STARTING FALL GARDEN 2011 in ZONE 8-9a

Today, I almost died from heat exhaustion planting 6 tomato plants. I sure hope they're worth it! LOL I have about 6 more to plant, but will go out again EARLY tomorrow morning to plant them.

You probably know this but make sure your little tomato guys are shaded from the scorching sun. I put up shade cloth and take it down sometime in Sept? Can't really remember one year to the next! I haven't planted any for the fall yet. Probably should, huh?! Janet

Well, yeah, you ought 'a plant for the fall!

I was gone for several days, during which ALL my tomato plants and eggplants looked like death on a shoestring. So, I did a walkthrough to decide which were alive enough for me to take cuttings for a fall potentiality...and, I discovered a huge herd of STINKBUG nymphs and a huge herd of STINKBUG teenagers.

Can you say "DO NOT flick your Bic at a dry tomato plant???!!!"

After carefully putting out the fires, I managed to erradicate/permanently disable most of the Stinkbugs, so I'll not have THAT issue to deal with when I plant my cuttings this weekend...

And, God so graciously and kindly poured some water on all the plants immediately after I watered them...(He knew the plants really needed a nitrogen boost, and, that I might have missed a few smoldering stinkbugs...).

Fast forward a couple hours, and those new-growth suckers were standing up at attention, yelling, "Oooh, oooh! Me, me!! -- pick me, pick me!!!"

Ya'll be careful out there with all that dryness, yah hear?

Linda ^^_^^

P.S. I'm ripping the bells this weekend. They're nothing more than lush greenery and white blossoms, are seemingly sterile, and taking up space and water...

Oh, almost forgot. This is part of what I did yesterday to prepare for my fall/wtr veggie garden. Tomato seed-saving for 2012 is finished!




This message was edited Jul 7, 2011 1:46 PM

Linda, you're my hero!

Hugs!....

Steph, et al!
Just remember about flicking that Bic!!!!

^^_^^ (jumping up and down, stomping feet on flaming stinkbug as it hits the dry grass below...)

Oh my gosh, Linda. I needed that laugh so bad! Being a pyromaniac, it sounds like alot of fun! Glad nothing burned down!
I saw my first assassin bug today! Will wonders never cease?

Janet!
If you saw an assasin bug, jump for joy! And, check around to see where it's hanging out in your grass (hopefully there are more down there), and try to keep a perimeter of whatever foliage is down there. It's attracted to milkweed...

Tut-tut. Cookin' in the garden ... doesn't the recipie specify simmering tomatoes in a POT, over a STOVE?

Those cookbooks should be more specific ... lots of people will do anything to get a slightly fresher tomato.

But I think you went too far this time!

Corey

LOL, Rick!

I was more surprised than anyone when I realized the tomato leaves were flaring up!

But, I had a singlemindedness of purpose --

KILL A HERD OF STINKBUGS BEFORE THEY HAD THE CAPACITY TO FLY!!!

p.s. I think, subconsciously, I was going for a roasted tomato flavor! ^^_^^

Has anyone tried growing tomatoes from seeds in the spring from ones planted in the fall? Last year, we had tons of mater volunteers in our garden. We transplanted several of them and they did well and were very productive.

Today I tried to take a lesson from others and went through my tomato patch, removing branches that didn't look healthy or that seemed done. I should have been doing it all along. But now I can at least see what I've got and what may be worth hanging onto through the fall.

A couple days ago, I did remove some suckers -- watered them well and brought them inside, it is SO hot out there and I was afraid I'd put them in shade and then discover the sun moved and I'd just cooked them. Of course now I'm afraid to get them too close to a window for fear of THAT cooking them, lol. Anyway, they are looking straggly but hanging in there.

Linda, my bell peppers' second crop of blossoms is starting to produce -- marble-sized -- so we'll see what they do. My peppers are in pots so I don't have to pull them.

LOL

As for my harvest -- not much!

Tomatoes -- I am picking maybe one tomato a day and a couple cherry tomatoes. The tomatoes get picked before fully ripe and I let them finish indoors, to keep the birds from getting them.

Squash -- SVB got through my every defense, although I know my tin foil moved from watering and wind and left the vines unprotected at times. Plants look pretty pathetic. I did harvest a small (5 inch) zucchini, and hope at least 2 more patty pan will have time to get big enough to pick before the plants totally keel over. Not much to show from the plants though!

