Advice needed from you Chicken experts

I've been doing a lot of reading on chickens. I've been very interested in the Jersey Giants since I wanted birds for eggs and meat (not pets or showing) but what I'm reading indicates that these birds can have problems with their legs (due to their size) that I might not want to have to deal with.
Can someone recommend other breeds that are good brown egg layers and good meat birds? Also gentle to handle (at least as far as the hens are concerned). For right now I'm not into hatching babies so I wouldn't need a rooster to begin with.

Thanks!

MollyD

Hi MollyD--the largest, gentlest dual purpose brown egg layer I know is the Orpington. They are total sweethearts. I'd look for good egg-laying strains--ask questions of breeders. But in general they are good layers. Australorps too--but they are a bit smaller. Maybe Langshams--but I haven't heard much about them as egg layers.

Thanks Catscan! I'll look into those breeds.

MollyD

MollyD, Catscan is right about the Orpington being a gentle hen. Not so some of the roosters, tho. I now have Australorps and yes they are definitely a good brown layer. They are also the most docile hen we have had. DH said one tried to peck him, but I haven't had any do that yet, and they are just about a year old now. We also are not making pets out of ours as we want them for eggs and meat. I will say that the Australorps are quite a bit smaller than the Opringtons. In fact, our Australorp roosters are close to half the size of our RIR rooster. Rhode Island Reds are another good brown egg layer and meat chicken, but not quite as gentle as the Orpingtons or Australorps.

Jersey Giants take too long to get to butchering size. You do have to monitor the amount of feed they take and add vitamins from early on to give them strength to hold up their weight.
Orpingtons are honeys, Dekalb has a Brown that is a good size, lays earlier about 16 weeks, large rich brown eggs. They are gentle disposition also and winter hardy where the Orpingtons have less tolerance for the severe cold weather and lay a soft beige to light brown egg. They are smaller than the Browns.
We got our Browns from Sunnyside Inc, Beaver Dam, Wisconsin and have been very pleased with our birds. Both breeds above are considered a heavy dual breed I believe.

Jcomy is Dekalb a hatchery ? Browns are a breed I hadn't heard of before. Definitely need hardy birds here. Even with a heat source their house will get very cold in winter.

Thanks!
MollyD

Hi jcomy, are the Browns the same as the Bovan Browns? According to one website they are the same as the Gold Sex-links.

I think Orpingtons are supposed to be pretty good in the cold--big birds with heavy feathers. I know they aren't suppose to do as well in the heat--same reason. I am worried about this because we have long hot summers here and my little Oprington is a 6 week old fluff ball.

I do not know if the Browns are like anyone but Dekalb is the one who bred them and Sunnyside handles them. One of our neighbors had them and I decided to try them as she praised the egg laying and still a good heavy hen if you wanted to butcher.
Our Orpingtons refuse to come outside during the winter unless it is above 30 degrees. The Browns and the Special Blacks are out if it is above 0. The same is true in the summer...above 90 the Orps stay indoors where it is usually 15 degrees cooler...but so do the others except for brief foraging periods.
Our winter this year (Zone 2) was long periods of -24 and therebouts... It was rough on all the birds although the coop is insulated and we added a "sunheat" radient heater for the sub weather. They also had the light bulbs to offset cold during the daytime and they laid faithfully all winter. They are good foragers and we have most eggs ranging from 2 1/4 oz to 4 oz.... It hurts to see the eggs that are above 3 oz....They have been a healthy lot that for sure!

Hi, I just found this site describing the Bovan Brown under Gold Sex-Link. It sounds a lot like the Dekalb Brown. Good in cold and lays a lot of brown eggs!

I do believe I have heard someone refer to the Brown as Bovan Browns... Very good. I love discovering new info on my girls. Thank you I will check it out more thoroughly.

Catscan the link you mentioned didn't show up. Could you post it again please? They sure sound like chickens that would do well in my zone 4b.

MollyD

Hi MollyD, Sorry about the link. Here it is. I've never heard of the hatchery before.
http://www.dunlaphatchery.net/Standards.aspx

Thank you! Enjoyed their pages very much. Didn't see what their minimum order was. Did you notice any mention of it? I may have to call them about this.

Thanks!

MollyD

I have some Buff Orpingtons and a RIR. They are both very gentle and easy to handle. The Orpingtons do grow to a pretty good size and are good layers, but tend to go broody. The RIRs are a good dual purpose breed. I love then, so they are show birds. Not food!

MollyD, I think it is a 25 chick minimum. It is the only number they list under prices. But you might be able to work something out if you call them. Here's hoping. I know several hatcheries list gold or golden sex-linked, so maybe one of them will be willing to send fewer. I know it is a production hybrid, and they are often better layers than dual purpose "heritage" varieties. Not sure about sizing for eating though.

