(Mk*) Rowan Mountain goldenrod is the only smaller goldenrod I know of that will grow in Florida. (Amargia is a hop, skip and a jump from the FL line.) The Rowan is available from Plant Delights, if I can't find it locally.
Oh, the false dragonhead on that site is really something. I can't grow it here, but maybe I could plant one in a friend's' more northerly garden and get visitation rights.
We are downhill from a major run of powerlines. The maintenance crew seems very heavy handed with the herbicides. I worry about the run-off.
More native things blooming in a Tennessee yard
Cville's comment about roses reminded me of something I've been meaning to ask. Somewhere in this forum, I read that someone was going to rip out azaleas for some reason...I believe it had something to do with pollinators. Does anyone recall that and if so, what's wrong with azaleas?
I don't know where that's located here, but I have read that azalea and rhododendron pollen is toxic to humans and honey made from that pollen can cause problems for humans.
http://cal.vet.upenn.edu/projects/poison/plants/ppazale.htm
It was probably us as we set up for honeybees. I have learned since that if the bees have plenty of good nectar plants blooming at the same time the azaleas are blooming,the bees just ignore the azaleas. It is when the bees have nothing else available, that toxic beauties like azaleas, oleanders and Carolina jessamine become an issue. It isn't so much having azaleas, that causes trouble,. It is ripping out all the clover nearby because it is perceived as just a weed. The bees don't see it that way. lol. I only know about honeybees, but I assume it is much the same way with native hives and solitary bees. Mk*
This message was edited Oct 11, 2013 12:03 AM
Interesting. Apparently why I never see many bees on my azaleas. I do have lots of other nectar sources as well. They love the abelia that grows between a couple of the azaleas. Of course, they don't bloom at the same time, but I always see bees covering the abelia and never the azaleas when they are in bloom. Yes, we have quite a bit of clover. This "lawn" (more of an assemblage of weeds and grasses) was 40 years old when we bought the house. No going back now. lol. But we do have a lot of bees including my favorite carpenter bees. I know they aren't everyone's favorites, but I call them my gentle giants.
Do you have a number of hives, Mk?
So are azaleas toxic to bees? I have some very large azaleas that were there when we bought the house; they might be 40 years old. I haven't replaced them because I'm too busy planting new shrubs, and because some serve as great bird shelters and nesting sites. Azaleas are supposed to attract hummingbirds, but I haven't seen hummingbirds or bees near them. I think azaleas bloom before either shows up in our area.
I do have a lot of bees of various types in my yard. Bees even took over one of my birdhouses! The bees' hands-down favorite plants are my Salvia Black and Blue. The hummers love them, too, but I think they're intimidated by the birds.
It's one of my favorites, too - beautiful, blooms from spring to frost, requires zero maintenance except deadheading, deer-resistant, etc.
A neighbor has 2 hives in his yard, second year. He rotates sections of his yard in California buckweed, which drives the bees wild.
Look into this. In winter, and before he began the buckwheat, his bees lived in my yard. They really like the camillia in January.
I meant to say the hummers are intimidated by the bees, which totally hog the salvia all season long. It's a good thing I'm not afraid of bees, because otherwise they would never get dead-headed.
I will look into camillia. My initial reaction was that I don't have a sunny spot for one, but if they bloom before trees leaf out it won't matter.
I don't think azaleas are toxic to bees. Honey from azaleas can have some toxic substances in it, but from what I understand, the bees tend to avoid the plants since it's difficult for bees to harvest from them. I have a partial list of plants that are known to be toxic.
Black Nightshade
California Buckeye
Death Camas
Dodder
Leatherwood
Locoweed
Mountain Laurel
Rhododendron
Tobacco
Veratrum or corn-lily
Yellow Jessamine
http://www.wildflower.org/expert/show.php?id=7891
Yes, azaleas are only a concern if you are raising honeybees. Honeybees that feed heavily on azaleas and rhododendrons can produce "mad honey." The honey has a nasty psychoactive effect on humans, but the responsible alkaloid doesn't appear to harm the bees. Considering the way bees avoid azalea blossoms if other things are available, I suspect it has some of the 30+ chemicals bees don’t like. This area is proud of its azalea/dogwood trail in spring. Amargia is a local oddity in that we have no azaleas. If your concern is harming the bees themselves, I wouldn't worry about azaleas..
There is fascinating info on the relationship between bees and flowers at this site. http://daisydukesgardens.com/2013/electric-pollen/
I'm keeping it at one hive until I know the ladies have enough good forage. That is one reason I'm interested in different kinds of goldenrod. Having them available from August to November is the goal.
