Hi all,
Does anyone know how the cultivar name 'Mathilde' is pronounced? Is it Ma TILL da? It really doesn't look like the word would be pronounced like that, but any other way I try to pronounce the word makes even less sense. (this is for the Hoya carnosa x serpens cross.)
I, for-the-life-of-me, can't figure out how this word would be pronounced. I know it is someone's name or nick-name and I believe that the name is Swedish.
Anyone know...??? (:o)
Thanks,
Mike
How do you pronounce 'Mathilde'?
Hi...the name, actually, is Belgian and, I believe pronounced Ma-tilled...accent on the last syllable. Unless it is Flemish and then I would have no clue!!! LOL
Hi Carol,
Thanks!
Mike
ma-till-dah
it's from the german side of things
(also my mother's middle name)
Googled and found this: http://dictionary.infoplease.com/mathilde
I thought it was pronounced ma-till-dah also ... I guess it could depend on the area of the world you are from?
Wow, thanks, now it's clear as mud! (:o)
"Ma•thil•de
Pronunciation: (mu-til'du; Fr. ma-tēld'; Ger. mä-til'du), [key]
—n.
a female given name, French or German form of Matilda.
Random House Unabridged Dictionary, Copyright © 1997, by Random House, Inc., on Infoplease."
I guess "Mathilde" is the French or German form of Matilda, as noted above. (thanks for the link, Lin!). Since I am half German, I'll pronounce the word as Matilda.
Mike
This is a wonderful thread. It reminds me of all of the hoya names that no one really knows how to pronounce. When I get together with other hoya lovers and we talk about different hoyas, well carnosa is a no-brainer, but who knows how to pronounce onychioides? I gave it a Greek pronounciation - "o nick o dees" and a friend pronounced it "o nee chee oy dees" (say that 5 times fast!). The really bizaare ones are names that end in "ii" -is it "cur tee see eye" or "cur tee see". Is it "mac gill i viray ee" or "mac gill i viray eye". I could go on. A question that we should be posing here I think is, is there a reliable location to procure the correct pronounciation for hoyas?
Thanks for starting this thread Mike - I love it!!
Christine
Hi Christine,
Thanks for giving me a small clue to the pronunciation of Hoya 'onychoides'! (:o)
In the Gesneriad club I belong to, there is a lady that works with various molds (the kind that grow on walls, etc.) and she says that the double I (ii) is pronounced like this: "mac gill i viray ee" rather than "eye". It's like it's a foreign language or something! (:o)
I have also heard that there is no soft "c" sound in Latin so that the genus name for Maples (Acer) is pronounced as you would pronounce an "acre" of land rather than "ay sir", the way I have always pronounced it.
Mike
This message was edited Oct 20, 2008 7:08 AM
lol...this is a good thread.
Now I pronounce this 'Mah- teelD, with a 'hard' D, which is close to MatildA, but not quite.....because the nice man (Emilio) whose wife this is named after lives near France, (Belgium....we were discussing this one once on GW and he was partaking in the discussion) and the two years of French that I took in high school taught me that this word is pronounced that way.
Our French teacher had us all choose a 'French' name, and one of my classmates choose Mathilde.
Since it's the French form of Matilda....I'm assuming it should be pronounced in the French dialect.
The dictionary doesn't always capture 'dialect'....and so we all pronounce it differently, I suppose, LOL!
We should ask Emilio!
Well...as botanical names are Latin, they should be pronounced in Latin. There ARE two schools of pronounciation of the 'ii' as I have been told.... The Brits say Mac gill e vray eye eye and the Americans say eye (two at the same time. Look at Latin pronounciation. ........iae is pronounced eye ay. A good Latin Dictionary is a great help but there are exceptions (aren't there always??)... Oooops, wrong again. There are not two 'i' in macgillivrayi...I was trying to say that the 'English' pronounce both when there are two.
Yes...Emilio would tell us if it is pronounced as in French or as in Flemish (kinda Germanish)
This message was edited Oct 20, 2008 9:25 AM
This message was edited Oct 20, 2008 1:26 PM
Wait a minute....not to be argumentative...but cultivar names usually aren't Latin, are they?
Nan,
Actually, you're correct.
Latinized cultivar names have not been allowed since 1959. I am also into dwarf and unusual conifers, along with just about every other plant out there, so, a weeping conifer that was discovered and named now could not have the cultivar name of 'Nan's Pendula'; the cultivar name would need to be something along the lines of 'Nan's Weeping', 'Nan's Golden Weeping', etc.
