What MONEY WASTERS would you recommend others avoid?

And what does 'twee' mean? Sounds like it might apply to me. I like that 'passing the time nicely'. Sounds better than 'growing old gracefully'.

No, I took that to mean they were waiting to die. Yuck.

Laurie, help.

Okay, now our Laurie is British so we have to reach into the British parts of ourselves, if we have any (which I do) to understand her. Here is what I understand her to be saying, in plain American English: The word 'cheerful' when applied to the color 'yellow' reminds her more of bold, brassy (or coppery) drinking men in bars than of twee (tiny wee?) old ladies hanging their clothing on the line. So perhaps the 'yellow cheerfulness' daffodil is misnamed, in her opinion?
Did I get it sort of correct? (REaching WAY back into my genetic stock of the British Isles...)

My dad was pure English too. But it's been a few years since we lived there.

Twee: affectedly dainty or refined. http://www.audioenglish.net/dictionary/twee.htm

As I read it, AFFECTED, is the operative word here. Pleasant/cheerful = coppery = bold men. Not pleasant/cheerful = eggy yellow = women who are dramatically helpless.

Edited for interpretation.



This message was edited Feb 22, 2010 8:41 PM

Thank you for that definition of 'twee', Kathy, I was erroneously assuming the same meaning that Pixy had for the word. I love expanding my vocabulary in engaging contexts I am not likely to forget. I gathered something similar from Laurie's vivid descriptions (don't know if I got it as intended though):

Lively, interesting cheerful = big hearty men with porters of beer = coppery yellow

Boring, affected cheerful = twee old ladies = egg yolk yellow (like forsythia)

My disappointing Quail daffodils were more like the latter. The 'yellow cheerfulness' daffodil's yellow is more like quiet, soft sunshine, not inanely chattery like I imagine the twee old ladies to be.

It all comes around to about the same thing: coppery yellow hearty porter men = good. Forsythia yellow little old laundry ladies = bad. Shall we say that it's a more 'intuitive' understanding of the language?

If I leave you long enough you get it absolutely on the nose!!! Twee - affectively dainty is perfect, and inanely chattery - usually about the things that you cannot respond to: "owwww, I was thinking about pegging out some laundry, but then I looked at the sky and I didn't like the way that bird was flying, wind may be getting up, and Molly down the road said that the the other day the wind got up and her best pillow slip just went round and round and she took the stepladders out to see if she could get it untwisted, but then Peg two doors down from her said I shouldn't go up those steps if I were you Molly, you know what happened to ol' Dan you know the farmer that used to be down the bottom, his son never did take much to farming, sold up soon as he could, when he did that mind he was 96 and had two strokes, and his wife did leave him when he came back from the war - now was that ww1 or ww2, I can't remember but my marm was just a girl at the time and she......" - that sort of yellow.

I like yellow, I like yellow daffodils and others, I just am very fussy about colour, and emergency clothing yellow does not belong in a garden (although my DH would desperately appreciate it when he comes looking for me with the telephone.)

Laurie....you crack me up! ;-)

This message was edited Feb 22, 2010 2:53 AM

You guys crack me up! I love this neighborly thread! Nothing to add to your list of course, since I live, uh, 1500 or so miles from there, but it's so *interesting* that within your small geographic region, there are such variations in what will and won't survive. All goes to show that plant preferences are very local, and almost anything might be worth a try, if you can figure out what it likes.

Non-blooming peonies: could be you know this already, but the planting depth is pretty critical. The eyes themselves have to be 1.5 to 2 inches below the soil surface, no more and no less. That's not a lot of wiggle room. Then they like soil to be a little toward the alkaline side, if anything; which is why they're so husky in the Midwest. Bone meal makes them happy, but otherwise I think they're undemanding.