Cukes -- are also looking poorly along the bottoms of the plants -- still green at the top but no fruit growing anywhere now and the blossoms sort of all seem crowded together in knots at the top -- seems like a virus of some sort but maybe it's an environmental reaction of some sort. Time will tell.

Melons - I have 2 cantaloupes and 2 watermelon hanging in panty-hose slings on vertical vines. And they are so exciting to watch. Just waiting and waiting and waiting until I can pick them. Cantaloupe are full-sized but not ripe, and watermelon are pretty much the same size and shape -- and I have no idea how big this variety is supposed to get. I'd better go back and look at my seed packets.

Leafy stuff -- I'm harvesting a leaf or two of kale or Swiss Chard every day. I tuck them into a bag in the fridge and will make a sort of tomato-bean-kale stew here today or tomorrow in the crock pot. And shearing my basil and oregano plants pretty regularly and drying the leaves. I LOVE seeing my little herb bottles full!

Onions -- all done. I pulled the last of them a couple of weeks ago.

hrp50, don't feel inadequate -- although I know exactly how you feel! Notice that of my above paragraphs, there is not much to eat! One tomato, a leaf here and there and a lot of whining, wishing and waiting -- lol! But I'm learning. I think the biggest lesson to learn in gardening (aside from taking care of the soil, lol) is patience.

drthor -- you rock! Love seeing your harvests, garden plants and seedlings. Keep it coming. I feel like I'm playing chopsticks in the presence of Chopin when I look at my harvest and then see yours, but that's okay, I'm learning heaps and dreaming of when MY garden (hope, hope!) looks like yours someday!

Hey, Lise!
I've learned that this gardening venture is as much about the ADventure, as the harvest! I get a total kick out of seedlings popping from seeds -- even moreso than seeing tomatoes ripening on the vine. Go figure!

And, total victory when I discovered a whole herd of Assassin Bugs were providing pest patrol for Free!

And, finally growing an onion bigger than a ping pong ball! Mind you, they're all still out there, and I've only eaten about 3 out of the 50 or so there, but, for me, it was the joy of DOING it! Guess I better bring those onions in, huh?

BTW, how are you storing your onions?

P.S. It's almost time to start ordering onion plants for next year! I'm gonna plant out earlier this time. This year I set the plants on January 8th. This time, I'm going to set them out by mid-October or -November. I believe it was UberShoe or Farmerdill who advised that onions do best growing through the winter. Mine tolerated the slight freezes in February like little polar bears.

Here's to the next growing season, which is already right around the corner!

Linda

July 9, 2011 plan toward the f/w veggie garden:
►Snip off all the suckers I plan to grow for a fall crop (Sioux, Momotoro, Black Krim) ~ 3 of each
►Rip all the tomato plants that will not be grown in the fall
►Refresh the container soil and prep for the next wave of fall tomatoes
►Rip, or severely trim back, the bell peppers that aren't producing
►Relocate the "Fooled You" Jalapenos to more sunlight (they're producing well, but could do better...)
►Harvest the onions and prep the EBs for collard and mustard greens
►Sow seeds in large Jiffy pellets, GS 15-cell unit, and 4" nursery pots for the following:
Broccoli, Cabbages, Cauliflowers, collards, mustards, Romaine lettuce, spinach

Thanks for your 'to do' list, Gymgirl. Making decisions on what to do is the toughest part of gardening for me. I get overwhelmed and indecisive and then I find I'm late getting things done. And, lol, I think most of my post was actually intended for the other zone 8/9 thread, but oh well! lol.

My onions have all been consumed already. I grew about 50 but thinned out several throughout the season and ate those at a small stage; then it seemed the others were stalled at a certain point (about pingpong, a couple slightly larger) and weren't ever going to get any bigger, so that was it, I just pulled them. I let them dry outdoors for a few days, then trimmed them and put them in a basket in the kitchen. We ate the last of them just last night.

I did really enjoy growing them so am game to do it again. Maybe I'll order something too. Last year I just bought onion sets from Home Depot but there was no official variety aside from "red" and "white."

Would someone PLEASE turn down the heat out there and send us some wet stuff??? Makes me want to do anything but think about gardening!

Linda, when you sow your seeds, do you do it indoors or out and if you do it indoors, do you use the same set up as when you sow in the winter?

I know what you mean, stephanietx. I stare out my kitchen window and look at my poor fried yard. About all I get done is hauling hoses. My outdoor thermometer reads 102 right now. I can't last more than a few minutes out there.

