I'm new to the Homesteading forum & books I got today!

Hi everyone! I'm new to the Homesteading forum. I'm working towards educating myself in self sufficient living just in case some day my family and I [have] to live off the land some day (thank heaven, we have 25 cleared acres that is currently being leased to a dairy farmer for growing soybeans). In the mean time, I'm looking forward to trying my hand at gardening and see how I do. My husband and I, along with our extended family, totaling 15 people, which include five growing grandsons and one granddaughter (the youngest) ages 3 - 8, so we have some fresh, young hands coming up quickly. :) We are truly blessed! I have had chickens for three years now - been spending most of my time on the Poultry forum, but I am eager to learn so this will be fun. I hope to pass all my new found knowledge to our grandchildren so that they too will be able to provide for themselves should society collapse. ...Hopefully that day will never come, but there is no harm in being prepared. ...I use to be a Girl Scout - many moons ago. lol :-D

Jayryunen, I spent the morning on Amazon and bought the books listed BELOW, in addition to the ones you already know I ordered. Thanks again and bless you for all your help!! ....I figured building a good "self sufficient living" library was a wise thing to do. :) I already have the Ball canning book, so I'm good to go there. ....If anyone knows of a good book about the growing, harvesting, and processing of grain, I'd sure appreciate it if you could point me in its direction. Jay, I'd like to learn more about High Tunnel gardening too. Where do I start? :)

If anyone has any tips or recommendations, I would love it if you would share them with me. I'll keep an eye on Homesteading and read post from the past. I look forward to getting to know you all. Dave's Garden has the best folks on here!!

Thanks everyone!
:) Glenda

1 "The Book of Non-Electric Lighting: The Classic Guide to the Safe Use of Candles, Fuel Lamps, Lanterns, Gas Lights, & Fireview Stoves, Second Edition"
Tim Matson

1 "Build a Smokehouse: Storey Country Wisdom Bulletin A-81 (A Storey country wisdom bulletin)"
Ed Epstein

1 "Root Cellaring: Natural Cold Storage of Fruits & Vegetables"
Mike Bubel

1 "The Scythe BookSecond Edition Mowing Hay, Cutting Weeds, and Harvesting Small Grains with Hand Tools"
David Tresemer

1 "The Hoophouse Handbook: Growing Produce and Flowers in Hoophouses and High Tunnels"
Lynn Byczynski

1 "Carrots Love Tomatoes: Secrets of Companion Planting for Successful Gardening"
Louise Riotte; Paperback

1 "Roses Love Garlic: Companion Planting and Other Secrets of Flowers"
Louise Riotte

1 "Grow the Best Strawberries: Storey Country Wisdom Bulletin A-190 (Storey Country Wisdom Bulletin, a-190)"
Louise Riotte

1 "The NEW Passport To Survival. 12 Steps to Self-Sufficient Living"
Rita Bingham

1 "Seed to Seed: Seed Saving and Growing Techniques for Vegetable Gardeners"
Suzanne Ashworth

1 "Preserving Food without Freezing or Canning: Traditional Techniques Using Salt, Oil, Sugar, Alcohol, Vinegar, Drying, Cold Storage, and Lactic Fermentation"

1 "The Winter Harvest Handbook: Year Round Vegetable Production Using Deep Organic Techniques and Unheated Greenhouses"
Eliot Coleman

1 "A Guide to Canning, Freezing, Curing & Smoking Meat, Fish & Game"
Wilbur F. Eastman

Welcome Glenda! Glad you dropped in. =0)

I think in the back of a lot of folks mind is the thought of what to do and how to prepare if the whole thing goes kafloooey. And along the way we discover we really don't need and actually don't enjoy all that glitz and hype they keep trying to sell us. The satisfaction that comes from growing your own carrots, sewing your own clothes, and making your own cheese just can't be beat by some throw away plastic do-hickey.

I"ve been studying Coleman's books (The New Organic Grower, Four Season Harvest) for high tunnel info, as well as so much other info, so you've made a great pick there. =0) He has really developed quite a system, all without heating the greenhouse. I don't think we'll go 4 season, as it's nice to have some time off from baby sitting a garden... we'll borrow some chickens and let them glean and fertilize during the winter months.

