Didnt want to sound too demanding in the subject area but need advise on a matter that will need to be taken care of tonight. I've posted in the past that I have a couple of birds with bare backs. I had questioned mites or lice in the past or possible abuse from the rooster. My roosters spurs are ridiculously long. I just bought a dremel and stone last weekend, but havent gotten to the job yet. I have 2 hens that look very bad. One is in quite a bit of distress as I type. She is breathing hard and making a loud wheezing sound. She has a large area on her back that has been bare for quite some time. I took a look at the rest of her and she also has her stomach picked clean of feathers. This area is bright red, very hot to the touch and skin seems to be flaking off. The other hen that looks lousy does not seem to be in any distress yet, but has area on front of neck that is red and raw (looks exactly the same) and same thing on her stomach. Does this sound like something pest related or something else? I have a topical that will kill lice and mites that I can put on them, I got it this summer from the lady I got the ducks from. I didnt use it because I didnt think it was a pest problem and I would rather not use a chemical on them. In addition I dont want to have to refrain from using the eggs for 2 weeks. I cannot remember the name of this topical she drew it up in a syringe and said to put a drop on each of the chickens backs. There combs all seem to be normal colored. I had posted last night that my rooster also sounds hoarse. Now wondering if this is all related. Your thoughts are really appreciated. I have 20 chickens between 2-3 years of age, and 18 that are preadult. The pre-adult chickens show no indications of any of these things. I have a rabbit cage that is about 7feetx2 feet that I have 6 chicks in, they are about 2-3 weeks old. I was considering putting the two hens that look really bad in with them to separate them and possibly use this medication as just a whim, but also am concerned about QT'ing these girls with the babies. I have a feeling the buff orphington that is wheezing so bad will be dead in the next couple of hours. These were a couple of the chickens that were going to be given away at the end of the summer for someone to either eat or use as a lesser egg layer. I dont want to spread something to other chickens and dont want to give away unhealthy birds. Thanks .
Need advise asap pretty please : )
I wouldn't put them in with other birds. They may have a systemic secondary bacterial infection, advanced fungal infection or other contagious disease. Probably not related to the hoarse rooster. I think the pesticide may do more harm than good. I never like killing anything--but it sounds like the sicker of the two is suffering and should probably be euthanized. The healthier one? Maybe try the pesticide--but I would want to know what it is and then google for contraindications. Good luck. I'm sure others will have better advice.
Thankyou for the response. I checked over the 2 birds that look bad and cannot see mites or lice, but I dont know how hard these things are to see. I looked at the shaft by the skin in areas that are picked at. The bird that is really suffering right now had areas that were bleeding where she had picked her feathers out. Some of the other birds feathers have been looking a little rough and thought maybe I had a feather picker, but after being down in the pen and watching them, I think they may be doing it to themselves. I'm going to go down now and go take some photos. I'm already feeling upset and maybe having to euthanize one or some of them. Of course I'm a little over emotional now in general because I'm withdrawling from an antidepressant that I just stopped. Also feeling guilty about whatever might be going on. Thanks, I'll post some pics shortly. I'm afraid you guys are going to be appalled at how bad these spots look : - (
heres some pics, I just took some randdom pics of some of the different chickens. They all seem like they are cleaning themselves alot. ? if related, or question from being evening and alot of mosquitos out.
another
I'm not sure about all the possible mite conditions in birds, but in dogs there are mites that live buried very deeply in the skin in the hair folllicle and cause serious redness and thickening of the dog's skin as well as extensive hair loss. Often there is secondary bacterial infection. These mites live on all virtually all dogs, but dogs and puppies with weak immune systems can be overcome by them. In order to diagnose a dog you have to scrape the skin very hard to try to scrape up a mite. Sometimes they can't find them and just treat anyway. Sometimes the condition is so advanced they can't control it. I'll try googling to see if there is something similar in chickens
RIR with raw neck in the front
oops last pic was of belly, here is the neck.
Okay this is pretty horrible and may not be at all what you have--but it reminded me that some mites only attack the birds at night and hide in cracks in the coop during the day--so you would never see them.
http://www.birdmites.org/mites.html
This is the buff orphington that is wheezing and in very bad shape, this shows how she is breathing, and I did a video of her too, I'll see if it load
Here is a more general discussion of mites: http://www.backyardpoultrymag.com/issues/2/2-5/Laura_E_John.html
Mites can kill birds--but so could a fungal skin disease if it got bad enough. I'll look that up.
Video didnt work, prob too big of a file. Buffs stomach.
This is another birds back that is just starting the red thing. I had assumed once again that it was caused by the roosters spurs
rooster with looser fluffy feathers under wings. May be normal??????? Tried to just upload this but it didnt go, so if this appears twice, sorry!