This message was edited Mar 29, 2008 11:04 AM

I was told New hampshire Reds are good dual purpose birds, good layers and fast growing birds. I ordered 10 pullets and a roo for someone so this summer I can report how they do.

The Browns dressed out to about 5-6 pounds but we have only butchered about 6 so far. They prepared nicely and the broth was really tasty and hearty. Haven't tried to roast one yet or fry.

That's a good size for us jcomy. We're a family of 2 so we don't need really bid meals.
Sorry if I upset those who have them for pets. I do understand how you feel about them.

MollyD

We don't have any chickens yet but my Mom has some that are great layers. Hers don't even quit laying when they molt. She has Black Sex Links. She often gets double yolked eggs.

CajuninKy how are they for eating?

MollyD

Hi MollyD. I just thought of the Delaware--which is a cirtically endangered dual purpose chicken. It was the dominant breed in "the broiler industry of the Delmarva Peninsula, which at the time provided chickens for the entire East Coast. Though the Delaware's dominance was short-lived, giving way in just twenty years to the Cornish-Rock cross, it still makes an excellent dual-purpose barnyard breed. Unfortunately, it is now quite rare....Hens lay large, rich brown eggs and will go broody and they make fairly good mothers." Quote from "Storey's Illustrated Guide to Poultry Breeds". I got my Delaware from Meyer Hatchery. She is just 6 weeks old, but very friendly and seems to be the smartest of my 5 breeds. I just hadn't thought of eating her!:-)

LOL Catscan what would she think! I'll look into that breed too. I'm wondering if I should get 2 or 3 different breeds and see which one works best for us.

I won't tell your Delaware you're recommending her kinfolk for dinner! ;-)

MollyD

well, i simply have to recommend the Buckeye... great for cold weather, full size for eating by 4-6 months. beautiful eggs. simply GRRRReat!

tf

need some fertile eggs?

TamaraFaye, everyone talks about what characters Buckeyes are--eating mice and all. But some books say that they are friendly--others not so much. I am always interested in friendly brown chickens. What are their eggs like?

TamaraFaye,

Thank you but I don't have a brooder for any eggs :-( I worked once with a borrowed brooder and that was a total disaster! I promised myself I would never ever borrow equipment like that again in my life!!!
Maybe next year? I really appreciate the offer though.

I may end up getting a few of each recommended breed to see which one works best here in my environment.

MollyD

I'll have to ask. I know she has eaten them before but only after they became "old" as layers. I'll let you know what she says.

Their eggs are great! The meat, well, we have only eaten roosters. One was a cockerel and he was delicious. once they were over a year old, then it required speical cooking. but the dark meat is really dark and the white meat really white.

characters, oh yeah. my rooster knows his name and follows me around. they are all very loveable with their own personality. the hens are tough and will fight a rooster who is not their beau.

i have a video of the chickens and cats competing for a box of young mice!

we do not have a vermin problem that is for sure. the only time there was ever a snake in the hen house was when the chickens were living elsewhere and we only had ducks and guineas. then a big snake came in to steal Olive's eggs she was setting on! luckily DH saw it on the monitor we had set up to watch the hatch.

i gotta tell you, had i not been prego when the extra cockerels had been ready to butcher, they would have all been eaten! the ALBC served Buckeye at their 2007 convention as a delicacy.

i got mine from xtremegamebirds.com they are also available from urch/trunland in MN.

Buckeyes are supposed to make good mothers, but mine went through too much stress for me to ever find out. We have a new batch started from our favorites, so we will see. I can tell you that our Buckey/Leghorn cross "Buckhorn" went broody and took care of those sexlink "Black Australrops" from Privett Hatchery when she was only 6 weeks old! but for all i know that could be characteristic of any cross... She is a big and delicate little girl, and still takes care of the 5 week old bantams that are outside in the new pens.

So i can recommend Buckeyes and Buckeye crosses.

Molly, where did you read about the JG leg problems? I am interested, as i was given three JGs and am crossing them with BAs...

tf

i just saw this,lol so here's my recommends. most of these i raise or have raised- road island reds, orpingtons any color, giant cochins, turkens, brahmas, sex-links, marans. for egg laying alone rir, turkens or gold sex-links r awesome for huge eggs. some of these r tinted egg layers like turkens and marans r choc egg layers.
hope that helps.
silkie

