Lily Group Buy from ADR for mid-atlantic spring swappers

I think that your time is off by 1hr.

LOL! She's seldom asleep before 10, even when we think we're "shooting for" 9. Jim works from home mostly, and I'm a stay-home mom, so we're not getting her up at 6:30 to go to day care... that makes us a lot more laid back about our schedules, and all of us get to bed relatively late most nights. Don't worry -- she gets enough sleep!

She's having a bedtime snack now, though, so I put up a thread for chatting about B&D Lily offerings: http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/1296051/

I'm so late to the party. I tried to fill up all the orders -- I'm totally flexible. I haven't read the full thread -- if I missed something and shouldn't be placing this, that's fine too.

ASIATIC HYBRIDS

5 'Elodie' 12/14 cm bulbs


ORIENTAL HYBRID LILY VARIETIES (available number in parentheses)

5 'Deep Impact' : 16/18 cm bulbs, red-pink with thin bright white edge

5 'Sorbonne' : 14/16 cm bulbs, pink-lavender with thin white edge, seems to be a favorite pink in reviews

8 'Lake Michigan' : 16/18 cm bulbs,white bloom blushing to magenta on tips

5 (or 15) Happy Tiny Oriental 'After Eight' : a genetic dwarf developed for pot culture, it looks to me like a miniature 'Star Gazer'. We'll make do with 25 if we don't get to 50.

10 Casa Blanca' : 16/18 cm bulbs, white, an extra-fragrant classic

10 'Stargazer'' : 16/18 cm bulbs, white & pink & cranberry, an extra-fragrant classic

OT HYBRID LILY VARIETIES (available number in parentheses)

5 'Bonbini' : 16/18 cm bulbs, white with unique star pattern at throat

4 'Conca d'Or' : 16/18 cm bulbs, white and gold

5 'Holland Beauty' 16/18 cm bulbs, cream edge, pink-red center. One of the newer hybrids from the tet Black Beauty, featured on the cover of B&D Lily's 2009 catalog.

4 'Satisfaction' : 16/18 cm bulbs, pink-red with yellow throat. Said to be sturdy enough to not need staking! Hart's favorite, as I recall.

Jill - I'll take:
5 Casa Blanca willing to take 10
5 Stargazers
reduce my Satisfaction order from 15 to 5 please (if it doesn't complicate things)

I would be interested in a couple of 'David' phlox

NOTE: a store that's been added to my weekly route is north of Leesburg right before the bridge going over to MD. Although I probably won't be at the seed swap - I can easily cross the bridge and come by to help sort most any Sunday after church.

Don't worry about zeroing out quantities at this point, order the number that you want... it's even OK to ask for ones that seem to be "sold out," as you never know when there could be enough interest for a second bag to be ordered. Just realize they may or may not be available!

The weekend before the spring plant swap is Mother's Day, so I'm guessing that might not work for a sort-meet. But May 5 should be fine, Chantell. I'll ask for the lilies to be sent out the week of April 30th, and we can get together that Sunday, whoever is available. At the least, I can pull your order and get it to you. Are you planning to go to the plant swap May 18?

Happy, I need to update the availability list from Terp's order on down. I'll put you down up to 5 for whatever is left... and you should feel free to look at the ADR lily page and go OOOOHH if there's something we should consider adding.

On the Tiny Oriental 'After Eight' lily, Happy, Aspen, Donner, and Holly, please let's look at the numbers. For the first bag of 25, I have 5, Aspen 5, Donner 10, Holly 5. Holly, did you want 10 altogether if we can get a second bag of 25? In that case, Holly would get 5 more, I'd get 10 more, and Happy would also get 10. Holly, if you'd rather have just 5, Happy & I will split the second bag. Either way, we're good, and I'll see about getting a second bag.

Terp, you can have my 3 'Dimension' bulbs. You can also have 3 'Lake Michigan' if you want them... or Happy will take them, no problem either way.

Chantell, I think Happy had dibs on those 5 'Stargazer' bulbs. But I'm going to check with my brother and see how many he really wants... could be 5 or 10, could be 25 (in which case we'll get a second bag).

No biggie on Stargazer - it's growing in my yard some where already...LOL Esp if we end up order from the other place. Ahhhhh I can smell it now...life is good

I'm happy to up any of my orders if needed to make a new bag -- but probably not to more than 10 or 15 of any one variety. Please give me a heads-up first. Chantell can have the Stargazers if she'd like -- I don't feel strongly.

