What about this flu shots?

Yikes! Bless this beautiful girl who has to deal with such disabling and heartbreaking result.

DH and I are getting the H1N1 vaccine as we are going to be road tripping for a month this winter. We don't get regular flu shots. We are waiting for a couple of weeks (maybe longer) to allow the higher risk groups to get their shots first as this was requested by Health Canada when the vaccine was first made available. We're not travelling til mid December so we can wait. That's not to say that we won't catch it here, just that we will have more exposure when travelling.

Les I am waiting until next week although I guess I would qualify to go to the Oval clinic. Hoping the lineups might be shorter, dont look forward to standing a long time , in fact cant do it. I have a cane with a seat on it somewhere, guess I better take it out!
Paper this morning saying province might not get as many doses as ordered!
Really considering they pretty much knew this would happen things have not been well organised and I guess they are realizing that finally!

Brava Carol if you can wait. I'm disgusted and saddened that many low risk Calgarians are flooding the lines forcing high risk people to wait.

Well it would not have happened if it had been made clear that only high risk people would be vaccinated the first week and if the lines had been controlled and low risk people sent home.

I am significantly limiting my public exposure for the next while.

This message was edited Oct 30, 2009 12:45 PM

No kiddin.

I agree with Carol - it was never publicized that only high-risk people were to be vaccinated first; can't blame people for trying to get their vaccination.

Do you know, the lines for the clinics are already closed for the day because they've reached their daily capacity. The Richmond clinic line closed at 10 Am this morning. Unbelievable.

Given this vaccination debacle, it's hard to believe our healthcare system could actually handle a pandemic if one were to happen. IMHO.

Can you believe this???? The homeless shelter had their own private H1N1 vaccination at their shelter last night. The government won't set this up for any senior facilities, schools, doctor offices etc, but by gosh they better make sure the homeless people are 1st in line. This is really screwed up.

This just in from an on-line local news source about the flu clinic in the east end of Ottawa.

These people will get sick from sitting out in the cold.

Using some kind of a number system would sure help even it was by the hour. Walking the dogs this morning about 9am a neighbor came hurrying by with her toddler in the stroller. Her husband had been at the clinic( which is nearby) since 5 am and had just called her to say he thought they would close the doors soon! But even if you are in that line when they close the doors you have several hours to wait.
And now they are thinking there will not be as much supply as expected and they might have to close the clinics for several days bext week!

Well I really would like to get the shot but I guess at 70 I am not in the high risk group. But I am also not capable of standing in line for long periods of time. So no shot for me for a while . They keep saying well the clinics will run for several more weeks but in the meantime the bug is all around and lots of people sick.

I am severely limiting my exposure to groups but I do have a volunteer job as a tour guide and I am not cancelling that, just hoping nobody will want a tour today! Other than that I only need occasionally to go for groceries .

The Alberta govt really messed up big time with this one!

Must admit the Saskatchewan Health Ministry was up front about that.......we knew that Health Care Workers would receive their shots first (on Wednesday, Thursday, Friday of last week). This week its the people with asthma, pregnant women, others with immune problems (though the shortage of vaccine may change that). Then it will be those of us not in the high risk group...... they will be opening it up by announcing who can come in by the first letter of peeps last names (in alphabetical order)

So mid to late November (if more vaccine arrives)........meanwhile most of us will have been exposed to the virus (Moose Jaw now has one case of H1N1..... lab confirmed).

Keep in mind there was (worldwide) pandemic H1N1 outbreaks in the late 50's and late 60's (so if you were hatched by then chances are you've already been exposed). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Influenza_pandemic

Some disagreement over whether there was one in the 70's (Fort Dix had some virus escape there in the 70's but it was contained to the army base). :

"Fort Dix outbreak
Main article: 1976 swine flu outbreak

In 1976, a novel swine influenza A (H1N1) caused severe respiratory illness in 13 soldiers with 1 death at Fort Dix, New Jersey. The virus was detected only from January 19 to February 9 and did not spread beyond Fort Dix.[7]"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Influenza_A_virus_subtype_H1N1

This message was edited Oct 31, 2009 11:15 AM

It's just been announced that Alberta has temporarily halted all the vaccination clinics. Can you say gong show?

ALL of them??? Are they still doing staff in ER and ICU's?

Saskatchewan is now cutting back on who will get the shot (all willing Health Care Staff have been taken care of here):

H1N1: What You Need To Know
Saturday, 31 October 2009

Doctors, nurses, pharmacists and other health care professionals have been getting their vaccination shots for the H1N1 virus. Next week, certain high risk groups will get theirs as well.

