March on the Homestead

Hey Robin... I know about those tire ruts... our drive looks awful, being as it cuts across a slope and the water from the hillside tends to pool there; our ruts are deep enough to nearly bottom out the cars. Every year I think, "I need to trench that and put in a culvert" and every year things dry out and I 'forget', or rather get caught up in all the other things need doing.

Thanks for the onion info, podster... but I've been using soilless seedling mix, and they are on a germination mat... germination isn't the problem, the problem is they are pushing themselves out of the mix, exposing the root. I've picked up some straight perlite to try that... once they get themselves sprouted, I'll move them into seedling mix. That's the plan, anyway.

It was clear up to 31º this morning, up into the 60's yesterday... with freezing daytime temps predicted over the weekend. Thunderstorms or maybe it will be snow this afternoon... must be spring. It can't tell if it's coming or going. LOL

Not much will be happening round here today... I'm on the road this weekend, so just getting things set up for me being gone. The peas in the soil blobs are sprouting, so I'll be able to plant them next week (when it's supposed to be warm again, unless of course it's not). None of the peas I direct seeded have come up. I'm trying to remember where I put the mouse trap.

Whew...I can't believe I had the bright idea to dig up this Butterfly Bush. It's getting the best of me! I've just spent almost 2 hours digging down and around it and I might have it loose enough to finish pulling out with the garden tractor. If not, I guess I'll dig more out from under it, so I can cut any deep roots. It's about 4 years old and I knew it wasn't going to be easy, but now I'm thinking I should have just cut it all the back and put a stump killer on it.

We started with a hayfield 8 years ago and probably need twice as much gravel as we've already had put down. But like you, when it's dry, we just don't think about it.

Already 63* here and still sunny. Yeah!

Hi. I'm new here but love the GH heating ideas. We don't have one yet but plan to build one, hopefully later this year. We are thinking about using geothermal heat. Has anyone tried it? We could use ideas. BTW, yesterday it was 65 here and the spring bulbs were starting to bloom. Today we have 2 inches of snow on the ground. It's been so wet that we haven't been able to till or get anything in the ground yet. Frustrating!

What is geothermal? Guess i won't be much help to you. LOL

Nope, don’t have much to work with here as far as geothermal goes. But we are looking into all sorts of things around here.

Hey Robin. In reference to your compost heating, give this some thought. Is there any way you can place thin walled flu pipe or something similar through your pile so that both ends stick out. The idea is to let the higher internal heat of the pile heat the air in the pipe. As the hot, or at least warmer, air leaves the pipe it will draw in cooler air and start a circulation. This should (maybe?) transfer more heat from the pile to the surrounding air. But I guess if it works too well you might cool the pile enough that it stops generating heat. May not work but it sounds good. (grin)

Oops! Deleted as duplicate post.

This message was edited Mar 20, 2010 2:11 PM

I’m forgetting my manners TexaninKS, welcome to the conversation. I know about the frustration, my potatoes are just breaking ground and getting their first bunch of leaves and now the temps are going down into the low to mid 30’s for the next couple of nights. Sure hope we don’t get a heavy frost out of it. At least my procrastination on setting out the tomatoes and peppers paid off this time, maybe I will only have to plant them once this year. LOL

Welcome, Tex! Hate to hear you getting that kind of weather, cuz it means it's headed our way.

I've heard the word, but don't recall much about it. Tell us about it and we'll kick around some ideas. :)

Neighbor came back in and went over the garden he plowed last week. It looks SOOOO good! I figured I'd have a ton of work getting my wide rows set up, because I didn't think his equipment would do such a nice job. Was I ever mistaken! He appears to be interested in some of my gardening techniques. Surprising, seeing as he and his wife are old school farmers.

Well, I need to head back outside. Lots to do, plus I'm cutting way down on my smoking today. Seems pretty easy so far, when I leave them in the house and I'm clear over in the garden. Just doesn't seem quite so important if it means I've got to hike to have one. Wonder if I ought to string up some halagen lights so I can continue working out there till bedtime. LOL

Lizard, maybe...need to think about this.