I realized I can't do lilies on my awful front hill - they are deer candy, right?

What was that about Phlox David?

Is anyone considering bare root sources? Gotta love the prices when you can find them, and they are so easy to deal with.

This message was edited Jan 30, 2013 9:48 AM

I'm easy....

Happy, I haven't ordered bare root plants from ADR before. I thought we might add a bag of something to our order, just to test the waters (and see what they consider to be a "#1 division"). Also, I don't want to sort out a big bare-root plant order in addition to the lilies. Phlox 'David' seemed like an easy "sell" for our group, especially as I can use 10 or so myself. The phlox are $1 apiece in a bag of 25 (possibly plus shipping, as I didn't ask Chris about plants, just bulbs).

Hmm, let's say phlox are available in groups of 3... if we "spread them around," we'll get a good number of reports. I'll take 10. (3 will go to Pittsburgh, 3 to Winston-Salem, I'll keep 4)
So we have 5 groups of 3 left... SSG, Chantell, Happy...

It's hard not to get excited all over again seeing their perennial page, but let's save that for next spring, and we'll see if we like their bare root plants as well as I liked their bulbs. I could probably be talked into getting 1 bag of something else if somebody was really dying to see what their hostas or DLs looked like... LOL

What is so special about the Phlox--"David"?
Where can I see a picture of it? G.

Link to Phlox paniculata 'david' in Plant Files

http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/go/51621/

I've heard good things re its fragrance, Gita!! I think Bluestone carried it???

Gita, I have a serious powdery mildew problem, so I need a phlox that's super super resistant. I've read that David is one of the best varieties, and the white blooms are really pretty.

I never noticed it being powerfully fragrant, but it has a sweetness about it... it's white, tough, and does all right even in part shade. As with all phlox, the butterflies love it. I figured if we were going to try just one of their phlox varieties, 'David' would be a good choice -- white goes with everything, and I know I can take any extras and give them to my MIL. :-)

SSG, if you want more than 3 to try, you're welcome to them. Just LMK.

Oh, 3's definitely plenty! :)

Jill--

A bit off topic, but I thought this was important.
Tapla was asked what he thought off Polymer Crystals in soils. Here is what he said. I c/p it for everyone to read.
The last paragraph is downright scary!

********************************************************

I don't use them for 3 reasons. The first is, I generally want to reduce water retention in my soils so I need to water more often. Many growers are already using soils that support too much water retention to ensure plants have at least the opportunity to grow to their genetic potential within the limiting effects of other factors. Essentially that means if everything else was perfect, excessive water retention would be a significant limiting factor. Perched water, that is the soggy layer of soil at the bottom of the pot, limits root function and affects root health, so soils that minimize or eliminate perched water, or other grower practices that help to reduce the volume of perched water in soils, offer greater opportunity for plants to grow closer to their potential.

Second, the PAC gels commonly used can hold water very tightly, which means that though they absorb lots of water when available, they also tightly hold onto water at the opposite end of the cycle that would normally be available to plants.

Third, hydrogels as polymers are environmentally friendly, but depolymerization occurs very quickly. Nutrient salts (fertilizers)increase the rate of degradation, and it doesn't matter if the salts are derived from synthetic or organic sources. All nutrients plants normally take up through the roots are taken up as salts whether from organic or synthetic sources. When the acrylamide units break down, potassium acrylate and acrylamide are two by-products. Acrylamide is known to be a lethal neurotoxin and a carcinogen that is easily inhaled or absorbed through skin, and eventually the compound makes its way into the water supply. I think the risk is greater at repotting time than at potting time, so at a minimum you should wear rubber gloves and a mask when repotting plants in soils that contain PAC hydrogels.

Al

I'm happy with whatever Davids you want to throw my way.

Gita, just about everything that goes into the garden can be controversial. Not all "hydrogels" are the same, and they break down differently also. For example, I wouldn't use the polymer inside disposable diapers in my garden. I've heard this information before but never seen it substantiated for polymer moisture crystals. According to Watersorb.org (my source for the crystals), "Watersorb super absorbent polymers will break down into nitrogen, carbon dioxide and water with no residual toxicity." If you're concerned, go to their website and contact them.

