A good problem to have....(I think)

Charlotte, NC(Zone 7b)

Ray_Der_Phan - you're an artist!? How wonderful. I can't draw a straight line. LOL I've always admired people with natural talents. Between a husband and two children you'd think one of us could draw - but NO.

1lisac - thanks for asking

Quoting:
Bee-did the hurricane affect you?
- apart from some wind, we didn't have any problems with the 'cane. Not even a drop of rain, which we sorely needed.

Everett, WA(Zone 8a)

Usually I kill seeds by over-watering. Maybe a method that worked well with your old mix was too wet with the new mix?

Just guessing.

Or, if they were ever in a sunny window, maybe they "cooked".
Or were stored somewhere where they caught a little condensation or several high-humidity days?

Charlotte, NC(Zone 7b)

Corey - you could be correct. The mix I used contained peat, whereas I usually use coir. I had run out of coir bricks and didn't want to take the time to order more on line, so dropped by W-Mart and picked up to two bags of MG's potting mix. I bet that [I]was[I/] the problem, the mix stayed too wet, and the seeds rotted.

Well, I won't make that mistake again!

Everett, WA(Zone 8a)

>> Well, I won't make that mistake again!

I've been wrestling with overwatering for as long as I've been starting seeds (just a few years, mostly). I think I'm slow to learn when the lesson is that I should stop doing something that I want to do!

So far, my solution seems to work better each time I change my mix in that direction. Now I use progressively coarser and less water-retentive seed starting mix.

I liked the idea of coir, but each time I bought some, I got wildly different textures, and was afraid of unknowingly using a salty batch for seed-strating.

So now I use mostly 1/4" to 1/2" screened medium pine bark mulch - chips, shreds and fibers. More or less bark dust - I'd rather have less. Like very fine orchid bark, but 10-20 times cheaper.

I add grit and coarse vermiculite and usually some coarse Perlite. I avoid bags that have been soggy & compressed long enough to smell anaerobic.

Then, if there was very little pine bark dust and the overall texture is coarse enoguh, I add just a little peat-based commercial seed starting mix like Miracle Grow (trying for 10-15%) just to be sure it does hold and wick enough water and has some fines for roots hairs other than pine bark dust.

The coarse structure lets my overwatering flow right through and leave some air-filled pores behind.

Any more than 10-20% fine particles defeats the purpose of using coarse components to create air spaces (pores large enough for water to flow out of). Any fine particles will fill those pores until the soil is only a little more open than straight milled peat moss, or pudding.

Pine bark is nice because the surface can dry out quickly while 1/2" down is still moist, yet it rehydrates right away (unlike peat moss). As I make up cells or pots for seeds, I pick out the coarser chips and save them for laying back on the surface around the seedling. Like top-dressing with gravel or coarse grit, but with water-absorbing gravel.

Corey

SE Houston (Hobby), TX(Zone 9a)

Corey,
I'm about to prep my eBuckets for my fall garden, and need a recommendation on refreshing last season's 3:1:1 mix (Tapla's 5:1:1 container mix modified for my eBuckets). The mix worked wonderfully well. I believe I can get another season or two out of the mix with some refreshing.

I grew tomatoes in the mix last season. I've started sifting the mix and breaking up dried clumps of roots. The mix is bone dry, and the dust was flying (probably dried up Dolomite lime).

I'll be growing "hungry-for-organics," water-hogging brassicas next: cabbages, cauliflowers, Brussels Sprouts, and broccolis. I'm thinking of refreshing the mix with a 50-50% blend of the current 3:1:1 and Black Kow Composted Manure. I want to decrease the peat component (MG Potting Mix), because the blend held a bit too much water. So, I'm thinking of this proportion:

4 parts of the current 3:1:1 blend
1 part brand new MG potting Mix
1 part Black Kow Composted Manure

Am I on track here?

Thanks!