Welcome Tex. Sorry I overlooked that. Where are my manners?

Robin, I hope you are able to quit smoking altogether. It would be a great gift to yourself.

My goats have near about agravated (sp?) the crap out of me today. I got the fence charger hooked up. Turned them out and Molly went under the fence. I caught her and tossed her back over the fence. Then i had to swat her a couple of times for trying to come back under again. Then Dusty came through and wouldn't let me catch her. The fence must have shocked her because she would not cross it to go back in. I had to chase her until I gave up. I turned the fence off and left. Then she went back in. So I put them all back in the goat house. Back to the drawing board. Guess I'll have to string more wire closer together.

I'm pooped and I still have half my work to do. Oh well, the day is young. If I could just get rid of this nagging pain and weakness I could get some more done. I wanted to try putting my red hen back in the flock. I also wanted to get some basil planted.

Thanks for the welcomes. I've also read about using pipes to vent compost heat to the GH.

Also smoking here and know I need to stop, as we all do.

Nagging pain and weakness, Cajun? What's up with that? Retired therapist here, sorry, can't help it.

We are debating whether to have a cow or goat for milk--don't really want milk but do want butter and cheese. Your thoughts to a newbie?

Still snowing. Geez.

Well, I am glad I'm behind the growing curve this spring ~ low 30°s for the next three nights. The only things I put in the ground are cold hardy vegies and herbs so I won't lose sleep this time. And the wind is blowing so hard I saw some of Jayryunens' New Mexico hilltop go by!

TexaninKS ~ glad to have you join us... sounds like you are displaced and missing TX? I know I would in wintertime for sure. I have not seen much geothermal mentioned on DG. We have a customer that installed that years ago and heats/cools his home. I honestly don't know how deep they went. My BIL is building a large garage and using it for that in MN. Unfortunately to do it correctly is cost prohibitive for most of us poor folks. We have a friend here that is building his own house with a GH attached so he can draw from the GH heat during the day. He is also doing a poor boy form of geothermal using what I believe is known as earth pipes or tubes. He is not going deep but I honestly don't know the depth or length he is planning. I will be curious to see how his system works. As I understand, it is his intent to have the warm or cool air simply circulate by convection without a fan to assist the movement. He recently finished a self composting commode and intends to fertilize with humanure. I am always interested in seeing what he comes up with next and how he implements it.

If anyone is interested this is an excerpt explaining the geothermal in laymans terms.

I thought I saw someone waving when it when over the house. LOL.

Yeah, my taters are the only thing I’m worried about out there. Everything else is cool stuff except the corn, but it won’t be up for another few days are so anyway. Then again the wind may uncover everything too.

I would think all that damp, cool air would introduce a lot more moisture into the space your trying to cool. With our already high humidity wouldn’t that just create a fungus garden on the walls?

I’ll be up in your neck of the woods Monday Pod. Have to go to New Summerfield and pick up hanging baskets. That may change though if it doesn’t warm up by then. Will summer ever get here?


This message was edited Mar 21, 2010 12:47 AM

I am hurting like crazy this morning. Pushed too hard yesterday I guess. I'll miss Sunday school but hope I can make church. Tex, .I have MD. I do good most days. If you want butter, goats won't help. The fat molecule in goats milk is too small to make butter. But that is what makes it easy to digest for folks with stomach problems.

Hanging baskets for resale? I have a friend that went up to New Summerfield a couple weeks back and bought a ton of annuals. Bet she is gnashing her teeth this morning. Your taters will be just fine even if the tops get nipped. One spring mine were bit back 3 times ~ not to worry. They will be just fine.
I don't know about the humidity factor in geothermal but it surely couldn't hurt in a GH?

Dark & gloomy here ~ if it doesn't get above "Brrrr" today, I am not going out! I can deal with cold & sun or gloom & mild but not this weather... come on springtime.

