can you grow martagon lilies in texas?

i really, really want to try these but will they do o.k. in texas? also, i am getting some other lily bulbs (asiatics,orientals, and pardalinum, splendens and black beauty) in may. is that too late to plant in the ground here? will the heat thru the summer cause them to die? would planting in pots be better? i am not that concerned with getting blooms this first year but i do want them to live. thanks.barb

How cold does it get and for how long? Plant them in the shade.

Unfortunately my martagon book is in a box at present. Someone else who has Dr. Foxs book can perhaps look this up for you. They grow well in VictoriaBC,also zone 8 but not nearly as much heat as you get.

inanda

we haven't had the same weather 2 yrs. running in about 5 yrs. but if i had to say we do get into the 20's. usually it's only for a day or two at a time. occ. it may last a week. lots of times though it might be in the 30-40's in the daytime with 32 or below at night. but like now...........in the 60-80's with nighttime temps in the 40-50's. temps are supposed to drop this weekend. who can say?

yeah i wasn't really worried about our cold. it's the heat i am worried about.

I grow martagon lilies no problem here in the north of England. As long as they get some shade they are really worth a try.

does no one grow martagon lilies in the states, esp. the south?

I had them, but they didn't like me.... Maybe they will reappear some day....

In his book, Eugene Fox writes:

thank you leftwood. i guess that is why i have never seen a martagon here. lol. do you know about the ones called pardalinum, splendens, citronella or black beauty?

Citronella is a vigorous species or hybrid. (It depends on who you talk too.) I would think that it would do fine.
Black Beauty should do fine, but if you have alkaline soil, I don't think it will like it.
Pardalinum, probably OK - just gussing though.
Splendens - um, not a species and I can't place what your actually talking about. Pard or Wallaby will probably know.

the splendens is a tiger of some kind. i do have alkaline soil. what will happen to the black beauty in alkaline soil?

Citronella is a hybrid. Period. Vendors who call it something else (like a species) are wrong. See Lily Register.

Pardalinum grows all the way down to southern California in woodsy areas along streams. So water it in the summer if it gets too dry. We have no summer rain here in Oregon so I water these about once a week.

Splendens? Probably L. tigrinum splendens aka tiger lily.

I think these will do OK for you. Let us know and especially after they come back (hopefully) next year-- It is good to be able to let others know how they grow in your area.

Black Beauty has been vigorous in my zone 5 alkaline soil, for 4 years now, going on 5.

BTW: All the tiger lilies were re-classified awhile back and are now considered L lancifolium var (insert name).

i am happy to know black beauty will grow in alkaline soil.

also, i just bought some "tiger lilies" from home depot or walmart. the picture on the front doesn't look like the petals are recurved like pictures of lancifolium that i have seen. is there some other kind of spotted lily? they were labelled only as pink tiger lily and orange tiger lily. and i know that some asiatics and some of the other hybrid lililes have spots. i don't know that much at all about lilies. had no idea there were so many different kinds. please keep any information coming about any of the varieties. thanks.

Actually, I don't want to suggest that these will do well in alkaline soil. To be on the safe side you should prepare your bed well with amendments worked in, including peat to bring the pH down (peat is acidic in nature).

Re-reading your first post, May is pretty late to get lilies and they probably will be sprouted. Be careful not to break off sprouts and get them planted right away when they arrive.

Vendors have a habit of calling all tiger lily hybrids tiger lilies. The "pink" tiger lily is nice, I grew it for a few years. These hybrids don't have the same flower form as the specie (orange tiger).

if you break off the sprouts does that mean they prob. won't have time to send up shoots again for the year and you won't get anything even coming up till next year? and if you add peat to bring the ph down this year do i just add peat on top of the soil from then on out to keep it down? and do you just throw a few handfuls in the planting hole? or does it need to be tilled into a bed? asiatics seem to grow here without peat. so you are just talking about the tiger lilies or just black beauty specificaly?

and after i got in these co-ops i started reading on lilies and i had already decided that spring was not the time for me to be planting these. hope to get in a fall bulb co-op. thanks.

Yes, broken sprouts mean no stem for this year.