I laugh about the f______. My husband was seduced by the yellow flowers one spring long ago, bought one, and planted it in almost-all-day light shade, across the road from our house, because there was nowhere in the yard I thought was sunny enough and I refused to plant something that couldn't possibly flourish. Over there was nothing but pure, unenriched sand (well, a little upper-level forest-floor sandy stuff on top); and it was in a spot that never but never gets watered, being far from any hose. I swore it was going to die, and it sat there doing not much for six or seven years. But every year it was back, small but well-shaped. Then it started to "take", and though it's nothing like as monstrous as it could be if it was growing somewhere hospitable, it's a survivor in an impossible spot. And it does bloom in spring! So it is appreciated, here. It reminds me that my husband was right, and I was wrong, in spite of all my logical objections. You have reminded me to reward it, after all these 13 years, with a little Osmocote.

Echinacea: My observation at the nursery is that few of the recently developed plants are as vigorous as older ones. Supplying the right conditions will be important, and figuring out what they are could be tricky! Here, the standard pink ones will do fine in part sun, whereas the bright oranges and yellows seem to really need to full sun, and a reasonable supply of water, with good drainage to boot, and normal (not too rich) soil. Overwatering won't do for these guys either. They seem to rot off pretty easily in the pot. This isn't as much of an issue in our sandy soil, once plants get into the garden (I live in lake country, and there's almost *no* clay); but I would imagine in the PNW, it could be a problem.

Have a great day, you guys!

Oh, Laurie, just run screaming! Around my neck of the woods, (an Americanism, also referred to as 'stomping grounds', meaning "that place where I live", or "where I am used to being") we call that kind of stream of consciousness Attention Deficit Disorder. Maybe a better way to refer to that is Twee Little Old Lady Syndrome! LOL!

Now that meaning does fit me.

Hi joanic, glad to see you over here. A little lime then might be good for peonies? I just re-planted a few of them yesterday. I use kelp in the planting hole.

I just found this thread, and you all have me laughing. Too funny!

So now I need a recommendation, since I have no clue and don't want to be a money waster! My tiny city back garden is lush in the spring and summer but very bare in the winter. I do enjoy watching the change occur but would like to see something evergreen growing on the fence in the winter. In the summer the fence is almost invisible, but in the winter it looms large. In the summer that area is mostly shaded but in the winter gets sun - well, when the sun shows up! I envision some sort of vine - any suggestions?

Pretty garden, Portland. What is growing between your flagstones? I've tried various things in different stone settings and they all seem to die on me. I think my problem is too sharp of drainage and the rocks too close together -- I think I end up baking everything. I'm planning a new patio likely with flagstone and would really like to 'get it right' this time.

Well Laurie, I am not going to say the "F" word, but your little exercise got us all to thinking. Guess that is why I don't do well on those tests where you have to figure out what the h--- they are getting at. LOL , you know, the ones that the 10 year olds get the answer right every time.

But, it was very interesting.

I still want mine to bloom.

Jeanette

Not say what? Forsythia? OOPS Laurie is right that it is a good highway plant. And now, everytime I see a blank place in the hedge, knowing a vehicle plowed through, I will think of Laurie and wonder how she is doing.

I love the explanation of twee. It was very entertaining to read the attempts at translation. Made my day.

BTW I finally remembered what plant I was trying to think of that I haven't been able to grow successfully (besides zucchini which I grew last year very well much to my amazement so I will try the same thing this year). Whew! It is lavendar and then I remembered calendula also. I know, I know they are both supposed to be very easy. I've tried two different places for each, so they have been wasters for me.

Judi, I'm sorry I don't have any viny ideas for you. Something espaliered popped into my head, but I don't have a clue what it could be, ( just something) or even something artsy.

Something artsy would be Climbing Hydrangea, but don't think they are evergreen. Love their bark.

Jeanette

I love my pyracantha for an evergreen hedge.

There is an evergreen climbing Hydrangea...will have to look for my tag "bag" to find the name (it escapes me just now - must be sometimers).