There's a book by Carla Emory, someone here will know the title, which is the bible of homesteading, from what I hear. Many, many folks swear by it.

That's a nice selection of books; I'm going to have to check into some of those titles. =0) If you get any of the magazines I mentioned on the farming forum, they've all got 'bookstores' with lots of great titles. And lots of on-the-ground experience to benefit from.

I'd check in with Tiller's International on the family grain plot. They've got a lot of knowledge about subsistence farming. It's a very neglected part of our self-sufficiency learning, I think.

I don't know if you want to poke your nose into it, but you might check into how that dairy farmer is growing soybeans... some techniques can render your land pretty useless without a lot of special seed and off-farm chemicals. A very touchy subject...

So.... don't be a lurker, hunker down and chat a bit with us. We're all learning from/with each other as we go along... =0)
Jay

Jay, is the Carla Emory book you're talking about call "The Encyclopedia of Country Living"? It's the only Carla Emory book that I found on amazon, but wanted to make sure before I order it. It looks like an awesome book!

I also printed off instructions, from several sources including the CDC, on how to make rain, stream, etc., water drinkable. So I feel better about having that information in printed form.

I ordered some seeds from Victory Seed Company yesterday: Kentucky Pole Beans, Gold King Carrots, Golden Bantam Corn, Sugar Baby Watermelon, Small Sugar Pumpkin, Big Max Pumpkin, Brandywine Red Tomato, Abraham Lincoln Tomato, Iceberg Lettuce. .......Wish me luck! lol

Oh, check your D-mail too. :)

.......I'm off to check out Tiller's International......
Have a great day!

Yes, that's the one. =0)

Don't forget first aid! I'd suggest the survival sites for what they would recommend or wilderness first aid. Those are based on the assumption that the ambulence won't be there anytime soon, so they have more info on what to do.

Backwoods Home magazine is another good resource. I don't particularly agree with their politics, but there's no doubt about their skills, knowledge and experience. Here's their website...
http://www.backwoodshome.com/index.html

There's an article in the most recent issue about simple solar power, which I'm going to look into. I've been trying to figure out how to run a re-circulating pump in a place that doesn't have electricity without it costing a bazillion dollars.

Okay, one of the drawbacks of typing in the sun is the possibility of typing an ENTIRE post and losing it due to sun glare disappearance of the cursor....arghhhhhhh.

So trying again...welcome Glenda! I have bookshelf envy (Hi, my name is Sunny and I am a confirmed bibliophile) - that said, you're off to a terrific start. I love Carla's book but it has to be read novel style which is a little unlike my style for research style reading, but chock full of good stuffs. Gene Logdson's books are good as well, and the book "The Self-Sufficient Lifestyle and How to Live It" can't recall the author and I am out on the porch at the moment.

Don't get overwhelmed; I sometimes do and have to take a step back and breathe. It should not be this hard, but we have lost a lot of the knowledge transfer that we should have experienced. And oh, the Foxfire books rock as well.

Have fun!

~Sunny

Hi Sunny! It's wonderful to meet you!! :-D Thanks for the author and book recommendations. I'll look into them! I did get a copy of Carla's book, "The Encyclopedia of Country Living" yesterday. Oh my stars! That thing is HUGE!! You certainly get your money's worth! That one is going to take a while to get through. My husband and I are leaving on vacation in a few days and will be gone for about 8-10 days so I might take it with me. While he's watching sports on TV in the evenings, I can flip through it and do some reading. :) A couple years ago, I started collecting the Fox Fire books. They're great! I was born in Kentucky and all my ancestors go back to Tennessee, Old Virginia, and the Carolinas before the American Revolution. Many of them were some of the mountain men that settled the Smoky Mountains area. So when I read Fox Fire, I feel a real connection to the folks in them. ...I just wish I knew all that they knew!! LOL Some day, I hope to leave Michigan and move South. I miss Dixie terribly.

