carpinus kawakamii

Finally took some pictures of this for Kevin. I bought it from Arborvillage last spring, and just got it planted maybe a month ago. A little early to say much about it, but it does look a lot like Carpinus japonica in foliage and form.

Scott

Here's a shot of the foliage.

Scott

Cool! Hardy to Zone 5? Did you hear that Arborvillage is calling it quits?

NO! Not them too!!! When? Can I still place orders with them?

Scott

I sure hope you are kidding about ArborVillage calling it quits, Kevin!?!

I saw it in the Plant Delights catalog that just came. I called Lanny, and left a message--no callback yet.

I apologize if I lead this thread astray, but since its likely all the Carpinophiles will be checking in, I was hoping to get opinions on some of the more common Asian Hornbeams? I've got a chance to pick up C. japonica next week, and from what info I've been able to gather it is regarded as one of the most ornamental of the bunch. Of course, opinions vary, with Dirr commenting "literature has been kinder to the species than reality of its performance warrants." As is always the case for me, cold hardiness has to be considered and I've seen it listed as z4/5, which is certainly worth taking a chance on. Any thoughts on this one, or there others I should be focusing on?

Bob

I haven't seen a full-grown Japanese hornbeam, so I cannot comment on form; however, I do have several of the Asian hornbeams, and out of a group of plants notable for exceptionally fresh, clean, richly colored, and attractive foliage, this one is the best. It always gets comments.

Apparantly this tree/shrub grows quite wide. I am looking forward to watching mine grow. As for zone 4 hardy, wow, I dunno. I'd be interested to know if they are.

Scott

This message was edited Aug 25, 2006 8:58 PM

Another Carpinus japonica pic.

No survival for me here Maack. I'm convinced Carpinus are rotten for Fall planting, and they may be part of it, but I have tried 2 or 3 C. japonica here with no luck.

I still can't believe how large this Carpinus fangiana is but don't know much about it.

Growin,

If you are able to collect seed from that, I'd love to give it a try!

Scott

Multiple attempts with no success...that doesn't bode well for me. Any success with coreana, laxiflora, or tschonoskii?

Yes, Death(though once again a fall transplant of large specimen--worth another try), Yes

Also C. cordata grows very well, C. fargesii is staying alive, but perhaps marginally hardy, C. polyneura completely NOT hardy, C. schuschuensis is fine, C. orientalis fine.

Also, about C. japonica--Beaver Creek sells large specimens, and I assume they grow them in their fields on the WI/IL border. So, it may be hardy, and my timing has just been wrong. Plant in Spring? I am convincing myself to try again.

Agreed--you must try again. Anything else would be cutting and running.

Kneevin's research assistants are deer?

Maackia, I'm growing C. laxiflora, tschonoskii, and coreana. C. coreana is a neat tree. Very small foliage, neat, clean. I like it a lot. C. tschonoskii and C. laxiflora are first year plants for me, so I don't know much about them yet. A maybe 10 year old C. laxiflora is growing at Spring Grove, probably has been down to -15F, maybe -20F during that time.

I have one small seed grown C. turkzaninovii barely hanging on. I hope I don't lose it, but it is not happy. Maybe it needs to get in the ground.

I still have a handful of seed grown C. henryana, which grows very well here. I believe it is supposed to get a little bit bigger eventually than the others discussed here. Kevin, how's your looking? Guy? Evil?

Finally a good thread on Carpinus!!! My life is complete.

Scott

Oh I forgot about killing C. turczaninovii over winter, but my C. tschonoskii is doing great after many winters and many transplantings. C. betulis has no hardiness issues, and the fastigiate one I have is thriving with neglect. Of course, C. caroliniana is doing fantastic, and the blazing red fall color is quite the bonus.

Scott--you gave me two C. henryana. I planted one in shade and one in sun. The one in sun is by a couple V. plicatum tomentosums, so it gets loads of water, but has barely grown. The one in shade gets nothing, and loves it! It has grown quite a bit. We shall see how winter treats them(I had one of these die years ago over a brutal winter).

Scott, mine look fine but haven't grown much yet. I think they're still too busy celebrating their escape from the O-HI to freedom in beautiful Illinois!

We have several of the other species mentioned, and haven't managed to kill any of them yet. Have not attempted C. polyneura, C. schuschuensis, or C. laxiflora, and never even heard of C. fangiana surviving antwhere in the Midwest. The C. fargesiana is very attractive when showing new spring growth. Our C. coreana was doing great until some dang unknown bark borer spiraled its way around the upper trunk this year, and I don't know yet if the top half of the tree will be able to overcome that.

Guy S.

I'll be surprised if it is hardy long-term in zone 6, considering where it comes from:
http://www.efloras.org/florataxon.aspx?flora_id=2&taxon_id=200006180
Note the wording 'subtropical'

Resin

Do they all have the smooth, muscled bark characteristic of our native Blue Beech?

Resin, That is very peculiar! Mine came from Arborvillage, which is in Missouri. I wonder if they've got it mislabeled. Or, the link said it grows to 2,000 meters altitude, which even in subtropical regions could translate to what? Zone 7? Zone 6 perhaps? It seems to me that other Taiwan natives of high altitude can be grown here, although I cannot remember an example at the moment.

Maackia, No, they all have got very different bark. So far, I know of no Asian species with the sinuous bark of our native, which, of course, is unfortunate. I need to get back up to Dawes Arboretum. They have a decent collection of these hornbeams. Although they are all young, they are still 3-5 years older than mine.

Scott

Hi Scott,

I'd not rely on it - Arborvillage may well have been growing it in a polytunnel with frost protection. You have to get really high in Taiwan to get even zone 8; Abies kawakamii and Picea morrisonicola are both zone 8, and grow at 2400-3800m (they can be grown in the warmer parts of Britain, but not in e.g. zone 7 Denmark). At 2000m, it's probably zone 9. The mainland (Fujian) origins should be hardier, but probably not more than one zone hardier.

Resin

Maack:

Bark can actually get flaky on some, like this Carpinus cordata

Still the best foliage for me comes from Carpinus fargesii