General Discussions - 2010 - Chapter 31

And the eggplant. Need to give the bales another "Hair Cut"

Last but not least... The purple tomatillio...

Well, thats the summary and I could not be happier Ken with this type of gardening. I know that I will be doing both raised beds and hay bales next year. My only problem is that some of the tomatoes are near the top of my 54 inch cages.

nini, is that a bottle or a bucket? How is that a soaker hose? It looks like gravity flow. Your plants look terrific. So nice to see some good plants growing. Our weather finely broke and turned a little warm. In the mid 70s, with high 40s at night. Best we have seen since last year.

I did get my tomatoes planted today. So things are looking up.

nini: excellent photos! Keep up the good work!

Kent

Jnette

I was sleepy when I posted the photos. It is a 5 gallon bucket set up with soaker hoses off of them onto the bales. It is gravity flow, that is he reason you see them sitting on top of 3 cinder blocks. I started off with two and did not have enough lift to get the water flowing and had to go to three because of the hight of the bales. The buckets are set up like a soaker arrangement off of a rain barrel would be. Seems to be working Ok so far. It takes about a day or two for the 5 gallons to run out.

Nini , you old thang , you . Absolutely beeuutiful . The plants look good enough to eat, even without catsup . I'm tickled pink for you .

Hey gang- I'm developing a new passion which works great with bale gardening, or ANY type of gardening: VermiComposting. Worm composting not only breaks down your compost much faster, but it also creates castings which are the most productive and beneficial compost/fertilizer/soil enhancement that there is, and it's SO simple. A woman in Idaho has a phenominal blog site (and even offers ecourses (for FREE!) in VermiCulture. If you're interested, check out http://www.vermiculturenorthwest.com/castings.htm. Apparently out of the thousands of worm species, only about 6 are effective composting worms (Red Wigglers!) and all they really need is shredded newspaper and some blended fruit/veggie matter and they'll create black gold for you!!!! Check it out.

Not sure how that would work with bales. Can you explain in a seperate thread?
Thanks!

catmad- I don't know how to start a new thread here, but I always use a cup or so of soil wto each plant when I plant in my bales. Catings are so rich in nutrients and apparently have some moisture retention properties as well, and will not burn plant roots. I think it would be an ideal fertilizing enhancement for bales, as well as for flower and in-ground gardening.

Go to the Strawbale page, and at the bottom you can start a new thread. I just thought that other people (who aren't reading here) might benefit from the info.

the only problem might be the heat in the bales would be bad for the worms, but since i have 3 bins of worms, i may try after the weather warms up a bit.

oh no- you wouldn't put the worms in the bales! You could just use their castings/vermicompost to plant with your plants.

Suz, that link doesn't work.

If you just drag over it and copy and paste into your browser, it works.

Hi ya SBG"s
I think I remember reading about planting asparagus between the bales. Has anyone tried that, or can I find info somewhere? The rest of my veggies are starting to look really cool...am very excited about "fresh"veggies"...I do have a Worm Factory and will be setting it up this week. Will take a little while to reap the benefits; however, will give it time and care and with some luck, I won't have to buy bags and bags of eco compost.

Hi mainejei; I don't know about planting it between the bales, unless that would be one way to get started to make sure you didn't disturb it the first year. Asparagus has deep roots and takes a couple years to get a good root system before you can start harvesting any. The way I planted mine was to dig down 6" and place a strip of vinyl siding along the edge of where I planted it, to keep the grass from growing over into its space. It only had 1 to 2 shoots from each plant come up the first year. I left it alone for 2 years. This is now the third year and I only felt it safe to take 2 shoots ( sprouts ) from a row of 14 plants. I do have 2 other plants I started several years ago that are providing enough to serve maybe 1 or 2 times a week. To sum it up I would say to treat it like a fruit tree. It has to have time to produce.
I hope this has been of some help. I know your soil is much different than mine but asparagus will have to have a bed of its own.
Russ