Linda

Charlotte, NC(Zone 7b)

Corey - I have never had a problem with Classic Coir purchased from Worm's Way. They have two types, one is coarser than the other. What they call "Classic Coir" is the finer one.

I can't get into their web site at the moment - hopefully they are still in business.

Oceanside, CA(Zone 10a)

The good/bad problem continues. Looks like a lot more hot sauce on the way. Oh my poor kitchen :)

Thumbnail by Ray_Der_Phan
Central, AL(Zone 7b)

Congratulation for a problem well worth having! lol

Irving, TX(Zone 8a)

WOW fantastic
Do you have pictures to share of your vegetable garden area?

Liberty Hill, TX(Zone 8a)

Thats amazing. Im so jealous, after the terrible year we've had I have a severe case of tomato/pepper envy. I can usually count on a fall crop but it was 105* today. So between the deer and the drought/heat this year may be a total bust. Do you ship Ray? LOL

Greensboro, NC(Zone 7b)

:D

SE Houston (Hobby), TX(Zone 9a)

Yeah, Ray,
You'd better show me a picture of your plants....

Radish seeds on the way? Fourth graders? Little kids?

Me and Ray playing with the 4th graders! ^^_^^^^_^^_^^^^_^^_^^^^_^^_^^^^_^^

Everett, WA(Zone 8a)

Hi Linda

Your seeds are in the mailer and will be mailed today.

>> I want to decrease the peat component (MG Potting Mix), because the blend held a bit too much water.
>> So, I'm thinking of this proportion:

4 parts of the current 3:1:1 blend
1 part brand new MG potting Mix
1 part Black Kow Composted Manure

The biggest probklem with re-using potting soil is the buildup of salts.

I you're going to re-use it, I would urge you to flush it repeatedly to remove salts and left-over fertilizer. If I understand eBuckets, everything you add stays in the soil, even soluble things like salt and nitrates. You don;'t want them building up or getting into undesirable ratios. Maybe improve the drainage first, but put it in big buckets with holes in the bottom, and flood it a few times per day, trying to drain out as much as possible each time.

Flush the salts!

The second problem is that soil structure breaks down some, even pine bark, even in one season, unless you get your drainage from coarse grit or crushed rock or coarse Perlite or "Turface".

You might want to re-screen the old mix with 1/4" mesh to throw away some of the finer & broken-down bark and peeat. Don't rub too hard or you'll break it down even more.

If I was going to re-use potting soil, I would try to build the "structure" back up by adding more coarse pine bark chunks - as big as you think is OK for your size bucket. Start with some medium mulch, and put some through 1/2" mesh, keeping the pieces bigger than 1/2". Probably hand-pick out the pieces TOO big for your bucket. Anway, try to add the larger size particles and don't add any small stuff.

You might consider some coarse grit or crushed rock - that won't break down. But remember you want particles as big as the bark chips.


Are you assuming that all the peat that WAS in it has already broken down and been digested? Because I see you're adding more peat. I think you need the opposite for better drainage. If it holds too much water already, I would not add even more peat. Pine bark does some wicking by itself, and broken-down bark fibers are already adding to the "fine stuff" in the mix.

Adding one-part-in-six of compost might not be enough, if they like a rich organic soil. Whatever organics you had last year may already have all been digested. However, compost will also make it hold more water. Maybe, before you add any compost, mix it well with some coarse bark fragments. Amend the compost until it looks like it will drain OK and not hold excfesssive water. THEN add some of that blend.

I have no expeirence with eBuckets myself, but if the part of the soil that is below water goes anerobic (which I would guess would happen), more compost will make anerobic soil even more unhappy (I guess).

On the other hand, I have little experience with pots and none with eBuckets, so if I were you, I would also ask someone with experience!

Corey

SE Houston (Hobby), TX(Zone 9a)

Thanks for the feedback, Rick!