Does anyone know if Emilio is a member of Dave's Garden? If it isn't, we should see if he would join. (:o)
Mike
OK, I thought so....not all of my thoughts are flighty, lol!!
I didn't realize though, that they weren't 'allowed'.
I just know there are a lot of 'odd' cultivar names out there, and they're more often than not rather 'unconventional'...one that comes to mind is an Osteospermum...the cultivar name is 'whirligig'...and there's probably not much debate on how that's pronounced! (Ü)
I'm not sure if Emilio posts over on GW much these days, either (I'm there off and on, but haven't noticed any posts or responses from him)...but it's a good thought to see if he'd join us here at DG!
LOL, now I'm really confused ... so, what is the correct pronunciation of Hoya Mathilde??
I think it depends what language you prefer to pronounce it in - essentially, "correct" isn't as important as how comfortably it flows off of your tongue... I'll still pronounce it "ma til duh"; my friend will still pronounce onychioides "o nee che oy dees", because that's how she's been pronouncing it all along. I have a friend who's mother called forsythia "for cynthia", clearly incorrect, but not for her.
I guess I will continue to say "Ma til duh" ... Like the song "Waltzing Matilda".
LOL, the way your friend pronounces onychioides is the same way I've been pronouncing it!
I guess I don't have to worry too much since I don't have either of those Hoyas! ^_^
ooh, Lin...now I know something I can send you (that you don't have already!) in your upcoming package! LOL!!
Woo Hoo ... Nan, are you serious? I keep saying I've got too many plants and I'm not going to do that house plant swap each month but now I'm glad I joined in on the October swap ... and glad you got my name! ^_^ A cutting is fine ... I've had good luck rooting them so far! Oh, I am so excited ... another hoya to grow! ^_^
My newest addiction! Botanical pronunciation. ^_^
I can't help you with the cultivar name, but do you mean onychoides? I can't find any reference to a species spelled onychioides.
onychoides = oh-nik-OY-deez http://davesgarden.com/guides/botanary/search.php?search_text=onychoides
However, if you DO mean onychioides, then it would be oh-nik-ee-OH-id-eez, *or* oh-nik-ee-OY-deez
I'll take a wild stab at Mathilde, but I really don't know, since it's a common name. muh-THIL-dee
I would go with 'matt-ild' I dont think the spelling is phonetic, ie, every letter pronounced as in Spanish....if it is phonetic, it would be Matt- il- deh, ..the 'e' being pronounced as it is used at the beginning of egg and the 'h' being silent, altho the whole of the 'deh' part would be soft, like an after thought MATT-IL deh
This message was edited Oct 21, 2008 4:54 AM
This message was edited Oct 21, 2008 8:09 AM
This thread is giving me a headache. :)
lol!
Edit to say: Lin, thanks. Ever since I read your comment, I haven't been able to get the song "Waltzing Matilda" out of my feeble brain. ;)
Barb
This message was edited Oct 21, 2008 12:30 PM
I'm just glad I can now pronounce oh-nik-OY-deez and 'Mah- teelD and when I say these names it no longer sounds like I'm from a different planet. (:o)
Mike
OK...now try tjadamanguensis -
cha da man gensis - I think
This message was edited Oct 22, 2008 10:03 AM
lol!
When I go to a greenhouse/nursery looking for a specific plant using the *botanical* name.....I always say "I can spell it but I can NOT pronounce it"....so I spell it for them!
(sometimes *that's* easier said than done, too!) (Ü)
Did any you take or have t take Latin in school or college?
I really think I'd like to learn more about it...but I've heard it's a major pain!
I had to take it at school... it has been useful in later life at times, tho it was utterly dull at school. I dont remember much, but it does just pop back from memory when stimulated..most European languages at some point had it mixed in as those pesky Romans got everywhere....some languages more than others, so if learning Spanish, French, or even Romanian to name a few, its very useful to have learnt it when young...
There's also latinIZED names, for additional migraines. There, the name is pronounced as the name would be in its own language, but with a latinized ending, like macgillivrayi and waymaniae and patella.
I read a lot of names, but when I am talking to someone face to face I often realized I've never said the name out loud before. Even apparently simple ones can stump you- how about fungii and 'Tove'? Let alone Hoya juannguoiana.
I've always thought onychoides would be "ah-nee-koy-dees", but who knows an ancient Greek they can ask?