Good Morning from sunny, windy central Texas! We are about to get blown away. At least the wind didn't allow frost to settle, even though the thermometer said 32 at daybreak.

Have heart, Podster....spring is definitely on the way!

Since I garden under hay, I just propped flakes of bale hay around my peppers, tomatoes and dill, and threw some more hay on the potatoes, beets, lettuce, etc. that are all well out of the ground. The Dutch cabbage, turnips and peas don't seem to mind a little freeze.
Too chilly still to work outside, but if this wind settles, I will get out to spade a few rows later today.

Sorry to hear about the MD, Cajun. I have peripheral neuropathy in both feet and have to avoid too much standing/walking.

Thanks to all for info. The poor boy geothermal is what we hope to do in the GH. Soil temp at 6-8 ft here is about 55. OK, no goat. Maybe a cow. Anybody know anything about Dexters?

Anybody have opinions on grain mills?

TexaninKS, hope your geothermal works out for you. I don't think it would be easy for us to do, as we are sitting on a pile of limestone rock. In order to dig a hole to plant a tree or fencepost, we have to pry enough rock out to make a hole, and then we have to try to find some dirt to fill it up again.

Wow, Caliche, I have the same problem! For fence posts I get a cushion, a radio, hand tools, and a cold brewski and sit down comfortably and begin digging around a big rock. Throw the rock out, dig out another big rock. Throw the rock out, etc. etc. LOL

TexaninKs, have you made butter and cheese before?

AZgrammie, I go after the rock with a 5' antique wagon axle that is flattened on one end. I throw it hard, and then while it it wedged, I pry at the rock. Faster than a hand pickaxe, as I am old as dirt, and don't have time to waste. LOL

Caliche I can just picture you prying the rocks out with an axle! You probably get good leverage with it. I think I'd have to jump up and down on it, like when I have to get the lugs off a flat tire. I never mastered the use of a pickaxe, either. If you ever run out of rocks, come on over, I have tons of them. Especially in the road!

Got home this morning to find no frost at all and the taters doing fine if not a little wind blown. If this wind lies down we may have some frost tonight though. Right now I think there is a little sleet or fine snow mixed up in the misty rain. Have to look real hard but its there.

Your fire sure looked good.

Even in a GH too much humidity isn’t good. I think robin and her compost might be more efficient, especially if she could move the pile outside and pipe the heat inside.

The ladies are clamoring for the pretty stuff at the nursery now while the guys are still into the fruits, nuts and berry part of it so DW has decided I need to bring in some hanging baskets. We try to have unique things that you won’t find in the box stores.

I can’t spell cow much less know how to take care of one if I had one. Guess I will have to depend on barter for our milk and butter or do without. Told DW I didn’t want any livestock that I couldn’t pickup and walk off with.

Nope, haven't made butter or cheese but am willing and ready to learn! Actually, we made some butter just using cream from the store but that doesn't count. :) We are wanting to be more self sufficient, just started gardening last year, so are newbies. We bought 20 acres and hope to build a small house this spring/summer. It's KS so we don't have much but prairie so far.

As for the GH, think on this: If we run piping underground (where it's 55 degrees) and put a water/antifreeze solution in them, then continue that piping through the GH walls (snaking it around) and floor with this 55 degree solution in it, would it be enough to keep the GH at a temp for plants? That's our big question and we can't find anybody who can answer it. It's hard for me to explain and I probably didn't do it well. Anyway...

My daughter is in vet school (proud mama) so I'll depend on her for cow info. :)

Our snow is melting. Yeah!

(grumbling) Well, I wanted to try tilling the garden today on my day off, to supplement my lasagna beds, but it started raining at 1 a.m. and was still plugging alone with rain and wind when I got up at half past noon. Sigh. Something ate all of the tops off of my lettuce seedlings in the garden, but the spinach and potatoes seem to be doing okay still-I'm hoping the mice left the peas alone, but won't know until later in the week I'm sure. We are due for ice pellets and snow flurries tonight...winter's last hurrah I hope!