Oceanside, CA(Zone 10a)

Well, I wouldn't call what I have as a vegetable garden. 99% of my veggies are grown in containers on a deck, concrete, in a flower bed or along the fence line. Here's something I threw together real quick(instead of 1 pic at a time) from some phone pics. You'll get the idea of how I grow things. Got to make do with the area you have :)

Thumbnail by Ray_Der_Phan
Liberty Hill, TX(Zone 8a)

What are the tomatoes on the bottom right corner?

Central, AL(Zone 7b)

One terrific greenthump you've!

Central, AL(Zone 7b)

This is my sister's make-shift veggies garden. They--she and hubby and in-laws grow alot of hot peppers and other veggies as well. These are La-Kwa vines and fruits.

Thumbnail by Lily_love
Greensboro, NC(Zone 7b)

That's a beautiful collage, Ray - thanks for sharing.

Oceanside, CA(Zone 10a)

Quote from 1lisac :
What are the tomatoes on the bottom right corner?[/quote]

It's a Cherokee Purple x Unknown(I suspect "Rose") F3

Pretty neat looking, huh? Tasty too!


Quote from Lily_love :
This is my sister's make-shift veggies garden. They--she and hubby and in-laws grow alot of hot peppers and other veggies as well. These are La-Kwa vines and fruits.


Wow, those are cool looking! Never tried bitter melon before. Might be worth trying to grow here some time.


[quote="AmandaEsq"]That's a beautiful collage, Ray - thanks for sharing.


Thanks Amanda! Glad you liked.

Central, AL(Zone 7b)

The fruits of bitter melons take an acquired taste. One has to know how to cook them to make them enjoyable. Ray. They're annual, if you start the seeds early in spring. By July you should be able to harvest.

SE Houston (Hobby), TX(Zone 9a)

Ray,
I forget, are you using Al's 5:1:1 in free-draining containers?

Oceanside, CA(Zone 10a)

Quote from Lily_love :
The fruits of bitter melons take an acquired taste. One has to know how to cook them to make them enjoyable. Ray. They're annual, if you start the seeds early in spring. By July you should be able to harvest.


Yup, I have a friend who really enjoys them, said the same thing you just did. I'm weird, I enjoy bitter foods.

Oceanside, CA(Zone 10a)

Quote from Gymgirl :
Ray,
I forget, are you using Al's 5:1:1 in free-draining containers?


Nah, I use a few different brands of potting soil(Fox Farm, EB stone mainly) and then add perlite and some amendments when/if needed. I have mixed my own but I didn't really feel the savings was worth it. But then again, I didn't keep at it long enough to get it dialed in perfectly.

Irving, TX(Zone 8a)

Thanks so much for sharing your set up.
Now I want to move to California and run away from TX heat !!!
CONGRATS

SE Houston (Hobby), TX(Zone 9a)

Thanks, Ray!

I'm about to set up 40+ eBuckets for the fall/winter crop. I set up 30 in the spring, and I found the PBFs container recipe to be a tremendous $$$ saver. I can get a yard of the PBFs for $18. The only real issue is sifting out the larger pieces that won't work for the eBuckets. But, I'll be able to add the large chunks to my raised bed, whenever that gets built.

My seedlings are SOOOOOOOOOOOOO ready for plant out, but, I'm holding them hostage inside until this Texas heat drops down into the 90s on a consistent basis. We've had three 100+ degree days THIS WEEK...

It's gonna be a brutal winter as well, I think. Cold and DRY. Maybe not such a bad thing, though...Won't be rainy and slushy outdoors.

But, the foundations will continue to suffer...

I've started collecting the buckets for my 4th graders. They're gonna decorate them! How cool is that? I have GOT to remember to take pictures of the decorated eBucket garden! I think I'm just gonna go with the original eBucket use of the potting mix. They'll get a good harvest, and I won't have to sift PBFs for a whole class! (That's take until NEXT fall/winter)

Hugs!

Linda

Greensboro, NC(Zone 7b)

Linda - did you ever get your math straight? :)

SE Houston (Hobby), TX(Zone 9a)

Kinda.