It really is sad to think of all the day-to-day knowledge about selfsufficient living that has been lost. I'm willing to bet that 80% of Americans don't know how to plant-grow-preserve food, can't make their own clothes, can't build a house or shelter, and can't repair much of anything mechanical. ....That's scary when you really think about it. Today's society lives in such a artificial world. ....A few years ago, friends of ours that have a big farm created a huge corn maze and opened it to the public. Like everyone around here, we went through it and had a blast. But the next day, a couple buses with middle school students from Detroit arrived at the corn maze, full of kids raring to go. They all paid their money and headed into the maze. About 10 minutes later, chaos broke out. The kids had never seen CORN before and when they got inside they lost their sense of direction, and all they could see was the tall corn towering over them. That's when they all FREAKED! There was screaming, crying, and panic everywhere. The farmer, his farm hands, and family had to go in and get those kids out. The corn scared them. ....Oh brother. :-[

It did cross my mind that trying to learn all about selfsufficient living could become really overwhelming. It's such a broad topic with soooo much to learn!! I've decided to prioritize and take pace myself. Steady as she goes should do it. :) ....I bought some more seeds today and hopefully I'll have enough for next year too. I'll rest a lot better having my own seed bank. ;) This year, I'm planting a little bit of everything but I'm going try my had with pole beans. I'm going to plant enough to get a feel for how much I have to plant to get 15 people through a year. If I do well with them, then next year I'll expand my garden. My Mom passed away the end of January, but my Dad wants to help me. He remembers a ton about how Granny grew things, canned them, etc. It will be good for him to have a garden to keep him busy. :) He's also going to show me how Granny use to dry her beans, apples, pumpkins, etc.

Well Sunny, I've rambled on enough for now. Enjoy that sunshine! I'm so glad spring is here!!
Take care!
Glenda

Wow! I love that you have a connection to pioneer roots, too. My father's family has been in the country since before the revolution, much of the time down south. And it's great that your pa is eager to pass on what he knows! Hooray!

Yep, I've found that I learn a lot when I focus in particular on one crop, trying to really learn what it likes, what varieties are suited for my garden, and how to get a really good crop. I plant other stuff and hope it grows. LOL But to really invest time and energy in one has paid off for me. I've got tomatoesand peas down pat now and am moving on to peppers and onions. =0)

Yep, if you think about it, it can seem a might overwhelming, but when you're standing out in the garden, it all becomes much clearer. It IS overwhelming. LOL

Jay

WOOHOOOO!! All my books arrived!!! .....I'm sooo excited!!! And so my library begins.... ;)

I have a question for you all. ....If I dig a pit, or well, to store vegetables in over the winter - like mentioned in some of my books, will they freeze where I live? (Michigan zone 5b) If the answer is yes, [what do I need to do] to keep the frost from getting to my stored produce here in Michigan?

.....I'm just thinking ahead so that I can prepare now. :) Thanks y'all!! :-D

Fantastic! It's so exciting to read and get all kinds of info and start stewing up ideas... gets me into trouble all the time! I just love it. LOL

Did you get the root cellaring book?

If you bury a barrel, you can store stuff in it over the winter. Just put a couple bales of straw on top to prevent freezing. Of course, it's inconvenient as all get out, but it's a quick and easy beginning while you dream up the perfect walk-in root cellar.

You could also play around with a dead chest freezer, bury it and cover the top with rigid insulation. That'd be neater, but you'll still have to get down on hands and knees to reach in.

We've talked about putting said dead freezer in a garage or minimally heated building, wondering if that would work just as is.

Glenda, welcome to the wild side! Yep, there is so much to learn and it does tend to get overwhelming. Just hang in there! The more you learn now, when it it isn't so desperate out there in world, the easier it will be.

I keep a list going of projects I want to do. Set up rain barrels and using gray water, collecting and saving seeds, planting fruit trees and bushes and perrenial fruits and vegetables, putting up a greenhouse and potting shed, fencing and shelter for future animals...well, those things are done, but the list goes on! The next big thing on the list is a small solar system on a small camper set up out behind the shed (mainly for a small light, the laptop and cell phones) and a small wood stove, just in case we lose power for an extended time. Larger than needed garden, filling freezer and stockingpiling groceries, paper products and medicinal/health & beauty items are all an ongoing project. I keep a few gallons and a couple of cases of bottled water at home. I also have bought some propane camping gear along the way and buy a tank or two of propane when I have extra cash. Just buy a little at a time.

