Is There a Doctor In The house???? Need Help!!!

I woke up to the pouring rain thankful it's been so dry here.
Set out to do the morning bird check i treid an umbrela but its hard to hold a feed bucket and that too. I decided to just get wet instead of fight it and was allmost done when i noticed my self blue roo sitting on the ground in the rain. I only have one ground pen and it's got the pair that the hen with bits came from i threw in some seed and the hen ran to it and he got up stumbling and went to the seed. I thought mareks at first but somebody had left thier door ajar {me} one day day last week and they had free ranged all day. If you could know my set up that is not a good idea here all but 2 of my pens are off ground and under those pens are DANGER Built up pigeon/chicken/dove poo and feathers nest material scattered feed/seed I remove my manure about 4 times a year more if it just gets to heaping. So the stumbling could be something he ate all sorts of foreign things can cause problems but that wasn't the worst i found when i picked him up PEOPLE i think i have in the history of my haveing chickens Dry Pox i just draw up and cringe. Me who treats her sanctuary like a hospital who uses germ x until my hands are bone dry and cracking that quarintines and isolates all birds to thier own private homes. I have failed my flock and brought a enemy into there lives Shame on me Shame on me!!!
Questions Questions Questions.
He only has 2 crusty yellow warts should i put him down {SOB} due to the lameness and Pox??????
How big of a threat is he to my other birds he is in his own pen i looked it up on the web and it can be passed to pigeons??????
How Bad will it get?????
How far can it spread distance wise???
Is it safe to still sell birds that have no signs of it????
How about his hen should i put her down because she will get it too??????
My hen with the 11 bittys was in that pen not more than a week ago when she was setting will she get it and will it kill her babys?????
How many birds will be affected is there anyway i can stop this in it's tracks i'm prepared to cull?????
Would torching my pens Which is useing a blow torch on the all metal ones kill this thing????
How long does it last???
I will Probably will have more Questions I"M Scared people i brought home a rabbit once and it carried a virus it wiped out three of my rabbits in less than a week and it was isolated.
The Only chickens i have gotton was 2 pairs of modern game and they are perfect and have no pox scars and i got them 2 months ago.
I feel like dirt because these birds depend on me for thier safety and its my responsibilty to keep them in the cleanest, safest, careingest liveing conditions i can provide and i let them down.
I'm just beside myself i hate to see a bird in distress or sick i got a cabinet full of all sorts of things i use to keep them well. AS soon as i see a wound i clean it with peroxide and apply neosporin or triple antibiotic i use germ x religously to prevent germ spread and keep thier pens sprayed for lice and look at vents for nits.
But now this i'm so upset just so upset and crying gotta go now. *Harmony*



[A note here i did over react a little but i've never seen pox and my roo was down and it was a hard mornin]










This message was edited Sep 16, 2008 10:43 AM

Harmony.

#1) Try to relax - it is not your fault. What you need to do is continue to do the best for your birds and we all know you are a very caring, loving, careful chicken mom. NOT your fault. Breathe.

#2) My chicken health handbook has lots of info on dry pox and I am going to type it up for you now, but it will take a few minutes. Patience. :-)

#3) We all send you hugs.

Claire


This message was edited Sep 10, 2008 11:38 AM

Dry Pox (also call avian pox, fowl pox, sore head)

Incidence: common in some areas worldwide, especially in confined flocks in cold weather
System affected: skin
Incubation period: 4 to 14 days
Progression: spreads slowly (except when spread by mosquitoes), last 3 to 5 weeks in individual birds

NOTE: HARMONY - this could have come from MOSQUITOES!! NOT your fault!!!!!

Symptoms: in birds of all ages, except newly hatched chicks, raised or clear whitish wart-like bumps on comb and wattles that grow larger, turn yellowish, and later become reddish brown, gray, or black bleeding scabs, appearing singly or in clusters. Scabs fall off to form smooth scars. May cause weight loss and drop in egg production.

Mortality: 1 to 2%
HARMONY!! Only 1 to 2% of birds die from it. Not as serious as it could be. Most recover just fine and may just have a few scars.

Cause: pox virus that affects wide variety of birds and survives for many months on scabs and feathers of infected birds.

Transmission: Through skin wounds, feathers and scabs from infected birds, MITES, MOSQUITOES, WILD BIRDS

SEE!!! Not your fault!!!!

Prevention: defies good management (see, again, not your fault). Control mites and mosquitoes, vaccinate where pox is prevalent

Treatment: None. Isolate infected birds in uncrowded housing. Remove scabs around mouth and eyes so birds can eat. Prevent secondary infection with 300 mg oxytetracycline (Terramycin) per gallon of drinking water for 3 days followed by vitamin supplement in water. Infected birds NATURALLY RECOVER in 2 to 4 weeks and are immune.