If we have another year like this one, I will be tempted to pull out most of the roses, as well. I only have time for tough, old cultivars and species roses. I don't spray. Normally, there might be a little blackspot at the end of the season, but nothing serious. This season was horrible for rose diseases. Only 'Dr. Huey' did okay. The Y generation kids added an 'Iceberg' to Amargia's want list. I'm hoping to come up with a white or pastel blooming, native climber that will work on an arched tunnel where the kids have the idea of using the climbing 'Iceberg'. Any ideas?
Jim is a native of PA and gets nostalgic for autumn leaf color this time of year. He purchased a chalk maple to help with his homesickness. I'm just happy it wasn't yet another blueberry. Rabbiteyes do have good autumn leaf color even this far south, but what to do with all the fruit in summer is becoming an issue. lol. Mk*
This message was edited Oct 12, 2013 1:06 PM
This message was edited Oct 12, 2013 7:39 PM
MK - thanks, I really enjoyed that article.
Interesting article! Nature can be so fascinating. This month's Garden Gate had a blurb about British research showing that fungi can help plants warn each other about aphid attacks and attract wasps to kill the aphids, not something I every would have guessed. Here's a link with some info; there's a lot more online if you google "mycorrhizae fungus attracting wasps". http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-22462855.
So I will cross the azaleas and rhodos off my worry list. I don't raise honeybees, and have over 80 shrubs, 13 trees and an assortment of flowers on my 1/3 acre lot for the pollinators to pick from!
With all those trees, I have a limited amount of sun, so I'm planting bird and pollinator-friendly plants in a meadow near my house. I have 2 kinds of goldenrod there, one of which is still blooming. I don't know what kind it is; I pulled the plants out of a crack in the street.
Unless you're tending hives and harvesting honey it doesn't seem to be a big concern. We have an assortment of plants on our property as well. We seem to have lots of happy bees, mostly carpenters and some honeybees.
Intriguing about the fungi, Muddy1. Nature is endlessly fascinating. I always wonder what we don't yet know?
The one thing I really missed during out decades in CA was the fall leaf colors. Last year the leaves were mostly down by this time. This year, everything is still very green.
Same here with the roses, Mk. A friend and I found a White Rose of York on an abandoned property and some of it now lives here. It blooms early in the year but is not a repeater. I don't wish to spray so my other roses will be left to their own devices. Here, even the disease-resistant Knockouts look ratty by the end of the season. But they have come back to spectacular blooming the next year as has the Cl. Cecile Brunner and the Abraham Darby. Thanks for the site about the bees. Another good one.
....
I like trees much better when the leaves are on the trees! They are pretty in the fall, but leaf-raking is not how I like spending my outside time. The process is easier now that I've started mulching the leaves and spreading them directly under shrubs or on garden paths.
Those are gorgeous flowers, Cville. I love the blanket flowers.
Thanks, Muddy. It is still so warm here. Very little leaf color yet so it looks like they will all come down at once. I do the same - rake them where I want them, under the azaleas and on the beds elsewhere. The gal who mows for us has a mulching mower and that takes care of them fairly easily.
I did a little seed collecting in the backyard yesterday.
Impatiens capensis (Orange Jewelweed), common milkweed, Gonolobus pods.
You reminded me that I need to go collect jewel weed seeds. Thanks!
Not in Tennessee, but I love it!
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/10/17/garden/the-good-for-nothing-garden.html?hpw
Leaves have started to turn red and yellow almost overnight. Temps down into the 40s tonight. Guess I should think about moving the tenders into the garage. lol.
You've had high heat and now cold cold while our temps have been relatively stable. Not as warm as typical for any part of the year, but we are still in the 60s overnight. Cool enough to fool the neighbor's camellia into bloom which normall doesn't start till December/January.
I've had this on a want list for awhile so I was happy to see this about the Carolina Climbing Aster.
http://www.clayandlimestone.com/
Thanks, C'ville_Gardner, for the NYT link above. I can relate in the sense that my garden is 'my garden' and may not look all that great to anyone who does not love to be in 'their own garden'.
Also, I bought an Ampelaster carolinianthus last spring from Niche Gardens and it is blooming now on a back fence where I can let it grow pretty much unchecked.
My garden is changing more and more toward my own thing. :) As time goes by, I'm letting more things grow unchecked or at least minimally pruned. I have a fairly large backyard and I'd like to see a lot of it covered with plants in their natural state.
I dutifully prune shrubs in my front yard so they don't block the sidewalk, or too much of the windows or front door, and so that they look more or less respectable (even though my wonderful neighbors don't care)...but in my backyard (my sanctuary!), I will not prune any shrubs unless necessary to allow them to grower taller or wider, so I have ended up with things like a rhododendron as tall as the first story of my house. Native volunteers are allowed to stay on my property no matter where they decide to grow.
Perennials do get moved when I realize they're not happy where I've planted them, usually because there is not enough sun...usually due to the unpruned shrubs and trees.....