The one I have may be an evergreen over there too. I think in my cold climate they are deciduous. I think. Maybe not. I have had 2 and lost them both. But I just love them. I am sure I will try again.

I like my pyracantha also. Do the birds eat the berries on yours Sharon? I think one year the robins did because they were probably here so early and there wasn't anything else to eat. LOL, normally the berries dry up on the plants before they bloom again in the spring.

Judi, I will again say that we need to see more pictures of your lovely yard! I think Jeanette as a great idea with the hydrangea... even if it is not evergreen, they look very "artsy" without the foilage, and wonderful right now with their new growth starting to show. An espallied (sp) pyrocantha would also be very cool, and they are evergreen.

Jeanette, the birds love Mom's pyrocantha, and so does my puppy Phoenix! We just crack up watching her sit on the deck and munch the berries... it is the goofiest thing I have seen in a long time!

Have they fermented over the winter? When I lived over there I had a Mountain Ash tree and the birds always waited until they had fermented (I think after a freeze) and then in one day the birds would strip it. I had a Mynah bird and I would pick some and put them in the freezer for it then give it a couple every once in a while all winter. It just loved them. It would say "How about a popper". Those MA berries were it's poppers.

I would not have thought a dog would eat them. But my dog used to eat strawberries and raspberries and tomatoes. So, I guess why not. As long as they don't hurt it.

My poodle used to eat the huckleberries and she cleaned up all the strawberries.

Strawberries, grapes, blueberries, raspberries......once one of my pups has figured out that they are good there is no safe zone! Fortunately, they have not discovered the way that peas are packaged.... they love the peas, and like the shells, but I am thinking that maybe they don't really smell until the pod is cracked?

Jeanette, the birds love the berrries of the pyro. in the spring, so they have probably fermented at this point. Phoenix has been eating them since November. None of the other dogs have ever done that, but she will just sit by the planter box on the deck and munch and munch. She will also finish off every bit of a bowl of salad that I don't finish (my other dogs work around at least one type of vegie), so maybe she is just a fruit and vegie nut!

Don't let dogs eat grapes. They are on the do not eat list.

We saw the warnings that grapes are bad for pups after our dogs had been eating them for years. It is really hard to convice a pooch that has been helping themselves to the grapes for years to stop..... they didn't get the memo.....

I would worry about them a bit more if they had ever had a reaction, but so far have not. Trust me, we have tried to discourage them, but even if you clip the ones that are within easy reach, as soon as they fall to the ground, they are munched. Even if you try to pick them up, you can't be there all of the time.... we just do the best we can to keep them away from the grapes at this point.

I love this "worldly" humor.
Judi - an evergreen climbing Hydrangea seemani a great vine, although they can take a while to grow. http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/go/79961/
If you want something rampant Akebia quinata http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/go/78496. I planted one kinda on the neighbors property so when he went to put in a fence I didn't move it thinking that it might take over his yard (he was kinda rude about the fence thing). And after a couple of years tossing fertilizer over the fence for it I now find it is coming back over the fence. But it is now setting buds and will flower profusely.
I just ordered and evergreen vine From Raintree nursery called Billardiera longiflora http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/go/74155/ Sounded interesting I'll let you know how that goes

I really like the Akebia quinata - I wonder if it will get out of control in our area. It's beautiful. I also like the climbing hydrangea and that one might tolerate more shade. I have two pyrocantha in the front yard and I like them, and can picture them in that spot in the back by the fence. They would need to be espaliered to fit behind the shrubs that are full in summer. Thank you for the suggestions.

I will photograph my gardens at some point, but I am a rotten photographer. Maybe this summer.

My dog loves avocados but they give her "digestive woes" so I give her cooked carrots instead. And roasted sweet potatoes are her favorite!