And I can't figure out WHEN or IF to try to spray anything (fertilizer, garlic spray, whatever) onto my plants, since the directions always say not to do it in the heat of the day (but also don't spray at night or when bees are out, or or or...). I hope someone will let me know which FIVE MINUTES of the day might be appropriate? LOL.

On a more positive note, I'm thinking about doing one thing (one pot, one seed tray, one whatever) at a time in my kitchen, just to stay out of that heat. A vinyl tablecloth and keep the broom handy -- what do you think?

Hey Steph!
I've only sowed cole crop once before, last fall, as my first "winter sowing" adventure.

I used gallon-size milk jugs turned into winter sowin vessels with built-in lids. You can find them over on the WSing thread.

I've since learned I need to start earlier in order to have sizeable seedlings to plant out in mid-September. So, we'll be learning together!

My plan is to try both indoor AND outdoor sowing, and compare the results. It is oppressively hot outdoors now, and, I'm already feeling like the ones indoors will be much better off. At the very least, they'll be cooler and protected from the draught.

The ones outdoors will be grown under the patio cover, with a lot of natural breeze blowing over them. It'll still be warm air, though. But, we'll see what happens.

I found large Jiffy 16 pellets that I'll use to sow some of the seeds. I'll sow some in my Gardeners Supply deep-root 15 systems. And I'll sow some seeds in 4" nursery pots. Depending on when they decide to germinate, they'll either go under lights indoors or under the patio cover.

So, there you have it. Now, I'm off to snip tomato cuttings!

Hugs!

Linda

I think when I said like in the winter, I meant inside under lights. Thanks for the info, though. I think I'm going to try start stuff inside and then work on moving them outside.

So, as of today, I ripped and snipped half the tomato plants. I put the cuttings in containers of water with a couple spoons of diluted MG water soluable. I figured they wouldn't mind a teeny tiny hit to perk em up, since they looked like death on a shoestring.

Tomorrow, I'll rip n snip the remaining tomato plants. Hopefully, by Monday, I can sink the cuttings into some repurposed potting mix.

Linda

I did that about a week ago but kept the tomato snippings in the water too long. Peee-You! So, then I buried them sideways in a bed with nothing in it and covered with about an inch of soil/compost. Most will probably die (or were dead) but I might get some to root. I'm going to check them this evening. I guess I feel like, if they don't make it, there's always the option of buying plants... :) I'll be putting away my first cleaned up tomato seeds today and anxiously await the info on when to start them for next Spring.

I threw a bit of Epsom Salt into the hole when I planted my maters. Hope it helps them survive. lol

Janet,
I sowed my tomato seeds after December 21st (the Winter Solstace), on January 8th. My timing from seeds to seedlings was about 27 days. I began planting out March 19th. My intended plantout date was to be February 15th, but I fell behind. Hope to get em out by 02/15/12!

Keep in mind, they will need protection!

Linda

Ok, ok. What progress is being made toward our Thanksgiving bounty in zones 8-9a?

Here's my progress report toward my fall/winter garden.

My 3-shelf grow station is all set up and ready to receive seed trays! Eight concrete blocks, 3 shelves, 12 fluorescent lights.

Good to see your post, Gymgirl. Your light set-up looks so good and easy, I think I'm just going to show your photo to hubby and say, I want that!

As for what's happening here -- Not that much, and I'm feeling a little panicked to know that I'm headed out on vacation in a week or so and will likely be gone most of August. I can enlist a son to do bare basics watering, but won't be here to mother seedlings, unfortunately. I don't think I'm quite fanatic enough to take seedlings along on the road trip, lol.

In the last week, I did the following:
-harvested the last of a whopping 2 cantaloupes my vines produced (but they were GOOD!)
-harvested (yesterday) the only watermelon my vines produced (but it was and is GOOD!) - I am definitely going to keep trying to grow both kinds of melons.
-picked a few leafy things (kale, chard, herbs) and a couple late tomatoes (one was good, the other not so good)
-watering what's left. I started 2 pumpkins a couple weeks ago, and they are growing like crazy -- everything else is just hanging in there, or trying to in this heat.That includes a few tomato suckers in little pots, 5 bell pepper plants that are producing a second crop, plus whatever I already mentioned. I have one seed tray going with squash and chard but it's a battle keeping them happy (warmth without cooking, sun without frying, and not letting them dry up). I don't have much hope for them once I'm on the road!

