how do you say ....... ******* ?

hi everyone

I know I did this one elsewhere in a past life as the 'plantaholic' but I thought it would be great to do it again.

how do you say, or want to know how to say, the name of a plant in your garden?

I say Clem-at-is but you might say Cle-matis.

Cory-dalis or Coryd-alis?

To-may-toe Toe-ma-toe Poe-tay-toe Poe-tah-toe call it what you want but don't forget to call me when it's time to eat em!

We say clem-AT-is, but we know we're pronouncing it wrong.

We also pronounce "marjoram" as "ma-SHJOR-um".

Dave

Is it luh-RI-o-pee or LEER-ee-o-pee? (liriope)

Well, I take the view that there's no-one around speaking Latin any more, so I can't be corrected by anyone who actually knows, and I say it roughly how I remember being taught at school, adapted as seems appropriate to me in any particular case. It's another one of those things where the experts disagree, so we can all please ourselves and agree to disagree. And I say cl'maytis.

HE he
I pronounce Clem-at-is, but at the end would add 'or Cle-matis.'

Well, here's a few more for us to ponder:

Bergenia: ber-GIN-ee-ah (soft g) or ber-JEEN-ee-ah (or something else entirely?)

Hydrangea: hy-DRAN-ja or hy-DRAIN-ja?

Fuschia: fyoo-shuh or fooks-ee-ah?

And yes, I say clem-AT-is, too.....even though I'm usually correcting my own pronunciation in my mind, but most of the folks I talk to would need a translation if I pronounced it CLEM-a-tis

Now Dave knows why I asked for a pronunciation field in the plants database. I truly believe one of the major reasons we have "common" names for plants is because nobody feels comfortable pronouncing most of the Latin names. My personal goal is to become more proficient in using the correct (Latin) names for my plants, both when writing about them, and when talking about them.

I'm constantly referring to my crepe myrtles as my "lagerstroemias", and I don't even know the common name of my Deutzia scabras. :)

I love walking through the gardens and saying "Ahhh, the papavers are doing great, and just look at those miribilis jalapas! My helianthuses are towering above the brassicas.". :-) Trish and I have really gotten used to using the latin names, and I'm not really sure why. I guess it's the best way to learn them - use them every single day and eventually it becomes second-hand nature.

Dave

latin names it really has to be because one common name can refer to a few plants e.g. black eyed susan can either be a Rudbeckia or a Thunbergia.

but dont let this thread digress to much.

Mark

I know this is meant to be a fun thread, (thanks, Mark for starting it).......

but on a (slightly) more serious note, here's a link to a Latin pronuncation guide for anyone who's striving to do better in this area (I've found it very helpful when I can't find a good pronunciation key): http://www.saltspring.com/capewest/pron.htm

Well when I was at school half asleep in the latin class we were taught that all letters in the latin alphabet were pronounced 'hard' ie many people pronounce impatiens, 'Impa-sh-ens', the correct term in Im-pat-e-ns. There is also a genus of fir trees which have some interesting varient pronuciations although I'll let your imagination tell you what that one is.

My particular problem is with another interesting name, Silybum, is it pronounced....Sil-ibum, Seli-bum or silly-bum?

(HMMMM...the only Latin word I definitely know how to pronounce is "Rex"...pronounced "Wrecks"...) (...and after a long day it is true!)

On the Clematis question, I happen to have my school Latin Dictionary handy, and in the Preface, it discusses exactly this - the pronunciation of Clematis. It says Clematis 'in modern speech has the first syllable short and the second long or short according to the fancy of the speaker, has in classical Latin the first syllable long and the second syllable short.'

How you pronounce Latin names must be a matter of opinion, depending on whether you go for classical or modern Latin, whether you've been taught any rules, whether you've picked up any correct or incorrect pronunciation from listening to others, how letters are pronounced in your local area, how you feel comfortable pronouncing it.

So long as we know which plant we're talking about, and spell the Latin name correctly, I reckon we can say it how we like.

CLEM a tis....

Fuschia: fyoo-shuh or fooks-ee-ah?

i say fooks-ee-ah because the man who discovered it was called Fuchs i believe...

Astilbe Ast-ilb or Ast-il-bee??

Clem-ah-tis

Lil

Mark,

Now look what you have started !! Cant remember who said the Americans and British were two Nations divided by a common language - but it sure sounds like it !!

El Tel

This message was edited Sunday, Jun 24th 4:19 AM

Eltel

I believe it was George Bernard Shaw but I may be wrong :)

Helichrysum - hell-ee-CHRISS-um (short i) or hell-ee-CHRYS-um (long i)?

This one is a somewhat serious question.... :)

The problem with pronunciation is that, even when you know the correct way to pronounce a word, you still end up reverting to the way you've been saying it for twenty years.

A friend of mine taught me a good trick to remember correct pronunciations: associate the word with another word, or with an embarrassing incident in which you mispronounced it.
I used to pronounce "adamant" as "a-DAM-ant", until a friend said, "No, Shelly, it's like Adam Ant - 'A-dam-ant'". Since this episode was both embarrassing AND incorporated word association, I have NEVER mispronounced "adamant" since.

Now let me see, is it Zed or is it Zee?

In Ohio, these are the pronunciations I hear. I fall in the second group on each.

UM-brella vs. um-BRELLa

IN-sure-nce vs. in-SURE-nce

EYE-tal-yun vs. Ih-tal-yun (it sure doesn't come from EYE-taly, does it?)

A friend of mine grew up in a farming community near here. One day, a local radio station had a substitute announcer on. She laughed as he kept referring to the price of "eewees" (ewes) and the "Fighting Illinny" (Ih-LION-eye).

;-) Kimberley

I remember watching a gardening programme on television many many years ago. Two gardeners were discussing clematis. One would pronounce it one way and the other one immediately carried on the discussion with a very firm pronunciation the other way. Niether would give an inch. It was hilarious to watch.

it had to Geoff Amos and his other half? the old guy and the younger one?

Mark

go_vols

<
This one is a somewhat serious question.... :)>>

i think its hell-ee-CHRYS-um (long i)

lil

Thanks, Lilith. I was (mis)pronouncing it with a short i, and I heard someone say it with a long i, and figured they were probably right, but wanted to verify. :) Now I just need to find some opportunities to practice saying it properly!

Everyone knows, clematis is pronounced clem EYE tis! (Don't they?)

you all or ya'll
;]

Mark it does sound like Geoff Amos...maybe it was with Peter Seabrook?

I thought it was Percy Thrower, but it could certainly be someone more recent. Predates Alan Titmarsh definitely and Geoff Hamilton too I'd say. Perhaps back into the 70s.