Hi Mainejae, that may have been me, I asked for any advice :). Now I can say that, Yes, I tried it, or rather, I am trying it. I agree with Russ that it needs a bed of it's own, but I'm also very lazy, and have lots of room. So, I made two rows of three bales each (about 6-8 inches apart), and "planted" the crowns in between. Then I planted strawberries in the bales. Well, the strawberries died :(. But the asparagus (at least most of it) did grow. There was a teeny-tiny little spear from each crown, and they are now fluffy ferns. I couldn't stand the bales being empty (wasted!!), so they have become my squash patch.
The bales will be pretty much flat by next spring, I think. I'll probably top these with soil, and begin another "bed" at one end or the other. I don't plan to put new bales on top of the old, just let them become part of the landscape. The places where I left old bales before are now very nicely rotted, and seem to be very nicely textured, um, dirt, I guess.
HTH

cat that may be a nice place to start your strawberries, unless it would be where you don't want them.
Couple years ago I tried strawberries in containers. Worked fin during a mild winter, but the next winter the roots freeze dried and I lost them.
In this climate I'm destined to put them in the ground. And mulch them in the fall. You might be able to use containers, I don't know.
Just checked in for a bit but gotta run. I'm watering my sweet potatoes and need to shut it down before I forget it.
Russ

Got the tomatoes, yellow banana peppers, lettuce, eggplants, and some herbs in the bales Sunday. It has been cool and has rained since last night. I prepped the holes with compost from my garden. I know I planted them a bit early in the bales but I really needed to get them in, which is why I used the compost in the holes. When it stops raining I plan to add more compost on the surface around the plants. It looks like it may be a few more days!
Shawn

Shawn,
I did the very same thing, I planted half my bales with Roma and Brandywine tomatoes, along with a bunch of marigold, because it was nice, cool, and rainy outside. Most of the bales were ready but a few were not and still heating up. Now we need to keep an eye on the plants, if they start to wilt, cool them (the bales) down by watering them... may have to do it for a couple days!
Good luck!!
Bev

Has anyone ever used a old half rotted large round bale of hay? I always seem to end up with one or two of them and haven't made little squares in 10-15 years. For those of you that are wondering no I wasn't planning on putting it anywhere near my yard.

Randy

boy Randy- I've always thought how neat it'd be to garden in one of them! It'd take a lot longer to ''cook' with a LOT of urea (or several keg parties worth of guys peeing on the bale for a week!)and a ladder, but you could grow a LOT of stuff in one of them. If you could unroll it and lay it flat, it'd be amazing.

I've had more than one farmer offer to unroll a bad round bale in my yard if I wanted it, but I just don't have a means to utilize one right now! Kent could probably fill up all his raised bed boxes with just one of them!

Bev - your bales look taller, are they stacked 2 high? Also, did you wrap them in plastic and did you like shrink wrap the whole row before starting to water? Bet that keeps them upright and holding water pretty good.

To all of you, when you use a soaker hose, do you turn it on for a short time to get water to flow through to the end, then turn it off while that water soaks in, then turn it back on to really get it watered well? If I just turn it on, the water runs off.

Guess what I found? See the photo below? There is a matching hole on the other side of the bale. We did dig this side out a bit in order to put the poison pellets in. Makes me sick. I visit the bales twice a day looking for any plant damage. None so far, we'll see in the AM. Busy little boogers those gophers are at night. Need more owls. I have some things (onions, radishes, carrots and pole beans) in containers away from the bales, besides the ones next to the bales. Look at the picture in the next post.