For the rest, I've found that in ordinary garden soil or potting mix, the crystals help with perched water and soggy soil by soaking up excess water. Plants I've unpotted have no hesitation about growing roots right into the crystals, and they seem to be able to use the stored water just fine.

I don't want to get into a debate with Tapla or anybody else. It's always a good idea to check out a product that's new to you. Draw your own conclusions, and use it, or not.

**
With the 'David' phlox, I'm happy if it takes 3 of them to "fill" a pot or planting hole... that's still $3 per plant. If you want to "grow them on" over the summer, even a small division should give you a nice gallon-size plant to set out in fall. And with any luck, these won't be puny. :-)

I'm currently in a loving-those-phloxes mode, so count me in on any phlox that doesn't get mildew...

Happy, deer also like phlox. You may want to plant them where deer don't go.

I have been living in the current house for 5 years now, and last year was the first time deer left a few lily flowers for me. They seemed to eat the lily flower buds the day before they opened, as if they had been over to check the buds every day. They also ate the top of the phlox. Last year was also the first year the phlox got to keep the top long enough to produce flowers. Now I am buying quite a lot of lilies, and am determined to keep deer away from my garden this year. Well, at least I will try harder.

Phlox is for the back yard. My awful front hill only has plants that deer are supposed to dislike (I'm sure I made mistakes, but that was the plan). Only problem is the back is pretty shady, but phlox seems to do ok -- not spectacular, but enough to make us happy.

Jill has more going on here, if you're interested:

http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/1296051/

Greetings!
Jill I am keeping my eyelids up with toothpicks, but still having some difficulty reading all of the posts.
If Possible, I would like
Casa Blanca (2)
Starfighter (2)
and two of what ever anyone else would like but don't yet have enough interest.
Also, if need be I can switch my 2 "whatevers" for 2 David Phlox (Purple if possible) I will come to Frederick (a shorter distance for me than New Jersey:)
Cheers!
Marlene

Jill--

Are you taking orders yet for the Phlox "David"?

You said they come 3 for $3--something? I would take the three of these.
Gita

We'd like to add:

3 Lake Michigan

if the numbers allow.

James (DGS) thought they were beautiful also.

Oh, yes, speak right up if you want some 'David' phlox (which btw are white... I don't think they have the purple David, whatever it's called. They have 'Laura', but as SSG commented, I do think that one is mildew-prone. We'll go all out with different phlox varieties next spring if we like these... I just want some direct experience with their bare root plants before doing a group buy.

And speak right up if there are other varieties that interest you -- I know I'd jump right on any orienpet, and it wouldn't be hard to twist my arm with any pink-ish oriental lily, either.


***
PLEASE READ THIS
***
Those who ordered 5 of a kind... please let me know if it would be equally acceptable to you to have 3 of a kind (if we stick with one bag) or 6 of a kind (if we go to 2 bags of a variety). I want people who are just finding this to be able to get what they want, also.

Even if a variety is posted at "0 available," let me know if it's on your wish list, because I can probably juggle the numbers to make it happen.

critter -- I don't care what I get -- I'm easy any old way, including as to varieties I didn't ask for. no worries.

You can change my numbers. I'm also interested in the David Phlox. Thanks again for doing this. You're making my grandson's new garden very affordable.

***
READ THIS TOO!
***
I may add another vendor to this group buy. Bert (or "Bleek" as we know him) at Touch of Nature has a very nice offer going now. See http://www.touchofnature.com/specials/spring.htm

We'll save some on shipping by ordering as a group, and I'm going to ask him if he can offer additional discounts for big quantities. His prices are pretty low already, so I don't know if there will be a lot of advantage to ordering together unless you just want one or two bags (or want to split a bag, but these are small quantities, like 2 or 4). I did post to ask him the sizes of these bulbs.

I like the double orientals! He's also getting in a lot of those new shorter/compact lilies for pot culture.

OK... I'll catch up with numbers, suggestions, etc. later... right now, i have a Groundhog's Day Tea Party to set up!

Bleek is great.

You can adjust my order as needed.
I have Garden Phlox David, I have had it for years and its a real nice plant. Got it in a co-op years ago as just a bareroot took off great and always looks good.

You can adjust my order as needed too.