Seems to me that if your Asiatics are doing ok these others should be ok except with the possible exception of the orientals. If you do add peat you should mix/till it in well, don't just put a gob in the planting hole:) Fortunately I don't need to deal with pH problems, which is probably why there are so many bulb farms around here!

Magnolia-- it is good to know that your lilies are doing good in alkaline conditions. Are you amending with anything that lowers pH? I think even compost will lower pH, or so I have read. I really prefer to hear from people who have grown in different soil conditions because as they say... the proof is in the pudding (now where did that saying come from?)

When I add peat, I mix it in thoroughly with the soil. My soil pH is 7.5. Peat also makes soil retain more water., which I wasn't aware of , specifically, until I spoke with an iris grower about soil conditions last summer.

Pard, I have to work very hard to ammend my soil. Orientals seem to do fine here. I use composted cow manure and coffee grounds the most. Never claim to be a soil expert, but the iris guy in Oregon recommended gypsum for my soil and said that by the sounds of it, peat was not what he would use, at least for my iris bed.
My soil is classified in a soil test to be silt loam (gardens) and sandy loam (where my rapsberries are). I think part of what I do, is trial and tribulation. I do know that I work with a higher pH and would do just about anything to grow blueberries. But even replacing a 5 by 5 foot area of soil with 5.5 pH soil, I have only had 3 blueberries total.
Sometimes I wonder if micronutrients have something to do, also, with where lilies grow well. Soil is one of those things about gardening, that particularly intrigues me.

No, I wouldn't use peat for irises either. Gypsum is used on the iris fields here prior to planting. I think they rotate fields every 2 years. It's really nice when when they use the fields along the freeway. Makes it hard to keep eyes on the road during bloom season...

The need for micronutrients is a good reason to engage in composting, thus returning micronutrients to the soil.

I must be just stupid today . . . Magnolia, are you saying your Black Beauty is growing in alkaline soil, or alkaline soil that you modified?

One of the best known Minnesota hybridizers, Julius Wadekamper, grew his orientals in pH 5.5. I am not about to question his success, but my Black Beauty (oriental x henryi) doesn't grow in that strongly acidic soil. Perhaps low pH becomes more important in colder zones.

LOL Magnolia, I hope you mean 3 blueberry plants and not 3 blueberry berries! Can't hurt to give them some epsom salt in a water solution to help with the micronutrients if that is a problem. Most years I top dress my blueberries with amonnium sulphate, and they always have an oak leaf mulch.

Compost is a most excellent buffer, and by that alone it can lower a high pH. Depending on what it is made of it usually ranges between pH 6.5-6.8.

Oh Lefty, I am showing my failure side to you all here, aren't I? I had 8 blueberry plants and after 4 years, just 3 berries total. So much for going into blueberry production, huh? Have done sulfer, aluminum sulfate, you name it, maybe ignoring my failure is the answer. They do have beautiful fall color. LOL!
Okay, I have ammended my soil, but it remains very alkaline, at least it was 2 years ago with my last soil test. I think the test showed 7.8 and my home mixer deal (test) it to be 7.4 now. I keep working with it. I think my soil is good soil, just very high in pH.
Guys, stay with me, I have a brain that thinks much faster (and clearer) than I type ;0)
I'm all for composting. Will try the epsom for my blueberries too, thanks for the tip.

well after listening to you guys and some other people i think i jumped in and bought a bunch of things that i can't grow again. but i am not giving up. i will try to plant these lilies with peat added. also will add several inches of mulch and that's all i can do. except for trying to find some shade. now i will plant with peat when i plant but to add peat next year can you just toss it on top of the soil/mulch or do i have to work it into the soil?

Don't dispair! Take a look here http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/607475/ Steve grows bunches of lilies and he's only 1/2 a zone cooler than you. Maybe you could d-mail him for advice?

thanks moby cause i was in the despair boat. i have talked with steve some and he said i could prob. grow all but the orientals. he does have a few of them but he says they get smaller and smaller every year and blooms are few. so maybe i can just get rid of all my orientals and be o.k. thanks to everyone.

Mamajack, there is nothing like experience. Just like we try to grow things that aren't supposed to grow this far north, you are doing the same thing, only perhaps past the southern boundary. Good luck!