Had to move all of my deck seedling/planting/pots under the new n-sulate blanket that I got in preparation for tonight's low temps - calling for 34 in town, so it will be a few degrees colder here in the boonies. At least they got watered. Although, I had a recently moved outdoors flat of lettuce that I didn't put drain holes in and the red romaine was looking a little overwhelmed, being a few inches under water...LOL! I quickly poked holes in it to drain and hope they'll be okay.

Peppers finally came up today inside, and all of my tomato seedlings are looking strong and healthy; za'atar oregano came up like gangbusters, along with some roselle, but nothing from the Holy Basil (Tulsi) yet. The leeks all came up, and the black-eyed susan and dianthus are still peeping and growing. I have been really impressed with the seed I purchased from Baker Creek and also Horizon Herbs. I am getting really high germination rates, so will have to back off on my heavy-handed sowing techniques...haha! My flower seed is very old, so I sow it heavily and then forget the more 'fresh' things and sow them heavily too. At least herbs can be dried and stored if you have excess.

I'll be starting more lettuce, spinach and tomatoes this week, and maybe some summer and winter squash. I need to get my cabbage, broccoli and chard seedlings out in the garden soon too, and start another round of those, plus put some beets out in the garden. I hate waiting till past the freeze date but it is looking like I really should.

I've got a nice fire in the furnace, a new movie from Netflix and the new episode of Planet Earth-Life tonight, so I'm all set. Oh, and I also got some palak paneer this week, which I really, really like, so I'll be making some of that for dinner.

Welcome to the Homesteading forum TexaninKs - great folks here, with incredible ideas and wonderful sense of humor :)

Have a great week everyone!

This message was edited Mar 21, 2010 5:15 PM

I'm not too good yesterday and today. Pushed too hard Saturday and I'm paying for it. Did get all the work done and planted my 2 blueberry bushes. Also planted 5 concrete urns with different kinds of Basil. I have them covered right now with feed sacks so the predicted rains won't drown them. I also finished the #3 bed I was working on. The broccoli will go in it after this cool spell has passed. Need to start working on a #4 now.

Cajun, you're an inspiration to us all, how much you get done but just determinedly keeping at it. =0)

Welcome, Tex... where abouts are you in KS? Would you mind putting it in your ID info... it helps when folks are trying to figure out what conditions you are working with... I know they use forced air geothermal heating/cooling in the hog barns in Iowa, and yes, humidity does condense in the pipes, so a sump pump is necessary to keep up with that. As for your idea of circulating antifreeze... neat idea, the closest I know is of a woman who circulated water through piping in her compost pile to warm it and then under germination tables in her greenhouse, which also had the effect of raising the GH temp. It's her system got me thinking maybe I could do the same with my horse tanks to keep them thawed in the winter, but I haven't figured out how to keep the pile temp up for several months... she did, without turning, so I know it can be done, but the article didn't disclose her 'mix'... It was a SARE project, and if you look up SARE, there are all kinds of wonderful ideas being tried, maybe even something along your lines.

We got 6" of snow over the weekend, and another inch this morning, with warm in between, so things are just staying sloppy. The morning after the big snow it dropped to 8º and I lost all the broccoli that wasn't in wallo waters, so now I know they can handle 20º but not 8º and I'd better use wallo waters for them if I want to push the envelope again. Fortunately I held back some broccoli seedlings, so not a big deal.

Put out some of the peas in soil blocks to see if the mice will eat them once they're sprouted... time to start some shelling peas, me thinks. But it's soooo muddy between the house and the GH, I hate to slog through it....

Pulled the last of the overwintered carrots yesterday.... all firm and tasty. =0)

Thoughts on the goat vs cow issue.... though it is true that goat milk does not naturally separate, it can be separated using an electric cream separator. I've seen small ones advertised... they seem expensive, until you consider the cost of a good cow and her upkeep. Not to mention gallons of milk a day. I've got friends who separate their goat milk, make butter, etc.

