My Butterfly has been diagnosed with mites - broad mites in particular. I think I see signs of broad mites on other brugs and I've already sprayed with Avid, which I understand does not always work on broad mites. I have a whole list of insect remedies on hand, and only one, Garden Safe Fungicide 3, with miticide, which controls spider mites & ***other mite pests***, mentions any mite other than spider mites on their insect listing.
I'm in southeast Arky, zone 8a, and I would sincerely appreciate hearing from any and all of you that might have had this problem and the solutions that worked best for you. Off the top, I'm thinking maybe I should use a different product each time I spray. I would also like to know how I will know if the products are working, I have never seen a broad mite, so I don't know what to look for. I would expect that when I start to see new, unaffected growth, that it would mean something is working and, so far, that has not happened. TIA!!!
Mite question
this is your shrine deserving cool one telling you , Sherry, the only thing that has ever worked for me is Neem oil!
Kell is too smart, but she is right, Neem oil should do it.
I don't believe you can see broadmites, just the rust colored parts of your leaf where they have sucked the life out. I think, spray three times in 21 days to kill all eggs and mites. Sure hope it doesn't kill your plants, I have used it, also Avid and Sevin. The durned mites always seem to come most just when I have waited all summer to see blooms, then the buds keep dropping off.
Good luck!
Thanks, deserving goddess of all that is pink and, you too, Hibiscus, LOL!!! I'm going to order Neem oil today and use liquid Sevin today, and hope the Neem will arrive quickly. If I could find Neem at a health food store, would that work, or is the agricultural neem different??? You said a mouthful, Hi - I waited all summer for blooms, then the bud dropped off of my Isabella, only one bud and it bit the dust. I should have known those rust spots didn't show up by accident. Maybe I will be able to head it off. Thanks, so much to both of you. I will tell you that a local gardner, with spectacular gardens, told me she uses Malathion, which, she says, has always worked. If the Neems takes too long to get here, I'll use the Malathion next week...
DH has sprayed mine with fruit spray, anything like it that says on the label all kinds of mites, fleas, etc. If it kills fleas, then it's got to be good! Get Neem Oil at Walmart, Lowes, Andersons, any garden center. Lottsa luck!
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This message was edited Sep 20, 2004 6:13 PM
OMG LOL "deserving goddess" Oi wey! Did I miss the thread where it was diagnosed? What did it (the brug) look like?
I am glad someone has finally realized what a Goddess I am! LOL
We realized it a long time ago, just didn't want you to get the "big head".
Shelly, do you think Kell will still talk to us commoners now that she's acheived Goddess status?
Sherry, Neem is good. Just don't spray during the heat of the day.
Gosh Cala.. I dont know. I reckon one of us will have to wash her feet, and the other lay down rose petals at them to get her to notice us.
Thanks, Hibiscus!!! What gets me about these bleeping broad mites is that Avid says it's a miticide, but, apparently, doesn't work with broad mites. I used Avid immediately, and thought I was home free, but, instead, I think they spread. But how in the world would I know, since you cannot see broad mites. I don't know if they spread before or after I used Avid. I do think Butterfly is going to be okay, but, bless her heart, she looks like a spinach tree, instead of a brug and she's on the front row; however, she is so green and healthy appearing that my neighbor thought she was a beautiful new hybrid, whew!!! The best I could find on Google was to use a different miticide every 10 to 14 days. Is Volch Oil Spray anything like Neem Oil??? Thanks to the Goddess and provisional Goddesses - all Goddess positions are currently filled , but there's always plenty of space in the Diva division!!
Just so you know, the active ingredient in GardenSafe Fungicide 3 is neem oil, so you do not need to buy the neem oil separately if you have not already done so :-)
Sounds good to me Shelly!
Man, they grow them smart in Chicago, don't they!!! Imagine reading the ingredients, Ispahan, I'm most impressed!!! Thanks, Ispahan, Cala, et al...
Ok, Shelly. I've got plenty of rose petals, you can wash her feet!
Sherry.....I have been avoiding reading this thread because I didn't want to hear about yet another enemy to brugs. When I did though, it seems you said something about rust looking spots (?) I had a few leaves with rust looking spots the other day and just removed them. Is this a symptom of broad mites??? I HOPE not! What are the other symptoms? Sorry if you already said this above...I did not read carefully enough!
