Mel,
I had some 4 o'clocks that I planted in pots and I moved them into my shed overwinter but died, so I thought. I started watering them about a month ago and it looks like the original plant is coming back.
I try to collect all the seeds from them so I am pretty sure it is the original plant. I am just thrilled. Here is a picture I took of them last summer.
They reseed like crazy!! Nice, big hard seeds. I only had them for the first time last year but I just recently read that they will come back from the roots in zone 8.
That looks like it! Mine actually died too, but thought I saw growth, started watering, and here it came. I will post a pix later after church, and maybe you can tell me what the other huge bulb looking thing is with a funny sprout out of the top! Thanks
mel
4 o'clock are perennials in zone 7 or warmer. They form large tubers which can be dug up and stored during the winter. So if your 4 o'clock looks dead give it time it will most likely come back.
BettyDee
OK, the one on the right is growing very well. Don't know what it is, but it is growing like a weed! I need to know where I should plant it. Both of these came from a plant swap in the fall.
The thing on the left... I thought was dead. I found this little bud last week, so I started watering more... I don't know what it is either, but it looks like it will be large!
Any help would be appreciated!
mel
Is that the secret to getting my things to grow? Just throw them in the garage and forget about them until they're almost dead? LOL My neighbor, who knows nothing about gardening and is just throwing seeds out left and right no matter what conditions they require, is having better success than me.
ROFL Your so funny konkreteblond. Maybe you ought to compare your thumb with your neighbors. See who has a greenest one. j/k It is amazing sometimes how we give our plants lots of TLC and try to give them just the right conditions and someone else does none of that and has great success. I have a neighbor just like yours. She spends very little time in her gardens and I am in mine almost every day and hers looks far better than mine. It seems she doesn't get near as many critters bothering her plants. My place is known as the 24 hour "Sonnia's Salad Bar" for critters. But I refuse to give up, maybe someday we will be able to proudly show off our gardens to our neighbor until then we will just have to sigh and keep trying--maybe start putting more in the garage for winter. LOL Hmm I think I need to get a bigger garage.
Hello Mel, my first impresion of the larger plant is that it looks like a sunflower, but you say they were both given to you last year, and sunflowers are annual, so that doesn't make sense, it looks velvety, so the next thing I can think of is Jimsom weed, Datura wrightii, but that doesn't make sense either, because Datura likes warm weather, unless you have had it in the garage next to a sunny window. The large tuber coud be Four O'clock but the indentation on the bulb seems different, and the bud is still to small to tell. That is the best I can do at this time.
Josephine.
It's not a sunflower. It has a strange bulb at the base. It IS velvety. Datura sounds right. Yes, it is and has been in an insulated garage, on a shelf in a sunny west window with slight southern exposure.
The second pot does have a worn old homemade label that says pink 4 oclock, but do not know what they do, or what to look for.
thanks for the input. In my research, I am thinking I need to get some 4 o'clocks, though! WOW.
mel
Mel, I have loads of Four O'clock seed of many different colors. I love them because of their beautiful scent, and they very easy to grow. I will bring some to the roundup.
Great! How much sun do they take? I have a bed full of Mexican Hats that I would love to take out, and they sound great for my native bed out front!
mel
They can take full sun or semi-shade, I will post some pictures tomorrow. Don't get rid of all your Mexican Hats, they are pretty too.
Oh. I bought one at Westons about 3-4 yrs ago. I have hundreds now, and have given away more than I can count! Want some? Believe me, there are plenty! I am just trying to keep them out of the grass, and control them a little.
mel
Mel, I do!
John
You are right Mel, I try to keep them under control too. It seems that every year there is one plant that dominates over all the others, I had what I called the Mexican Hat year, about four years ago.
I think this is going to be the Primrose year, so I am very excited, it should be gorgeous.
Josephine.
A picture of an emerging Four O'clock. These are root hardy to zone 7. the tops die down in the fall, but the plant comes back larger and stronger every year. They make big bulbous roots and can be left in the ground through the winter. They like hot weather and full sun to semi-shade. I forgot to say one of my books lists this plant as native to West Texas, Arizona,Colorado, Nevada, and Mexico, other books say it a naturalized plant from South America.