This is an incredible clearing house site for poultry health sites. I went to specific diseases and looked up gangrenous dermatitis under "dermatitis". I don't think that sounds right. But you may find something that does. I am thinking it is either feather plucking after mite irritation with a secondary infection--or some type of fungal infection.
http://www.poultryhelp.com/link-disease.html#specific
aracuana starting to lose feathers on back, again , rooster??????
Also forgot to mention it seemed like I was seeing alot of runnier poo in the pen, but figured it was from the "teen" chicks. They eat the adult food and also have their chicker grower. I saw one of the hens poo tonight, she does not seem to compromised by what is going on, but it was water stool with the brown and white cap mixed in.
Has anyone here seen a chicken with staph skin infections? It is also called fowl pox, I think.
Okay, not fowl pox--that is viral. But I just read an abstract describing staph skin infections in young broiler chickens that then developed into lesions typical of fowl pox. Hmmmm.
This message was edited Jul 11, 2008 8:41 PM
Oh one more thing, I pen is very messy right now, you can prob see that in the pics. We are currently really overhauling it. It has dirt floor inside and out. I have had chickens 3 years and never cleaned out the dirt floor. Everything has composted in the past. This year was the first year it got really stinky, so I just rotatilled the inside and out. I removed about 15 cart loads of manure/dirt. I dont smell a strong ammonia odor, so I dont think they are being burned by ammonia. I do clean their nest boxes regularly. We put half the wood floor in this last monday, hopefully will finish other half on Sunday. We have alot of flies right now. I figured part of that was the addition of the ducks in the pen. They have their own sleeping quarters and I noticed they are pretty stinky with how they are with their food and water. I put DE down over inside and out and in nest boxes today to cut down of fly population. I purchase lime for the dirt outside and some stall dry for the inside the coop. I havent put the lime or stall dry down yet. I'm wondering if there was a mite or lice problem, maybe it got stirred up with all the work we are doing down there. Thanks for all the help.
I'm getting ready to go down and close everyone in for the night. I will look closely at nesting boxes for mites right now. Thanks Catscan for the help. I'm leaning towards using this mite/lice medicine I have. The lady who gave it to me raises chickens and ducks. She shows them and is very knowledgeable. She is also a doctor.
The Araucana photo looks like feather loss from being mated too often. And it's not the spurs that do it, it's just the fact of being stood on so often by the rooster, just the action of his feet on her back, over and over, will pull feathers out faster than they can grow back in. We had many hens with bare backs throughout the summer, but they never showed the kind of redness seen in your other photos - I don't know what that is. Somewhere on the net I saw these kind of aprons, saddles I think they called them, that you could buy and put on your hens to protect their backs from getting defeathered by the roos. They were just made out of something like denim fabric with two loops that went around the hens wings to hold them on.
Gosh hon, I sure wish I knew a lot more about sicknesses in chickens so I could be of help right now. I am so sorry and I hope you find out what it is soon!
Christy
Thankyou, I'm pretty sad for them, and pretty mad at myself. This is likely my fault for letting their coop get out of hand. I'm going to do more research on the net tonight. When I went down to put them in for the night I looked with a flashlight at the nest boxes and closely at the chickens, could not see any of those mites that come out at night. I think I am dealing with two things here. Alot of the chickens are experiencing feather loss without that bright redness. That I think is in fact from the rooster. Might be time to separate him, maybe even rehome him. I do like him, he's very nice, but I cant have him doing this to the chickens. He is the only rooster. I will check out those saddles and see if I can make them myself, but I cant buy 20+ of these things. It would be more financially smart to get rid of the rooster. So actually I think it is three things. 1. Rooster 2. Some dermatitis ? etiology ie: mites, lice, and bacterial that maybe started with the rooster 3. Bronchial. I have the one chicken wheezing and sneezing. When I was locking the chickens in for the night I noticed another chicken making some sort of sound from the chest that sounded fluidly. Again, I've stirred alot of stuff up in the coop from cleaning it, so that has prob. triggered this. I didnt think I stirred alot of dust up, but I'm sure some did. I'm thinking the flock may need to be treated with medicine. Also, I'm attaching a picture of one of my RIR's. This chickens feathers are lightening and she just looks like she is aging quite a bit. She is 3 years old.
hi, read through this as fast as i could, i think the loss of feathers is like said breeding, but in combination with moulting. up their protein, gamebird breeder crumble would help.
the redness i think is sunburn on those who have had th feather loss longer. even the under parts, if they lay asround in the dirt they expose that. pen those up & keep them out of the sun. rub aloe or vit e or even lavendar oil to help it heal.
you are likely right about stirring things up causing bronchial probelms. ACV, garlic & slippery elm in their water for two weeks.