In other garden activities:
-pulled up dead or dying cantaloupe, cucumber, zucchini and patty pan vines, and a few sickly tomato plants that were in pots. I held insects at bay for a long time, but with the heat stress and my not spending as much time out there lately, eventually insects had their way. Or maybe it was just time.
- emptied old tomato pots into the garden beds to add depth -- am trying to raise the level of the beds behind my long row of cinder blocks.
- hoed weeds from an 8' section along my side fence, where I will likely try to make another veg garden bed.
- hubby repaired a crack in the lid of a big tote where I keep garden supplies. It started leaking, so cleaned and re-organize the stuff in there. Only thing I lost was some cornmeal that had been in a paper sack.
- turning the compost heap a little every day.

My NEXT plans:
- refresh bed where the melons and squash used to be.
- try air-layering technique on tomato plants (the video I posted yesterday)
- screen some soil and compost so I have some nice light stuff for seedlings.
- figure out what I am doing. (A biggie -- What can I plant now, that my son can keep alive? What do I need to order? What will I grow this fall?)

I am finishing up a non-garden-related project at the moment that needs to get done in the next week, too, and that sure isn't helping me feel organized! But, life is good.

Hi, Guys!

Today was seed sowing day. First order of business was sterilizing last season's seed starting mixes. I bought an old microwave oven earlier this year, just for this job.

First, I wet the mix really well, then nuke it for 20 minutes. I use a large hard plastic popcorn bowl that can take the heat. After it's nuked, I fluff the mix quickly to release the steam, then cover the bowl with a large plate to hold in the steam. Then I move on to another batch, and by the time the second batch is nuked, the first batch is finished the sterilizing process. I fluff it again to cool it a bit more, then fill my seedling vessels.

I sowed 15 cabbage and 15 cauliflower seeds in the Gardener's Supply APS Deep Rooting System. I like this system because the seedlings develop a really big root ball, compared to seeds rooted in shallower cups. I only have two, and am considering getting another one or two.

I also sowed Broccoli seeds in two different containers. Nine seeds were sowed in a deep 9-cell tray, almost as deep as the APS system. I really would like to find more like this one. Nine more broccolis were sown in 8 oz. Yogurt cups.

The seedling mix is warm when I sow the seeds, and I water them in with warm water. Then, I quickly shove them into plastic drawstring bags and tie them up. This sets up humidity, and seems to hold the warmth inside the bag. I noticed fast germination last season, and wondered if it was the heat inside the bags. When my tomato seeds came up, and I vented the bags, I stuck my hand inside. I could feel the heat built up in there! In any case, all of my 212 tomato and 65 bell pepper seedlings germinated.

I'm praying for the same success this season!

Godspeed and Good Harvest!

Then I remembered my friends who were expecting seedlings, so I sowed 12 Catskills Brussels Sprouts and 12 Calabrese Broccoli seeds in 6 oz. yogurt cups for them. The cups are in a cat litter tray that I placed in a clear plastic, drawstring bag.

I'm toying with sowing some Collard and Mustard seeds, but not sure I should start them so early. They grow so fast, I'm afraid they'd outgrow my light stand before I could put them out. I don't want to set them out in this heat, and I'm not sure it'll be cool enough in 8 more weeks.




This message was edited Aug 8, 2011 9:36 AM

Great job, Linda. That was a LOT of work! You're going to have another great garden.
When you wet the seed mix, do you drain the water or is there some left in the bottom of the bowl when you nuke it? I've never sown seeds indoors before, so I may have more really ignorant questions! Like, once the seeds come up, do you remove the plastic bags right away?
Thanks kid! Janet

Today, I looked out my kitchen window at my wilting cantaloupes. So tired of these hot temps and drought.

Janet,
There are NO ignorant questions in the garden!!! Questions are to us veggie growers as heat is to tomato plants -- can't grow without it ('em)!

If you've tried to wet seedling mix before, you know what a pain it can be to get the stuff to absorb water. I put a pretty good mountain of dry mix in the popcorn bowl, and break up any old clumps. I find that using hot water from my kitchen sprayer to moisten the mix helps. Just something about that heat!

To answer your question, I just eyeball how much water I add. If I'm in a hurry, I swirl the soupy mix around to try to get it moistened, and so I don't end up with wet mix only on top, and dry underneath.

If I have more time I'll wet it good, and let it sit for awhile, to absorb, before I nuke it. The very last batch I watered was REAL soupy, but I was wearing down. I nuked it anyway, and by the time it cooled down, it was pretty wet but not soupy. That mix can hold LOTS of water.