Jill, ADR has an extensive selection of astilbes. Astilbes do so well in the shade and the deer don't touch them. If it wouldn't add more confusion, I'd like to try one of the varieties bare root just to test it out - if the bare root does well, this will be a cheaper way for me to get large quantities of astilbes in the future. The one that I was planning to get at the local nursery this year for my new "turtle" garden was Ostrich Plume. I think ADR has it in quantities of 25. I'd actually take all 25 if no one else is interested. What I was planning for the "turtle" garden was mass plantings (30-50, maybe even 75) of things like Ostrich Fern, Chelone, Astilbe Ostrich Plume, Astilbe Bridal Veil (or another white), and two or three other things that I'm still pondering on. Want to keep the varieties there few but en masse...

Jill, I'd be okay with either 5 or 6, rather than 3.

Aspenhill -- I've grown lots of astilbe bareroot before, and they do great.

Jill -- what is the price for a lot of 25 astilbe? I might borrow aspenhill's idea.....

Happy and Aspenhill et al. I've been looking at this site, too, especially their "Landscape Plugs" and Native Plants. They are wholesale growers for environmental remediation and sustainability. They are in PA. North Creek Nursery. For future reference at least. lol looks like some swaths in MAF gardens soon!

Landscape Plugs™

NEW SIZE! Learn more about the LP50 plug here.

Our best low-maintenance native perennials and grasses are available in plugs designed to be planted directly in the ground. We offer a wide selection of Eastern US natives and their cultivars selected for beauty and durability. Two sizes are available for direct planting: deep LP50 plugs are 5 inches deep by 2 inches square and come 50 to a standard nursery tray. Many shallow-rooted plants are available in flats of 32 (3" by 2.5" square) and are also suited to planting in the ground. Our Landscape Plugs™ offer an exciting alternative for quick establishment of plants in landscapes and containers.

Plant Selection
We are very selective in our choices for the Landscape Plugs™ program so that your planting gets off to a great start. All plants in our plug program are native to the midatlantic states, well suited to this climate and tolerant of drought and extreme temperature fluctuations. Robust root systems make for quick establishment and less initial watering. Plants purchased in spring are vernalized and ready to grow.

Why Use Landscape Plugs™?

* Plants usually reach flowering size in first season and have a high transplant success rate.
* Quicker and more reliable than seed, with erosion control starting in weeks rather than months.
* LP50 plugs have deep (5") roots that establish quickly.
* Compact size is easy to transport - a real cost saver.
* Plants are chosen for wide adaptability and ease of transplanting and establishment.
* Excellent choices for wildlife habitat development, providing food & shelter for many species.
* Plugs come in flats made of 100% recycled plastic and are #6 recyclable.

http://www.northcreeknurseries.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=plugs.landscapeplugs&alphaKey=M-O&whichName=genus&showIntro=0

Bareroot astilbe do well, yes... but again, I'd rather test the waters with 1 or 2 bags this year and get more next year if we like their idea of a "#1 division."

Astilbe 'Ostrich' and many of their varieties are $26 for a bag of 25, essentially $1 each plus a little extra (plus 15% if they decide we can't have free shipping on them also, which I think is unlikely but you never know). The compact varieties and the "visions" series are a little more, but still less than $2 each.

Let's try to be restrained though and focus on the lilies this year... Next year, if we're as happy as we hope to be, we'll buy out their supply of bare root perennials! LOL

Who is interested in the lilies from Bleek? LMK (here or Dmail) approximately how large you think your order might be... when I know some numbers I can ask him if he can give us an even better deal on a bigger order.

After seeing Bleek's selection, I'm thinking that maybe we could just order from ADR and from Touch of Nature this spring, then put together a fall order for those premium bulbs from B&D. I can't resist those "bargain bulbs," and I'm not sure I can find enough spots to put them all in this spring as it is, more so if I order some big B&D bulbs also.

We can pass the B&D catalog around at the spring swap -- they're sending me one, and they'll send you one too if you ask on their site. Then this fall, we can be planting some fat B&D lilies along with lots and lots of premium daffodils from ADR!

What do you think?

Coleup, I did a quick browse on the North Creek site... I did notice that they're "wholesale to the trade only," and I don't know if they'll make an exception for a group order from us the way ADR is doing. (Some places insist on a tax ID # to verify your status as a retailer.) Or maybe you have an "in" through places you've worked in the past?