please don't beat yourself up. sometimes we can't keep everything perfect for them. next time you clean, wear a mask & shoo them away. could even have bee the DE that irritated their breathing, the way it blows it could get some & not others... any grade DE is irritating to breathe
tf
Thanks TF. Was looking at photos online tonight and alot of my birds may be going into a moult which may be why I see them preening in the feathers more often. I have noticed more feathers in the pen in the last 2 days. My teen birds will prob. go thru their first moult soon, but I think some of my older gals may be too. The last pic of the RIR, after looking at online photos, looks like she may be getting ready to moult, same thing with the rooster. I dont know if my older chickens have ever moulted. Egg production has been down durastically. About 30-50%, which could mean multiple things. I saw some of the saddles online, wondering if I may be able to make them. I'm handy with the ol' needle and thread. What is ACV? and the garlic and slippery elm is ok for the younger hens? Do you just mince some cloves into their water or are using some other method. Also how is the slippery elm applied to the water? I just put the DE down tonight to help lessen the fly population, also put all over in the case of mites. Think I'm going to try and air on the natural side of things to start off with and try and hold off on that chemical I have. Thanks again, I keep you posted. I will have to see if the Buff makes it thru the night with her wheezing.
i had a young cockerel with his comb turning black the other day. i poured Apple Cider Vinegar with garlic directly down his throat. he was fine the next day.
mince a colve or two or garlic, and immediately put in a quart jar of Bragg Organic Apple Cider Vinegar. infuse for 24 hours. add one tablespoon per gallong of water daily for maintenance purposes. i could go on and on about it's beniefts as oculd others here.
slippery elm can be found in teas, lozenges, or capsule form. the best way to get them to drink it is in their water. by having them locked in out of the sun, they won't have another water source, they will hget used to it. if they get ancy about being penned up [don't put a light in there, and no feed for a few days], just add chamomile tea to the water as well...
once you get them past the moult, the game bird breeder will get them going again, both on feathers and on laying, but don't give it to your young birds, less than four months old.
when you say teenagers you mean what age? because 18 months is the earliest you will see moulting.
honeslty i dont' see why the ducks aren't controlling the flies... you might consider making your own fly trap, where they get in and lay eggs and don't get out...
to repel future infestations of anything, place bay leaves in and around sleeping areas and nesting boxes. add chamomile to your floor bedding regularly to help decompose the poo so the flies don't ahve a food source, and make sure your waterer is level so it isn't leaking somewhere, giving them a way to reproduce...
;hope the buf fis OK by morning. she won't mind the first swallow of ACV, but expect a fight after she tastes it LOL
tf
one of my roosters comb is blacky blue on the tips of the comb
if it isn't frostbite, then he is sickly or feeling down. perk him up!
okely dokely
although maybe he is just feeling down because he is not the head of the coup his dad is
Just read this and I agree with TF. As a matter of fact, I have a few hens that are balding on the backs of their heads also. That is from where the silly roo grabs ahold of the hen while trying to mount and during mating.
u call it mating i call it raping to me it dosnt look lik the hen gives him permision
Just realized I forgot to list the link:
http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract;jsessionid=31228224AF698AF20C15F3C3DDDA6D17.tomcat1?fromPage=online&aid=619852
I agree with Lucky...looks like raping to me, too....lol
GG
wow, catscan i didn't have time to read the paper [yet] but the abtract is RIGHT ON!
[to translate abstract]:
so to reduce feather pekcing, start the chicks on BEDDING with grains in it, like HAY... feed non-pelleted feed, feed animal protein [if htey can't free range, a protein BUCKET would be good] be sure they get a balance of minerals and amino acids. those are things they would get from packing around in the soil. and roughage, like grass and weeds and sprouts, also not grounded feed like crumbles, and not high energy feed like strictly corn or milo, but high fiber feed like oats and barley!!!
pekcing is reduced in laying hens by providing them with time-filled activities like feeding and foraging.
who knows, they spend more time foraging, they may spend less breeding or "raping"...
tf
i through in grass trimmings dose that count as activities
I don't know about your last line there tf.....mine spend all day free range and the roo's always manage to find a spare 5 seconds to slip it in right quick. We can't forget the one tracked roo mind....lol! More foraging might work for some roo's though....especially if they aren't use to it. It might side track them for awhile.
Lucky.....I had a bad pecking problem with a group of my young turkey poults and they were endlessly entertained by it. With the addition of a watermelon rind here and there, they were so busy they stopped the pecking!
Christy
Of course the one track roo minds. Oh gosh I have my brooder full beyond capacity and I keep them busy with table scraps, yesterday I gave them spaghetti It was a free for all and just to funny. I told hubby yesterday while we was watching the freenzy in the brooder now see it was a good idea getting chickens, the left overs that we never eat wont be sitting in the fridg for days, ahem weeks, on end. I am use to cooking for at least 10 or more and just cant seem to downsize my cooking.
i have a son tha tcan consume those scraps if you sell all those babies LOL
No children allowed lol....................I am getting to old to entertain them. That is something I need to do with all the new grandkids I am getting is build a jungle jym for them so I can stress more because they will get to high or fall and break something.