Gardening Energy UP, Pain and Depression DOWN

Seems like there is a lot going on the the gardener's bodies that doesn't always get as much attention as the actual fruits of our labors. Here we can share ideas and thoughts on how to enhance, cure, or prevent.

A hot bath fixes a lot.

There are so many things causing anxiety for us today - economic woes, weather woes, crime, environmental woes, fools shouting "You lie" at the President, aging parents, etc. I used to be a CNN junkie but gave it up.

Just want to give a kudo to Pixy's advice about asking for a different medication if the one you are on is not giving you exactly the results you are looking for. I have known too many instances where people just keep taking a prescribed medication without questioning the results. (One very good example is what can happen with some blood pressure meds! WOE!)
I am happy that I can discuss openly with my doctor and find out what is the best for ME. And I say "yeah for hormones."

I believe that Phoenix has the right idea - take a break - lie in a deep bed of soft grass and reflect on the beauty around --
Ha - easy to say - difficult to practice --
Mtn/girl does your doc discuss alternative forms for healing - like Pixy suggesting St. John's Wort?
I really do need to find another doc preferably Naturopathy or Osteophathy ---- Have considered it for years but the break from what has been engrained in your being is very difficult to challenge
Besides that - we have insurance that pays for the meds and refuses to assist with alternatives

Thanks, for bringing us over here, Sharon.

Thanks also to everyone's experiences. i definitely will ask about extra Vit. D and maybe some alternatives. We'll see what the blood work shows. Wasn't able to get out on the bike today cuz it poured. But, now I don't have to water. :)

I do not, at my age take anything as yet. all good for now, LOL but nice to know, when I need to find help. I know where to go ^_^

I think Vit D is a good Idea but the best way to get it is to garden nake.. LOL Sunshine is the one thing that people rarely get even in Phoenix. We all work under fake light and we rarely get the morning sun that feeds our brain chemistry. There is a gland called the Peineal (SP?) and it responds to sunlight creating a lot of good stuff. I often sit in the sun and eat, drink, coffee and gather my thoughts to face the day. When I am in AK and it is winter I NEED to get to sun or I am quite depressed. I also agree with exercise as the way to dump negative and clean the body of badies.

Tills, unless you are under 45 get thee 1000 mg calcium w/ vit D asap. One 500 mg in the am and one in the pm. Increase to 1200 mg per day after age 55 or so.

Exercise is the best - but I find it doesn't do a great job of reducing stress for me unless I exercise hard and really push myself. I have to get so tired that my brain slows down. Then the hot bath, then the soft bed, preferably not alone LOL.

Sorry, I just turned 57

Steve, I can agree with the NEED for sun when it is lacking. That is why I headed out of Anchorage within a couple of months of arriving in Sept. one year a while ago. Just couldn't stand the dark and the thought of cold in addition to the dark coming along very soon. Settled in the PNW and am still thrilled here even though winter leaves something to be desired in respect to sunshine. I know tanning beds are bad, but I find them good therapy when there are a lot of dark days.

Make sure you get your blood tested before starting D. You can overdose on it . . .

I like the idea of a Naturopath, but do remember that they are not MDs. My friend went to three Naturopaths who would not recommend a biopsy of a mole. When she went to an MD (who, to be fair, didn't believe the mole was dangerous, either), but he biopsied and it turned out to be cancerous. She has since had several "normal-looking" moles removed and slathers on the sunscreen. She was good about sunscreen before - definitely not a sun-bunny - but she's militant now.

Turns out a side-effect of the sunscreen ended up being very low Vitamin D levels, so they are working on a supplement program for her now.

This message was edited Sep 12, 2009 10:42 AM

Cabindweller, haven't felt the need to discuss alternatives with the doc yet. I seem to recall that he and Bill had same, however, and I know I have an old bottle of St. John's Wort hanging around somewhere.

I suppose I should consider something to help restore the brain cells that my love of wine keeps trying to attack. Or, pehaps I am just getting a bit older? (Now what was that I was I talking about?)

I think the neighbors would complain if I gardened naked. LOL

also, Judi, LOL on 'preferably not alone'.