I also keep a big loose leaf notebook where I keep specific details on how to do the things around the place that I want to do or take care of whatever we have going, in regards of food we're growing, poultry and animals.

Best of luck in all you are doing!

Thanks MsRobin!! ....It's nice to know that I'm not the only one thinking about what the future might hold. ;-D ....Keep plugging away on that list!

I keep a notebook too! All kinds of useful info, odds and ends in there.

Just read in the Wall Street Journal how foreign countries have infiltrated the computers that manage our electric grid... they've traced the codes to Russia and China, though of course both gov't deny such sabotage. But someone has installed programs that can take over the systems if activated. So someone has the ability to shut down our electrical grid and it's nearly impossible to find all the bugs.

So the PV system moves up the list... and this year there's a nice tax credit, too. =0)

Got my high tunnel up, so that improves our food security. Thinking about taking one or two of the donks up to a workhorse workshop this summer, learn more about plowing and cultivating in a hands on sort of way. The little I've done was years ago and it was only a weekend. I've read a lot more now and may be able to ask relevent questions.... instead of just giggle.

Glenda Yes you can dig your hold about 30 inches deep line it with leaves or straw put in the vegies and fruit to be stored add straw or leaves then top with the dirt you took out of the hold I came from Ionia county and we did this yearly when I was a boy

Dave, that's great info! So you know exactly what I'm up against, here in Michigan. :) ....Hey, what kind of fruit did you store in it? I've only read about storing vegetables.

We put apples in it

Ahhhh..... Do some variety of apples do store better than others?

Glenda ~ does your Michigan home have a basement? A basement was adequate for root cellaring in MN. We also kept all our canned foods there also. It offered enough insulation to prevent freezing. The average frost line in MN was 8" deep if I remember.
We would wrap the apples and the green tomatoes in newsprint to store. Once a month, we would unwrap and check to make sure there was no rotting. The tomatoes and the apples needed to be stored separately. The wrapped produce was put in slatted wooden boxes and would usually provide till springtime.
Best wishes... pod

Some apples do indeed store better than others. I can't help as to which varieties, but it is a valuable property and is probably part of many heirloom variety descriptions.

Jay, I know that some apples are softer, some firmer, etc., so it would stand to reason that some store better than others. Hopefully someone who knows will let us know. In the mean time, I'll try to find out and let everyone know what I find.

Pod, my house is about 150 years old, but it's in awesome shape. :) It is located on top of a hill so the land falls away from it on 3 of its 4 sides. It has a beautiful fieldstone basement/cellar the size of the entire footprint of the original part of the house. It is dry, solid, and in beautiful shape. It does have a cellar door that leads to the outside, which allows some cold air downstairs, but it's not freezing. Our furnace is located down there and actually, whenever I go downstairs it's always quite comfortable. How warm can my cellar be and still do the job of a root cellar?? Does anyone know the maximum temp?? That would be AWESOME if it's cool enough to store food from my garden! I wouldn't even have to go outside to get what I need in the winter time!! .....The frost here goes down about 42 inches. We don't get enough snow to insulate the ground here, so the frost goes deeper.
:) Glenda

I would guess our basement/fruit cellar would run from the low 40s to low 50s in temp. We had a woodburning furnace down there too. My Mom would sell eggs to the hatchery. We would clean and pack them in the basement year around. It sounds as tho you might have the excellent solution for your root cellar.

Hmmmm, that's interesting. I'll put a thermometer downstairs and see what kind of temps I get. Even thought it's supposed to be in the 80's this weekend, we'll probably still get some cold weather. .......Where else does one get 6 inches of snow and 80 degree weather all in the same month. :-[

Glenda, I've googled "root cellars" before and came up with a couple of links of how to simply retofit a "root cellar" pretty cheaply into a basement. Sure wish I had a basement, now that I can really garden!

Robin

Glenda... is that thermometer a hi/lo one? You'll need one to show you the range of temps you get down there. Even if it goes too high now, with such a large basement, you could probably just build an insulated wall to separate the furnace area from the cold storage area.

podster's right, about 40-50* depending on the veg... it should say in one of those books you got! LOL

And I do know that Red Delicious don't store. Will be looking forward to what you find....