Thoroughly clean housing after outbreak to remove all infected scabs, feathers, etc.

No human health risk.

I hope some of that makes you feel better. Your roo will recover. Your other birds, if they catch it, will most likely recover. Very low mortality. Plus, spread by mosquitoes and other insects and NOT YOUR FAULT!!!

Keep the roo well fed and well isolated from everyone else. Watch for symptoms on everyone else. Don't handle roo and then handle others. Handle all others first, then roo, then wash hands thoroughly, or use latex gloves to handle roo and throw them out every time. Keep him as isolated as you can because if a skeeter bites him and then moves on to another bird, it could get infected. Might even keep him in an outbuilding or something to minimize risk. Usually mosquitoes only bite once, get their fill, and leave.

Hugs, hugs, hugs, you are going to be fine and your roo should be fine.
I'm sure more experts will come in with advice.
Claire

Oh Harmony! I'm so sorry your so upset... It's important for YOU to be okay here too you know! Sending healing, calming loving thoughts to you and your birds..

It is definitely not your fault, and as long as you only have the dry form it is not serious.

Mosquitoes are the most common means of the virus spreading, so spraying for mosquitoes will help prevent further infection, but be aware that many or most of your birds are already infected. Watch them closely for signs of lesions.

What I did when it showed up here for the first time last year was ask a bunch of folks on what and how to treat, read everything I could find and then mixed several methods together.

Listerine, iodine, VetRx and cooking oil were all recommended for treating lesions and to repel mosquitoes from individual birds. I mixed together listerine, VetRx, betadine (povidone iodine), lavender oil and neosporin. I nuked it in the microwave to melt the neosporin, then poured into a small sprayer bottle and shook well. One or two small sprays per bird is plenty. I would rub the mix onto birds exposed skin daily--treat well birds first--you may even want to fix a separate bottle for them.

I also sprayed the yard for mosquitos and hung repellant strips (the kind you put on kids wrists) just above the height of the birds. I sprayed their coops with the kind of repellant you put on your skin.

Watch for birds who atop eating or eat very little--the lesions are PAINFUL, and this will be a clue to check inside their mouths for lesions. These lesions don't get crusty--they are yellow or white and will continue growing if not removed.

First, I brought the wet pox birds inside, farther away from mosquitos and where I could keep a closer eye upon them. Then I would soak listerine onto a q-tip and swab out the mouth--working to loosen and remove any lesions I found--it really seemed to help considerably. I did this a couple of times a day. Partly luck, but I think largely because how I aggressively managed and treated during this time I was able to minimize the number of birds with wet pox (only 2 or 3), all of whom recovered. The lesions in the mouth seem to start at the corner of the mouth, or on the roof of the mouth and work their way toward the throat. If they get pox in their mouths, eating will hurt, so try to feed soft foods--baby bird handfeeding formula is a good choice.

I didn't, but a neighbor had a couple of birds develop lesions in their eyes.

The scabs and any pus from any pox lesions can remain contagious for months, so be careful about cleaning these up.


Okay, re-read the original post to see what else needed answers. I too had a hen & babies get pox. They survived.

Yes, pigeons can get pox; my 4 didn't.

I chose to not sell birds that I had planned to during that time; since they had been exposed, I didn't feel it was fair to sell birds who had a strong chance of becoming ill.

Suze

Thanks Claire i haven't had anymore post here with answers to my questions.
I searched the web and found some pics i'm placeing 2 is this as bad as it gets or is this kind of like some things some have it bad while others dodge the bullet.
The amazing thing is on one of the site they said that research found putting iodine on the lesions helped heal the sores. Why i use iodine all the time and had put some on the roos comb but that was before you told me not to handle them." GOT GLOVES GERM X AND IODINE " ready for battle. I'm still on the fence about putting down the roo.{SAD} because of his lameness and the pox i allways try to do things by my head and not my heart it's better to lose one chicken and be sad then watch a whole flock suffer.
I still need to know if it is going to effect my mama and her chicks because she was in that pen with the roo up until about a week and a half ago???
I'm okay with selling as most of my birds are not in close contact with him and i haven't seen warts on any others i will check again just to be certain. I take this personally and allways strive to keep them healthy and when they are not happy i'm not happy.
Now People don't think me strange but i have performed CPR on rabbits given mouth to mouth to chicks
you simply open thier beak and blow gently no contact needed. Wet down and saved a heat exausted rabbits CURED eye infection in rabbits when i was told there was no cure. I was at a livestock sale this past july it was hot way close to 100 and somebody came in with a pair of barred rocks everbody said the hen was dead from sitting in the heat in a truck bed. He sat them aside and i walked over sad it had happened. Not critizizing at all because it can happen to all of us it's just one stuck traffic backup away. But i saw her eye flutter and i said shes not dead and i put her in front of one of the large fans they use to cool the animals i got my handy spray bottle and went to work.
I wet her good and she was breathing better but it was still on the side of bad so i felt her breast and said i need to bring down her core temp. All the while we were forgotten just me the chicken a jug of cold water and a fan. I lifted her wing and poured the water on her breast cupped my hand and put some under the other a few seconds went by and she opened both eyes good girl i said to her breathing was better but still shallow I worked about an hour on her water in front of the fan and talking and when he finally took her home in the front of a air condition truck i might add he came back about 2 hours later and said he had took her home and took her inside to the AC and went outside for a little while and came back to find her sittng on his sofa LOL!!! Later at the sale i had several people come to me and say boy you brought that hen back and one said you should be a vet as much as you care about these animals and i said i never give up if i think i can save it i will but i know when to let go as well it's all about the animal and not my feelings i would never have a animal suffering because i want to be a hero. I'm no Hero just somebody who cares.
This story was long but i feel better now Thanks for the kind words Claire

