Started digging today!

Have almost all the sod off the main pond which so far measures 29'L by 15'W at one end and 10'W at the other, it will be somewhere between 24-30" deep. Basically egg shaped though I plan on making the shape more random looking with large rock/boulders. Then there will be a plant pond 12"D and about 12-15' in diameter though not sure of exact size yet. There will also be a bog at the overflow end of the pond which will not recirculate back into the pond. Didn't measure the size of the bog yet but have the grass marked for the shape and location. Still trying to decide what to do about plumbing. Already have a 3900 GPH pump.
I used the shovel to cut chunks of sod and my Mom shoveled into the wheelbarrow and emptied it. I can't do any lifting of the dirt because of back problems. Hopefully hubby can do a lot of digging this weekend. Here's a pic of the outline after getting the first row of sod off.

Here's a pic of Mom in her lovely gardening clothes...she would be thrilled to know I posted this online :~D

The bog area you described sounds like what we saw this weekend. The pond had stone border, but on the back side, the pond liner extended about 5' beyond the border at a depth of about 10 inches. The area beyond the border was filled with gravel, no dirt. Bog plants were placed in the gravel. Water infiltrated into the gravel to feed the bog, but you didn't see any standing water... does that make sense? What exactly are the plumbing issues you are considering? I started a thread for our pond design also... http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/508874/ take a look if you like, we are still planning and not ready to break ground yet. We do have a small pond already which will feed the stream and lower pond.
Keep us posted, looks like a fantastic undertaking... Tom

After day 2 of digging have all the sod off and starting into the next depth. Ran into a drain pipe that shouldn't have been there so just doing 15" in that area then dropping down to 24". in the rest of the pond. Hoping to get some more muscle in here tomorrow. Hubby and my brother can do some digging :~)
Lana

Oh Right ON! Another start to finish pond thread! I'm bookmarking this so I can watch the whole thing develop.
I got my bog finished today, finally. It sounds like what you saw and described, Tom. Water feeds into it from the waterfall area and goes into the bottom of the bog. Then filters up through the gravel. Plants are in the gravel and there is almost no standing water at all. Water spills into the pond from the bog.

I do think you DH needs to get busy helping with all that digging! I rented teenage boys to do mine.

Pixy... your bog is different from what we saw. There was no water circulating through this bog. The water filtered in through the gravel, but the only way for the water to leave was evaporation. It gave the pond a very natural appearance. It was much like a river bank that was overgrown with plants to the point that you couldn't really get to the water's edge. Three fourths of the pond was bordered with this bog, the rest was bordered with a patio like area of flagstone, right to the water's edge, sort of like a viewing area.
Daisy.... from the pictures, it looks as if your soil is rather loose. If so, have you considered measures to keep the border from caving into your pond? I think Pixie can tell you about that problem from firsthand experience. Post some more pics from this weekend's progress... looking forward to it... Tom

My Mom and I were actually talking this morning about how perfect this dirt is for pond making. It is mostly clay though in places is a little sandy but still very firm. There are no rocks or roots at all and the dirt stays in the shape you cut it as you shovel. We're not even going to put a protective liner under the liner because you hit bedrock at 6' so we don't have to worry about small rocks working up against the liner. I've already had the camera out and will post pics this evening if I don't collapse first :~) This was my Mom's b-day present to me this year. We already had the liner and she had a pump she got on clearance a couple years ago and she's providing a lot of the labor and stone for the edging and plants of course once it's finished. She and I built her pond 10 years ago, the year I got married. We had the ceremony in her garden and my fav wedding pic is by the pond. When my hubby got home from work the other night and saw what we had dug I'll never forget the look on his face, LOL, he said I've fished ponds smaller than this! :~) Yes, DH is definately going to do some digging today!
Lana

Well, good and bad news today. We got the pond mostly dug except for digging the ditch for the bottom drain and finishing digging the shelves to depth but we finally got the liner out which we've had for several years and it's not wide enough, about 3' short. My Mom decided to do this last minute since we were getting some cooler weather so we didn't have time/manpower to drag out the liner to check the exact size it took my DH, Mom, and brother to move it. Sooooo, now we have to cut some off the length to glue to the side to get the width. Thank goodness we have plenty of length, it's over 40' long!

Has anyone had experience with putting a seam in EPDM? I've been looking online and what I've found is a 2-sided tape and adhesive primer. Fish safe? Any ideas? Thanks.

Here's a pic of Mom digging this morning.

And here is the liner sitting in the pond, you can see it needs to go to the grass on the left and to the top of the berm on the right. The berm was put there to level the pond because the yard slopes.

Here is a link to one thread about seaming two liners together...
http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/518157/
I hope this helps... Tom

Thanks Tom.

Looking good! I know that regarding putting two pieces of liner together, there was a recent thread where the husband taped the liner, then didn't wait the required 24 hours cure time before filling the pond and the liner leaked. I pieced some liner together for the stream bed and used the double sided tape at Home Depot. As long as the liner was clean and dry the tape worked well. After I taped it, I used silicone along the seam as well, just to be sure. It seems to be holding fine.