It becomes your call on how "wet" you plant it. I used to squeeze the mix so dry it crumbled and didn't even stick to my hands. My recent experience (all those tomato seeds!) showed me I could leave the mix more damp (but not drippy wet).

I think the potting mix needs to be damp enough at sowing, that you don't even think about watering again before that first seedling declares.

I pulled the drawstrings and tied 'em shut. I poked two dime size vent holes in the top of the bag. I want that humidity to stay built up. The run-off helps keep the soil moistened, too!

Hope I wasn't too wordy.

And, you just ask away.

P.S. I've decided to sow the Mustards and Collards tomorrow. I should be ok on the plantout in 6-8 weeks, so, expect more pics!

Hugs!

P.S.S. Since I'm continuing tomorrow, I'll take some step x step pics along the way.

Several weeks ago, I sowed my cantaloupe seeds. This is what it looked like last Sunday. We have added more straw to the right of the bed now, too.

This morning, I found these!

Steph!!!
Those are sooooo cute! Eat one for me!

Today, I sowed 6 Georgia Collards and 8 Florida Broadleaf Mustards. These will grow in 7 patented Earthboxes. I love growing greens in the EBs, cause they are serious waterhogs, and those built-in reservoirs sure help out. When the greens are at full steam, I end up watering morning & evening.

The collards grow so fast, I have to grow twice as many mustards to keep up! I harvest 18"-20" leaves about every 6 weeks at the peak. Then clean, blanch, and freeze. I should process about twelve gallon-size freezer bags this season.

Then, I'll do the same with the turnip greens and spinach.

"Lilly Mae's Greens," here I come!

Subbing !

I'm still a beginner. Would love to hear more about epsom salts and tomato plants. I pulled up 1/2 the garden today (old tomatoes) and planted Four Champion II tomatoes.

Summer was a bad tomato season for us... We've done better before...perhaps it was the varieties we planted.

Also - I'm gonna tell hubby that we are NOT allowed to plant Peppers anymore. Every year the veggies are too small. We don't have much room and will find something else (like tomatoes) that will taste much better home grown.

Anyway - another mistake I think we've made is fertilizing the Tomatoes BEFORE they set fruit... any advice on that appreciated.

Thanks All !

Mary

Hey, MaryandLance!
I use Epsom Salts (Magnesium) to green things up. Just about 1 tbsp to a gallon of water when I use it on my veggie seedlings, keeps em' nice and perky. I also use it on my lawns. 1 lb for my front lawn, 1 lb for my yard. Same greening up!

Have you started seeds for your fall/winter garden, yet? Better hurry! You're burning daylight to have seedlings ready to plant out by October 1st!

Hugs!

This message was edited Aug 8, 2011 4:13 PM

This message was edited Aug 8, 2011 4:13 PM

Hey Gymgirl ! Thanks for the advice! I'm much too "beginner" to do the seed thing... I transplanted (I said planted

Oops... it cut off my message... somehow. Anyway transplanted 4 Champion II Tomatoes yesterday.

Gymgirl - I see you are in Houston... if you or anyone is interested.... a Gardening Lunch in September in Baton Rouge:
http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/1204857/

OH! Please do :o) We aren't far from Houston ! (not for plants anyway LOL)

My apology for my OT contributions. So, back on track for prepping for our fall/winter veggie gardens, eh?

Saturday and Sunday, I sowed seeds for broccolis, cabbages, cauliflower, Brussels sprouts, mustards and Collard greens. Last year I sowed broccoli, cabbages, cauliflower, and Brussels sprouts seeds, and they took at least 18 days to come up.

I left home for two days, and EVERYTHING has come up!!!

I wasn't even gonna look at 'em for another week. So, I happen to peep and I see one leggy seedling and I think, "oh one came up". Then I look closely, and they're all up. Have you ever prayed for your seedlings NOT to come up?

Well, I shoved 'em under the lights and promptly realized that the vinyl mini blind labels were too tall, so clip, clip and the light came down.

So, now, breathe...

But, some of them are leggy stupid, and I'm not about to reseed 'em all. So, these are gonna sink, or swim. When they start filling out, I'll do another experiment and plant them deep.

We shall see. That's my story, and I'm sticking to it.

>> vinyl mini blind labels were too tall

I've had that problem, too!

Now I know to keep the labels for trays where I want to use a humidity dome under 4-4.5".

>> Have you ever prayed for your seedlings NOT to come up?

No, but when I wanted to collect Zinnia seeds beofre the rainy season, I wished those darn colorful, pretty blooms would hurry up, turn brown and DIE!


Corey