Suzan, if I were to get one of Randy's bales, Are you volunteering to unroll it???? :>) He is only about 350 miles from me. LOL

I really fell into a bargain today, One of our neighbors in town here called me today and asked if I could till up her garden patches. I agreed I could. So I gased up up the garden tractor and changed the oil quick and run it down town.
some places where the ground was a little hard I went over it twice.
I mean it really done a good job. Then she had a patch of straw berries that had got really weedy. She had me till up the weedy part and cut it back down to size. I told her I wouldn't mind picking up some of the ones I tilled up so she and I picked up a small tub of them. I hadn't planed to charge anything for the tilling but she insisted so I come home with a tub of strawberry plants and $40.00.
Well There planted in two seperate patches and have all been watered. I feel the Lord was smiling down on me. I didn't count how many plants but it made 4 long rows, spaced about a foot apart and 3 feet between the rows. I went back down, took her tub back with some radishes from my garden and a few sweet potato plants. Needless to say we were both happy.
Her origanel plan was to use one of those little Mantis cultivator. It didn't take her long to decide the job needed something bigger. lol
Happy gardening.
Russ

In this (artificial) wine barrel, I have sweet onions and a few radishes planted. Se how the gopher (s) is digging around it? It is almost like he thinks the whole thing will just drop down. Reminds me of a shark circling a boat with people on it.... This is not the only pot they have done this to!

QG Your maters are looking good in spite of the gophers. Guess some rat wire may be in order next year. Laid down under the bales and sticking out from under the bales on each side about a foot. It would keep them out but would make a rather hard job for you in the fall or when you wanted to roll the wire up and put it away for the winter.
Or plant a bunch of Castor beans around your garden. Give them rascals a good belly ache. Don't really know the answer.
Russ

quiltygirl wrote;'To all of you, when you use a soaker hose, do you turn it on for a short time to get water to flow through to the end, then turn it off while that water soaks in, then turn it back on to really get it watered well? If I just turn it on, the water runs off."

I just turn it on. I'm wondering if you're using the type of soaker that's like a "regular" hose with lots of little actual holes, or the kind (which I use) that just weeps. The weepers don't put water out fast enough that it can run off my bales, even before they began to decomp.

Garden2heaven, I run a lot of water in them. One of the things I like best about baling is that I don't seem to be able to over water. What's too much simply puddles around them, and give me very wet feet.

Russ, that's a good deal for both you and your garden friend! I love it when things work out like that!

QG, Hopefully you can understand what's going on with a side view of one of my bale set ups in the pic below. The bales on the left side are nearly buried in the ground while the ones to the right are atop a mound of dirt. We dug out the bank to make the trellis structure level. I wrapped the bales around the outside with black plastic (not shrink-wrapped tho). It does seem to help the bales stay wetter for a little longer.

I have flat soaker hoses with holes on one side (holes turned down) and leave the water on 1/2 throttle for an hour or so then turn it off. I can usually tell by looking if the bales are wet enough. We did have to drill more holes in the soaker hoses (about 6-8" apart) after we realized that not all the bales, or plants in some circumstances, were getting enough water. As soon as we made that adjustment, the bales started softening up and produced a few mushrooms!

I'm impressed with nini's bucket and soaker hose set up, too! I think that would work well with a rain barrel storage system! We are currently using the well, but have a rain water backup.

I really hate to see the problems you're having with the gophers. I had no idea they would do things like that!! I agree with Russ about the wire fencing under the bales and wonder if there was any way to do it now!

Thanks for all the info. I actually have 2 hoses running along my bales. One is the weeping kind and the other is the flat ribbon kind with holes facing down. They are each attached to a separate hose as it takes time for the water to make it around. I am on a well that has 65 gpm and we have blown pressure regulators, or I would have a dripline on a timer. I do have some 'shrooms! We have been blessed with a mild spring and even had some rain at the end of April and mist yesterday - a lot for us. No 100 degree days yet either. But they will come.... We have had a lot of wind, but not the HOT, DRY winds yet. They will come.... My bales are right out there for the wind.