I'd think a couple of goats and a cream separator would be a better choice. They'll be easier to handle, cheaper to buy and keep, less milk and you can make some mighty fine cheese from goat milk. If you turn out a clean product, it's also very easy to find folks who are looking for goat milk because their systems can't handle cow milk... kinda on the hush-hush, but if you put the word out, these folks will find you.

As for cattle breeds, I don't know what is common in your area, but you might look into a beef breed. They don't give such huge quantities of milk, will be less expensive than an exotic breed like a Dexter or miniature jersey, and you could get a good, well-handled heifer from 4H or FFA for a fair price. It'd probably be a whole lot easier to find a gentle beef heifer and a bull for her in the future than any of the minature breeds. Back on the ranches, they just milked whatever breed they ran... it's a rare ranch that has a jersey or guernsey. My farrier grew up milking his family's red poll cows.

Be warned, if you get into Dexters.... they do have a dwarfism problem, so educate yourself about that before you buy.

This message was edited Mar 24, 2010 11:46 AM

Hey, Jay, nice carrots! I'm hoping to get a big hoop house put up so that I can plant in the ground late summer for winter harvests. So much to do and want to do, that sometimes it's difficult to make a priority list.

TexaninKs, the reason I asked about whether you had made cheese and butter before....I haven't, but I think I remember it takes the cream off of about 3 gal of milk to make a pound of butter. Something you might want to find out for sure, as that might have some bearing on the breed you'd want to check into.

Yesterday I started marking off and setting up 3 deep wide rows (3' x 20') in the newly disked and plowed garden. Only about 27 more to go. Took half of the tomatoes out to the greenhouse. The temps dropped down to 35* overnight, 8* less than predicted, but they came through fine in the inner tent! Taking a break from that today and planted 5 roses I recently bought and putting in 50' of plastic garden edging across the front of the house. I'll come back in a day or two and finish clearing the ground for more plants later....maybe some of these Winter Sown flowers. But this afternoon, I think I'll go ahead and start potting up the greenhouse tomatoes. They are 12-15" tall in the 20oz solo cups and standing straight up, but I'm concerned about leaving them in these cups for another 3 or 4 weeks.

Hope everyone is having a great day!

Oh @#$%, we've got horizontal snow out there. %^( I could just kick something.

Robin, you do know it's not necessary to overwinter the root veggies in the GH? These were out in a raised bed, just covered by straw. I did a half-witted job of covering them this year--the straw blew away-- but if the straw is deep enough for your area, the ground doesn't thaw and the roots dug all winter. Frees up space in the GH, lets the soil rest or you can plant a cover crop on some beds while other beds bear leafy greens.

Is there just the one of you? 'Cause I am amazed at the amount of work you're getting done... of course, I'm stuck inside waiting for the ground to dry out enough, the temps to warm up enough, the everlovin' snow to stop.

I've just been reading an editorial by a guy whose opinion I have some respect for, and he's talking about major global food shortages within the next 3 years. Really getting down to the nuts and bolts of individual food security... know who produces what in your area: meat, veggies, eggs, milk. Build a relationship with them now, cultivate community now, wean ourselves from the industrial food titty now... hey, even if he's wrong (and he can be, spectacularly so) would what he suggests be a bad thing? As he points out, food poisoning is on the rise, food recalls are becoming routine (and frankly that they recall meat that was marketed 3 years ago is really scary), so raising your own and buying from friends and neighbors is, any more, basic intelligence.

I'm looking to add two more water collection tanks this year, hopefully another 3000 gallons. Enlarging the garden, and starting on a root cellar... and I see that Back to the Land Store has a foot powered small grain thresher! This is good news, for anyone that wants to raise a small plot of wheat. I'd sure like to get a look at it.

Everyone must have just taken breaks. Came in for my break and had 14 updated threads.

I know it's tough on you out there with that nasty weather. We go nuts here, even without the snow and muck, just because we aren't set up well enough to do anything in the winter other than hole up in the house.

