Anybody want to help with designing?

I am wanting to create a tall garden, with an average height of about 4 feet, with some plants beyond at the back. If it goes well, I will make all 3 of my front yard gardens similar next year.

It will be on the right hand side of the attached image. http://davesgarden.com/tools/blog/viewimage.php?did=43222

I am thinking about having a sea of purple in the middle for much of the summer. Probably the white of shasta daisies at the side walk, with Kniphofia, Lilies, Canna 'Phason' and others along the back and possibily showing through the middle.

What could I use for the purple of the middle? Maybe 2 or 3 different plants.

The space is probably 10x10 or so in size, and there are only a few plants on the right side, with some rock garden plants around the concrete walls.

I have a Cornflower that would look just gorgeous there, it is a purple/ blue. grows to 3' and spreads to a nice mound, Its called 'Centaurea Montana' wish I had a pic, can give you one in AM, but only the nice mound, hasn't started to bloom yet. Just a idea.

I don't know if this will help, but I love the Blue/purple colors.

Is that a swale? What's the soil like? How wet does it get and stay? Lilies need excellent drainage-they will rot if they are too wet, and I think Kniphofia like it on the dry side as well.

Kniphofia can actually stand quite a bit of water, although they do well with dryness, too.
How about tall alliums, like Allium 'giant' or 'globemaster' for the early spring? Only with good drainage, though. Just like the lilies.
Then I would recommend using a tall purple foliage plant that would keep the color from spring through fall. Maybe a Cotinus 'grace'? Whoops. Just looked at your photo. I guess that's too large a plant for this area.

If your soil is going to stay heavy and wet, you have a good location for a bog type garden of plants that like damp locations. You could grow the perennial lobelias there. There is a red one with red leaves that would make a nice statement. Cannas would be excellent there as well. They love water. Another tall one that will offer a nice purple/reddish color is eupatorium, otherwise known as Joe Pye Weed. The taller variety has lovely reddish foliage and gets to be about 6 feet tall. Loves water, too.

If the soil dries out a bit in the summer you may be safe putting some tall dahlias in that area, as long as you dig them in the fall. they would for sure rot over the winter. I was thinking tall purple dinner plate or cactus variety dahlias in a purple color. With the joe pye weed. that would be lovely!

Lobelia cardinal Queen victoria is RED with red leaves - however, it does suddenly disappear, so you always need to make divisions to replace them. Otherwise they are no problem. How about some verbena bonariensis. Grows to 2mtrs, and is wispy and nice with an almost luminescent cluster of small blossom blossom - wonderful at dusk, and birds love the seed heads. Does self sow, but extremely easy to weed out.

The tall saliva black and blue would be nice or some of the thalictrums like Ellen could get 10 feet tall as long as it is watered some. I would be questioning if it is wet in the winter if cannas would rot. Frozen wet it not good. I have done that. I think Melissa's idea is good of a dark shrub or maybe a bright red twig dog wood in the summer it would show off the other plants and in the winter it would give you some color. It looks like you are in the city so deer won't be a problem. Good luck

I planted Borage last year-it grew to 3 feet tall with an abundance of blue flowers for nearly all summer.

Yes, that is a stormwater swale from the road that enters my property. Right now, the soils at the wall, and maybe 1-2 feet back are soggy from the swale water. But quickly it dries as one goes away from the swale.

I did raise grade across the garden. At the wall there is probably 1-1.5 feet of soil added, with it thinning as it goes away. Grass thickness was 4-6 inches, and that probably represents the thinnest amount of added soil.

Attached is another picture of the ditch

So, Analog, the swale has water when it rains, but then is dry the rest of the time? What about having a 'river bed' running along through the bed - a nice rounded rock dip that softly meanders up the bed. At times it would have water, and at times be a dry bed. Then with the planting rising up on a mounded (Pix, what is the word?) area at the back and very low planting (in purple and blue) at the front edge.

I think this is a definate work party project.

Its a grass lined swale to provide biofiltration to the stormwater before it is released into a stream or lake, so lining it with gravel is a no-no.

Water ponds shallowly probably 20 feet beyond the garden, and through the concrete walled area. Water depth is about 3". All the water is dry, bone dry by August, and wet but mowable. Luckily its a designed drainage channel, or it would be a class 3 wetland. I have seen the government go after stuff like this. Luckily, I am as certified as one can be around here as a wetland delineater.

While I like the idea, I would have to get it past not only my wife, but the government regulators in my town, which would probably cost me plenty, and require me a civil engineer to design any changes. Sigh.

What's Mtlk Terr. Policy on rain gardens? They promote them down here fairly heavily. Could you make a case for it becoming a rain garden, which isn't quite a bog garden and still serves as drainage? The soil structure I think is different for a rain garden but it serves a similar purpose.