=0) Jay

Thinking about that, you are right. Ours was a separate room and it was in the northwest corner of the basement which remained cooler also.

Jay, I would have never thought about a high/low thermometer..... Thanks for the tip! That's what I'll get!

Podster, I hadn't thought about it, but the northwest corner of my basement has a good size hole in the foundation that allows plumbing to go to the area of the house that use to be the back porch. That area is always colder because of the way they added on to the house. .......I'll give it some thought; there should be a way to gather that colder air under that part of the house without making my pipes freeze..... This just might work! ;-D

Regarding apples, so far, I have found this....but not varieties yet:

"Store only fall apples. Summer apples do not store well. Leave the stem on the apple. Remove any bruised apples. Maintain a root cellar temperature of, ideally, 32 degrees Fahrenheit with relative humidity around 80 percent. You can store apples at higher temperatures, but you should increase the relative humidity to 90 percent. Also, higher temperatures will decrease the storage life of the apples."

........I'll look some more this evening.........

That hi/lo will be useful for a lot of things... GH temps, cold frame temps, etc.

You'll probably need to go to an heirloom apple site.... each variety description should say how well it stores.

There used to be a place in the ozarks years ago that specialized in heirloom apples, but I have no idea if it's still around. Anyways, haunt the heirloom apple sites (maybe even Stark's) and eventually you'll find the info. Then don't forget to come back and tell us! Maybe even start a new thread, 'cause that's very useful info and may catch some folks eyes that aren't reading this one (my current pet peeve... really neat, useful info buried in a thread on a totally different topic...)

Naturally, winter's over, so the temps in the cellar won't be entirely accurate for determining your temp range... that happens to me all the time. I figure something out just as the season for it is over. Blech! }=oP

LOL Jay

On the hi/low thermometer, you might look for one that has a sending unit where you can monitor it from upstairs. I do that in an outdoor plant shelter and keep an eye on the temp when I'm indoors.

Neato!

You all are "Smarter than the average bear!" ;) ......What would I do without you?!

I'll let you know what I find on the heritage apple sites, and where I find my high/low-remote thermometer!! Yeah!!

hugs,
Glenda

Hey, hey, hey Boo-boo!
LOL

they would have been Northern spy and Macintosh and a few red delicious your cellar would work fine if there was a cold room made in one corner it should hold about 40*

where in michigan are you located? I am not to far from big rapids. Currently homesteading on a string :)

That must be a real balancing act. Sorry. Couldn't resist. LOL

We have a cellar at our new place. I'll have to get me one of those thermometers also and store a few things "down cellar in a teacup". Right now I have the jars of pickled stuff down there.

This message was edited Sep 7, 2009 3:15 PM

LOL, Cajun that was great :) I'm wanting to know how many of those books Glenda has made it through by now!

I got some money for my BD and I bought 2 books for myself. I got Root Cellaring Natural Cold Storage of Fruits and Vegetables, and Barnyard in Your Backyard. I didn't get any produce raised to go in the cellar but I figure I can buy some. I should also be able to learn how to take better care of my chickens and goats. I got the horses down cold. LOL

I've been longing for a root cellar very badly this year... I've got beets, carrots and a ton of onions and no place cool to store them, so they're still in the ground. I think that'll work for the beets and carrots, but the onions are going to freeze soon! Dang... only so much onion soup a girl can eat! LOL

Do you have a dehydrator? I understand onion will dry well. I use dried onion a lot but am shopping for a dehydrator.

Yes, we do have a dehydrator... one of the Excaliburs. We love it, and I've been thinking about dehydrating some of the onions, but there's that slicing onions thing... LOL... and how many days can I stand the house smelling like onions.

We've dehydrated a case of apples (YUM) all the end of season red and green peppers, and a ton of jalapenos. We tried tomatoes, but they take forever to dry and I just couldn't bring myself to feel good about the amount of energy it took. Our sun is too unreliable here to sun dry, and we just don't use that many, so we've stopped doing them.

But yes, we'll probably dehydrate some... as soon as I decide I need a good cry!

Gather up some old panyhose and tie them up in that. You could hang them in the shed. Folks here pull them and hang them together by their tops in the barn loft.