Silkie, do gold sex links lay brown eggs? A friend works at Tractor Supply near here and that's one of the breeds they are getting (he thinks). Since DH wants to get larger hens, we will be buying some chicks from them. I want Buff Orpingtons, but they are getting assortments, so the friend said it would be kind of hard to tell what they were. He did say that they would probably get Gold Comets which I understand to be Gold sex links, so I might get those. But we need brown egg layers because no-one around here wants white eggs. ☼

yes-- the gold sexlink are s'pose to lay brown eggs. From what I have found now the Browns, gold sex link and Bovan Browns are the same kind of chicken!
Just didn't know it!
Granny you are right. There is just something about brown eggs that people think they are better than the white! I personally think it is a psychological connection to the fact that the "factory white eggs" are so blah in flavor and appearance... the brown eggs improve just due to the color. ;-)
We have only brown egg layers and we have gone from a trio to this year having 120 layers of brown eggs because we found ourselves without eggs as customers return and buy more each time. They all talk about how good the eggs are! I finally had to tell DH that this year the household needs came first...I refuse to give up my eggs! even if the neighbor does pay for them! :0

yes they r brown egg layers. i used to have comets same thing as a gold sexlink. they r some of the friendliest i've seen but i think that's all in how u raise them. we handle them everyday and raise from hatch for most of our flock.

i have blue/black/splash/buff and mottled orpingtons. lol that was a mouthful try saying that 3 times fast. orps r great too, love them but i like mostly the other colors although i have a real pretty buff girl i love too. around here everyone only has buff so i think it's i like they r a little different.

everyone here wants brown eggs also. from my understanding they taste better but we all know farm fresh does compaired to store bought but also their suppost to be higher in nutrients or vitamins or something. i don't understand that cause they all eat the same feed but i think that maybe why. they won't buy brown from the store only farmers.

my neighber's used to get brown eggs off of me and one day i gave him blue eggs he had a fit, rotfl. he thought i dyed them to freak him out i said just try them only difference is color. he loved them so much he came back and bought my americanas and my rir's, lol. him and his friend r elderly so they got them for companions and they said a blue egg was like finding a golden egg in the nest box, rotfl. wait till he sees i got choc eggers gonna be hatching in a few weeks, i think i'll hide them ones,lol.

one day i hope to have some chocolate eggers. my customers love our whites as much as our browns. XL to jumbo in size, with brighter orange yolks than the browns. they are from brown leghorns, but Molly mentioned she wanted a dual purpose bird.

GG, just don't get anything with white earlobes, that indicates white eggs.

over in the mediterranean area, is where white eggers originate. browns are American breeed [mostly]. back in the days, browns were the norm and it was special to get a white egg! now egg factories use breeds they developed just for the purpose, whose lineage goes back to the leghorn, and so most store eggs are white. they actually charge more for brown LOL, cause they aren't as efficient on their feed i think...

Molly, if you are ordering from a hatchery [local or Texas i hope], then you can request a brown egg assortment. then eat the ones that are dual purpose and keep the rest for eggs.

honestly, the ones that aren't dual purpose are often leaner, better forages, & more efficent producers for the amount of feed they consume.

but the bigger hens often have the sweet personalities too. and sex links just seem to be sweet because of their crossed genes. even our se link roosters are a hoot! i explained to my six year old that yes, they are sweet and not so smart, as we have to help them into their warm lighted pen still!

Thanks Silkie!

TamaraFaye yes I did read about the JG's leg problem which is the main reason I'm shying off them. It's something I'd rather not deal with at this time. I've been looking into the breeds you and others have recommended and today we were out and stopped at a place that sells home grown brown eggs. I asked if they sold chicks and no they didn't but a) they knew of a publication that listed poultry and other farm animals so we can look into that and b) they had spotted an ad for Golden Comets so we are going to look into that too. They may be too far away to buy. Otherwise we may go with Welp's or Ideal . We're thinking of order 25 (no matter who we go with in the end) of a straight run. Eating the males first (maybe keep one to guard the hens) . Let the hens lay for a year or two and go from there. Nothing against Texas but it seems so far away for babies to travel. In that time I can start thinking about buying a brooder and whether I want to hatch eggs and all that. I keep dreaming about having a pair of geese that will provide us with eggs and baby geese (for meat). Have also considered Pekins (can they be housed with chickens??)

MollyD

ur welcome. here is a link to hatcheries with some closer to NY. see if any of these may have what u need or want.
hope that helps,
silkie

http://www.poultryconnection.com/hatchery.html

Well we did it! Just took the plunge and ordered 25 chicks from Ideal.

Placed order for a straight run of 10 Buff Orpingtons, straight run of 10 New Hampshires and 5 male Delawares (they were out of females but figured (forgive me pet owners) that we could find out how they tasted). I asked for them to arrive in May so that by the time they're ready to be outside the weather should be warm. Had to hurray up and place our order since many sources were running out of stock.

Can you tell I'm nervous?