Picture taken 3-1-05
This message was edited Mar 14, 2005 1:54 PM
This is a bright glowing red that I just love. The flowers are supposed to open around four o'clock, but around here they normally open around six or six thirty, the reason is because what makes them open is the drop in temperature, not the lower light, so they open when it cools off which is on the late side around here. They stay open until about 10 the next morning and the scent is beautiful.
This is a varigated yellow and red that developed all by itself. I don't know what caused it, but I am very glad it did, because it is lovely. By the way, the hummingbird moths love to come and drink from these at night, and if go out with a flash light you can see them feeding, they are amazing.
I am getting so excited. I can't wait for some 4 o'clocks. I had no idea of their fragrance! I learn a new plant every day on here! I cannot imagine that I have not planted one up to now.
Me too!
These four o'clocks sound so nice, and they look beautifyl. I'd like to try them, but I'll ask around here to see if they so well in our area - I didn't see any zip code reports in the plant files. In the summer we often never get cool at night, so I don't know if they would actually open up.
I had no idea the 4 o'clocks spread by tubers. No wonder they were freely given away at the swaps. I should have a ton of them this year then.
Sunshine, sometimes I guess "ignorance is bliss"!! I tend to research things too thoroughly sometimes. I'm waiting to see if my neighbor's peonies live in her unimproved, full sun spot!! lol
Frostweed, I don't think you saw my question before the 4 o'clock topic...do you grow native Frogfruit or Cedar Sage?
lol konkreteblond--that should be something to see. By the way love your name.
Hello Konkreteblonde, I am sorry I missed your question. No I don't have either Frogfruit or Cedar sage, may be when I see you I can get some from you. Looking forward to meeting you at the Roundup ot at home.
Josephine.
No biggie, just was wondering. I do have both and do like them. I got the Frogfruit because it's a host plant for Buckeye butterflies and a few others. The Cedar sage didn't do much the first year but has reseeded some babies. I moved a few of them and they have a long taproot! I will have to pot up a tiny baby for you because once they get bigger I don't know if they will transplant.
Hello, This plant is the Texas Thistle ( Cirsium texanum ) beleive or not it is of the sunflower family. It is amazing how many plants belong to this family including asters and so many others. This plant can get 5 or 6 feet tall and at leat 4 feet wide, so it takes up some room.
It likes full sun. Normally it only lasts until June or July so it gives you a chance to plant something else in it's place for the rest of the season. This is a native, my book says that it is a biennial, but in my experience it has been an annual, although it does self seed, and I never have to plant seed.
Emerging plant, 3-2-05.
The painted lady butterflies eat the foliage of this plant, and it can be quite pretty when in bloom. I usually leave four or five plants on the slope and cut off the rest.
Many of us probably mistake it for a weed in its early stages, me thinks!
John
Here is a close up of the flower which is quite beautiful. Butterflies and moths love to drink out of all those little tubes, and the Goldfinches love to eat the seed,they also use the fluf from the seedhead to line their nests.
You are right John, but we really enjoy it, and even the kids find it interesting. If you don't have much room, one plant would suffice for the fun of it.
Here is a picture of another native blooming now, Mexican Plum, a lovely small tree.
John, I tried to bring some of the Texas Thistle home with me when I was in highschool. I saw it growing on the side of the country road on the way home from school one day. I thought it was gorgeous. My step father practically leapt out of the house frantically yelling at me not to dare bring that thing onto the property or I was dead meat. Well, not literally dead meat, but apparently it's poisonous to livestock and my parents raise cattle so they had a reason to hate it. It also takes over grazing land (remember *I* am not a cattle rancher and this is info I got from a cattle rancher....so if it's wrong, blame THAT cowboy, not me LOL). So I can understand why many Texans wouldn't like it. But I sure think it's pretty and if I ever lived in Oklahoma or Texas again, I'd let it grow in my garden without any complaints :-)
-Julie
I want it my garden too. Thistles have gotton a bad rap because they usually are seen as indicators of poorly managed pasture or rangeland. No rancher wants that tag! Btw, did you know that artichokes are a thistle, too? Yummy with mayo!