Tom's right about reinforcing the sides, although my soil is extremely different than yours. I ended up using cement to reinforce the sides because they were going to crumble if anyone stood on them. You may not have the same problem.

The pond folks here say taping a liner in a stream works ok.... must be something about the water pressures of the bottom of a pond that doesn't work as well. If daisy is only going to seam that shallow side it might work well... but let the tape cure like the directions say!!!
Daisy... question... is the center of the pond in that last pic 2' deep or more? Just curious... it doesn't look that deep.... Tom

It doesn't look as deep because the liner is short and not reaching the side of the pond just the shelf. Also, where we had to build the berm on the right side of the pond it makes it look more shallow. I am going to have DH double check it though. It's supposed to be 24" in the center and have a 30" sink at the far end where the bottom drain will be.
Lana

Watch out when you seam the liner. My husband was the offender, and even patching it has not worked. When we've saved some more money we're replacing the liner with one big piece. I've been told that the seam tape alone does not work, and you should get some epoxy stuff to go around the seam.

http://www.ponddoc.com/Store/Hardware/RepairMaterials.html

Pond doc has a lot of info, and unfortunately I didn't read it before seaming our liners together.

It looks like you seam will be much higher up than ours is: ours is pretty much at the lowest point of the pond. Like you we got a little exciting in the digging process, and over shot the liner we bought a few years back. Good luck!

Here's a pic of the pond completely dug with the bottom drain in place. This doesn't show the true size of the pond because the sides you see well in the pic is actually the plant shelf which is about 10.5" deep. We seamed the liner today with stuff from a roofing supply place. This evening we'll pull the liner into place and attach the bottom drain. Then we'll put a little water in to make sure the drain doesn't leak then we can start filling. We'll have to haul water because we have a cistern so we'll be able to determine the exact water capacity of the pond. We won't fill up past the seam today but since it's close to the top of the pond we'll be able to get quite a bit of water in it, barring problems, then finish filling tomorrow. I found a couple of big Golden Orps at the local fish store. Someone had brought some in from their pond to sell and the owner is saving the last 2 for me...they are over 12"!
Lana

Here's a pic of the monster 3" ball valve on the bottom drain. We had to get it at a commercial pipe supply place because of the size. It's really hard to turn too. The valve is about 25' from the pond with a big down-hill grade. I'll have to watch when I clean the pond because this will suck it dry FAST!

Here's a pic of the pond from the porch.

You have my sympathy on turning that ball valve! I have the same one, and it's really a monster!

Here's a pic this morning after the first 300 gal. It set in the pond overnight so the bottom drain is not leaking and so far so good on the liner. We won't put water over the seam we glued yesterday until later today to give it plenty of time to cure. There won't be much water over it. You should have seen our 5 yr old nephews when DH dumped the first load of water in there. They had a blast playing with the drain hose from the water truck and using the pond like a wading pool. They were hilarious :~D We couldn't tell anything about leaking until this morning because they had every bit of the liner wet right before dark so we couldn't tell if the level was decreasing.

Here's the pond with 1800 gallons of water. It needs at least 600 more gallons in it but have found a couple of nail holes at the upper part of the liner at the far end that need patched first. Have plants and 6 3-4" Koi from my Mom's pond in it, 1 14" Golden Orf(named Goldie) from the pet store is in already. Have 27 more Koi sizes ranging 3-8" in tubs on the porch going through quarantine before going in the pond. Desperately needing shade at this point and the lilies aren't producing pads fast enough. Will look for some Hyacinth to help shade, I have a few pieces but not enough to help this size pond until they multiply quite a bit. Have 2 pumps churning water until the plant pond and waterfall is built.

Going to have to trap some raccoons, have already seen paw prints on the liner and chased one off the back porch last night. Hubby will borrow some live traps from co-workers, one co-worker trains coon dogs so he'll take the coons for training purposes. It's either that or hubby spends the night out by the pond with his rifle :~)

Lana

Lana,
I have enjoyed watching your progress and it looks like the end result is going to be just gorgeous!! (It IS gorgeous). You should all be so proud to have built that honey by yourselves. One of these days I hope to have room for one. :-)
Terrie

My first lily bloom! If you look on the ledge on the left side of the pic you can see coon tracks in the algae on the liner. Going to buy a live trap today. Hope to get a lot of work done on the pond this weekend.
Lana

I took this pic yesterday evening while we had a nice rain falling...FINALLY! The fountain is temporary, I don't think I want it running all the time but it makes less noise than churning the surface. Note the left side of the pond in the front are 2 hostas and an astilbe sitting on the pond ledge in water, they've been there almost a week in full sun and look great.
Lana

That's going to be a great pond! Hope you can rein in those racoons.

Found a local coonhunter who wanted the coon to train dogs with so he brought a trap up yesterday evening and I set it with some bread and peanut butter. This morning there was a coon! I think there is another one too(bigger paw prints in the pond) so will set the trap again tonight after the coonhunter picks this one up. I took a pic, see below. We put it in the shade and fed it an apple so it wouldn't get hot and thirsty.