Lots to talk to the DR. about. Youse guys are the best!!

Well, we could start a whole new thing - gardening naked. Just imagine, no tan lines, well except for maybe the belly rolls, and maybe under saggy boobies and buns. I bet you shapely gardeners would get a lot of help!!! Rarejem, you would never have to do any work ever again, just supervise and look gorgeous!

Portland, that was such a funny comment.

Jan, take care of yourself.

Will do, Lynn, Thanks.

Are you telling me you guys garden with clothes on!? We here in MT choose the natural. I think Vit D is better natural. LOL

Who said we don't garden naturally? Clearing blackberry vines are not a lot of fun, though.

No thanks to the gardening neked idea. Ouch! Plus, my neighbors wouldn't thank me.

Soferdig, I believe you are referring to the pineal gland.

by the way, if one learns to meditate deeply, getting the brain into a theta wave, one can increase one's own serotonin naturally.

This website has some good basic information. http://www.spiritualcompetency.com/meditat/lesson8.asp

Regarding the vitamin D issue, frankly I believe that all physicians should be screening it as part of your annual exam. In terms of mental health it is critical. It's actually a hormone, not a vitamin (except when taken in food, such as milk which is supplemented with it), so I don't know why they call it 'vitamin' d. But sunlight is the only way to get our bodies to manufacture it. Here is an informative article for your consideration:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/therese-borchard/vitamin-d-and-mental-heal_b_211636.html

Here's another good one. Did you know that autoimmune disorders are associated with low vitamin D? And the the PNW has a statistically high percentage of, especially women, with autoimmune illness?

http://media.www.clipperonline.info/media/storage/paper1338/news/2009/06/05/Features/Make-Vitamin.D.While.The.Sun.Shines-3746508.shtml

When you begin to realize all the many ways in which our bodies depend on this hormone, it is incredible that any physician would not screen for low levels as part of a regular physical check up. It may be that in other parts of the country, such as the northeast, there is not as much of a problem with low levels.

Naturopathic physicians are trained completely differently from MDs and in my opinion, both have their place in healthcare. I look forward to the day, if I live to see it, where there will be naturopathic physicians, osteopaths, allopathic medicine, energy healing, massage, accupuncture, ,etc all under one roof. Now THAT would be treating the whole person!

Is the one roof you refer to a Brewery?
Hey when you garden in the buff you have to scrub a whole lot more than wearing clothing. My tub tonight had to be followed with a shower. I planted all of the RU plants and potted the ones too young. I had to tear out with my truck 5 trees to get room for the trees I got. One problem is I pulled off my front bumper with the first tree. Next one I used the trailer hitch. Lesson of the day. When being filled with testosterone back up to the obstacle

That would be very confusing to me!

Plus, in my experience, the deeply depressed person is the last person capable of shopping around & experimenting. When I needed help, I needed it NOW & the doc had better figure out something right then because just because I was in the office then didn't mean that I would return anytime soon. I was so leery of antidepressants that if the 1st one didn't work I would have just turned my back on them.

So, fortunately, the Effexor took effect pretty quickly. That, in combination with seeing a pretty competent shrink for a few months.

I would fear, Sofer, that gardening in the buff in Montana would be very confusing as well, and not good for morale. "Is that a goosebump or are you ... uh yeah, you're just happy to see me."

I'm with you, Pix. The problem right now is that there are too many people treating outside their licensing and there is no universal standard that lays out who can do what so that those who take on more than they should can be censored and you and I can be protected. I was amazed at what I heard and saw when I worked at Premera Blue Cross. Part of the problem was that there is no agreement (and no medical coding) for what constitutes appropriate treatment, who is qualified to provide it and how to bill it, but there was the coverage in many cases. There's a lot of room for healthcare reform right there . . .

Has anyone heard from RC (Shelly), She has not posted for awhile and a few of us are con sered. Anyone Have her # to contact Her. We know she is a firefighter, and things are bad with them this time of year. But she has always posted as her ware abouts. I have been in contact with Trish, She is worried to. And sent a Dmail to Sally.
Any help here would be so nice.