A fragrant native appreciated by bees and butterflies. Perfect! Thanks for the link, Cville_Gardener. I had talked the others out of a climbing rose for a sort of arched tunnel of fence wire that divides three garden areas. I like the idea of climbing aster much better than the passiflora we were considering. It will extend the season of interest.
I've been reading books on garden design, but I like plants as individuals too much to ever be very good at it. I can't see the forest for the trees. ;-)
Our native Spanish moss is so innately eerie, it's a natural for Halloween garden follies. I've never seen it used quite so imaginatively before though.
It makes a fabulous Cousin It !
lol. Indeed, it does. Very clever.
I prune the front more as well. But I don't hack things down into odd little shapes like a lot of people do, including some of the neighbors. Fortunately, I'm in an older neighborhood and people aren't as particular as they were in some of the newer neighborhoods we've lived in.
When I see shrubs in neat little shapes, I think of the constant pruning required to keep them that way. There's a house near us that has about 20 little shrubs in front, each one kept pruned into a perfect little ball...just seems like a waste of time or money to me.
My biggest problem is getting shrubs pruned before the birds build nests. After that starts, I have to wait until summer to do them, and by then I have a host of reasons not to spend time on them!
Neat article about the useless garden, thanks!
like the Cousin It…
Maypop passion flower vine can be VERY aggressive and pop up ten feet away in the next spring.
Agreed on pruning etc in that my front is neater-but not green meatball neat-- and back is more for interesting whatever comes along.
"Green meatballs" - lol. That's too funny but a very apropos description.
You know, Sally, P. incarnata is our state wildflower and I have had such a time getting it go grow for me. They say getting it started is the hardest part. I've tried several pots of it with no luck. I'm trying some seeds again this year. I've even dug it where I've found it in woods and it doesn't want to grow. Phooey. Any ideas?
I could send you some. I started mine from seed in 2010 and have transplanted them all over TH yard. I'll check to see if I did anything special to them as seeds....
I am reading directly from packaging received from Onalee when I purchased from her site:
". . . Seeds MUST be kept warm (75 deg. Or higher) at ALL stages of germination. Use a grow mat, old heating pad, or grow lights to keep them warm. Soak seeds 72 hours by placing them in a warm, damp paper towel in a ziploc baggie (and continue to keep warm!). When you remove them from paper towel after 3 days rub them between paper towels to remove all pulp/gooey substance that is on them (this is a germination inhibitor remove as much as possible by rubbing lightly between paper towels. 're-rinse the seeds as needed). Plant seeds about 1/2" deep using a well drained potting medium in pots or cell flats that have good drainage holes. Water with warm water to keep soil temp up, keep potting mix slightly damp, NOT SOGGY; continue to keep seeds and potting mix warm. Germination in 14 -30 days, some will come up much later than others. Continue to keep warm........"
I do remember them taking a long time to germinate. I'm sure I followed this to a "T" because I had heard they were difficult to start from seed.
Hope it helps.
Thanks, Amanda. I appreciate that. I have some seeds I just didn't want to take the time to germinate them. I have no patience with that sometimes. ;-) I can find them out in the woods to transplant and have planted some that I bought that were already sizable ... but no luck. I think I need to try planting them in a different location. Trouble with that is the gal who mows sometimes damages things. Grrrr.
Cville- I could mail you a small package of the roots I just dug up.
Sally, that would be great! I'll Dmail you my address.
Sounds fun! Don't say I didn't warn you though! It'll be this- something will have to sprout from all that.
http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/showimage/367656/
THe only place it wouldn't grow for me was poorly drained and fairly shaded and cool in winter.
I've tried in a location twice so I'll be trying new locations. Duh. Many thanks again. I'm determined to get the State Wildflower of Tennessee to grow for me. If it wasn't the State Wildflower, it would probably be growing here. Murphy's Law. lol.
Awww cville, how can this native be your state flower if it won't grown in your yard!!!?? Inconceivable.
It does want to spread and will climb towards the sun, even from shade. I've transplanted new shoots around the yard perimeters to encourage competition with the English ivy and Vinca coming in from all directions. I have not amended my clay soil a bit. Naturally in full sun will want supplemental water till established but then care free.
I started it for use as larval host to the gulf frittilary and other butterflies, but I've not seen any use it as such.
Once in a while I see a band of my crow friends sharing a fruit together.
All this! Hope Sally' s heavily rooted offerings will be the trick for you.
I snapped these pics last year. That's when I learned what a gulf frittilary is; also when I learned what Passiflora lutea is. I'd been pulling it for years and, shortly before seeing these cats, I saw P. lutea for sale at a native plant garden. I'm letting it grow in a few places now and I've started P. incarnata which grew enough to produce at least one flower this year. I keep seeing gulf frittilaries flying around but so far no caterpillars.