Dr. Mark Vooght is Medical Health Officer in the local Five Hills Health Region. He says there's no need to panic but we should take precautions with frequent hand washing and by staying home if we are sick with flu-like symptoms. "Most younger people are susceptible to H1N1 and we are particularly concerned about the smaller children and those that are immune-suppressed or have other reasons to have chronic disease which weaken them and make them more susceptible to this virus."

Five Hills Regional Director of Emergency Preparedness Ron Dufresne recognizes more and more people are getting the virus. "There are more patients presenting to their family doctors. We are seeing some increases in our emergency departments within the region. The key message there is if you're suffering from mild influenza-like symptoms do not attend the emergency room. Certainly, if you're symptoms are severe you can present to the emergency department, but appropriately you should present to your family doctor first."

While vaccination plans for next week won't change, future clinics are being re-evaluated right now. On Friday it was announced that all provinces will receive significantly fewer doses of H1N1 vaccine than expected. Due to the manufacturer's difficulties in producing enough vaccine to meet demand, Saskatchewan will be receiving 13,000 doses in its next shipment, rather than the 60,000 expected. As a result, the province's supply will need to be managed carefully until more vaccines arrive.

Here are the details on the next round of vaccinations for the H1N1 influenza in the local Five Hills Health Region. These vaccination clinics are for "at risk" groups of people only. They are:

--Children 6 months to 59 months of age.
--Pregnant women - from 20 weeks gestation (2nd trimester to 3rd trimester)
--Women 4 weeks post-partum (Up to 28 days after giving birth)

So those with asthma, suppressed immune systems etc. won't receive their shots until the above have been taken care of.
http://www.discovermoosejaw.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=10082&Itemid=401


This message was edited Oct 31, 2009 8:47 PM

What I have read here (Alberta) is all the public clinics are closed for a few days.( I expect health care workers etc all had their shots at place of work) When they reopen they may only reopen initially for people in the risk catagories . Thats what the govt wanted to happen in the first place but they just made a polite request and of course it was ignored and then they said they couldnt police the people coming in because of privacy issues!
And they also did not give any priority to police/fire/EMS workers! They were expected to stand in line like everybody else!
And since they are not going to be getting as much vaccine as originally expected/ordered I hope they will get a system in place so people dont just show up and wait in line for hours.
There have to be ways to deal with that one - I can think of a couple myself!

Anyway I guess it will be a while before I get my shot.

One of the things they have finally got right here is they have set up a special clinic at one of the health centres ( but only 1 in a city of 1 mil!) for people to go to who have flu symptoms instead of going to emergency or doctors offices.

Carol I wish all health care workers in Alberta got their shots at their place of work but that isn't the case (where my daughter works the nursing staff was told to join the line ups at the health clinic). She worked the two days that her town had the shots available and by the time she got off the clinics there were closed to new arrivals (I'm really curious as to who will be taking care of the patients when their nursing staff gets sick).

Canada isn't the only country that's short.....

"Vaccine Shortages Continue

U.S. health officials continued to express frustration over the shortage of H1N1 vaccine available to the public. Both Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius and CDC Director Frieden tried to reassure the public this week that more than enough vaccine will eventually be available for all who want it.

In spite of the shortage, some people who aren't at high risk for swine flu complications have jumped to the head of the line to get much-in-demand vaccine.

These people include healthy adults or senior citizens instead of kids, pregnant women and people with health problems.

Because the U.S. has only received about 24 million of the 250 million vaccine doses it's ordered, some health departments are stepping up screening measures.

Before Los Angeles County health officials stepped up screening at their flu clinics, Natalie Thompson sailed through the long line and got the vaccine along with her 8-year-old son, even though she's not in one of the priority groups.

"If I can get it, I'm not gonna say no," said Thompson, 35, of Hollywood Hills.

Another mom, Katy Radparvar, didn't say no either.

"Our doctor doesn't have it yet," said the 41-year-old woman who was vaccinated along with her three children at a public health vaccination site in suburban Encino last week."
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,570565,00.html

A way of getting more vaccine?...........

OP-ED CONTRIBUTORS
Do Women Need Such Big Flu Shots?

By SABRA L. KLEIN and PHYLLIS GREENBERGER
Published: October 27, 2009
THE emergence of the H1N1 swine flu has added urgency to what has become an annual ritual for millions of Americans: getting a flu shot. The good news is that scientists have developed a vaccine against the H1N1 virus. But it is taking much longer than expected to produce the hundreds of millions of doses the government had planned to distribute. And it is still too soon to know how effective the vaccine will be in preventing swine flu.