Ya'll, I have made a serious, serious error. Ya know how I've been saying this class project is for the 4th graders? Well, it's not...

It's for the FOUR-YEAR-OLDS!!!!!!!!! aaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrgggggggghhhhhhh!!!!

Can you say "total confusion?"

No matter. They can still watch the seedlings grow.

RAY,
THANKS FOR THE RADISH SEEDS! I got the package yesterday. Haven't opened it yet, but I know it's great stuff in there. The FOUR-YEAR-OLDS will be very happy!

Hugs!

Linda

Greensboro, NC(Zone 7b)

Big difference.

Looks like you'll be doing all the work. Hope you have help with this project! It's hard to keep a 4 year old's attention. I don't have kids, but I've done programs with younguns before. God, you're a brave woman. :D

Loveya.
A.

Oceanside, CA(Zone 10a)

Hi Linda, I think you are giving me credit for something I haven't done lol

I don't think I've sent radish seeds to anyone.....but I can if you'd like? :)

Did you mean to say Rick instead of Ray?

Speaking of radishes.....I maybe the worst radish grower in the world. They're supposed to be really easy but I never really give them much attention when I do grow them. Always get little radish marbles that are pretty useless.

SE Houston (Hobby), TX(Zone 9a)

Sorry, Ray! I DID mean Rick!

Lemme go find Rick!!

Amanda,
Fortunately, the instigator of this project is the mother of one of the FOUR-YEAR-OLDs. The whole family is vegetarian, so she's got a vested interest in exposing her daughter to veggie gardening.

Start 'em early! (kids AND veggies!)

Linda

Everett, WA(Zone 8a)

Hi Linda

I'm glad they got there. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised by the variety in there. The "French Breakfast" radishes are probably your best bet.

Anything that neither you nor the kiddies would be interested in, just pass along to anyone who might want them.

The Daikon radishes are NOT fast growers, and DO have big roots.

My idea for the Bok Choy was to sow them thickly, germinate fast, let the kids first see the "carpet", and then see what "thinning" is and why it's needed ... and eat the tender thinnings. Then let them grow another week or two, and eat bigger thinings. Then either re-use the bucket, or let them pick bigger outer leaves for several more weeks, if they like the "crunch".

And Bok Choy are just such dramatic, pretty things!

SE Houston (Hobby), TX(Zone 9a)

Rick,
Thank you soooooooooooo much for the seeds. The parent and the mentor are getting excited!

Amanda's right - WE'VE been collecting the buckets. And WE'LL be cutting holes, tubes, and collanders, and prepping them. Then WE'LL deliver them to the school teacher so SHE can begin the decorating project.

Then, WE'LL take a day off from work to go show them how to plant the eBuckets and sow the seeds....then, THEY can sit back and hold a hose pipe in the watering hole and watch the water come out of the overflow tube, and watch the seedlings grow...and then eat them...

HUH????? ^^_^^

Liberty Hill, TX(Zone 8a)

A while back on this thread drthor asked about Ray's set up. I found some pictures from a thread last year. Its along thread and there are pictures on various posts. http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/1107451/#post_7895311

Irving, TX(Zone 8a)

I am impressed on how many veggies you can grow in containers.
CONGRATS

Greensboro, NC(Zone 7b)

Linda, again I say "bless you." :D

Central, AL(Zone 7b)

For a small quantity of hot peppers. I freeze them as is. Then simply take them out of the freezer when I'm ready to eat them.

Thumbnail by Lily_love
Everett, WA(Zone 8a)

You go, Linda! I hope you all have fun.

Corey

SE Houston (Hobby), TX(Zone 9a)

1Lisac,
Thank you for the link that finally cleared up Ray's name. Which is NOT Ray Derphan!!!

Raider Fan, that is SOME piece 'a home! When I come back in another life as a tomato, put me in the sunshine, on top, overlooking some water, ok?

Hugs!

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