Thank you, Margie
Margie, I may have posted a photo of my Butterfly, which was beautiful, bloomed and all of a sudden, 'puckered up', started dropping leaves, etc. I cannot swear, but I think someone mentioned brown or rust spots too and some of mine have that also, so I figure I have a pretty good case of broad mites. I thought the puckered leaves was sun/water damage, which started after my sweet hubby tried to help me by watering, at HIGH, HOT NOON, if you please, whew. I should have known, and next time or next year, I'm just going to start spraying early in the season, on a schedule, like Edna, the check out lady at the grocery, told me to do in the first place. Course, there are lots of things I'll do next year.... Attached is a picture of poor Butterfly, who looks like someone traded her beautiful leaves for spinach...
Broad mites make the leaves deformed like that Sherry. Is the underside of the leaf brownish or bronze colored? That's another symptom of BM.
Avid used to be great for mites, but the more it gets used the more chance there is for insects to become resistant to it, but when you alternate your chemicals, you need to use the SAME chemical at least twice in a row, then if needed, use something else. Because Neem is an insect growth regulator as well as a smothering agent(because of the oil), there is much less chance things will become immune.
Thanks Cala!!! You are right, Avid didn't work, but I've never used it but twice and I paid a fortune for it. I will follow your instructions and use the same chemical twice in a row, and if I need something more, I'll use another one. After Ispahan told me about the Neem in the GardenSafe Fungicide 3, I checked my four bottles, and not one of them mentioned Neem. Finally, I went to the GardenSafe www site, and had to really search, but, yes, the Neem is in it. I cannot imagine why they don't put it on the bottle. Whatever, thanks, I hope I get them under control, but I don't think I'm there yet...
Neem might be listed as the active ingredient like this: Azadirachtin
You are so nice, Cala!!! Thanks you again...I'm off to the city to take my daddy to the doc, bye now...
Sherry, I just came across this thread. Did you succeed in getting rid of the BMs? How did you do it? Jeanette
Jnette, I did everything in the world to get rid of them, used everything that was suggested, no luck. As a last resort, and something I didn't think of until I had tried so many things, I called my local extension service. The director came to my place and told me that I didn't have broad mites or any other mites, but that I had a bumper crop of cats and slugs!! She said growing conditions seemed to be the problem (stess, watering at the wrong time, water on leafs when sun shining, etc.) and gave the appearance of broad mites. She also said it was possible that I had had them but there was no way she could make that determination without actually seeing signs and she did not. Unless you are certain it's broad mites, I would suggesting taking leaves and, or plants in to have them tested at your local coop. I was lucky the director had a meeting in my town, so she made a house call...and, I SURELY wish I had done it before I wasted all that time and used all those sprays!!!!! Do you have photo of the 'mites' or the damage done???
Sherry, I can't actually see them. They attack the new growth right down in the middle of the plant and the first I know the new fresh leaves are black and dried up. So, what does that sound like?
Jeanette
Would a systemic work, like Imidocloprid. If mites are sucking...they can suck to death...hehhehheh!!!
Carol
Funny Carol. Your opinion is the same as mine. I am using a systemic rose food. Because that is what I have and we are pretty rural. The nearest Lowes or HD are 80 miles away. But, whatever works. And that seems to be it . I am almost to the point that I am putting it on all of my plants. If I don't do it to one that is the one they are going to get next. Jeanette
http://www.epa.gov/pesticides/biopesticides/ingredients/factsheets/factsheet_006477.htm
Interesting!!!! I have not tried this but a Co-op just concluded. Did you all order any?
Judy
Sherry, did your damage sound anything like mine? Do you think that what she told you was right? What are "cats"? I have heard the term used before by some of you guys from that area. I don't have a cat. hehheh. Lord knows I know what slugs are. I do not have those.
Carol, maybe the reason we think the same is the area we live in. Not that Washington is anything like Hawaii.
Judy, I have written to Brian, the EPA ombudsman and asked him. wlyk.
