations of plants to see what works.

Sunflowers are super for giving morning glories some protection from the heat without shading them out completely. I also use cannas,banana trees,philos and elephant ears to create a sort of habitat. Over time you try things and catch on to what does and doesn`t work in your particular garden.



This message was edited Apr 15, 2007 10:07 AM

Wow - I've got a lot to think about now! I did start sunflowers a couple days ago (they haven't germinated yet) but I think I will try combining a Morning Glory with the sunflowers. That was a great point made about waiting until roses and clematis are established. I'm definitely not the most patient gardener and clematis have definitely tried my patience. Plus, as you said Frank - they are short lived blooms. Even so, I still look forward to them too much to do without them. Plus, I love the shape of the flowers on the clematis too.
Here's my problem though. I don't know the names of some of our clematis anymore. A few of them either had wilt or attacks by slugs and just when you'd think the plant was okay, it'd die for the season. So basically, I'll take pics this summer and maybe between you guys recognzing one you know and me scouring the internet and DG pics, we'll figure out which varieties I have.
Another combination I was thinking of is sweet peas and MG. I think the MG may be too vigorous but am not sure. After reading some posts here last night, I had dreams of MG's going up to the roof on our house! Last year the MG my cousin gave me that she started from seed stayed in a nice big pot and behaved itself. I'm hoping I haven't started any monsters from seed:-)

Bluespiral - thanks for so much info. I haven't quite wrapped my mind around all of it yet, but the grasses and MG's are also something we are interested in trying (after you mentioned it) esp. since I planted some black tip wheat a couple of days ago. It isn't the purple fountain grass that I could look at for quite some time, but it'll be interesting to see how it turns out.
Gardener2005 - thanks for the tip on not planting too close together. I hadn't thought about pests and disease. Would I be as susceptible to it in zone 5 as you are in LA? I know we deal with fungi on the tomatoes and strawberries here if we aren't very careful, but I didn't realize any pests liked MG's.
Also, do you think MG's can be as big and overpowering up here in the north midwest as they can with a longer growing season? I guess if an MG can be a "thug" in subarctic Sweden, it could be here...maybe just depends on the variety?

Yes, it depends on what kind of vine and it also depends on what it does in your particular garden and even the spot where you put it. Some of these things are very much trial and error.

This message was edited Apr 15, 2007 3:46 PM

Just wanted to thank everyone for their posts here - will be back when I have more time

Thanks everyone for such a warm welcome. I hope to read more about MG's being combined with other plants...

This has been a great thread to follow. I have been wondering about what other vines I could grow with the MG's. My main concern is that the MG's will find our summer nights too cool and they won't survive here. I want to have more hardy 'back up' vines planted with the MG's just in case.

Joanne

Moonflowers with Heavenly Blue MG is absolutely a heavenly combination.

Joanne, if you have some special MG vines, it might be good insurance to have at least one of each in a pot so you can take it indoors for the seed pods to ripen in the fall.

And! there's a workshop on vines for the prairie coming to your area tomorrow via the Calgary Horticultural Society: http://www.calhort.org/home/default.aspx

I got that link off of: http://calgarypubliclibrary.com/links/lkgardn.htm

after googling: http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Calgary+%2B+plants&btnG=Search - I see at least one other promising-looking link having to do with Weaselhead

Welp, the winds just crashed a neighbor's tree, and the top appears to now be where our car is parked lower down on the hill - about to go see. grrr - new job starting in a couple of days - argh - do things get this adventurous where you live?

Wineaux, nice to meetcha - our posts crossed in cyberspace. As prolific a flower-er as Heavenly Blue is, I can easily envision that combination - nice one.

Nice to meetcha too. It is one of my favorite combos. This year I am also trying mamoth sunflowers with several diffrent varieties of MGs. Soon as I figure out this picture thing I will post the diffrent combos.

Looking forward to seeing them - and maybe some finch or hummer visitors, too?

I had a brown hummer visit my house yesterday. It was looking in the windows at my blooms, but couldn't get at them.

Beth, now you're making me see those woody vines growing into our cellar through the stones in a new light - but I don't know of a cold-seeking MG that would motivate itself to pierce those walls in the opposite direction.

Poor hummer...could you crack the window and dangle a blooming MG tendril outside for him? You might need to block the crack in case he's anything like a bumble bee that kept coming in here a few years ago until I found his entrance - round and round the two of us went - bumble would come buzzing in from the back, I'd open the front door, out he'd go, then come back in again, out the front, etc.

Hey bluespiral - yes, I'm planning to attend that workshop - I'm a member of the Calgary Hort. Society.

By the way, Weaselhead is a large natural area in Calgary near our water reservoir; it is home to much plant and wildlife.

Thanks for the tip on seed collection; right now all the MG's I have started are what I've see refered to as "common". However, I am getting some special seeds in trade (or at least special to me because I can't buy them at the greenhouse) so if I manage to get some of them going, I will make sure to bring them inside in the fall.

Joanne

I'll bet Weaselhead is beautiful

It is beautiful. It's pretty secluded in some places; hard to believe you're in the middle of the city.

I felt bad for the hummer. I have never tried feeding them because someone once told me that you are just killing them by feeding them sugar water (I don't know if that is really true).

I seem to recall reading that if the sugar water and its container are not changed and cleaned properly, respectively, that bacteria harmful to hummers can build up. But, aside from that, it is also said that hummers get better nutrition from letting Mother Nature be the chef - evidently, they also eat insects in addition to sipping nectar from flowers.

There is a trio I hope never to be without in late summer up until frost - morning glories, dahlias and sages - all of which hummers visit in our garden beginning in August. In addition to morning glories, DG has forums for dahlias as well as for agastaches and sages (or sages and agastaches?). You can find lists on the Sage and Agastache forum for which sages can grow in shade or humidity or other special situations - I think sages (and agastache and plectranthus) were made in heaven to be companions for morning glories and hummers.