And for all that wonder about Laurie, No worry. She is fine, and buried in so many things LOL. I could not keep up with her if I put on running boots on. I so like her Style. The Dmail I got from her, makes me really want to go to England.

Lots of us are looking for Shelly. I sent an email to her old work address. It didn't bounce, but I haven't heard anything. Sally doesn't know anything. People on the NE forum are also trying to get ahold of her. Somewhere I think I have her mailing address, but no phone number.

Got to get so time to dig, I know she gave it to me, But I can't remember where I put it.
Thanks Kathy, No one told me that others where looking, or the ones that Dmail me.

Found it, but got a voice mail.

Good girl Tills, let us know if you hear back.

I had a blood test recently and when they called the only thing the doctor found out of line was that I was slightly low on D. So some of them are checking.



This message was edited Sep 12, 2009 11:39 PM

Pixy, very interesting info-thanks very much.

As to the combo medical practice, a friend of mine actually went to a clinic sort of like that. I think she was seeing an osteopath. Not sure about the acupuncturist, but they did have a therapist on staff. It was located in Boulder, CO-somewhere in that vicinity anyhow. She loved it-any and all treatments were just treated like a doctor visit.

This is sort of related, at least it's health-related. I've heard from my dr and elsewhere that they're now recommending tetanus boosters every 7 years instead of every 10-and it's particularly important for gardeners as tetanus can be present in soils. So, get those tetanus booster shots if you need one!

And no one told the others that you were looking either, Mary. Guess it's better to have many people trying to find Shelly rather than too few.

Susy, I wonder about tetanus boosters. I had a shot as a child after I broke some bones in a fall, but nothing in the ensuing 30+ years. I segue between getting as much medical care as you can & staying away from it as much as you can.

I mean, who really wants to hang out at the doctor's?

I haven't had any antibiotics in almost 20 years, drink like a fish, dig in the dirt every day, don't use any cleaning supplies that might dislodge the resident spiders ... and I haven't had a cold in maybe 6 years, never had the flu ...

I'm all about staying away from the doctor, but you don't want to mess with tetanus:

https://www.google.com/health/ref/Tetanus

http://www.emedicinehealth.com/tetanus/article_em.htm

Interesting fact: dogs don't get tetanus. Hmmmmmm.

Just wait, Summerkid. There was a time I could say all those things, too. But then the doctor, the blood tests, and the medications all became my friend. What me? But I'm invicible!! You mean I'm not invincible? It was a shocking adjustment, to say the least. So far, I've stayed away from OTC, meds, but [knock on wood], I have another 49 years to go . . .

And you know what? I don't WANT any chiropracty, or any acupuncture, or, really, any consistent medical intrusion into my life. I have friends who swear by all that stuff. But every one of them who comes to mind seems to kind of get hooked on the attention -- AND needs to lose, oh, 60 pounds.

Tearing around barefoot on the beach with Osita has done WONDERS for me ...

Good for you. Push back hard. Hope it holds up and that life doesn't hand you something else you don't WANT. :-D

What's confusing, summerkid? having a brewery, soferdig's manly confusion with his hauling rig, or having many options for medical care? I like having options. People are complicated beings. What works for one doesn't work for another. That's why we haven't cured things like depression yet. It would be my fondest hope that any medical provider who suspected deep depression in a client would immediately refer that client to a physician for medication, regardless of the provider's method of treatment. The client would not be faced with having to choose which route to take. At that point, we're talking about something that could save someone's life. Serious depression is pretty cut and dry. Just go to the doctor and hope that the first medication works well enough. Why should people suffer more than necessary?

But here's an example of what I was talking about: It would be nice (for me,and for my clients) if I practiced in a clinic with a physician, massage therapist, acupuncturist, chiropractor, naturopath, etc. There are so many times I will refer someone to another kind of provider to augment whatever treatment I am providing. For example, clients with anxiety generally benefit from acupuncture and also from taking certain supplements. Maybe they take medication, maybe they don't, but regardless of whether they do or not, I like to see them have at least one acupuncture treatment to see if it helps, and go to at least one appointment with a naturopath to talk about diet and supplements. Likewise, people under a great deal of stress benefit from massage. So do trauma survivors, at a certain point in their treatment. It would be much easier for my clients if they could make one trip rather than 2, and it would be nice to consult with other kinds of providers to see what they could offer. See, people are really complicated beings... Sounds a bit like the place your friend goes, Susy. There are probably places like that in Seattle. Tacoma just hasn't quite caught up yet. It's coming, though.