Hey Rob,
Just wanted to show you what the Cornflower looks like now before it blooms. stays this way most of the winter never dies back, at least here.
Tills

SB:
I would love for us to have a rain garden, even one of decent size, but I suspect the area drained would be too much for one rain garden, even massive in scale. Besides the infiltration rate is nil on most of the soil up here. I think an infiltration rate of 1"/hour is required for rain gardens. I was not long ago dealing with a development that was doing rain gardens in Kirkland, where I wrote the soils report.

TR:
Most excellent. I like plants that are evergreen, as most of my plants die back, leaving me with bare soil for much of the winter. Well, I usually don't cut many things back until the late winter, just to preserve the ground cover.

Tills,
Is this the bloom color of your "Centaurea Montana" I have a picture of mine. I wish mine stayed all year, they die back here but come back and seed freely with new plants every year.

AD, but don't rain gardens require gravel to enhance the drainage? voila, a river bed....

Yes that is the bloom, mine have never died back. Always there. they get a little sprawyl in summer and I just cut them back, and they bloom some more, and now I have new babies. I have 4 Adults that have never gone dormant. maybe they like it here?

Pixydish's suggestion of Cotinus is great; smokebush can be pruned easily to keep it smallish. There are also some great purple-leaved japanese maples that could add some height and texture. Maybe not for sitting in water, but they do like to have moist soil.

There are some great Iris for wet areas, specifically sibirica and louisiana cultivars. I've had 'Caesar's Brother' that will sit in water year round, and also deal with summer drought.

Ferns, maybe? Not purple, but great care-free plants.

You probably found a micro climate area of warmth, mine are not up next to anything just out in the open....yours appear to be near a structure which would give it better protection

Lousiana iris might do well in that area because they have evolved to grow in areas where they can be covered with water during the rainy season, but still do well when the soil dries out in the summer.

Whoops! Didn't see the previous reference to Lousiana iris, but now you have two votes. Plus. they are good biofilters. Seems like the city would allow using plants as part of a biofilter system for stormwater. I have a large biofilter attached to my pond, called a veggie filter, which uses gravel and plants exclusively for filtration.

This message was edited Mar 24, 2008 8:58 PM

Plantaholic - can I ask about your experience with Cotinus? I have one, but I've been concerned about its placement since I know it can get pretty big. I've also heard and experienced that they branch readily and profusely right below where you prune them. I'd hate to end up with a sheared look - have you had any trouble with that?

AD - so many natives like clay and can tolerate wet winter and dry summer. I love ninebark and there are wine-colored and chartreuse versions. The can get big, but I've been told that you can cut them back heavily each year if you want to keep them small. You lose the cool roughness of the bark, but they can provide sculptural interest year-round if you prune well.

Also, you can try ilex crenata (japanese holly) is a real workhorse in the garden that provides a nice backdrop for more flashy plants. It's evergreen, there are smaller versions and bigger versions, and it's pretty easy to manage.

http://www.bissettnursery.com/Nursery/nurs_Ilex2.htm

I think the key words are 'prune well'. Cotinus is like any other woody shrub that way. Do a heading cut and you will get plenty of fresh growth all around the cut end. Soon you will have a nice ball of cotinus that is dense and difficult to manage. Prune it the same way you would prune any other woody shrub if you don't want it to get bushy. You can still keep it smaller by using selective thinning cuts. But if you don't want it to grow to its natural size, maybe it's not the right shrub for that place?

Yes, Melissa, you're right. I just have so little hot sun that I'm limited in where I can have sun lovers. It may not be the most elegant solution, but let's just call it a little self-indulgence. ;-)

I am the queen of hacking at plants that are too large for my garden : ) (And for succumbing to buying plants that are too large for my garden LOL)
Granted, it's always best to start with cultivars known for their small size, but shrubs like Cotinus can be coppiced, and living in WA I bet that shrub will be 8' tall in five minutes!

Whoa! So many messages, too little time!

Cotinus is on my list of wants. I have looked into that one, and really like the idea.

As to planting the ditch. Until it turns into a rain garden, I will have to mow it, to remove the pollutants, so any plants would have to put up with spring and summer mowing. Which is why I created the walls for a dividing line between garden and gross water.

I did look into the rain garden thing, and it looks plausable, and I may know a CE that could design something for me, provided I did the soils report. Who wants to provide the backhoe services 8-P

But the reality of the ditch is that it gets so big, it would be nice to fill the darn thing in, and make it go away. A drained rain garden might do just that. And I am serious. It gets big beyond the fence. Scarey big. It is probably 12-15 feet deep where it disappears from view into a pipe in the northwest corner of my yard.

12-15 feet deep and disappearing into a pipe? That sounds like a danger to animals and small children or even large children/adults. I get a bad joo joo feeling about that....

Its sloped pretty well, and the pipe has a cage on it, so its better than your nightmare, but still it is a major obstacle toward us having a backyard.

I can see that being completely true.