MollyD

i ordered from ideal last year they are a great hatchery with beautiful birds.
silkie

Thanks Silkie :-) I chose them based on what was reported in this forum. I've had no prior experience ordering birds by mail. My only two batches (in 1980's) were purchased at local Agway store. I think they were RIR and maybe some Cornish Game but I wouldn't swear to it!

Now what do I do next? Plants are in the greenhouse till May but will be in garden by end of May at latest. It's a hoophouse made from cattle panels with plastic film. Has insulation on north wall and part of roof on north side. I plan to extend that so most of roof has insulation too. This is rigid foam. Will chickens peck at this? Should it be covered with plywood?
Floor is pea gravel. I was told this was okay. Would it be better to pour cement over this? I plant to put straw or hay all over the floor, bales along north wall at different levels so they can roost on them. Will that work?
Food: I saw those long trays for chicks to feed from. In winter I'll use the large plastic ones for adults.
Water: saw round watering things with holes for beaks.

Heat: I saw heat lamps at the store today. Will they need this in late May or June?

Am I overlooking anything?

MollyD

Hi MollyD, Someone will correct me, but I don't think you want plastic waterers/feeders in the winter--I've heard they crack and break in the cold. I've also read that straw doesn't make the best bedding, unless its chopped, because it mats down too easily. I think the idea of hay bales for them to roost on is neat. I moved my chicks out at 4 weeks because the days were in the high 60's/low 70's, but the nights were still in the 40's and wise people here advised me they still needed more heat at night. I first put their red 250 watt brooder light out with them and have since weaned them onto a red 100 watt flood light. They are now 6 weeks and I am planning to move on to a 20 watt red bulb when the nights are in the 50's. Then nothing. I finally put it on a timer saving me going out morning and night to turn it on and off. People with temps closer to yours can probably give you the best advice. I didn't baby my first chicks so much outside--but I kept them inside longer and they slept in a smaller kennel outside where they seemed to keep each other warm. Good luck and I won't tell my Delaware what you are planning for her potential dream roosters.

LOL please don't tell her how I was drooling while reading the description of how plump and juicy they were! I just signed up to be notified if females became available. Page wasn't working right so I don't know if it got through. Hope so. I'm guessing my straight runs will be at least 50% males don't you think? Now of those three breeds which male might potentially do the best job of guarding the hens or will this vary by personality?
I read that galvanize contained lead (solder in joints) which is why I thought plastic would be better. I'll use hay on floor then instead of straw.

Will my chicks need a brooder or will warm draft free quarters be enough? I liked the crib someone posted here :-)

MollyD

i got my d'uccles and polish from them, gorgous!!

hhmm if i remember right that is the blue foam? temperarily it might be fine but i have never used anything but wood and wire so i'm not sure. i'd assume if they did get into it and it was expandable definately not good for them could swell if eated and got wet and block pooing or crops. if bead is already pre-expanded i'm not sure as it may or may not be safe. usually it's not so much weather it is toxic it's if it swells and blocks or binds up the body. i'm only going by what i know since DH used t work at same foam plant here as my x-husband,lol.

mine peck at shinely or odd looking things like nail polish, jewelry, tattoos, odd colored chips or little pieces of odd bedding ect. they really aren't where they can get to much. usually if it is not good for them they ignore it or taste test it then ignore it. sometimes they can be real dumb though,lol. i have heard people have them eat nuts and bolts in a barn and they pass it fine but they get string and it wraps up the intestines and messes up crops and they can die so u never know with a chicken.

i don't know what pea gravel is. i have all above ground pens with wire floors on runs and wood floors in coops all sit 3-4ft off ground includeing coops and runs. someone with ground runs would be better to help u with that one cause i honstly don't know. cement is easier to clean and bleach ect to disinfect though. mine don't roost except on next boxes but i think that would work great lots of people here use bails for that.

i use different feeder. we have homemade pipe feeders and wooden self dispence ones, lrge metal dog pans from walmart. oh and i have an old trough style one. that one and the pipe ones r my favs lot less mess and waste. we've done popbottle ones also that cap on the wire to hold in place, those r great too. i use 1-3 gal flip over waterers or antique metal barn looking ones which r kinda kool. i keep mine under lights 95 degrees first week and drop it down 5 degrees every week till they r feathered in and i can put them outside and brooder temp is same as temp outside. usually about 6-8 weeks old. some keep them outside with lights though that is up to who is brooding and convienance. i don't have outside electric so can't do that here and i use heat lamps year round just move them up to reduce heat or lower to warm it. i feed mine medicated starter till 8-10 weeks old but it's supost to be 16 weeks but that is up to breeder. i like it helps protect against coccies and is high in protein for them and i rarely have any who get sick if at all. but if u are raiseing them organic it is not an organic feed. i give mine scrabled eggs every day too and treats of meal worms for extra protein and fun.
silkie