In all likelihood, we’d have a better H1N1 vaccine — and more of it — if in our preparations we had accounted for the biological differences between men and women.

Under the current guidelines, men and women are to get equal-sized doses of the H1N1 vaccine. Yet women’s bodies generate a stronger antibody response than men’s do, research shows, so less vaccine may be needed to immunize them. If we could give women a smaller dose, there would be more vaccine to go around. And we might also spare them the mild side effects that vaccines can cause, like pain at the injection site, inflammation and fever. All of these are more common in women than in men.

To be clear, it is essential that women get their flu shots, even if the current dose is more than they need. Pregnant women in particular should make sure they are protected, since those who get the swine flu are at least four times as likely as others with the virus to be hospitalized. (We don’t know whether pregnant women are more susceptible to the H1N1 virus, but it’s clear that once they are infected, they have a higher-than-average risk of complications.)

But ultimately we should do everything we can to vaccinate as many people as possible.

Many clinical studies have shown that men and women differ in their responses to several viral vaccines. A recent study demonstrated that women produce as many antibodies in response to a half dose of the seasonal flu vaccine as men make in response to a full dose. Other studies have revealed similar sex differences in response to vaccines for yellow fever virus, measles, mumps and rubella, hepatitis A and B viruses and herpes simplex virus.

Whether vaccines work differently in males than in females is not known. Clearly, more research on sex-dependent immune responses is needed.

In planning for the swine flu, however, public health authorities ignored the evidence that vaccines affect women more strongly than men. To determine the proper dose of H1N1 vaccine, the National Institutes of Health set up studies involving 600 children, from babies to teenagers — but neglected to investigate whether males and females should get the same dose.

Although our public health authorities remain confident they will eventually have enough vaccine for all Americans who want it, there almost certainly won’t be enough for all the vulnerable populations in poorer countries. Only a handful of countries have plants to manufacture influenza vaccine, and the world’s wealthiest countries have locked up most of what these plants can produce with signed purchasing contracts. We could make much more — and potentially save millions of lives — if we stopped giving women larger doses than they need.

Sabra L. Klein is an assistant professor of molecular microbiology and immunology at the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health. Phyllis Greenberger is the president and chief executive of the nonprofit Society for Women’s Health Research.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/28/opinion/28klein.html


This message was edited Nov 1, 2009 1:52 AM

Is this the child to blame for the swine flu pandemic?

~from an email that was going around this spring. Sorry, I don't know where the photo originated.

It has been a gong show in Alberta.
I am isolating myself.
Stocked up with Immunity boosters.
And I'll work on the yard and house for a few weeks.

One has to wonder what the powers, that be, will do if a really bad disease evolves.
Now everything goes worldwide in no amount of time.

Oh dear---I did weaken and ordered from that Tand M catalogue. That is the risk of isolating oneself, I guess.

Got mine today. One in each arm. So far, so good. Only an hour wait. Not bad.

Aah---to live in Lotus Land!

My daughter is now missing work due to a flu (I wonder which one it may be). Said more than somewhat tongue in cheek.

I'm guessing she is now happy that I bugged her to purchase lots of soups, juices, ginger ale, etc, as well as cold/flu medication. Now if I could have only talked my son into doing the same (I hear a lot of "oh Mom") but he did take note that 1/3 of the students in his University classes are now absent.

There is an excellent Cookbook and Nutrition book for young men or anybody.
It is the one written by Chris Carmichael who is Lance Armstrong's trainer.
I gave each of my sons , son-in-law and older grandsons this book.
Another good one for kids living away from home is called
"Cooking Without Mom". (sorry don't remember author).

Doesn't matter whether you are running marathons, studying hard for U. exams or fighting off the flu---it goes better if you keep yourself in top nutritional form.

When I was teaching I would always encounter a student who asked "What can I do for tomorrow's exam?" My standard answer was "Have a good night's sleep and a
good breakfast before you come".

:) I'm always on the lookout for Christmas gifts

Cooking Without Mom (Spiral-bound)
~ Hen Party Enterprises (Author), Shelley Ackerman (Illustrator)
http://www.amazon.com/Cooking-Without-Mom-Party-Enterprises/dp/0969434901

Currently only used copies are available at Amazon. I'll also check GBIP (Global Books In Print) to see what's available there.

