Non-member trading.

Is this frowned upon? I have been solicted by several non-subscribers and I'm wondering what's proper prococal.

Thanks for any tips.

Use your own judgement. I would be very cautious.

I'm a new gardener and an even newer "saver/trader", so I have a pretty small inventory. I hate to turn someone down who really wants to try a "new" tomato, but I'd hate even more to not be able to give the seed to someone "in the fold" should they request it. I've also been on a Feedback Thread and got a little concerned after reading some comments. Guess I'll stick with the tried and true -

Thank you for responding!

I have traded with many non-subscribers and have seen no reason to be any more cautious with them as with subscribers. In fact I have been burned only by subscribers actually. Just because a person doesn't wish to spend money on a subscription doesn't make them untrustworthy. But by all means use your own judgment........you might wish to ask these would be traders what their reasons are for not subscribing if that is indeed an issue for you.

I don't really know what my issue would be - guess I was just curious about SOP.

You do make me think, though, if someone can't afford the membership, maybe they do NEED the free tomato seeds! (I don't think people realize what a bargain subscribership is! I was stunned when I finally looked into it and realized how inexpensive it was. Kicked myself REALLY HARD for wasting alll those months as an NS!)

I don't rememebr saying anyone couldn't afford the subscription....what I said was they may not wish to spend money on one for whatever their reasons. I myself didn't right off because I wasn't sure this place was for me....I'm still not sure I do belong here, but for now I'm enjoying myself.

I would never give a thought to sending out tomato seds with my own postage money.

I do balk at paying $3.85 to pack/box/drive to P.O to send priority mail, if I'm not even going to get an acknowlegment that they received, or get any postage money for that amount. That is when you become "cautious"!

I don't really have much inventory, as yet, so I kind of like the trade option - unless you get burned, and by then it's too late.

I'm very new to this - have been sending out SASE and seeds for the past couple of weeks, but haven't received anything yet. It sure is fun running to the mailbox each day, though - just in case. And next week I'm driving to Guilford, CT to make a trade w/a new DG pal! Can't wait! (Just wish I knew how to tackle the Hosta to get her a nice starter! I keep staring at it hoping for an answer ~:-)) Ommm - guess it will come to me!

And still none of that has anything to do with being a subscriber or not...............................

Hi Sequee,
Well before I became a subscriber many of those who were subscribers gave me seeds for sase and I really appreciated that. It's up to you but if someone e-mailed me yes I would. Can't always be on the receiving end.

Thanks! It's great to have your input!

You could ask the non-members to send their plant/seed/postage first. You could even use the excuse that you've been burned alot so you just want to make sure it comes through.

Always get postage up-front..Then you won't get burned, at least not on SASE..Member or subscriber makes no difference to me..Had good and bad experiences with both.. Just because they pay, doesn't mean they won't burn...Use your own judgement and common sense, and like I said....Always get SASE postage up-front....If they really want the seeds or plants for postage, they will usually send it pretty quickly..

larkie

Sequee...thanks for asking this question. The replies have certainly been interesting for me to read. I'm in a situation at the moment where I have the sneaking feeling I got took. ;-) And you're right, that USPS priority is a bit much to pay just to find out, the person on the receiving end doesn't intend to pay/trade. (oh, well...such is life.)

~julie~

i can't imagine why non-subscribing members would be any less reliable than a paying member - am i missing something here?

No greencheese your not....it just seems the 'impression' is a non-member is somehow less reliable for not wanting to spend monies on a membership. Don't understand that, but hey there are a lot of things in this world I don;t understand. :-)

My take is that paying members are a part of the community and add something to it. You build "relationships" with some of the members, or become familiar with them just by reading their posts.
I feel that the majority of the non paying members (maybe not a fair analysis) are just are searching for free plants. I know most the emails that i have gotten from non paying members can be pretty much summed up as this "i noticed you had ****, where can i send postage to". I dont think i've ever been offered anything in return for their wants.
I have since deleted my trade list, and choose to do it on a more personal level.
New members are not a problem with me, they have to start somewhere. But IMHO there is a big difference between nonpaying and paying. If you trade or sase to a nonpayer, what are the chances of ever hearing from them again? I personally like to see/know the people i'm trading with.
I've also developed my own opinion about some people here. Some are very giving and generous, others are very taking and ungiving. Its really nice when you sase to someone and then see something that they are offering and request and you are told "what do you have" or "ill see if i have any left". There are some people that i won't sase to anymore.
So, being a nonpayer/payer doesnt really determine if you are worthy or not, really. There are always going to be the greedy ones that take advantage of the generosity here. I just feel that if someone is a payer, you notice it. Nonpayers just drift off in to the sunset.
Jen

i think i just rambled, eh? lol

I think it is, at least to me, a non-member has less invested - including no reputation. It is almost the same with trading with a new subscriber though too. I think you just have to be careful. I sent seeds to non-subscribers for SASE last month, but of course waited until the envelopes from them arrived. I would have a harder time sending a plant for trade to a non-subscriber though before receiving their side of the trade, though.

I may be wrong, but thinking a lot of times, the nonsubscriber just gets on to see what they can get for free. Where subscribers become known, make friends, then can feel good about asking for, and making trades.

OR they sign on to see what Dave's is all about and to check 'us' out before making the leap into subscribership.....at least that is what I did.
I just don't understand where in the world all this mistrust of non-subscribers comes from....very odd

I haven't been a subscribing member of DG's for very long and I joined at about the same time as the now infamous 'humblebumble.' That was terrifying to watch as a 'newbie.' It took me a while to decide that I was worthy of trying to do SASE exchanges with some of the established members. You see, I'm just starting the garden in my yard this year and have nothing of value to trade item-for-item. So I guess I'm in the process of trying to build a good reputation as a trader.