Jeanette
''cat''
No, J'nette, your damage did not sound like mine. My leaves fell off and grew back puckered. Lots of us had that this growing season. Mine did not arrive that way (cuttings, some rooted). It appeared that I had broad mites and I treated them over and over and it did zero. The extension director said what I have, appears to be poor management, mostly, not watering at the right time - I had about 6 plants that had the problem and they were located near each other, yet in the same garden where the rest of the brugs flourished, unusually nice plants. That, she said, was because the ground was low and she advised me to build it up, which, of course, I will do. My brugs did not have the 'black', dying area that you mentioned. Cats are caterpillars and they are wretched, they can devour a brug in a flash and their damage is so ugly - I reached the point that I said to hell with it, I'll 'fix' it next growing season and, I will, but I'm not sure how I will be able to accomplish. The cats are really awful because they lie in transparent cocoons under leafs and they are 'alive' and such a beautiful green, I feel wretched. sorta, destroying them because, I guess, they become butterflies, right?? Does anyone know if all cats destroy brugs or if it's just 'mean' cats??? Of course I LOVE butterflies and based my gardens on attracting them, now they are destroying the plants that attract them. What to do??? Gardening presents some tough decisions, huh??!!
Judy, interesting article on Messenger. I'm expecting great results in the spring. LindaSC
I just finished using a packet on some cuttings, brug & begonia, that weren't doing as well as they should be .. but it was strictly my fault, too many crisis around here and they got put on the back burner. We'll see just how good this stuff is!! lol lol
J'nette, I forgot to tell you something re the broad mites that the extension lady told me...she said that broad mites particularly love begonias and my begonias were sitting right by the 'sick' brugs all the growing season and now in the GH and the begonias were and are happy as larks, in fact they are unusually healthy and are still blooming...
Here are some good sites for recognizing what mites you might have one day and how you can treat them. I found some of this information very interesting.
Cyclamen Mites http://www.uky.edu/Agriculture/Entomology/entfacts/trees/ef422.htm
Broad Mites http://insects.tamu.edu/fieldguide/broad_mites.html
Spider Mites http://ohioline.osu.edu/hyg-fact/2000/2012.html http://www.ext.colostate.edu/pubs/insect/05507.html http://www.uky.edu/Agriculture/Entomology/entfacts/trees/ef438.htm
Thanks Shirley, that looks like lots of good information. I've printed it all off and will read it more carefully later.
Thanks Shirley, The only link that would come up for me was OSU and I don't think what I have is spider mites. I have had experience with them before and I am not able to see any fine webs.
I wonder if the others wouldn't come up because of the time? It is 6 O'clock here. I wouldn't think they would turn off their computers when they go home. But I can't explain any other reason for them not to work.
Will try in the morning.
Also, I am going to get one of those microscopes. Conn has them for $4.99 but it is $10 for shipping. I have to go into the big city tomorrow so I will see if I can't get one there.
Also, all cats are not butterflies. How do you know what you have are good cats? If they aren't good why don't you use some BT on them? I just opened a bag on a Janet Reno that has such beautiful leaves bursting to get out and one of the leaves has large holes. Another has white spots that look the same as the white nubbies when they swell to make roots. Is that what one of you, I think it was Gretchen, called cat poop? I sure hope not because I really want this Brug to do good. It appears to be such a strong grower.
AND, I like Janet Reno. LOL
Jeanette
Jeanette, the cats I've seen in their transparent cocoons are all identical and we thought we saw one turn into a yellow butterfly. They are, I think, unusually healthy, brug leaf green cocoons. So, I expect that they must not be cats that are butterflies. They eat like there is no tomorrow, the damage was fast, before I knew they were there, they chewed and chewed on my brugs. I don't like cats, butterflies or not, if that's what they do. Obviously, the poison brugs are the food of life to them...
Do what I do . Plant Cat food plants for the butterflies and the babies.
I have NO cat problems because of this practice and no , I do not spray poison in my garden.
Well, duh, Scooter, I didn't know there was a cat food plant, except for my brugs. Where can they be located?
Asclepias (there are some very pretty ones), bronze fennel, and parsley are some....and good old fashioned milkweed works as long as you don't let it go to seed in your flower bed. LOL! I let it grow under my pine trees that are around the edge of the garden. So far so good.