I purchased these for them when they left home (and the dormitory):


The (Reluctant , Nervous, Lazy, Broke, Busy, Confused) College Student's Cookbook by Joshua N. Lambert and Debby Lee (Spiral-bound - Aug 2001)
4.0 out of 5 stars (13)

Cooking Outside the Pizza Box: Easy Recipes for Today's College Student by Jean Patterson and Danae Campbell (Spiral-bound - Dec 3, 2003).
4.3 out of 5 stars (18)

The Starving Students' Cookbook by Dede Hall (Paperback - Jul 1, 2002).
4.2 out of 5 stars (17)

As well as Better Homes and Gardens New Cookbook (1930-2000 Limited Edition) by Better Homes and Gardens Books (Hardcover - Sep 1999)
5.0 out of 5 stars (11)

I just know however they won't cook soups (and freeze) in anticipation of being sick. That just isn't going to happen. :(

BTW I did a flu display at the library.........

* flu/cold cookbooks (mainly soups)
*books with cider vinegar recipes
*books on previous and forecasted (ie bird flu) pandemics
*books on how to avoid colds/flu (good luck)
*books on how to take care of yourself/others when sick
*books on vaccinations

I've never seen books fly off the table so fast.




This message was edited Nov 8, 2009 12:19 PM

Swine Flu kills 14 more Canadians in two days, seven in Ontario
By Salim Jiwa.

Swine Flu is rampaging through Ontario, B.C. and Alberta and more Canadians have died in two days than any other period. Ottawa reports 14 Canadians have died in two days. Seven deaths are in Ontario, 3 in B.C., 3 in Alberta.

OTTAWA – Swine Flu rampage has killed 14 more Canadians in two days and taken an additional two lives in B.C. in the same period to take the provincial death toll to 17. Ontario registered seven more deaths between Nov. 3 and 11 a.m. EDT on Nov. 5. The startling number of deaths in just two days – vastly higher than any other period since the H1N1 virus surfaced in April – flies in the face of health officials who were making optimistic predictions.

Federal figures released on Thursday shows a dramatic rise in the Canadian death toll that has zoomed to 115.

Three more deaths occurred in two days in B.C., in Alberta another three were reported dead, seven new deaths were reported in Ontario, Newfoundland and Labrador reported a single death.

Ontario’s new tally is now 37, with the deaths escalating in the past three weeks. British Columbia is now showing 17 deaths, Alberta has 17, 5 are dead in Saskatchewan, 7 in Manitoba, 27 in Quebec, Nova Scotia, Yukon and Nunavut have one each. Newfoundland and Labrador go up to two.

Some government officials had been predicting the worse was over, however, the new deaths are likely to boost the scramble for vaccine.

The federal government said on Thursday that 225,000 unadjuvanted vaccines have been delivered to provinces so vaccination can start for pregnant women in the first half of their pregnancy.

So far, only adjuvanted vaccine was available and it was not considered suitable for women in their first half of pregnancy.

The Swine Flu rush is being felt in hospitals around the country. In B.C., Children’s Hospital is reporting up to 80 kids per day in emergency while the Fraser Health Region is reporting 350 patients with flu like illness in their emergency wards and up to 12 admissions per day.

How many more people have been hospitalized in the past two days is not clear.
http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/281696

thanks Lilypon for all the information

I've been telling my sister, 55, who's morbidly obese, always gets whats going around and it settles in her chest, who often in a year seems like she's got the flu, who had abdominal cancer last year with radiation and is still dealing with those effects... has a very bad cough, worse than what she usually gets. I found this out last evening. I have told her again and again that if she's got a cough AND a fever, to get herself to a clinic asap. Last night her temp was 38.3 (normal is 37 and 40 equals 104F) she refused last evening to go anywhere. She just called and wanted to know if 39.3 was too high? I'm sure you could here the higher pitch of my voice when I said sarcastically.. yes.. and get going to the ER. She hasn't had a flu shot, and really doesn't want to go, so she said she's off to a clinic.
I do hope goes sooner than later.

My apologies for venting

Linda in Victoria

Vent away Linda. The original purpose of the thread has passed anyway. I don't blame you for your frustration, not one bit. You can only try to help, the rest is up to her. I sure hope she listens to you.

Well I heard from my sister. Her doc says she's probably got H1N1 and has put her on Tamiflu, along with 2 others sprays, one for her nose and one for her throat as well as a puffer. Doc says she doesn't have pneumonia and if she's not better in 2 days to come back. I'm glad she went to her doc, and that she's getting some treatment.

Thanks for the ear....