I have to wonder if there couldn't be a system put in place that, or at least an accepted policy of asking newbies and/or non-subscribers to establish themselves (myself included here) by sending their part of the exchange, be it SASE or trade item, before the established trader sends theirs. To me, once again, as a newbie, it seems fair...and I most definitely would have accepted and understood a policy of that kind when I first came here. I wouldn't have objected in the least if someone I initiated an exchange with had asked me to send my part of the deal "up front" especially if it was the first time I'd dealt with that person. And if I was sending a check...I wouldn't have felt it discrimination for the person to wait until my check cleared.

DG is the greatest site I've seen. The people are extremely generous...at least the ones I've had the pleasure of exchanging with...and they're always helpful and understanding with the new people. I certainly understand the reluctance for established members to trade with non-subscribers and newbies. I just wish there was a way to make everyone understand how important it is STAY FAIR with their deals.

my .02 worth

~julie~

I have traded and sent cuttings to newbies and nonsubscribers with very good results, even on GW, which is famous for problems.

Have never been "stiffed". Maybe had to remind a few, that they never acknowledged receiving my package...........

Mine experience is also good with nonsubscribers , I sent and received many times. Never faced any problem with nonsubscribers. If we will do with nonsubscribers , may be soon those will also the subscribers members of DG, Only because of our behaviour. Always think better/positive for others. Dont worry if they are not responding in same.

Very well said gumlla :-)

Ditto Gumlla....

Larkie

What i was trying to stress is that all of the emails that i got from nonpaying members were requests for sase.
I've never had the pleasure of doing a trade, because nothing was offered on their part.
Jen

MSJen
No problem if they did not offer you any thing, may be they don't have or new gardeners. I think when your plants bloom in some ones garden, he/she should remeber you and pray for you. And in return or exchange prays are the best instead of seeds or plants.

MSJen

If you have limited seeds to offer, I'd stick to trade only. SASE is basically free seed. Until you build up a seed bank, why not offer them for trade only, and when you have more seeds, offer SASE for those who were in the same boat you are now.

I send seeds all the time without trades or even SASE. I have to admit, I am much more cautious if the inquiry comes from a non-subscriber, especially if they became a member the same day as their request. Some folks are just surfing for seeds and some of those folks are just looking for seeds to use as trading material. I have often seen my own seeds on someone else's trade list. Seed trading should require some investment, don't you think?

Lol. It is a little..... pushy... when you get a message like "I'm interested in your rose seed, you can send it to: etc."

MSJen, are you new to gardening yourself? You'll probably find that after a few years you'll have plants reproducing like crazy and you'll be relieved to get some off your hands especially since they're going to good homes (I hope!).

I've just spent 10 minutes trying to answer this question without being too opinionated for my own good. Therefore, I will whittle it down to this:

No, I don't have a problem trading with non-subscribers!

lol.................:-D

I've been doing this for a while, and if youll notice on the plant trading forever i've offered sases numerous times.
The point i was trying to make is you get these emails "out of the blue" from strangers wanting plants. I dont do seeds so thats not a problem.
My plants do multiply like crazy which is why i offer them on the plant trading forum. Ironically, tho, i dont think i've had a nonpaying member respond to those offers.
I try to live my life day to day and what i stand strong on today may not be so important tomorrow. Who knows, maybe ill land my broom and start sase'ing to nonsubscribers.

No one says that you're a bad person!!!!!!! I understand how you might not want to trade with them since they can just vanish into thin air after you've sent your plant. It's just your preference and YOUR decision.

Man I am ready for a cup of tea.

Gumlla - you have a wonderful way with words. I know I will think fondly of each person whose plant grows in my home and garden.

Thank you for such a wonderful perspective!

Sequee
In this world, you can buy every thing else happines if you have money. So always try to make a smile on the faces of others with your behaviour.

Excellent words of advice - thank you!

CaptMicha is the COOLEST!!!!

She is very generous, even to uninformed newbies, with nothing to trade but postage! :)

Ditto on this being the BEST SITE EVER!!!! The only other site that rivals (IMO) is eBay! And this is much cheaper, and much nicer follks!

Kim

I think some of us were VERY HARD on Sequee when I think S. was just asking a question because they are new to the site. It's unfortunate that when someone asks an innocent question, being a newbie, others jump down their throats. This has made me rethink asking some of the questions I had planned and that is detrimental to forums altogether. There does not appear to be any verbage which states that people who don't subscribe are untrustworthy- it was just a question.

I am a newbie as well and have already started doing SASE and Trade because I was able to subscribe and learn immediately how to harvest my own gardens correctly. Some people may not be able to afford it, some may choose not to do it. However - there can be a feeling of safety when you know that if you are trading or sending to someone you have a way of following up with them if there was a problem. I think it is a great idea to ask people who are not established to do the work upfront and perhaps it should be discussed further.

But please, let's not jump down someone's throat or we'll stop having a positive dialogue.

Susied, who do you see as having jumped down her throat? She asked a question, and recieved various opinionated answers....mine for one.

I think there is the perception that a subscriber would somehow be more diligent about protecting their reputation as regards trading, and I can understand that. However, it's not necessarily true. I was ripped off this past August by a subscriber who is STILL subscribed, and then there was the whole humblebumble fiasco. She had something like FIVE different subscribed aliases on Dave's Garden.

Being a cautious soul myself, I would probably ask a non-subscriber, or a subscriber who hasn't been here very long, to send to me first.

But in the end, you should do your trading in a manner that makes sense and is comfortable to you.