Hubby and I worked on the pond today building up the sides where needed and patching the holes so we should be able to fill it tomorrow...I hope :~)
Lana

A comment on the three inch ball valve. Have the same on my pond except it only has half the handle to one side. Hard to shut off and will leak later on. Need a pipe wrench to close it now to not leak. So I worked as an RV tech and knew how to solve it. Glued a holding tank drain cap on to the end of the drain pipe. Twist lock and its secure.
Then I wondered if a three inch holding tank drain valve would work. Too late to try one now but they are really easy to open and close. Food for thought everyone. I know they work good on 200 gal
RV tanks.

Thanks for the info on that valve! Mine's a killer!
Lana, that's a great looking coon you have there! HOpe he gets away from the dogs. I haven't seen any racoons around here lately (knock on wood), but I think it's because my dogs always try to herd them! We have many very old douglas firs on the property and until this year we could count on them coming into the garage and trying to get the cat food. They were nice and fat! I don't know where they went to, but I can only think they got tired of my dogs! I kind of miss them because I really like racoons, in spite of their smart ways! But since I have the pond, I prefer them gone. Now that I've said that, they'll probably be back.!

Hi Lana :)

I have been popping in and out reading. I am really impressed! You have done such a wonderful job! If you need a few lettuce and hyacinth or water celery or...., E me.

Those racoons are so darned cute! It's a shame they are also such a pain in the rear when it comes to fish and water gardens. If we forget the garbage on the porch, we get to clean up one heck of a mess! Between the racoons, opossum and outdoor cats, my yard is quite an adventure in the evening. LOL

Thanks folk for all the great comments/advice! The raccoon was a female so I'm sure there are more around but we haven't gotten any more in the trap yet. The guy won't run the coon with the dogs he'll just drag the cage with the coon in it to make a scent trail then hang the cage in a tree for the dogs to tree on. That's how he trains young dogs. The coon will get upset but no violence involved. Hubby and I stood by the cage admiring it for a long time but pretty as they are I don't want them in my pond :~) I've run opposums off the porch too Badseed :~) I started feeding the cats early so all the food would be eaten before dark. I'll E you. Here's a pic I took yesterday evening with hubby in the pond. It has 2300 gallons in this pic and we'll have to do a little more back filling and bring it up another couple inches and it will be at capacity. Then we need to get the plant pond built :~) The foam is caused by Melafix I just put in.

Lana

Lana, you sure you aren't building a swimming hole? LOL Looks like you have the weather for it, lucky you! This pond will be awesome and I can't believe how fast you've done it!
Hey, thanks for explaining about how the coon guy will use the racoon. It's something I know absolutely nothing about. Racoons are so fun to watch .... as long as they're in someone else's yard!Or garage, or garbage can! Smart critters!

Another update; worked on the pond again today, got the sides built up to level and it's almost at capacity. Might take 300-600 gallons more but we won't fill it until we're done with everything so that will give us a little working room at the top of the liner. Was able to get some Hyacinth, Water Lettuce and Celery last week in the mail from a DG friend and then another friend who has a pond locally had me come and take lettuce out of their pond because they were throwing it away by the buckets full! I came home with 4 trash bags full, the pond is staying much cooler now. I made a floating basket type thing out of pipe insulation and bird netting to float some hyacinth in so the fish can't get the roots. There's so much floating lettuce and hyacinth in there now I don't think they'll do much damage to any one plant but it may come in handy later. I might use it for anacharis too to keep it out of the pump. I'll try to remember to describe how I made it later. Too tired tonight and fumble fingered :) Here's a pic. The floating basket is on the right hand side...see if you can pick it out LOL.

Lana

PS. CAN'T WAIT TO GET THE PLANT POND AND WATERFALL IN! That's the next priority along with getting the flat rock up here from Mom's to replace the brick holding the liner down and getting the neighbor and his bobcat to cart me some boulders off the side of our road and set them by the pond.

PSS. Took my first fall in the pond today but, thankfully, it was only plopping on my butt onto the deepest shelf. I was in the pond and had my bathing suit on so other than ouching the back a little, it was a cooling dip :~) I didn't even sit on any plants LOL. Hope all my future pond accidents are that gentle...yeah right!

It's looking great! The plants already look like they've been there forever!

Thanks!
The plants are thanks to Mom saving plants for 'my pond' for several years now just waiting for the pond to be built. Her small pond was quite overstuffed.

LOL Now that's a mom who knows her kid! And a mom who has faith in her kid, as well! Nice going, mom!

Just took this pic. Had a terrible storm come thru yesterday evening blowing leaf confetti and everything else in the pond but it's beautifully clear this morning. You can see the Golden Orf toward the front of the pic. All the others are hiding under the floaters in the back of the pond.
Lana

That's an orfe? Dayum, he's a biggy!

The Orfe is about 14" I think.

Nice looking fish! I can't find any of those around here.

Have been trying to get a good pic of the fishies but they just won't co-operate :( Here's the best I could get. Tomorrow...well, today actually DH and I are going to pick up block to make the plant pond so we can get the waterfall going. Then we'll have to do the bog but that's for another weekend.
Lana