I didn't know yall had sent post as i was busy writeing my post THANK YOU and i feel better!
Here's another pic of pox.

Harmony - you must have been typing while Suze was answering. As you see from her post, her hens and chicks that did get it were fine. If it were me, I would wait the 14 days for incubation of the virus after separating the roo, just to see if any more birds get it, before selling them. But that is just my opinion. If you have mosquitoes in your area that are getting it somewhere, it's not even a matter of whether your birds were in contact with the roo. Plus, he would have got bitten by a mosquito 4 to 14 days ago, so others could have been bitten in the meantime.

Also see what Suze said about the iodine mixture. She clearly has the experience to help you out even more than my information in my chicken health handbook. But it does not sound as serious as the wet pox and I am sure everything will be OK.

I loved your story about the hen cooling down experience. You have such a dear heart to be so helpful and caring, and I am sure that hen knew it.

I would not put that roo down if I were you. He will get over the pox and be just fine. Hang in there!
Claire

Thanks for all the encouragement and help i went and inspected everybody and he is the only one with the three warts. No claire i didn't put him down i tend to panic when it comes to my birds.
I see no reason to move him hes not in close contact with any others but his hen and i pray she be spared. the closest thing to him is up off the ground and he is on the ground and he is still sitting on the ground i did catch him and put iodine on his warts. I was supposed to sell this weekend but looks like i will be only takeing Doves And Pigeons as they have no combs. I visited alot of sites and most gave the incubation period as 7 to 14 days it varied a little from site to site. So i'm going to wait 2 weeks to see if anybody comes down with it and if not i will sell then.
This roo and his hens were going to be my pet chickens and not breeders the 11 that hatched was a suprise i get so busy with all i have sometimes i over look and Duh i walk by thier pen and said look shes laying again did that for a week for i stopped long enough to realize she was setting and it was to late to unset her soooooooo now theres 11 more.
Thanks again.

I hadn't had a chance to get here yet but i have good news. My roo is a little better today he is walking around a little and theres not anymore warts on his head.

Hurray! He's got a chance then!

MollyD

Just keep an eye on them because dry pox can become wet pox. It is the same virus--it is just where it infects that is the issue. That's one reason you want to treat any wounds near the mouth, nose or eyes as soon as possible.

Suze

Suze I'm treating his warts with Iodine it was recommended by you as well as some of the sites about pox. I applied it allready twice today and it seems to be drying them up.
Yes i'm watching him closely if you knew me when any of mine has a problem i'm on it and stay on it till it's solved.

Super! I'm glad it's helping. I just wanted to make sure you knew that wet and dry pox are only different in where the lesions occur. With different names it would be easy to assume that they are separate illnesses.

Looking at the pix, it is definitely pox.
Suze

Suze sorry to confuse you about the pics those are one from a sites i visited yesterday and ask the question is this as bad as it gets sorry for the confusion. I visited him again right before dark and he was up and i was excited let me tell you i caught him and treated his warts and they don't look any bigger and he still just has three so i'm hopein thats it. I put him down right at the front of the pen and he walked all the way to his hen. I believe it wasn't mereks i think it was from them getting out {i left the door ajar} and eating something toxic.

Harmony,

I don't know enough about chicken health to offer anything helpful, but I just wanted to tell you that I'm thinking of you and your roo and sending warm, healing vibes your way.

I will no longer be posting on this thread

Okay who upset Harmony???

MollyD

I wanna know too as I haven't been in DG for a few weeks!

Harmony, this is the Chicken_Fairy. Terribly sorry the storms have brought infected mosquitos to your area. I did all I could to protect as many chickens as possible. Meanwhile please know YOU CAN HANDLE THIS. And when everything has calmed down, your DG friends will be here waiting. As you say, STAY CALM.
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CF