John
I have thistles in my yard. If one would grow in the right place I MIGHT keep it, but I don't know... I remember watching the BBC one day and seeing Penelope Hobhouse showing her beautiful Thistles. they must have been 4-6' tall! The flower is pretty, just not in my bermuda/johnson/clover covered yard!
Hello Julie, I became concerned because of what you said about your stepfather, so I have done some looking around on the web. The Texas thistle is called (cirsum texanum) and I haven't found anything about it being poisonous. However, I did find something about
(cirsum solanum) which is of the nightshade family which is quite poisonous. May be that was the one your stepfather was referring to. That is what I have found out so far.
Thank you for the warning though.
Mel, if you put some at the back of a flower bed it will do pretty for you, as a fun thing to grow.
Josephine
I will try.. but have you seen the taproot!? I'll look for a baby one!
thanks
Mayo on artichokes? Ick! ;-). I'll have mine with oil and vinegar thanks :-). The only thing I have against thistle are their pokey spiny Ouch! inducing leaves. But if planted towards the back of a bed, that needn't be a problem.....well, until it's time to cut them after they've died off, but that can be handled with a thick pair of gloves and pruning shears. :-)
Josephine, you're probably right about it being a different one. And ranchers probably take one look at any thistle and get their dander up LOL. Thanks for that clarification (and sorry to make you worry without reason).
Mel, yep, ya gotta get a baby one or you'll never pull that bugger out of the ground....or dig a proper hole to trasnplant it into either. But they grow so darned fast that a baby one should become a Mama one in no time :-)....and then all her seedlings will be popping out of the ground for you the following year.
-Julie
Here's a pic of one of our most common thistles here in Israel (now isn't it pretty mixed with all those yellow wildflowers? :-):
Nice photo, Julie! Bet that yellow one is a mustard and, is that a cultivated field in the background?
Yes Julie, they are very pretty. Is the yellow flower Yellow Mustard? I remember in Spain there were fields covered with yellow mustard and red poppies and it was gorgeous. I am from Spain, by the way, but I came to this country in 1961 and this is my country, I love the U.S.A.
but I do remember some nice things about Spain, and the flowers are one of them.
Josephine.
John and Josephine, the yellow flower is a Sinapsis..probably Sinapsis alba, but could be any of the various Sinapsis that are native to Israel. Mustard is from the Brassica genus. I can definitely see the resemblance in the flowers to this one for example http://davesgarden.com/pf/showimage/5042/ . Both Sinapsis and Brassica are from the Brassicaceae family.
Josephine, that's a long long time to be away from "home". Do you ever go back? If so, is it strange to you when you do? We also get red poppies, anemones, ranunculus and adonis flowers (all look like red poppies at a glance). And they grow in fields of all sorts of things. I agree, when they grow in a field of something yellow it's a beautiful site :-).
-Julie
John and Josephine....well, I did some more quick searching after I sent that last reply. Those flowers just looked too similar not to be more closely related. It seems that the botanical name Sinapsis is commonly known in Hebrew as "Hardal", which is the Hebrew word for mustard. Soooooo maybe Sinapsis is a syn. for Brassica....or maybe they really are separate. I'll have to check some more.
Oh, and John, sorry I forgot to answer your other question. Yes, it's a cultivated field immediately after the flowers...dunno what they are growing there though. Will probably be able to tell in a few weeks time. The area in the pic is in the foothills of the Jerusalem mountains about 5 minutes drive from my house.
-Julie
okay, back with an answer....nope, they are not the same Genus. However, in English, the common name for Sinapsis alba, Sinapsis nigra, and Sinapsis arvensis (and like others) are all commonly called Mustard (Brown mustard, Black mustard, etc). So yes, the flowers in the pic are mustard! Way to go both of you! :-)
This message was edited Mar 15, 2005 8:14 PM