Based on my readings and questions here, it sounded like gophers would not be a problem. Duh? Why would I think that. Everything that goes INTO the ground has a hardware cloth or, minimally, a chicken wire basket! I took a picture to the nursery last month and the Master Gardener gal that teaches the classes had never heard of strawbale gardening. However, Another employee I have talked to before saw the photo and said "I hope you put wire down. Oh s- - t. DH said 'too late', but DD said she would help try. DH was right. Besides the weight of pulling them up even slightly to try to slide wire even a half at a time, they were just going to come apart. Oh well, live and learn for next year. I will just need to be vigilant with poison and keep dogs away.

Russ, what is rat wire? Have not seen castor beans in packets in stores.

Thanks for all your input guys and gals.

qg I'm not certain but Castor Beans may be an outlawed noxious weed in CA. I have plenty of the beans, If not illegal I could send you some.
Rat wire is probably a slang term but it is a fairly heavy wire commonly used in the bottom of rabbit cages. The little square holes are only big enough for a rabbit "pellet" to fall through about 3/8"sq It's heaver than poultry wire. The C/Bs were advertised in a couple seed catalogs but I didn't check weather or not they could be shipped to CA. Someone let me know and I could send you some. They grow pretty big here is a end of season picture of some in my garden.

and another

I got home too late to water tonight but I plan to use the soaker hose while I shower in the morning and then go give the bales a good watering before work. I'll have to get up at 5am to do that but I am okay with that. I am interested in seeing what happens. It was sprinkling when I got home tonight but I am not sure we will have any real rain tonight.

Bev, this is the latest I have ever planted. I feel like such a slacker!! I am hoping I can spread out some seed a bit later this month. So much going on this month. Testing at work, kid graduating, family coming, working after work with my hubby, and all the rest that comes along with being a wife and mother. Relay for Life this weekend so Sunday I may have to go to bed really early! :) Have to get up and do it all again come Monday! LOL!

QG, What Russ is talking about is Hardware cloth. (rat wire) And next, my caster beans do not grow anything like Russ's. I don't know why his grow the way they do, probably all the manures etc. he has used over the years. However, in CA they might grow like that too.

Boy, Russ- that was a sweet deal! To make a friend, and get $$ and strawberry plants, too?? Beautiful!

Russ, I checked the CA Invasive plant list and it appears as 'limited' and, I guess, still being evaluated. They make it difficult for us 'non scientists' to read that info. At first I was using regular chicken wire, but fear that is not strong enough. They do sell a galvanized chicken wire with smaller holes and heavier, double, wire. But, currently I have a roll of hardware cloth that I am making the 'baskets' for roots of plants to go into the ground. I have either left a short collar above ground or folded it back to cover the top of the root ball at the surface. Not so attractive, but.... That would be great if you could share some of your Jack in the Beanstal, oops, I mean Caster Beans.

Shawn, I feel like I get later and later planting my garden every year. We all just do what we can, as much as we can, and hope that's enough. Every little bit of the veggies we get planted will hopefully help us nutritionally and economically! Remember to have fun, too, LOL!!!

Hello again,

Its my last day in New Zealand!!! Tomorrow Im off to Brisbane. The weather is really bad here, cold and stormy, but finally some RAIN!!! Lots of it. So much packing to do. Things for storage too. Need to get back to it asap. Ill check in again soon when Im settled in my new home. Just wanted to quickly say hi, let you know Im still here somewhere If all goes to plan Ill have a new garden before long.

While I was in Palmerston North last week I had a quick peek over the fence at my old garden. Its a little bit overgrown, but mostly just really empty for this time of year. Obviously nothing had been planted in my carefully prepared beds. Fruit trees looked ok, hard to tell when they have lost most of their leaves though. Im ready to let it go.

Graduation was fun and exciting. My family came down, we walked around taking photos and meeting my old class mates. Good thing I had cut my long hair off a while ago, or the silly little hat would not have fitted me. The pic is with my sister.

Hope your all enjoying the start of summer. Gardens are looking great!
Will check in again soon.

Lena