Oh yes, Magnolia, soil sulfur is another good acidifier. Aluminum sulfate, not so good because the AL can build up in the soil and become toxic. If pH is your problem, then you should be seeing discolored foliage. Yellowy leaves with darker green veins. In bad cases, the leaf margins or interveinal parts of the leaves dry up and turn brown. This is all caused by lack of certain micronutrients, which is caused by a pH that is too high for the plant. Even though these micronutrients may be in the soil in abundance, if the pH is too high, and the plant can't extract them.

Another thought occurred to me. Are you growing northern type blueberries, and are they cold hardy enough? Any Minnesota bred cultivars are good: Northblue, Northsky, Chippewa, Norht Country, St. Cloud, and there are more. Most all Michigan (highbush) blueberries should be hardy for you. But the most cold hardy would include Northland, Elliot, Patriot, and I am sure some others too.

THANK you leftwood. i have been doing some big time pouting about these lilies. i am going to try them all but i think i will trade my orientals. i didn't get a lot of them but just wanted to try. i got one miss lucy though and i think i will put it in a pot. will she grow and multiply in a pot? and do i just use regular potting soil?

Mamajack, I recommend MG potting soil. Orientals don't multiple as quickly as Asiatics. When I purchase bulbs, I try to keep that in mind and usually always purchase at least 3 oriental bulbs to have a good showing. What orientals do you plan to trade?

i am not sure of all of the varieties and i have already traded some but i know there was muscadet, tom pouce, paramount, stargazer, gold band and pep talk. also, i prob. will have 1-2 black beauty. but i do have 2 trades to satisfy first. i had extra asiatics coral sunrise, tropical dream and marquee. also, a few orienpets but i plan to try to grow all but the orientals.

and on the miracle grow..........do you repot the lilies several times a year? i am thinking if i repot with the MG that i won't need to fertilize the lilies. will they go dormant in a pot in the house in winter? or can i just leave the pot outside?

Do you get any freezes? I would think you could leave them in the pot in an unheated garage and they'd be OK. You wouldn't want the pots to freeze. I believe that MG says the fertilizer lasts for three months. You could supplement with a good basic fertilizer after they finish blooming. I would replace at least the top third of soil annually. The bulbs are pretty resilient. If it were me, I'd just tip them all out and repot in fresh potting mix.

Lily bulbs never go dormant. If you can't naturally provide the required cold period, you can keep them in your fridge packed in peat (MG will work) in a baggie.

well we get freezes but they don't last a long time. maybe 2-3 days or overnight, occ. for a week. and then it gets warm again. and then it repeats the process. that's the way it's been for the last 4-5 yrs anyway. so i am beginning to see............if i want this lily to bloom i am going to have to dig it up and put it in the fridge for a few months, right?

Magnolialover, maybe you have the wrong variety of blueberry. We have very alkaline soil, but used a lot of sulfur when we planted ours (it's a Sunshine Blue Blueberry) and lots of compost, Texas green sand and I don't know what else. I can look in my journal and find out if you want. It's 2 years old this spring and has probably 3 dozen or so berries. We bought that variety because it doesn't need as many cold hours as the others.

Well, I sure get the cold hours here ;) I have most of the berries that Lefty mentioned, North Country being my favorite. When I asked about them a couple years ago in MG class, they basically said not to bother in the soil so alkaline. I have to keep trying.

there is supposed to be a blueberry farm in athens here in texas. i didn't believe that at first because of our alkaline soil. although the soil there may be more acidic as they have lots of trees . wonder what he grows?

mamajack, you could grow your Orientals this summer in pots, enjoy the blooms and fragrance on a porch with some shade, then trade them off in the fall. Then at least you can get some enjoyment out of them.

I have heard of a blueberry farm in Tx, I think it was somewhere around Bastrop, but I 'm not sure. Malcolm Beck was telling DH and I about it. He is the guy that started Gardenville in SA. He doesn't still own it and I'm not sure he still lives in SA. But he would be one of the best people to talk to about that. I think he was advising the guy that own that blueberry farm.

i will keep a few of the orientals in pots. thanks for all of the advice and information.