I'm not sure what you mean, Katie59. I bill under a medical diagnostic code, not a type of treatment. And general practioners started covering many of the roles that psychiatrists used to cover because it's just darned difficult to find a psychiatrist and get an appointment. It was a barrier to service, and I mean a big one, at least around here. When I can get someone in to see a good psychiatrist or psychiatric nurse practioner, I count myself and my client very, very lucky. If not, they have to go to their family doctor or internal medicine doc. I don't know if that's the kind of thing you were talking about or not.

I'm not sure I want to rely on government and insurance companies to protect me. I do think that people need to educate themselves about what's out there and not depend on the government or the insurance companies to do it for them. I'm always surprised when people come in to my office and expect me to write prescriptions. They really haven't taken any time at all to learn about what kind of provider they are seeing. That kind of information is readily available. Maybe I'm on the wrong track with your comment. If so, please clarify.

sofer, please go easy on the testosterone. You're going to hurt yourself!!!

katie, sorry, didn't see your post before filing mine.
I AM INVINCIBLE HEAR ME ROAR

I don't fear death. So there is a certain part of me that is willing to accept life as it degrades, and not try to prolong it.

Does that sound awful to you guys?

It doesn't sound awful. But I don't believe it. :-)

Now summer has said something I can completely sink my teeth into! I don't want any kind of consistent 'intervention' either! I barely make time for the yearly exam. Actually, I do not get a yearly exam. I get one about every 3 years just to assuage the guilt. This year they wasted insurance money and staff time to make sure I don't have an std! As if!! Here's an idea for reform: how about if I say I haven't slept with anyone but my husband and he with me for the past 30 years the doctor just believes me and saves the money on the stupid test? I get a letter in the mail to tell me I've tested negative. Really. do tell.

but I do love my chiropractor. and my massage therapist. Just like a spa treatment!

I don't like being told what to do any more than you do, summerkid. Maybe I even like it less than you do.

they get hooked on the attention at the doctor's office? Really? There's actually a diagnosis for that. I can do without the attention at the doctor's office.

Um, what does that have to do with them needing to lose 60 pounds? You lost me there.

Pix, for medical payment from an insurance company, you have to bill a CPT code as well as a diagnostic code (or several diagnostic codes). The amount of reimbursement is dependent on the CPT code, the network you're in and the contract you've negotiated, whether the medical directors at the insurance company feel that reimbursement for that procedure (as represented by the CPT code) is appropriate with that diagnosis. And then, they have to look at whether they think you, as the service provider, are licensed in this state to bill that code on your own or in conjunction with another (say an M.D.) Much of that is variable and not consistent from one insurance company to another. This is all assuming that the patient has coverage for the conditions and treatments proscribed.

Like it or not, service provided depends in part on who is able to pay and who will provide based on how they think they will get paid.

So many people can't or won't or don't have the time to research and research and research so they can poke holes in the arguments they hear. They just want to feel better so they can get back to what they're good at. I sympathize with them -- I've heard a lot of stories and most people just don't have the resources to push when they've been feeling that poorly for that long.

Yes, I''m well aware of how the billing works. I think the disconnect is that my cpt codes are based on the length of the session and who is present, not on a certain 'procedure'. So I might bill an individual session (90806 or 90808) for a diagnostic code, but that says nothing about how the issue is actually addressed. I think the mental health side of things is probably much more straightforward than the physical health side.
And tell me about it! I have to hire someone to do all the medical billing because each insurance company is different, each contract is different within that company, etc. It's just a pain in the you-know-what. I finally got fed up and dropped out of participating with three companies in the last two months. Probably hormones but I've had it with them. No more managed care contracts for me.
Think how much money would be saved if all the insurance companies had to pay the same amount for the same service and offered only one or two types of policies? Wow! The mind reels!