Well that was sensible of her! Probably better than sitting in the Er for a long time along with all the other people with colds/flus etc.

Still no idea when shots will be available again to general non risk public here but the clinics for the risk groups ( not all yet) are going well.

Woke up this morning with a stuffy slightly sniffy nose and bit of a HA which just says regular cold to me so started ColdFX.

Anyone know what proportion of people might have such a mild case that they don't even know it? I woke up Friday morning a bit achy and my upper left jaw ached. Really strange. Felt a bit weird all day, but after a good night's sleep have felt fine since.

Ann

Give it a couple of days Ann. Jen said she felt funny (stomach) a couple of days before she became congested. Now she has congestion (head), coughing, diarrhea, aches, etc. Dr. found high hemoglobin count about a week (or so) before her stomach felt queasy so has asked her to come into the hospital today for further testing (maybe she will also get the tamiflu shot.

Linda I hope your sister is listening to you!





This message was edited Nov 10, 2009 8:53 AM

Here's the best Canadian source, for answers, I've found: http://www.phac-aspc.gc.ca/alert-alerte/h1n1/faq_rg_h1n1-eng.php#av

Here's the CDC's (Center for Disease Control and Prevention) site: http://www.cdc.gov/h1n1flu/ (keep in mind its American, and talks about the vaccines they are giving there, but it gives Stats and Press briefings).
Currently it notes: "Almost all of the influenza viruses identified so far continue to be 2009 H1N1 influenza A viruses. These viruses remain similar to the virus chosen for the 2009 H1N1 vaccine, and remain susceptible to the antiviral drugs oseltamivir and zanamivir with rare exception" http://www.cdc.gov/h1n1flu/update.htm



This message was edited Nov 10, 2009 10:34 AM

Why is 2009 H1N1 virus sometimes called “swine flu”?
This virus was originally referred to as “swine flu” because laboratory testing showed that many of the genes in this new virus were very similar to influenza viruses that normally occur in pigs (swine) in North America. But further study has shown that this new virus is very different from what normally circulates in North American pigs. It has two genes from flu viruses that normally circulate in pigs in Europe and Asia and bird (avian) genes and human genes. Scientists call this a "quadruple reassortant" virus.

(according to the CDC site...forgot to lift the link)

Hope everything is fine with Jen Pam.

My sister is listening to me, more today than yesterday. Her temp hit 39.5 last evening, this morning it's back to normal. But she's still got a very harsh productive cough.

She was on the phone to a friend of hers. Her friends mother was in Ottawa, got sick with the flu on Thursday, Friday they put her into a coma to ventilate her, by Sunday, she was dead. They've said it was the H1N1 flu.

Linda I talked to Jen this evening and she sounds sooooooo much better!!! Ü She actually has an appetite now and had a friend pick up a sub for her (still has the cough but doesn't sound as congested). She also picked up her test results and discovered the Dr. made an error in reading her first test....the more detailed test that was sent away came back saying her hemoglobin is fine but she has a low white blood cell count. I checked patient ratings of that Doctor online and it seems he has made similar errors before.

She now has a copy of the test results has an appointment with a Dr. in Moose Jaw this Friday. Jen has lived in that town for 5 years and can't get a physician (they just have too few Dr's for the population). BTW it turns out the fellow that farms our land/and is our accountant has a wife that is a Doctor here in town (and she was happy to take Jen on). All of a sudden my city of 35,000 seems like its a small town of 500 (what are the odds???).

Still crossing my fingers for your sister (and Jen) until they are totally clear of this flu. I'm sure sorry to hear about the other lady. BTW I made contact with a fellow that is working towards his PhD in veterinary science (he lives in Germany) and I asked him about the vaccine since the same company makes it for Canada also makes it for Germany (only they've had the adjuvant in their flu vaccines longer). He said he wasn't worried about the vaccine. He went on to say people will die with or without it ( and that deaths will be a lot higher without it) and that people will get Guillain–Barré syndrome with or without the vaccine. In fact here is some of his exact wording.....

"Speaking of Guillain-Barré syndrome, a news article I read today referenced a recent publication on that. Only the abstract is available to non-subscribers, but the take-home message is right there. "Highly visible health conditions, such as Guillain-Barré syndrome, spontaneous abortion, or even death, will occur in coincident temporal association with novel influenza vaccination." People will die, people will get GBS, vaccine or no vaccine."



This message was edited Nov 11, 2009 3:21 AM

Here's the abstract: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19880172

Explaination of "coincident temporal association" : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correlation_does_not_imply_causation