Tsuga canadensis vs Tsuga caroliniana

Is there an easy way to tell these apart? Is one or the other a superior yard tree for the Midwest? What about Tsuga diversifolia? Anybody having fun growing that one in the Midwest?

Scott

I know I have seen diversifolia at a couple of nurseries here in the Chicago area. Rich's Foxwillow Pines carries/grows it and doesn't list any disclaimers in their printed catalog at least. No firsthand experience though.

Willis

Tsuga canadensis has (bluntly) pointed needles, T. caroliniana has notched tips to the needles (but so does T. diversifolia).

Otherwise, by cones:
http://www.pinetum.org/cones/TScones.htm

Resin

canadensis a major source of preferred deer browse here; grows well, but no regrowth due to over 50 bambis per square mile.

Well on your way to that magically destructive 100-125/square mile. For a reference for those without a deer problem, 7-15 per forested square mile would be a normal level. The most I counted in my backyard at one time at my old house was 16, and it wasn't forested, and the backyard was a half acre. The local forest preserve board told me there was no problem, and it wasn't overpopulated. Now, amazingly, three years later, they are finally talking about hiring sharpshooters. Imagine that.

Hi Scott,
I have had T. diversifolia in my garden for the last 5 or 6 years without any damage at all. I have never protected this plant from the winter sun and the plant has never winter burned. I actually purchased the T. diversifolia from a nursery in Duluth, MN. I have seen this plant listed as a zone 5 plant, but I would have to say that this plant is easily a zone 4 plant.
Mike

There is a T. diversifolia at Dawes that I dearly love. I have seen no other specimen around here however, so it leaves me wondering. I'll have to special order it, if I do.

Scott

Oops, lost my picture when I added text. Here is the T. diversifolia at Dawes.

Scott

Branching looks as if it would not adapt/shed heavy snow loads as well as T. canadensis. Ken

It's tough, though - the areas where it comes from in Japan get seriously heavy snow in the winter

Like this:
http://files.myopera.com/Mathilda/albums/71783/snow_in_japan_6.jpg
http://files.myopera.com/Mathilda/albums/71783/snow_in_japan_7.jpg
http://files.myopera.com/Mathilda/albums/71783/snow_in_japan_5.jpg

Resin

Looks like it really wants to get out from underneath those oaks.

Seems like I have seen T canadensis that was fairly horizontal too. I also would wonder if the habit is not just as affected by the local context as it is by genetic difference.

Though, of course, I have never seen T. diversifolia, so what the he** do I know?

While we are talking hemlocks (my favorite conifer BTW, and fortunately the ones I have planted in my woods are thriving and unbrowsed by deer, except one G.D. buck who selectively rubs his velvet off on young hemlocks), what is the status of the wooly adelgid in the upper midwest? I know that in MI, some infested plants were found near Harbor Springs in the lower peninsula (where the native plant populations are abundant) in some apparent landscape specimens brought in from out of state. So in Michigan there is a strict quarantine on most plants brought in (not sure if it is all out-of-state plants or just those from the east coast).

What is the status of the pest in OH, KY, WI, MN, IL (boy that seems to cover a lot of forum members here, where there is a strong midwestern presence...)?

My T. diversifolia is also growing in full sun rather than in part sun. Edelweiss Nursery, in Duluth, has a T. diversifolia growing in a somewhat shaded spot and it looks almost identical to the plant growing at the Dawes Arb.
Mike

Hi David,

There's maps here:
http://www.na.fs.fed.us/fhp/hwa/distribution_maps.shtm

Resin