Yeah, I'm here by myself right now. Al is working in Utah. He's been out there 5 weeks, with maybe another 3-4 weeks to go. I really get much more done when he is out of town. I work slow and steady for an hour or so, and then take a 15 break. Put in close to 10 hour days that way. Plus the weather has been near perfect for the most part, which is a big help. I also don't have any critters to take care of besides our dog. With Al gone, I was able to start a few hundred plants in the house, don't have to cook, have very few dirty dishes and it only takes 20-30 minutes to clean the house once a week. But I'll sure be glad when he's back.

Good to know about the carrots. I'm also reading about onions being overwintered in the garden too. Stephanie, maybe? My memory is failing me at the moment.

I agree about the food issues. I'm trying to rebuild my stockpile of staples again and I'm really focued on growing as much food for us as possible. I think with a hoop house and some serious planning, I can extend the season on a fairly large variety of vegetables. I'm on to something with the compost bin surrounded by plastic for an inner tent in the greenhouse, plus the additional layer of plastic next to the greenhouse walls. I had a couple of little tomato plants in the tent till almost Christmas before they bit the dust. Our heat pump is too big for this place, so we're working on an idea to attach a greenhouse and tie into the ductwork to help heat the greenhouse over the winter. We also have a line on local meat.

I need to get back to work. Keep reading so you can share all those wonderful ideas with us!

Onions are a little trickier for overwintering, as they aren't completely buried. But I did it a couple of years ago and some managed to survive to flower and set seed the next year. Deep straw and a cover of plastic to keep it dry... have to watch that it doesn't get too warm too soon and start them growing. Maybe some sort of 'roof' and open sides?

Yep, not having to cook and clean helps a lot. Just grab a bit and go. When I'm solo here, it's canned soup and sandwiches til the loved one returns.

OK, more fruits from the reading... the latest issue of the Small Farmer's Journal came yesterday, just in time I'd say. LOL In any case, besides Lynn Miller's ever thought provoking and sometimes just purely provoking editorials, there's a wonderful letters section from all sorts of folks both actually horse farming, wanting to horse farm, retired from it, and just straightforward admirers. I love the letters and all the voices and dreams and stories they tell. Here's a couple of excerpts from a letter by a 60+ reader, grew up in Maine...

"...my dad would say there are two kinds of farmers. You either sold what you couldn't eat or eat what you couldn't sell. We all sold what we couldn't eat, or traded in reality."

"Dad also said there were two kinds of farmers, those that farmed for money, and those that farmed with money. Everyone I knew farmed for money. But it never was money. You traded..."

"I think you need two things to be a farmer. First, you need a leg up." And he tells the story of his aunt fronting him the money for his first wood lot, and how everything else he's gained in the world stemmed from that first wood lot.

"Next, you need someone who believes in what you do." And I think we all know the truth of that.

"So now I have two things to remember.
First, be thankful every day for what you DO have, not what you don't.
And second is to give each person you meet a leg up when they need it, even if you can't. That's the deal."

"P.S. I think it's hard to remember sometimes, but important to remember, that firewood and potatoes are true wealth and that money is just green paper, and that all of us, no matter how rich or poor, are still just working for food."
Earl Mitchell

Just good old common sense!

I was never a girlie-girl, but a city girl, none the less. The only reason Al bought this big of place was because I wanted to live in the country. We haven't been able to spend all of our time in the past 8 years at home, so haven't accomplished as much as what I'd like. And we have more time than money invested, but it's coming along. A lot of that is because when I found Dave's Garden, I was inspired by so many people here and have attempted a lot of projects and ideas that I would never have dreamed of before. There's still so much more that I've been dreaming about in regards to being self-sufficent. We'll get there, but it will just be a little slow going.

My new garden, freshly disked and plowed, almost 250' long x 30' wide. This will be for annual vegetables. The perrenial garden is 50' x 70' and has asparagus, strawberries and herbs. I'll probably add another 20-30' for the artichokes I've got started.