Jnette, your mynah took no harm from the fermented mountain ash berries? I have an African Grey parrot that could stand the occasional mellow-out. Or crank-up, depending on the effect, ha ha! -- Joan

Edit: "They" say the lowest pH tolerable for peonies is 6.5, so I guess if you know your soil is pretty acidic - like if rhodies and azaleas and blueberries would be happy - I'd certainly go for the lime.

This message was edited Feb 23, 2010 8:09 AM

I've got a Billardiera and so far it's kind of a slow starter. It died back a little in our cold, but not completely. It was pretty small when I got it last spring, so I'm hoping it will take off more this year.

With vines being discussed, this is a perfect time for me to add Passiflora caerulea to the waste of time list. I have an all-white blooming one-only the antthers (or pistils?-those flowers are complicated) are purple. Maybe it's more delicate, I don't know. I lost the tag-it was something I picked up at FM. Grows like crazy--as long as the winter is really mild. Summer 2008 it must've grown 30ft. However, get any really cold weather and it dies to the ground and takes forever to come back. After last winter, I didn't see new vines and growth again until August (even with our nice summer), and definitely no blooms--and I'd mulched and covered it. This year, again, dead to the ground.

Seems like in either this thread or another, trumpet vine was trashed pretty heavily. I have one growing on my NE porch support which is just starting to become a presence. What do I need to watch for? I just pruned it all back to 3-4 main vines, and kept those all trimmed back to those growing horizontally and at least pencil size or bigger. I did notice last year that it tended to want to spread out sideways more than I wanted, but I kept after it with my snips. Any other pointers? It's been pretty sparse with its bloom. Gets morning sun only. Could easily be moved at this point.

I think it depends on where you are, zone wise. In zone 8, you may have a problem, but why not put something around it so it can't spread too much. Or, if you move it, how about planting it in a large pot, kind of like a muck bucket with drainage holes and then plant that in the ground? I did that with my hops and the only thing I have to watch for now are the vines that lay on the ground and keeping them from taking root. But you are clipping those back, so shouldn't be a problem for you that way.

My mom had one (a trumpet vine) here in zone 5 and it spread from roots. Sometimes our colder climate slows down things like your morning glory that is so bad there, we have some, but it is very tiny and is not the nuisance that it is over there. However, even over here the trumpet vine roots spread.

Wonder if you could get by with just root pruning them each year. You might want to talk to a horticulturist. I think that is what they do to wisteria to make them bloom. I know it would not hurt the plant any. You would need a sharp shovel, don't know how deep you would have to go.

I read through the trumpet vine comments in the Plant File and it seems to be more aggressive in the south and east than in the PNW. I really have not had a problem with it so far, and have had it growing for about 3 years I believe. I'll see how it does this season as it seems to be fairly robust now. Sounds like the key is to keep after the sprawl and watch for suckers.

I have a trumpet vine growing on the south side of the house for about 10 years......... Although it won't stick to the stucco I have growing on long bamboo stakes. It does spread fairly vigorously with underground roots and now it has grown about 20 feet up the front of the house. The hummingbirds love it. Every year I cut back the shoots growing off to the side. It loves as much sun as you can give it.

Well that is pretty good for the south side. Do you have any trees shading it or anything? If not, it should get pretty good sun, like the afternoon sun, right? That is not bad. My mom used to have them coming up anywhere from 5 to 10 feet away from the main plant. Roots.

Actually I kinda live in a "hole" where nothing is quite full sun but that area gets about 8 hours of sun at it's peak

Azorina, I'm sun-challenged as well. What do you find grows well for you?

Another dud- zone 7 hardy jasmine.

Judi, I finally got to a time when I could post a few pictures. Here is my pyracantha "hedge". I have to work at keeping it at this height as the windows above it provide the view from my living room.
On the topic of money wasters, I would heartily recommend that you buy pyracantha only when you can see the berries on it. (Fallish). I bought some at the wrong time and they turned out to have an ugly yellow berry.
By the way, this picture was taken in January.

That looks nice.