I'm making close to 40 of these wide raised rows, 20' x 3'. This front middle row is almost 4' wide, Decided that was probably too wide, so the rest will be 3' wide. The soil is nice and friable, so moving the soil from the paths to the rows is fairly easy.

Potted up a bunch of tomato plants to 1 gal pots. Sure is nice to see so much green in the greenhouse!

This message was edited Mar 24, 2010 10:52 PM

Very impressive!

Starting this year we are going to start enlarging the main garden for the same reasons most you have already talked about. Planning on four 25’ wide by 50’ long areas with two foot wide rows. And will leave enough room to run a tiller between them. Plan on doing one each season (I’m lazy) so we can rotate crops to a different area each year. Plan on using soaker hoses for irrigation since it uses less water and hinders a lot of the weeds.

Our livestock will be limited to chickens, rabbits and maybe a goat. Since we are in a rural area, I’m hoping we can barter for everything else if times get that rough.

Didn’t think of having an area just for the perennial stuff. Nice touch.

Great start Msrobin ~ is that an electric fence I see in the background? I wondered if wildlife (deer) will present a problem for your garden.

I also like the perennial garden setting. My folks had one that was right by the orchard. They also grew rhubarb. I have a couple of perennial beds here with garlic and onions and some herbs that are perennial. No major gardening here but have been determined to add nothing but edibles this year. I am wanting to backslide tho... found a fragrant annual bloomer I want to try ~ night phlox. Wonder if the blooms would be edible ~ lol

Jayryunen ~ I appreciate the Earl Mitchell quotes a lot but the one that struck home for me was

Thanks everyone.

This is the year of the gardens. We're trying to get Al out of construction and this is going to be our source of future income. All other projects are on hold till this phase gets up and running.

No electric fence, although some kind of fence will be put up this spring/summer. Our dog does a pretty good job at keeping deer on the other side of the property where we can watch them. Al wants to get chickens again and we let our freerange during the day.

The wire and fence posts are actually 2 rows of 3 grape vines each with an underplanting of additional strawberries, that I planted last year. Thinking about moving those. There's 3 blueberry bushes planted behind these grapes. Our small orchard (7 trees and 3 cherry bushes) is between the end of the garden where I started making rows and the perrenial garden. There's 5 more cherry bushes along the back edge of the new garden and several grape vines near the shed. Should have lots of fruit this year.

The perrenial garden came about in the form of an ah-ha moment. The weeds were so bad when we returned home early last summer and it took all summer to finally remove all of the 6' weeds and get the garden cleaned up. I already had 200 asparagus plants in and the strawberries mutiplied to about 300 plants, plus there were 3 rows of herbs. The entire northside is planted with peonies and gladiolas and iris in a 2' wide border row. I discovered the weeds didn't have quite the foothold in the perrenial rows that the they did in the rows that I used for annual vegetables. So I decided since we were doing the market garden, that it would be easier to keep the annual vegetables together in a new garden and I spent the latter part of last summer increasing the number of perrenial crops in the older garden. Rhubarb....hmmm. Might have to add that in too. The only reason we went as big as we did on the new garden was because we had a little extra money to pay a farmer to do it and there was no way I could get it done by myself using a tiller. If I don't need all of it this year, I'll just use cover crops on the empty rows.

Lizard_keeper, we started with chickens, rabbits and goats too. Will be looking to replace them in a month or so.

Podster, did you set up your water beds on top of the ground or dig down? I'm using both this method and a few self-watering buckets, just as insurance for a couple of dozen tomatoes.

Jay, appreciate you're sharing those quotes, too. Amazing how simple some ideas are from the older folks. Are you starting to dry out any?

We didn't get the thunderstorms overnite, but probably will this afternoon, and it only got down to around 50. However, suppose to have a couple of nights down in the low 30's, so think I better set up some long ex. cords to the greenhouse, so I can run a small heater or maybe a halogen light for a few hours on those cold nights. Thinking about just using a timer.

On that note, guess I should check the greenhouse....